I am new to DnD. We have started Hoard of the Dragon Queen and I am about to hit level 3. I am playing a GOO Tomb Warlock. I know I'm not meant to be a melee character but I have heard Hoard of the Dragon Queen is dangerous(?).
I noticed that Shillelagh is a bonus action. I have Two Weapon Fighting (Soldier background?). Am I allowed to cast Shadow blade (2d8) and Shillelagh on a club (1d8+CHR) and fight with the 2 weapons each turn? Both have the light property.
Is it worth doing this and if so what work be better defensively, Mirror Image or Armor of Agathys?
It's not impossible to do it, just a character decision if it is wise.
Few things to consider:
1) Shadow Blade and Shillelagh are both bonus action casting times so you will need 2 turns to get them both active. Shadow Blade is also going to use your concentration as well.
2) You can use Two Weapon Fighting with Shadow Blade + Club BUT you won't get your ability modifer to damage for which ever weapon is in your off hand.So, assuming right handed character, you need to decide whether you are going for right hand shadow blade (2d8+dex psychic), left hand Shillelagh (1d8 bludgeoning) or right hand Shillelagh (1d8 +cha bludgeoning) left hand (2d8 psychic).
3) To make best use of this you'll need to have the Fighting Style: Two Weapon which means multi classing to Fighter or Ranger and/or getting the Dual Weilder Feat. EDIT: amended wording based on reply below to: To make best use of this you'll need to have the Dual Weilder Feat and /or multi classing to Fighter or Ranger to ge the Two Weapon Fighting Style.
4) Defensive spells is again a bit more of a character choice: Armour of Agathys has a long duration but I view it as more of a "come and hit me" spell as you want creatures to hit you so you can deal the damage from the spell. I think Mirror Image is a better defensive spell and effectively means you can potnetially dodge 3 attacks and given you need to maintain concnetration on your Shadow Blade this might be the better option.
5) Don't forget you can throw the Shadow Blade and use a bonus action to summon it back to you so you can also be a ranged support as well.
6) Shillelagh can be cast on two seperate clubs (gain requires two turns to do) so if push comes ot shove you can always use a club in each hand. This bit is cheesy but if nothing is really happening you could always say you are walking around with a hand on each club and every minute you alternate casting Shillelagh on them so they are almost always active and ready. This also means you can free up a spell slot for something else (hold person, darkness, protection form evil & goodetc).
3) To make best use of this you'll need to have the Fighting Style: Two Weapon which means multi classing to Fighter or Ranger and/or getting the Dual Weilder Feat.
correction, the dual weilder feat does in fact not grant you the two weapon fighting fighting style, you will have to get that elsewhere
Is it worth doing this and if so what work be better defensively, Mirror Image or Armor of Agathys?
that is a matter of taste honestly, mirror image can be a bit unreliable at times as it is up to luck but at the same time it will significantly reduce your chance to get hit at all, armor of agathys grantees that at least a certain amount of damage is dealt to your enemy and a certain amount of damage is always prevented, regardless of luck or opponent. What you should be keeping in mind is concentration, whenever you take damage you must make a constitution saving throw to maintain concentration. This might make it better for you to pick mirror image, it depends on whether your dm thinks damage to temporary hit points would force you to make a con save to maintain concentration
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i am soup, with too many ideas (all of them very spicy) who has made sufficient homebrew material and character to last an thousand human lifetimes
6) Shillelagh can be cast on two seperate clubs (gain requires two turns to do) so if push comes ot shove you can always use a club in each hand. This bit is cheesy but if nothing is really happening you could always say you are walking around with a hand on each club and every minute you alternate casting Shillelagh on them so they are almost always active and ready. This also means you can free up a spell slot for something else (hold person, darkness, protection form evil & goodetc).
Nope, it can only be cast once;
"The wood of a club or quarterstaff you are holding is imbued with nature's power. For the duration, you can use your spellcasting ability instead of Strength for the attack and damage rolls of melee attacks using that weapon, and the weapon's damage die becomes a d8. The weapon also becomes magical, if it isn't already. The spell ends if you cast it again or if you let go of the weapon."
last line of a spell catches me out again, although i can't see a reason you shouldn;t be able to cast it on two different club if you keep the caveat that the spell ends if you let go of them.
