I am interested in knowing why Druids are unable to wildshape into other members of their own species. For example, a human into another human. Is there a reason in the lore as to why they are unable to do that?
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A caffeinated nerd who has played TTRPGs or a number of years and is very much a fantasy adventure geek.
Humans are in the humanoid category which does not fit with:
Wild Shape
Starting at 2nd level, you can use your action to magically assume the shape of a beast that you have seen before. ...
That's the category of creature that a druid can wildshape into. I suspect the reason may partly involve game mechanics and an attempt at balance. Lore-wise, I don't think d&d druids have ever had a different base of wildshape ability.
Forgotten Realms went to the trouble of having the Goddess of Magic deliberately set limits to magic and spells. If other settings have lore on that stuff, I don't know it.
Not in terms of lore, but in terms of mechanics, I think it would make the ability OP. The ability to substitute any person you've ever seen? Likely without even a check? Yeah, that's pretty OP.
On a related note but not intended to be rhetorical at all...would you allow a Druid to become a specific pet? Or do they just become a typical example of that beast? To illustrate, you see a king's pet dog Rover. Can you become Rover, or just a dog?
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If you're not willing or able to to discuss in good faith, then don't be surprised if I don't respond, there are better things in life for me to do than humour you. This signature is that response.
Not in terms of lore, but in terms of mechanics, I think it would make the ability OP. The ability to substitute any person you've ever seen? Likely without even a check? Yeah, that's pretty OP.
On a related note but not intended to be rhetorical at all...would you allow a Druid to become a specific pet? Or do they just become a typical example of that beast? To illustrate, you see a king's pet dog Rover. Can you become Rover, or just a dog?
They could shift into an exact duplicate of that dog (in my opinion) but they'd have to really study the dog to get the temperament down.
They would also lack the memories of the dog, and any specific knowledge that it might have.
I don't actually think that's RAW though.
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A caffeinated nerd who has played TTRPGs or a number of years and is very much a fantasy adventure geek.
I would also add the flavor of a druid is about nature,.
The idea of wildshape was a way to be more nature like, so the argument that would be harder to discount would be why cant a druid change into a plant.
this is also demonstrated with low levels, weaker monsters since the druid is not as in touch with nature, flavor wise.
Mimicry is more for illusion or the changling/doppelganger species, and out of the current accepted concept of the druid.
this is just a quick and dirty answer for the topic,.
I would also add the flavor of a druid is about nature,.
The idea of wildshape was a way to be more nature like, so the argument that would be harder to discount would be why cant a druid change into a plant.
this is also demonstrated with low levels, weaker monsters since the druid is not as in touch with nature, flavor wise.
Mimicry is more for illusion or the changling/doppelganger species, and out of the current accepted concept of the druid.
this is just a quick and dirty answer for the topic,.
Seems like the best thing to do here would be, to be a Changeling Druid of the Circle of The Moon.
Increased Wildshape ability + the ability to become other people.
Then at later levels, add magic items for to further increase the charactere INT, WIS and CHA saves. (I am not sure off the top of my head what items would do that).
It feels a bit min/maxie though.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
A caffeinated nerd who has played TTRPGs or a number of years and is very much a fantasy adventure geek.
Seems like the best thing to do here would be, to be a Changeling Druid of the Circle of The Moon.
Increased Wildshape ability + the ability to become other people.
Then at later levels, add magic items for to further increase the charactere INT, WIS and CHA saves. (I am not sure off the top of my head what items would do that).
It feels a bit min/maxie though.
This would be a rather cool concept.
Sort of like the ultimate changeling. If it were a book or a movie the character could struggle with what am I and what is my true self.
Could make an interesting villain as well.
If you are old, you remember editions of dnd (BECMI) where druids were offshoots of clerics and did not shape change at all without a specific spell.
had to be a cleric for so many levels then switch to druid.
Fluff. The druid is supposed to have a deep connection with nature. Wild shape implies that you're transforming into a wild animal, not a civilized or semi-civilized humanoid.
Crunch. You want an ability that gives the character a mechanical advantage that is in keeping with the fluff, that is not too overpowered or potentially useless, and one that is fairly simple and streamlined. I think they went with beasts and didn't add plants because it's generally a lot more advantageous to transform into a wolf than it is to transform into a tree (streamlined). There are also several carnivorous plants in the game that have unique abilities that might be challenging for a less seasoned player or GM to manage (simple).
Lore-wise you are calling upon the primal forces of nature and being imbued with the power of various totems of that primal force. You're a shaman, not a shape shifter.
Get a disguise kit or cast minor illusion otherwise
It's because that's the purview of other classes. It's a brand of political/social trickery that's been reserved for the illusion school of magic.
This is it. Mechanically, polymorph is not meant to be a low level Druid power. Sometimes the constructs and structures of the game are for "...because it's fun and makes a balanced game." reasons vs story or logic.
Beasts only is good flavor and mechanically sound to me.
Not in terms of lore, but in terms of mechanics, I think it would make the ability OP. The ability to substitute any person you've ever seen? Likely without even a check? Yeah, that's pretty OP.
