So, most DMs I've played with make us roll passive ability checks. Notably Insight and Perception. Now, the rules say that to make a passive check, the DM should use the passive score of the ability in question. But when I asked other DMs about it, most say it's at the DM's discretion to use the passive score or to roll for them. But I can't find anywhere in the rules that says that. So where does this idea come from?
So, most DMs I've played with make us roll passive ability checks. Notably Insight and Perception. Now, the rules say that to make a passive check, the DM should use the passive score of the ability in question. But when I asked other DMs about it, most say it's at the DM's discretion to use the passive score or to roll for them. But I can't find anywhere in the rules that says that. So where does this idea come from?
How do you roll a passive ability check? That's an oxymoron.
Happens quite often: - The party enters a room, the DM tells us to roll for perception (without us asking for it or taking the Search action). - An NPC tells us something, and the DM tells us to roll for insight (without us asking for it either)
So, most DMs I've played with make us roll passive ability checks. Notably Insight and Perception. Now, the rules say that to make a passive check, the DM should use the passive score of the ability in question. But when I asked other DMs about it, most say it's at the DM's discretion to use the passive score or to roll for them. But I can't find anywhere in the rules that says that. So where does this idea come from?
If you're looking for what the rules say, they're in the 2014 PHB (also in the Rules Glossary):
Passive Perception. Sometimes your DM will determine whether your character notices something without asking you to make a Wisdom (Perception) check; the DM uses your Passive Perception instead. Passive Perception is a score that reflects a general awareness of your surroundings when you’re not actively looking for something [...]
And the general rule about using other abilities and skills can be found in the 2024 DMG:
Passive Checks
Ability checks normally represent a character’s active effort to accomplish something, but occasionally you need a passive measure of how good a character is at doing a thing. Passive Perception is the most common example. (See “Perception” later in this chapter.) You can extend the concept of a passive ability check to other abilities and skills.
For example, if your game features a lot of social interaction, you can record each character’s Passive Insight score, calculated in much the same way as Passive Perception: 10 plus all modifiers that normally apply to a Wisdom (Insight) check.
A passive check is a special kind of ability check that doesn't involve any die rolls. Such a check can represent the average result for a task done repeatedly, such as searching for secret doors over and over again, or can be used when the DM wants to secretly determine whether the characters succeed at something without rolling dice, such as noticing a hidden monster.
At a guess it is because most of the time people prefers to roll for things rather than having things just happen (or not) without being able to influence events.
So why are my DMs asking me to roll for perception instead of using my passive score when I'm not actively searching something?
DMs can ask for a perception check as they wish; it does not have to be related to the character asking a question or taking a specific action. That's a perception check that is based on the luck of the dice plus your modifier, rather than a passive perception which has the same value all the time.
For myself, I might use passive perception for deciding if the party sees monsters stealthing in or for any situation where I don't want to alert the players something might be up. Hard for low level monsters to sneak up on my ranger character with a passive perception of 18.
On the other hand, for your party that does not have high values for passive perception, allowing them to roll may give them a chance to perceive something that their passive value would not permit.
In general, if there's an interaction where I want to have a wider range of outcomes or where I will enjoy making them just a wee bit paranoid or where I have a range of possibilities about what they might notice, I'll call for a roll and compare that to a DC.
It's super fun to have them roll for perception... and fail. :) "Oh, you don't notice anything." or just "Thanks." :-)
So, most DMs I've played with make us roll passive ability checks. Notably Insight and Perception. Now, the rules say that to make a passive check, the DM should use the passive score of the ability in question. But when I asked other DMs about it, most say it's at the DM's discretion to use the passive score or to roll for them.
But I can't find anywhere in the rules that says that. So where does this idea come from?
How do you roll a passive ability check? That's an oxymoron.
Happens quite often:
- The party enters a room, the DM tells us to roll for perception (without us asking for it or taking the Search action).
- An NPC tells us something, and the DM tells us to roll for insight (without us asking for it either)
If you're looking for what the rules say, they're in the 2014 PHB (also in the Rules Glossary):
And the general rule about using other abilities and skills can be found in the 2024 DMG:
This is from the 2014 PHB:
I discovered the thread Passive Checks - How do they work? How should they work? some time ago. If you have time to read it, it has some interesting opinions on the topic.
So why are my DMs asking me to roll for perception instead of using my passive score when I'm not actively searching something?
At a guess it is because most of the time people prefers to roll for things rather than having things just happen (or not) without being able to influence events.
I don't know, Natrel. Each DM is different. A passive check is a DM's tool after all.
Perhaps they figure that, in the circumstances, your characters would be actively paying attention.
Or maybe they just don't like passive checks, or want to give you a chance to discover something that's above your passives.
There are many options. It's mostly a matter of DM style. There's no correct way to do it.
DMs can ask for a perception check as they wish; it does not have to be related to the character asking a question or taking a specific action. That's a perception check that is based on the luck of the dice plus your modifier, rather than a passive perception which has the same value all the time.
For myself, I might use passive perception for deciding if the party sees monsters stealthing in or for any situation where I don't want to alert the players something might be up. Hard for low level monsters to sneak up on my ranger character with a passive perception of 18.
On the other hand, for your party that does not have high values for passive perception, allowing them to roll may give them a chance to perceive something that their passive value would not permit.
In general, if there's an interaction where I want to have a wider range of outcomes or where I will enjoy making them just a wee bit paranoid or where I have a range of possibilities about what they might notice, I'll call for a roll and compare that to a DC.
It's super fun to have them roll for perception... and fail. :) "Oh, you don't notice anything." or just "Thanks." :-)