You don't gain Two Weapon Fighting from the Soldier background. You'd need a level in Fighter, or two in Ranger, or three in Bard (College of Swords) to get that. It's not really worth it in my opinion.
If you're playing a Tomelock, to gain some melee ability take the Primal Savagery cantrip from Druid (XGTE). It's a D10 melee spell that gives you some options in close quarters. For the other options I'd definitely take Guidance, and the third based on whatever appeals.
You should have the Armor of Shadows invocation to give you on demand mage armor (basically +1 studded leather).
Perhaps, at level 4, take the "Moderately Armored" feat in order to gain proficiency with medium armor and shield.
Armor of Agathys is handy because of the extra HP. I saved my character (6/2 Swordlock) from some injury by having a 15HP temp hit point buffer. Mirror Image is good for avoiding attacks.
You don't gain Two Weapon Fighting from the Soldier background. You'd need a level in Fighter, or two in Ranger, or three in Bard (College of Swords) to get that. It's not really worth it in my opinion.
I'm seeing;
Actions in Combat Two-Weapon Fighting
under BONUS ACTIONS in my dndbeyond character sheet and thats throwing me.
I think I will just stay out of melee combat and learn how to use spells properly.
If you have two light weapons you can use your bonus attack to make a single attack with one of the weapons but you can't add your damage modifier to it unless you have the duel wielder ability from fighter/ranger/bard.
You don't gain Two Weapon Fighting from the Soldier background. You'd need a level in Fighter, or two in Ranger, or three in Bard (College of Swords) to get that. It's not really worth it in my opinion.
I was confused by people saying that you got the two weapon fighting style from the background as well. I checked and couldn't find it anywhere. 2 levels of Paladin would get it as well.
If you're new to D&D, it's probably best to avoid doing something too crazy with your character. Shadow Blade is a good choice for Warlocks, it's not too crazy. But using Shillelagh is somewhat unique. It's not too bad for levels 1-4, but once you reach level 5 and martial classes get extra attack and cantrips get an extra damage die, it's not very good anymore. Shillelagh with extra attack, or even with a Cleric's Divine Strike isn't bad (especially with Spiritual Weapon on top), but as a Great Old One Tome Lock, you won't have extra attack or really anything at all to make Shillelagh worth using. Shadow Blade will be 3D8 + dexterity or strength psychic damage once you're level 5, so it's still a good tactic even after you reach level 5. But Shillelagh won't be that good for a GOO Tomelock.
The easiest path would be to do the typical Hex + Eldritch Blast strategy, and using your bonus action to move your Hex around. A build with Shadow Blade combined with either Green Flame Blade or Booming Blade is also quite viable. But I can't see Shillelagh being a good option.
I'm glad that you're going to try the easy path and stay out of melee and to try to use spells properly. Hex + Eldritch Blast is a very powerful combination, and I hope that you have a ton of fun with it once you get a second beam on your Eldritch Blast at level 5.
booming blade and green flame blade don't work with shadowblade anymore cause it doesn't have a cost associated with it. (a melee weapon worth at least 1 sp). As to all these guys saying you have to multiclass to get two weapon fighting style........ you can get it from fighting initiate. Yes Shil and Shadow blade are both bonus actions, Summon your blade on turn 1, and shil your staff on turn 2, this is pretty simple stuff, or in a lot of games you get a surprise round, summon your shadow blade and shil on turn 1. There is just sooo much misinformation in this thread, and since it shows up high on google I figured hey, let's clear some stuff up.
Finally, the Shadow Blade is a weapon and uses your attack modifier, don't forget to add that in as if you decided Dueling with a sentinel shield or something is better than going this duel wielding route, you get to add not only your STR/DEX mods like any other weapon, but also your Dueling +2.
Hi,
I am new to DnD. We have started Hoard of the Dragon Queen and I am about to hit level 3.