On a related note but not intended to be rhetorical at all...would you allow a Druid to become a specific pet? Or do they just become a typical example of that beast? To illustrate, you see a king's pet dog Rover. Can you become Rover, or just a dog?
They could shift into an exact duplicate of that dog (in my opinion) but they'd have to really study the dog to get the temperament down.
They would also lack the memories of the dog, and any specific knowledge that it might have.
I don't actually think that's RAW though.
There's a group where the Druid can wildshape into a specific Wildcat she had befriended when freed him as a kitten from a hunter's trap. They grew up together, and he "peacefully" passed away of old age. (Quotes used because there's more to that story afterward.) As for anything else, they are generic, non-specific beasts of the intended kind with her wild shape.
Human. Male. Possibly. Don't be a divider. My characters' backgrounds are written like instruction manuals rather than stories. My opinion and preferences don't mean you're wrong. I am 99.7603% convinced that the digital dice are messing with me. I roll high when nobody's looking and low when anyone else can see.🎲 “It's a bit early to be thinking about an epitaph. No?” will be my epitaph.
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I am interested in knowing why Druids are unable to wildshape into other members of their own species. For example, a human into another human. Is there a reason in the lore as to why they are unable to do that?
A caffeinated nerd who has played TTRPGs or a number of years and is very much a fantasy adventure geek.
Humans are in the humanoid category which does not fit with:
That's the category of creature that a druid can wildshape into. I suspect the reason may partly involve game mechanics and an attempt at balance. Lore-wise, I don't think d&d druids have ever had a different base of wildshape ability.
Yes, I understand this, but what I was asking, is why. Why is this the case?
A caffeinated nerd who has played TTRPGs or a number of years and is very much a fantasy adventure geek.
Forgotten Realms went to the trouble of having the Goddess of Magic deliberately set limits to magic and spells. If other settings have lore on that stuff, I don't know it.
Not in terms of lore, but in terms of mechanics, I think it would make the ability OP. The ability to substitute any person you've ever seen? Likely without even a check? Yeah, that's pretty OP.
On a related note but not intended to be rhetorical at all...would you allow a Druid to become a specific pet? Or do they just become a typical example of that beast? To illustrate, you see a king's pet dog Rover. Can you become Rover, or just a dog?
If you're not willing or able to to discuss in good faith, then don't be surprised if I don't respond, there are better things in life for me to do than humour you. This signature is that response.
They could shift into an exact duplicate of that dog (in my opinion) but they'd have to really study the dog to get the temperament down.
They would also lack the memories of the dog, and any specific knowledge that it might have.
I don't actually think that's RAW though.
A caffeinated nerd who has played TTRPGs or a number of years and is very much a fantasy adventure geek.
It's because that's the purview of other classes. It's a brand of political/social trickery that's been reserved for the illusion school of magic.
Choir of Fire had a great answer.
I would also add the flavor of a druid is about nature,.
The idea of wildshape was a way to be more nature like, so the argument that would be harder to discount would be why cant a druid change into a plant.
this is also demonstrated with low levels, weaker monsters since the druid is not as in touch with nature, flavor wise.
Mimicry is more for illusion or the changling/doppelganger species, and out of the current accepted concept of the druid.
this is just a quick and dirty answer for the topic,.
Game over man... Game over! -- Pvt. Hudson
Seems like the best thing to do here would be, to be a Changeling Druid of the Circle of The Moon.
Increased Wildshape ability + the ability to become other people.
Then at later levels, add magic items for to further increase the charactere INT, WIS and CHA saves. (I am not sure off the top of my head what items would do that).
It feels a bit min/maxie though.
A caffeinated nerd who has played TTRPGs or a number of years and is very much a fantasy adventure geek.
This would be a rather cool concept.
Sort of like the ultimate changeling. If it were a book or a movie the character could struggle with what am I and what is my true self.
Could make an interesting villain as well.
If you are old, you remember editions of dnd (BECMI) where druids were offshoots of clerics and did not shape change at all without a specific spell.
had to be a cleric for so many levels then switch to druid.
Game over man... Game over! -- Pvt. Hudson
There are two reasons that I can think of:
Lore-wise you are calling upon the primal forces of nature and being imbued with the power of various totems of that primal force. You're a shaman, not a shape shifter.
Get a disguise kit or cast minor illusion otherwise
This is it. Mechanically, polymorph is not meant to be a low level Druid power. Sometimes the constructs and structures of the game are for "...because it's fun and makes a balanced game." reasons vs story or logic.
Beasts only is good flavor and mechanically sound to me.
There's a group where the Druid can wildshape into a specific Wildcat she had befriended when freed him as a kitten from a hunter's trap. They grew up together, and he "peacefully" passed away of old age. (Quotes used because there's more to that story afterward.) As for anything else, they are generic, non-specific beasts of the intended kind with her wild shape.
Human. Male. Possibly. Don't be a divider.
My characters' backgrounds are written like instruction manuals rather than stories. My opinion and preferences don't mean you're wrong.
I am 99.7603% convinced that the digital dice are messing with me. I roll high when nobody's looking and low when anyone else can see.🎲
“It's a bit early to be thinking about an epitaph. No?” will be my epitaph.