Great video with good explanations. Even with the wording on One Spell with a Spell Slot per Turn the definition of Reaction states you can still do so even you also take an action, bonus action or both.
With this wording I think you are able to still cast a Counterspell even if you already cast a leveled spell. I have been trying to find more information regarding this as I feel it still needs clarification but this is also just my personal interpretation of the wording.
Great video with good explanations. Even with the wording on One Spell with a Spell Slot per Turn the definition of Reaction states you can still do so even you also take an action, bonus action or both.
With this wording I think you are able to still cast a Counterspell even if you already cast a leveled spell. I have been trying to find more information regarding this as I feel it still needs clarification but this is also just my personal interpretation of the wording.
You can't cast two spells on the same turn if both use a spell slot. It doesn't matter if they use an action, bonus action, or reaction.
Great video with good explanations. Even with the wording on One Spell with a Spell Slot per Turn the definition of Reaction states you can still do so even you also take an action, bonus action or both.
With this wording I think you are able to still cast a Counterspell even if you already cast a leveled spell. I have been trying to find more information regarding this as I feel it still needs clarification but this is also just my personal interpretation of the wording.
Yeah, the Leveled Spell rule stops this. You can use a Reaction if you've already used your Action that same turn, but that doesn't enable you to break the other rule. There's more Actions and Reactions than just what uses spell slots, after all.
When you cast a spell such as Charm Person, that can be cast with a higher-level spell slot to target an additional creature, you can spend 1 Sorcery Point to increase the spell’s effective level by 1.
So by my understanding (which is likely wrong) but does this now mean you could use it on scorching ray and get an additional ray?
When you cast a spell such as Charm Person, that can be cast with a higher-level spell slot to target an additional creature, you can spend 1 Sorcery Point to increase the spell’s effective level by 1.
So by my understanding (which is likely wrong) but does this now mean you could use it on scorching ray and get an additional ray?
I don't think so. Scorching Ray doesn't upcast to add more targets, but to add more rays. Those rays can be used to target the same creature, so I don't think that would qualify.
When you cast a spell such as Charm Person, that can be cast with a higher-level spell slot to target an additional creature, you can spend 1 Sorcery Point to increase the spell’s effective level by 1.
So by my understanding (which is likely wrong) but does this now mean you could use it on scorching ray and get an additional ray?
I don't think so, because the upcast doesn't say "... can target one additional ...".
In my opinion, those are the keywords to check now.
Some spells that do qualify for Twinned Spell that didn't before are Bane and Bless (if you take Magic Initiate or the Divine Soul origin), Charm Person and Jump at higher levels, and Catnap from Xanathar's.
They should have renamed "Twinned Spell" to something else. The new design isn't even recognizable and doesn't feel at all like a spell being "twinned". Massive nerf to say the least. There are only so many Sorcerer spells which even have this wording. Examples include Banishment, Blindness/Deafness, Charm Person, Enhance Ability, Fly, Gaseous Form, Hold Monster, Hold Person, Invisibility, Jump and Spider Climb.
They should have renamed "Twinned Spell" to something else. The new design isn't even recognizable and doesn't feel at all like a spell being "twinned". Massive nerf to say the least. There are only so many Sorcerer spells which even have this wording. Examples include Banishment, Blindness/Deafness, Charm Person, Enhance Ability, Fly, Gaseous Form, Hold Monster, Hold Person, Invisibility, Jump and Spider Climb.
I think it's the consequences of back-compatibility. The old one was a mechanical and balance mess, so needed replacing or removing, and if they drop it, the old one still exists.
Still, one level of upcast for one sorcery point isn't bad, even if it's pretty limited.
It always sucks when something that used to work stops working, but it's probably for the best. There's spells that are clearly intended to have limited targets (if they wanted you to have more, they'd include an upcasting option for it) and the old version bypassed that. The biggest losses are probably twinned Levitate (which I consider a save or die), Haste and Disintegrate.
Adding a target to Blindness/Deafness, Darkvision (which now goes to 150 ft), Spider Climb, Fly, Invisibility or Hold Person for just 1 point is a good deal though.