I am playing a GOO Tomb Warlock. I know I'm not meant to be a melee character but I have heard Hoard of the Dragon Queen is dangerous(?).
I noticed that Shillelagh is a bonus action. I have Two Weapon Fighting (Soldier background?). Am I allowed to cast Shadow blade (2d8) and Shillelagh on a club (1d8+CHR) and fight with the 2 weapons each turn? Both have the light property.
Is it worth doing this and if so what work be better defensively, Mirror Image or Armor of Agathys?
Thanks
It's not impossible to do it, just a character decision if it is wise.
Few things to consider:
1) Shadow Blade and Shillelagh are both bonus action casting times so you will need 2 turns to get them both active. Shadow Blade is also going to use your concentration as well.
2) You can use Two Weapon Fighting with Shadow Blade + Club BUT you won't get your ability modifer to damage for which ever weapon is in your off hand.So, assuming right handed character, you need to decide whether you are going for right hand shadow blade (2d8+dex psychic), left hand Shillelagh (1d8 bludgeoning) or right hand Shillelagh (1d8 +cha bludgeoning) left hand (2d8 psychic).
3)
To make best use of this you'll need to have the Fighting Style: Two Weapon which means multi classing to Fighter or Ranger and/or getting the Dual Weilder Feat. EDIT: amended wording based on reply below to: To make best use of this you'll need to have the Dual Weilder Feat and /or multi classing to Fighter or Ranger to ge the Two Weapon Fighting Style.4) Defensive spells is again a bit more of a character choice: Armour of Agathys has a long duration but I view it as more of a "come and hit me" spell as you want creatures to hit you so you can deal the damage from the spell. I think Mirror Image is a better defensive spell and effectively means you can potnetially dodge 3 attacks and given you need to maintain concnetration on your Shadow Blade this might be the better option.
5) Don't forget you can throw the Shadow Blade and use a bonus action to summon it back to you so you can also be a ranged support as well.
6) Shillelagh can be cast on two seperate clubs (gain requires two turns to do) so if push comes ot shove you can always use a club in each hand. This bit is cheesy but if nothing is really happening you could always say you are walking around with a hand on each club and every minute you alternate casting Shillelagh on them so they are almost always active and ready. This also means you can free up a spell slot for something else (hold person, darkness, protection form evil & goodetc).
correction, the dual weilder feat does in fact not grant you the two weapon fighting fighting style, you will have to get that elsewhere
that is a matter of taste honestly, mirror image can be a bit unreliable at times as it is up to luck but at the same time it will significantly reduce your chance to get hit at all, armor of agathys grantees that at least a certain amount of damage is dealt to your enemy and a certain amount of damage is always prevented, regardless of luck or opponent. What you should be keeping in mind is concentration, whenever you take damage you must make a constitution saving throw to maintain concentration. This might make it better for you to pick mirror image, it depends on whether your dm thinks damage to temporary hit points would force you to make a con save to maintain concentration
i am soup, with too many ideas (all of them very spicy) who has made sufficient homebrew material and character to last an thousand human lifetimes
Nope, it can only be cast once;
"The wood of a club or quarterstaff you are holding is imbued with nature's power. For the duration, you can use your spellcasting ability instead of Strength for the attack and damage rolls of melee attacks using that weapon, and the weapon's damage die becomes a d8![]()
. The weapon also becomes magical, if it isn't already. The spell ends if you cast it again or if you let go of the weapon."
last line of a spell catches me out again, although i can't see a reason you shouldn;t be able to cast it on two different club if you keep the caveat that the spell ends if you let go of them.
I probably should have worded number 3) the other way round: get dual weilder feat or mc to get fighting style
You don't gain Two Weapon Fighting from the Soldier background. You'd need a level in Fighter, or two in Ranger, or three in Bard (College of Swords) to get that. It's not really worth it in my opinion.
If you're playing a Tomelock, to gain some melee ability take the Primal Savagery cantrip from Druid (XGTE). It's a D10 melee spell that gives you some options in close quarters. For the other options I'd definitely take Guidance, and the third based on whatever appeals.
