The ranger always seems to be the class to get the most tinkering so I figured I'd throw my hat in the mix.
Please take a moment and review my version of the ranger. It's not spell less like many other builds. Instead I tried to add some different mechanics that would separate the ranger from the pack. I also wanted to make it compatible with the UA Ranger Revised as well as any future ranger conclaves from WOTC. See link to my home brew ranger revision below:
You did a pretty good job, but I think the already-existing rangers work just fine. For example, my revised ranger 6/fighter 1 does 3d8+2d6+8 per turn with hunter's mark, Colossus Slayer, and Extra Attack, at +10 to hit with Archery and Close-Quarters Shooting, and can do it in melee or up to 150 feet away. With just 5 levels of PHB ranger and no levels of fighter, I calculated his offensive CR at 6. I just hope I never run into anything immune to piercing damage.
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"Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both" -- allegedly Benjamin Franklin
Not really trying to bump damage so much as add something new and different to make rangers special. One of the big deals for me is actually adding the relentless tracker feature. This may seem odd but I can't express the frustration I have when the DM tells me I can't track such and such creature only to have the cleric or wizard drop a divination and go to town. And I like the idea of the ranger being the 'play with initiative' class and so the ambusher class feature.
Maybe I will take another stab at making those features (tracking and ambushing) more interesting...hmmmm
This thread has been quiet. Let me take a second stab at sparking some interest...
One of the ways I attempted to make my homebrew special was to give the ranger a 'ambush' ability. This ability is meant to make the ranger the 'go first and ruin your day guy'. Anyone have any opinions on it? I have separated the related features out and listed them below to make it easier to review.
Ambusher
Starting at 3rd level, you have advantage on initiative rolls and, on your first turn during combat, you have advantage on attack rolls against creatures with a lower initiative roll.
You may not use this feature if you are wearing heavy armor.
Deadly Ambusher
Starting at 6th level, you deal 1d6 additional damage with your weapon against an opponent with a lower initiative value than yours.
In addition, you may use a bonus action to reroll your initiative. You must take the new roll and your initiative changes to the new value on the following round. You may not use this feature if you are wearing heavy armor.
Superior Ambusher
At 17th level, your weapon attacks deal additional 1d6 damage (so +2d6 total) against any creature that has a lower initiative value than you.
In addition, at the start of combat any ally within 30ft of you gains advantage to initiative.
Foe Slayer
At 20th level, you become an unparalleled hunter. You have advantage against any creature with a lower initiative than you and any attacker with a lower initiative has disadvantage with attacks against you.
First, I think your armbusher should be an archetype. Second, why do you introduce 2 featues that someone with heavy would not be able to use without providing them with anything else instead? I enjoy my melee ranger in heavy armor... SO this would be a real slap to the face. Also, archetype features for ranger are at level 3, 7, 11, and 15
maybe look up the revised ranger + archetype deep stalker
adv on initiative (from natural explorer)
10 feet more movement in first round of combat (Underdark Scout)
1 more attack if you use the attack action (Underdark Scout)
evade darkvision -> easier to hide in shadows (Underdark Scout)
you get darkvision 90 feet (Deep Stalker Magic)
Edit: your whole homebrew thing punishes someone using heavy armor, which is ridicoulus in itself...
you forgot saving throw proficiencies
feral awareness: if you are prof in perception, your passive score would already include your prof. bonus. would be better to cahnge the wording into: you get prof in perception, or expertise if you already have that. Or reword it into, another falt bonus like the feat Observant
the deadly ambusher and superior ambusher traits regarding initiative order feal really really weird
True, I could do most of the changes I want with an archetype but I really wanted to make some changes because I don't care for either the PHB or the UA ranger. You might notice I removed the advantage to initiative from natural explorer-this was to move it to a later level and make a one level dip to ranger less appealing. And I axed favored enemy. This was because that feature has never worked quite right since it's introduction. Favored enemy is either useless or really powerful depending on the opponents in the campaign.
As for penalizing heavy armor...well the flavor I am trying to capture here is that of a lightly armored and fast moving ranger. It's no more ridiculous than barbarian rage not allowing heavy armor. I do think it ridiculous for a woodsman/hunter/tracker specializing in ambush to be wearing full plate. It's just not what I am trying to make here.
Good catch on the saves. They would be same as ranger. I'll add that in.
Maybe it would be better for feral awareness to provide a flat bonus. hmmm
Not sure what you mean by the deadly and superior ambusher features being weird. Can you elaborate? Basically this ranger gains bonuses against opponents with a lower initiative and he can use a bonus action to re roll if his roll was low. At 17th level he can provide advantage to initiative to his party as long as they are close to him when the action begins. easy peasy. Or at least I am trying to make it easy.