Great video with good explanations. Even with the wording on One Spell with a Spell Slot per Turn the definition of Reaction states you can still do so even you also take an action, bonus action or both.
With this wording I think you are able to still cast a Counterspell even if you already cast a leveled spell. I have been trying to find more information regarding this as I feel it still needs clarification but this is also just my personal interpretation of the wording.
You can't cast two spells on the same turn if both use a spell slot. It doesn't matter if they use an action, bonus action, or reaction.
For me it's game-breaking if my mage casts Magic Missile on his turn, and then my fighter gets shoved off a cliff and dies because I couldn't react with Feather Fall.
This is why I've already started a House Rules document... (c.f. dropping and drawing a weapon requires a Utilize action, and the whole deal with Surprise).
Notes: (Remember to edit your posts to avoid accidentally repeated quotes/copy paste)
For me it's game-breaking if my mage casts Magic Missile on his turn, and then my fighter gets shoved off a cliff and dies because I couldn't react with Feather Fall. This is why I've already started a House Rules document... (c.f. dropping and drawing a weapon requires a Utilize action, and the whole deal with Surprise).
Your ability to cast Feather Fall off-turn is completely unaffected. The single spell slot per turn rule is per turn, not per round.
So, if I cast Magic Missile, and then start moving, and an ogre has a Ready action to shove me off the cliff (during my moving on my turn), I am hosed.
Yes, being a bit of a Rules Lawyer here. It just seems that all spells cast as a Reaction should be exempt. Aside from the ridiculous scenario above, they will all be off-turn (including the Counterspell noted in the video).
In the 10 years I've been playing 5e I can only recall maybe one time the equivalent rule (bonus action spell rule) got in the way of a same-turn reaction, and it didn't involve Feather Fall. 9/10 times the new rule just means you can't rely on Shield to save you if you were planning on casting a leveled spell and then moving without withdrawing.
The new version is basically how everyone misquoted the bonus action rule anyways, and it has the happy side effect of squashing the "I counter your counterspell" interaction.
So, if I cast Magic Missile, and then start moving, and an ogre has a Ready action to shove me off the cliff (during my moving on my turn), I am hosed.
So, if I cast Magic Missile, and then start moving, and an ogre has a Ready action to shove me off the cliff (during my moving on my turn), I am hosed.
Yes, being a bit of a Rules Lawyer here. It just seems that all spells cast as a Reaction should be exempt. Aside from the ridiculous scenario above, they will all be off-turn (including the Counterspell noted in the video).
A lamentable casualty of the change, unfortunately. However, most of the time I don’t think the new rule will make any difference, and the times it does won’t be game breaking. And it rather tantalizingly opens up a few, limited possibilities for having your cake and eating it, too.
There are ways to cast spells without slots: spell scrolls (reasonably affordable to craft for low level spells), features, and feats. If you took Feather Fall for Magic Initiate you could go through your above scenario once per day with no problems. Or keep one spell scroll of Feather Fall on you at all times in case it ever comes up. Applied to Bonus Action spells like Misty Step, uses are limited but powerful in ways not possible before. I can imagine some dire moment where a wizard with Fey Touched, completely surrounded, Misty Steps away and drops a wicked AoE spell where they were just standing a moment before. It’s going to create some epic moments.
As an aside, nobody actually knows how most magic items work now, until the DMG comes out, so I would reserve comment on the interaction with things like magic wands.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u5irURNRkDo
A video to explain spellcasting using the new rules.
Instagram/YouTube CeCe.Simulacrum
Twitch yourwelcomez
Great video with good explanations. Even with the wording on One Spell with a Spell Slot per Turn the definition of Reaction states you can still do so even you also take an action, bonus action or both.
https://www.dndbeyond.com/sources/dnd/phb-2024/rules-glossary#Reaction
With this wording I think you are able to still cast a Counterspell even if you already cast a leveled spell. I have been trying to find more information regarding this as I feel it still needs clarification but this is also just my personal interpretation of the wording.
You can't cast two spells on the same turn if both use a spell slot. It doesn't matter if they use an action, bonus action, or reaction.
Yeah, the Leveled Spell rule stops this. You can use a Reaction if you've already used your Action that same turn, but that doesn't enable you to break the other rule. There's more Actions and Reactions than just what uses spell slots, after all.