You should have the Armor of Shadows invocation to give you on demand mage armor (basically +1 studded leather).
Perhaps, at level 4, take the "Moderately Armored" feat in order to gain proficiency with medium armor and shield.
Armor of Agathys is handy because of the extra HP. I saved my character (6/2 Swordlock) from some injury by having a 15HP temp hit point buffer. Mirror Image is good for avoiding attacks.
Thanks for the information everyone. I think I am trying to be too clever.
I'm seeing;
Actions in Combat
Two-Weapon Fighting
under BONUS ACTIONS in my dndbeyond character sheet and thats throwing me.
I think I will just stay out of melee combat and learn how to use spells properly.
Thanks again.
Sure thing.
If you have two light weapons you can use your bonus attack to make a single attack with one of the weapons but you can't add your damage modifier to it unless you have the duel wielder ability from fighter/ranger/bard.
Like I said, I don't think it's really worth it.
I was confused by people saying that you got the two weapon fighting style from the background as well. I checked and couldn't find it anywhere. 2 levels of Paladin would get it as well.
Paladin doesn't get the option. Apparently two-weapon fighting Paladins aren't in the D&D vision of Paladins.
(Though a level in Fighter will fix that right up)
Ahh yes, I have never played a Paladin, can't stand them. I knew they had a fighting style at level 2 and thought they would get the same options.
I like Paladins, but that strength 13 requirement to multiclass is a pain when I prefer high dexterity stealthy characters.
You can do a Dexadin, taking stealth and thieves' tools from your background, but no multiclassing with him.
Paladin needs a CHA 13 to multiclass, not STR.
An character needs to have an strength score of at least 13 and an charisma score of at least 13 if paladin is not your initial class
i am soup, with too many ideas (all of them very spicy) who has made sufficient homebrew material and character to last an thousand human lifetimes
The multi-class prerequisites for Paladin are 13 strength and 13 charisma.
They're one of those demanding classes.
If you're new to D&D, it's probably best to avoid doing something too crazy with your character. Shadow Blade is a good choice for Warlocks, it's not too crazy. But using Shillelagh is somewhat unique. It's not too bad for levels 1-4, but once you reach level 5 and martial classes get extra attack and cantrips get an extra damage die, it's not very good anymore. Shillelagh with extra attack, or even with a Cleric's Divine Strike isn't bad (especially with Spiritual Weapon on top), but as a Great Old One Tome Lock, you won't have extra attack or really anything at all to make Shillelagh worth using. Shadow Blade will be 3D8 + dexterity or strength psychic damage once you're level 5, so it's still a good tactic even after you reach level 5. But Shillelagh won't be that good for a GOO Tomelock.
The easiest path would be to do the typical Hex + Eldritch Blast strategy, and using your bonus action to move your Hex around. A build with Shadow Blade combined with either Green Flame Blade or Booming Blade is also quite viable. But I can't see Shillelagh being a good option.
I'm glad that you're going to try the easy path and stay out of melee and to try to use spells properly. Hex + Eldritch Blast is a very powerful combination, and I hope that you have a ton of fun with it once you get a second beam on your Eldritch Blast at level 5.
Thanks for this info! I had no thought about throwing shadows blade but this is gonna come in handy!
booming blade and green flame blade don't work with shadowblade anymore cause it doesn't have a cost associated with it. (a melee weapon worth at least 1 sp). As to all these guys saying you have to multiclass to get two weapon fighting style........ you can get it from fighting initiate. Yes Shil and Shadow blade are both bonus actions, Summon your blade on turn 1, and shil your staff on turn 2, this is pretty simple stuff, or in a lot of games you get a surprise round, summon your shadow blade and shil on turn 1. There is just sooo much misinformation in this thread, and since it shows up high on google I figured hey, let's clear some stuff up.
Finally, the Shadow Blade is a weapon and uses your attack modifier, don't forget to add that in as if you decided Dueling with a sentinel shield or something is better than going this duel wielding route, you get to add not only your STR/DEX mods like any other weapon, but also your Dueling +2.