Basically this ranger gains bonuses against opponents with a lower initiative and he can use a bonus action to re roll if his roll was low. At 17th level he can provide advantage to initiative to his party as long as they are close to him when the action begins. easy peasy. Or at least I am trying to make it easy.
Basically, it makes it a lot more complicated to track intitive aswell as interupting the flow. I dont like the idea about this, and providing a damage source on-top of that just werids even weirder.
here is more feedback to your features and the order i would rebalance them into:
1: feral awareness
2: fighting style
3: combine fleet of foot and ambusher.. if you are so fast on your legs, you get advantage on initiative (still against heavy armor penalty though)
6: relentless tracker with bonus damage if you know who you track
8: land's stride
10: hide in plain sight, maybe with inbuilt sense the unnatural - but knowing enemies are around is weird. would call for surival or perception aswell. In my experience passive perception already does this job, and feral awareness increases your passive already. also doubles on later feral senses
14: Vanish
18: more damage for relentless tracker
Overall, there should be empty lines of feature upgrade, because those are the level you get a higher level spell slot, those already increase your power a good chunk. Also at this point, bringing back favoured enemies and introducing your 1d6 and 2d6 damage bonus from ambusher, relentless tracker and sense the unnatural regarding them may be another valid idea to evade building upon inititive rollercoaster.
Second, why do you introduce 2 featues that someone with heavy would not be able to use without providing them with anything else instead?
Because rangers aren't proficient with heavy armor.
Shhhh, Matthias. Maybe his DM doesn't know. :)
Ok, so I shuffled some abilities around per Kremdes suggestion, fixed the saves and skills, and updated feral awareness. I also got rid of Sense the Unnatural for now. I liked the idea of that ability but it was hard to get the language right.
I doubled down on the 'no heavy armor ranger' by adding in some more of that type language.
Kept all the ambush abilities as is. I'm committed to at least play-testing those features. I just like the idea of the ranger being the only class to mess with initiative. It gives them something unique.
At this point I think the class is ready for some play-testing. I see that according to my Poll it's split 50/50 as far as folks interested in a new ranger version. I get that. There have already been so many tweaks but I am liking this one.
For Feral Awareness change "expertise" to double proficiency bonus. What kind of bonus was expertise suppose to be? Expertise brings me back to 3.5e days.
Ambusher 3rd level ability seems very powerful especially if your a dex based ranger and your going top or close to the top in the round. As written you have advantage on initiative and you would have advantage on attacks with no magic. Seems a bit OP to me (just my opinion). I suggest moving the advantage on attacks to Deadly Ambusher but having it replace the second part of that ability but restricting that part to 9th level.
Also suggest to put a link to the UA article in Range Conclave so people have easier time accessing it.
For Feral Awareness change "expertise" to double proficiency bonus. What kind of bonus was expertise suppose to be? Expertise brings me back to 3.5e days.
Ambusher 3rd level ability seems very powerful especially if your a dex based ranger and your going top or close to the top in the round. As written you have advantage on initiative and you would have advantage on attacks with no magic. Seems a bit OP to me (just my opinion). I suggest moving the advantage on attacks to Deadly Ambusher but having it replace the second part of that ability but restricting that part to 9th level.
Also suggest to put a link to the UA article in Range Conclave so people have easier time accessing it.
The UA revised ranger gets "you have advantage on initiative rolls," and "on your first turn during combat, you have advantage on attack rolls against creatures that have not yet acted," at 1st level.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
"Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both" -- allegedly Benjamin Franklin
For Feral Awareness change "expertise" to double proficiency bonus. What kind of bonus was expertise suppose to be? Expertise brings me back to 3.5e days.
Ambusher 3rd level ability seems very powerful especially if your a dex based ranger and your going top or close to the top in the round. As written you have advantage on initiative and you would have advantage on attacks with no magic. Seems a bit OP to me (just my opinion). I suggest moving the advantage on attacks to Deadly Ambusher but having it replace the second part of that ability but restricting that part to 9th level.
Also suggest to put a link to the UA article in Range Conclave so people have easier time accessing it.
Expertise can be found under the class features for either the Bard or the Rogue. Expertise does exactly what you suggest...it doubles proficiency bonus. It's a good point though. I will try to edit the language a bit to make it clear.