Twinned Spell
Cost: 1 Sorcery Point
When you cast a spell such as Charm Person, that can be cast with a higher-level spell slot to target an additional creature, you can spend 1 Sorcery Point to increase the spell’s effective level by 1.
So by my understanding (which is likely wrong) but does this now mean you could use it on scorching ray and get an additional ray?
I don't think so. Scorching Ray doesn't upcast to add more targets, but to add more rays. Those rays can be used to target the same creature, so I don't think that would qualify.
I don't think so, because the upcast doesn't say "... can target one additional ...".
In my opinion, those are the keywords to check now.
Some spells that do qualify for Twinned Spell that didn't before are Bane and Bless (if you take Magic Initiate or the Divine Soul origin), Charm Person and Jump at higher levels, and Catnap from Xanathar's.
The Forum Infestation (TM)
They should have renamed "Twinned Spell" to something else. The new design isn't even recognizable and doesn't feel at all like a spell being "twinned". Massive nerf to say the least. There are only so many Sorcerer spells which even have this wording. Examples include Banishment, Blindness/Deafness, Charm Person, Enhance Ability, Fly, Gaseous Form, Hold Monster, Hold Person, Invisibility, Jump and Spider Climb.
I think it's the consequences of back-compatibility. The old one was a mechanical and balance mess, so needed replacing or removing, and if they drop it, the old one still exists.
Still, one level of upcast for one sorcery point isn't bad, even if it's pretty limited.
It always sucks when something that used to work stops working, but it's probably for the best. There's spells that are clearly intended to have limited targets (if they wanted you to have more, they'd include an upcasting option for it) and the old version bypassed that. The biggest losses are probably twinned Levitate (which I consider a save or die), Haste and Disintegrate.
Adding a target to Blindness/Deafness, Darkvision (which now goes to 150 ft), Spider Climb, Fly, Invisibility or Hold Person for just 1 point is a good deal though.
The Forum Infestation (TM)
For me it's game-breaking if my mage casts Magic Missile on his turn, and then my fighter gets shoved off a cliff and dies because I couldn't react with Feather Fall.
This is why I've already started a House Rules document... (c.f. dropping and drawing a weapon requires a Utilize action, and the whole deal with Surprise).
Your ability to cast Feather Fall off-turn is completely unaffected. The single spell slot per turn rule is per turn, not per round.
So, if I cast Magic Missile, and then start moving, and an ogre has a Ready action to shove me off the cliff (during my moving on my turn), I am hosed.
Yes, being a bit of a Rules Lawyer here. It just seems that all spells cast as a Reaction should be exempt. Aside from the ridiculous scenario above, they will all be off-turn (including the Counterspell noted in the video).
In the 10 years I've been playing 5e I can only recall maybe one time the equivalent rule (bonus action spell rule) got in the way of a same-turn reaction, and it didn't involve Feather Fall. 9/10 times the new rule just means you can't rely on Shield to save you if you were planning on casting a leveled spell and then moving without withdrawing.
The new version is basically how everyone misquoted the bonus action rule anyways, and it has the happy side effect of squashing the "I counter your counterspell" interaction.
The Forum Infestation (TM)
Yep. Working as intended.
A lamentable casualty of the change, unfortunately. However, most of the time I don’t think the new rule will make any difference, and the times it does won’t be game breaking. And it rather tantalizingly opens up a few, limited possibilities for having your cake and eating it, too.
There are ways to cast spells without slots: spell scrolls (reasonably affordable to craft for low level spells), features, and feats. If you took Feather Fall for Magic Initiate you could go through your above scenario once per day with no problems. Or keep one spell scroll of Feather Fall on you at all times in case it ever comes up. Applied to Bonus Action spells like Misty Step, uses are limited but powerful in ways not possible before. I can imagine some dire moment where a wizard with Fey Touched, completely surrounded, Misty Steps away and drops a wicked AoE spell where they were just standing a moment before. It’s going to create some epic moments.
As an aside, nobody actually knows how most magic items work now, until the DMG comes out, so I would reserve comment on the interaction with things like magic wands.