Matthias is correct. Moving the initiative and attack advantage out of Natural Explorer to 3rd level was my way of balancing the UA ranger revised. The rest of the ambusher features are just my way of expanding on that idea. I go back and forth on how powerful it is. On one hand it is just advantage to attacks which any number of abilities or situations can provide or take away. On the other hand a player could easily build his/her ranger to milk it for all its worth. Another thing to consider would be how the DM rolls initiative for bad guys. In my games we typically break up opponents into groups and roll initiative for each group. If a DM were to just roll once for a big group of baddies (or a BBEG) then this ranger would be just that much better.
I'm considering your suggestion for moving advantage on attacks to 9th. Thanks for the input.
I also added a link to the UA ranger revised. Good suggestion.
I'm considering your suggestion for moving advantage on attacks to 9th. Thanks for the input.
The Assassin Rogue gets advantage on attacks vs creatures that have not acted in combat yet at 3rd (plus turn hits into crits with surprise) so the Ranger getting it at 3rd doesn't seem overpowered. What I will question though is the wording "against creatures with a lower initiative roll". I get that for Ambusher this advantage on attacks is only for your first turn, but for Deadly and Superior Ambusher, is the bonus damage meant to be every turn or just first turn? The cyclic nature of combat and creatures using the Ready and Legendary actions it can get confusing as to who has a lower initiative vs who is acting out of turn.
If all the abilities are meant to be first turn only I would suggest using similar wording to the Rogue's Assassinate feature.
The ranger always seems to be the class to get the most tinkering so I figured I'd throw my hat in the mix.
Please take a moment and review my version of the ranger. It's not spell less like many other builds. Instead I tried to add some different mechanics that would separate the ranger from the pack. I also wanted to make it compatible with the UA Ranger Revised as well as any future ranger conclaves from WOTC. See link to my home brew ranger revision below:
http://homebrewery.naturalcrit.com/share/Hy5nLZiSZ
(edit: here is a link to the UA ranger revised for easy reference: http://dnd.wizards.com/articles/features/unearthed-arcana-ranger-revised)
Current Characters I am playing: Dr Konstantin van Wulf | Taegen Willowrun | Mad Magnar
Check out my homebrew: Items | Monsters | Spells | Subclasses | Feats
You did a pretty good job, but I think the already-existing rangers work just fine. For example, my revised ranger 6/fighter 1 does 3d8+2d6+8 per turn with hunter's mark, Colossus Slayer, and Extra Attack, at +10 to hit with Archery and Close-Quarters Shooting, and can do it in melee or up to 150 feet away. With just 5 levels of PHB ranger and no levels of fighter, I calculated his offensive CR at 6. I just hope I never run into anything immune to piercing damage.
"Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both" -- allegedly Benjamin Franklin
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Thanks for the comments Matthias!
Not really trying to bump damage so much as add something new and different to make rangers special. One of the big deals for me is actually adding the relentless tracker feature. This may seem odd but I can't express the frustration I have when the DM tells me I can't track such and such creature only to have the cleric or wizard drop a divination and go to town. And I like the idea of the ranger being the 'play with initiative' class and so the ambusher class feature.
Maybe I will take another stab at making those features (tracking and ambushing) more interesting...hmmmm
Current Characters I am playing: Dr Konstantin van Wulf | Taegen Willowrun | Mad Magnar
Check out my homebrew: Items | Monsters | Spells | Subclasses | Feats
Okay, so replace Land's Stride/Fleet of Foot or something with Relentless Tracker. Maybe Hide in Plain Sight.
"Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both" -- allegedly Benjamin Franklin
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D&D Beyond FoundersHi Slaine000,
looks like a well thought through variant.
I've moved this thread over to the homebrew subforum, but left a shadow topic under ranger.
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This thread has been quiet. Let me take a second stab at sparking some interest...
One of the ways I attempted to make my homebrew special was to give the ranger a 'ambush' ability. This ability is meant to make the ranger the 'go first and ruin your day guy'. Anyone have any opinions on it? I have separated the related features out and listed them below to make it easier to review.
Ambusher
Starting at 3rd level, you have advantage on initiative rolls and, on your first turn during combat, you have advantage on attack rolls against creatures with a lower initiative roll.
You may not use this feature if you are wearing heavy armor.
Deadly Ambusher
Starting at 6th level, you deal 1d6 additional damage with your weapon against an opponent with a lower initiative value than yours.
In addition, you may use a bonus action to reroll your initiative. You must take the new roll and your initiative changes to the new value on the following round. You may not use this feature if you are wearing heavy armor.
Superior Ambusher
At 17th level, your weapon attacks deal additional 1d6 damage (so +2d6 total) against any creature that has a lower initiative value than you.
In addition, at the start of combat any ally within 30ft of you gains advantage to initiative.
Foe Slayer
At 20th level, you become an unparalleled hunter. You have advantage against any creature with a lower initiative than you and any attacker with a lower initiative has disadvantage with attacks against you.
Current Characters I am playing: Dr Konstantin van Wulf | Taegen Willowrun | Mad Magnar
Check out my homebrew: Items | Monsters | Spells | Subclasses | Feats
First, I think your armbusher should be an archetype. Second, why do you introduce 2 featues that someone with heavy would not be able to use without providing them with anything else instead? I enjoy my melee ranger in heavy armor... SO this would be a real slap to the face. Also, archetype features for ranger are at level 3, 7, 11, and 15
maybe look up the revised ranger + archetype deep stalker
Edit: your whole homebrew thing punishes someone using heavy armor, which is ridicoulus in itself...
Thanks for the critique Kremdes.
True, I could do most of the changes I want with an archetype but I really wanted to make some changes because I don't care for either the PHB or the UA ranger. You might notice I removed the advantage to initiative from natural explorer-this was to move it to a later level and make a one level dip to ranger less appealing. And I axed favored enemy. This was because that feature has never worked quite right since it's introduction. Favored enemy is either useless or really powerful depending on the opponents in the campaign.
As for penalizing heavy armor...well the flavor I am trying to capture here is that of a lightly armored and fast moving ranger. It's no more ridiculous than barbarian rage not allowing heavy armor. I do think it ridiculous for a woodsman/hunter/tracker specializing in ambush to be wearing full plate. It's just not what I am trying to make here.
Good catch on the saves. They would be same as ranger. I'll add that in.
Maybe it would be better for feral awareness to provide a flat bonus. hmmm
Not sure what you mean by the deadly and superior ambusher features being weird. Can you elaborate? Basically this ranger gains bonuses against opponents with a lower initiative and he can use a bonus action to re roll if his roll was low. At 17th level he can provide advantage to initiative to his party as long as they are close to him when the action begins. easy peasy. Or at least I am trying to make it easy.
Current Characters I am playing: Dr Konstantin van Wulf | Taegen Willowrun | Mad Magnar
Check out my homebrew: Items | Monsters | Spells | Subclasses | Feats
Basically, it makes it a lot more complicated to track intitive aswell as interupting the flow. I dont like the idea about this, and providing a damage source on-top of that just werids even weirder.
here is more feedback to your features and the order i would rebalance them into:
Overall, there should be empty lines of feature upgrade, because those are the level you get a higher level spell slot, those already increase your power a good chunk. Also at this point, bringing back favoured enemies and introducing your 1d6 and 2d6 damage bonus from ambusher, relentless tracker and sense the unnatural regarding them may be another valid idea to evade building upon inititive rollercoaster.
"Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both" -- allegedly Benjamin Franklin
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Current Characters I am playing: Dr Konstantin van Wulf | Taegen Willowrun | Mad Magnar
Check out my homebrew: Items | Monsters | Spells | Subclasses | Feats
its not like you can get proficiencies in some other ways following game rules... *roll_eyes*
For Feral Awareness change "expertise" to double proficiency bonus. What kind of bonus was expertise suppose to be? Expertise brings me back to 3.5e days.
Ambusher 3rd level ability seems very powerful especially if your a dex based ranger and your going top or close to the top in the round. As written you have advantage on initiative and you would have advantage on attacks with no magic. Seems a bit OP to me (just my opinion). I suggest moving the advantage on attacks to Deadly Ambusher but having it replace the second part of that ability but restricting that part to 9th level.
Also suggest to put a link to the UA article in Range Conclave so people have easier time accessing it.
"Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both" -- allegedly Benjamin Franklin
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Current Characters I am playing: Dr Konstantin van Wulf | Taegen Willowrun | Mad Magnar
Check out my homebrew: Items | Monsters | Spells | Subclasses | Feats
Current Characters I am playing: Dr Konstantin van Wulf | Taegen Willowrun | Mad Magnar
Check out my homebrew: Items | Monsters | Spells | Subclasses | Feats
Not sure if homebrewery allows but maybe put a link in the UA article in the Ranger Conclave section. Should have mentioned that in my original post.
I am pretty sure homebrewery will allow it. Thanks for the suggestion. Original doc has been updated.
Current Characters I am playing: Dr Konstantin van Wulf | Taegen Willowrun | Mad Magnar
Check out my homebrew: Items | Monsters | Spells | Subclasses | Feats