How is this a suitable substitute for Drow, thematically or mechanically?

Quote from tdomingo >>

How is this a suitable substitute for Drow, thematically or mechanically?

Not sure.

scout seems like a better fit thematically, though it has the issue of CR 1/2 vs CR 1/4.

It's not, anymore than scouts make sense for Deep Gnomes.

I'm just gonna ignore the more stupid suggestions and use the 2014 statblocks for those creatures. Way wide of the mark, WOTC.

Quote from VitusW >>

Quote from tdomingo >>

How is this a suitable substitute for Drow, thematically or mechanically?

Not sure.

scout seems like a better fit thematically, though it has the issue of CR 1/2 vs CR 1/4.

 I came here to say the same thing. Scout makes a lot more sense.

Spell Save DC for Sanctuary should be on the statblock.

When you consider the lore, it makes sense. Male Drow of Lolth are limited in what they can become in the Faerun setting -- outside of a Dungeon Master's discretion -- and that would either be a Martial combatant like the Scout or Guard; or an arcane caster.

Female Drow of Lolth on the otherhand had a wider variety; but Drow of Lolth that were Acolyte Priests were typically only female.

With that out of the way -- this was a question about conversion and quite honestly; considering that the stat block says "Any Humanoid"; you could just as easily make it a Drow and give it the added species benefits of a Drow without over-tipping the CR.

As the conversion for your typical Drow, it just doesn't match anything you've seen before. I realize you could swap DEX and STR, switch the mace for a short sword, switch Radiant Flame's damage type necrotic, and maybe swap light for dancing lights, and it'd be much closer to the old stat block and still be on CR. I just think it's a lazy conversion.

Quote from tdomingo >>

As the conversion for your typical Drow, it just doesn't match anything you've seen before. I realize you could swap DEX and STR, switch the mace for a short sword, switch Radiant Flame's damage type necrotic, and maybe swap light for dancing lights, and it'd be much closer to the old stat block and still be on CR. I just think it's a lazy conversion.

 Again, I think it was merely an example and not so much laziness on WotC; because as I said -- you can take any non-specific humanoid Stat Block and give it a Drow Species Tag.

Honestly,  reading through the various similar sounding comments on other stat blocks -- I am getting the general sense that people would rather complain that all of the work wasn't done for them.

But you yourself gave an GM answer. The stat blocks as they are can be used as is, straight out of the book, with little to no changes but where is the fun in that? As a GM, you should already be using the stat blocks as a foundation and making minor tweaks.

1st -- this stat block is for a general Priest Acolyte but nowhere does WotC mention any Deities or Demon Princes; not only to keep it setting non-specific but also so that they don't have to just copy & paste the stat block a hundred different ways with minor tweaks.

A Human Acolyte Priest of Tyr is not going to be the same as a Mountain Dwarf Priest of Moardin; or a Silver Dragonborn Acolyte Priest of Bahamut -- and they shouldn't have the same stats, but they all share a similar foundation. 

2nd -- if you had 2 Drow Acolyte Priests; they shouldn't be identical because they aren't just clones of each other. If they both have the same AC or Equipment or Spells; it makes combat tedious and repetitive.  

Quote from SamTheDoomMaster >>

Quote from tdomingo >>

As the conversion for your typical Drow, it just doesn't match anything you've seen before. I realize you could swap DEX and STR, switch the mace for a short sword, switch Radiant Flame's damage type necrotic, and maybe swap light for dancing lights, and it'd be much closer to the old stat block and still be on CR. I just think it's a lazy conversion.

 Again, I think it was merely an example and not so much laziness on WotC; because as I said -- you can take any non-specific humanoid Stat Block and give it a Drow Species Tag.

Honestly,  reading through the various similar sounding comments on other stat blocks -- I am getting the general sense that people would rather complain that all of the work wasn't done for them.

But you yourself gave an GM answer. The stat blocks as they are can be used as is, straight out of the book, with little to no changes but where is the fun in that? As a GM, you should already be using the stat blocks as a foundation and making minor tweaks.

1st -- this stat block is for a general Priest Acolyte but nowhere does WotC mention any Deities or Demon Princes; not only to keep it setting non-specific but also so that they don't have to just copy & paste the stat block a hundred different ways with minor tweaks.

A Human Acolyte Priest of Tyr is not going to be the same as a Mountain Dwarf Priest of Moardin; or a Silver Dragonborn Acolyte Priest of Bahamut -- and they shouldn't have the same stats, but they all share a similar foundation. 

2nd -- if you had 2 Drow Acolyte Priests; they shouldn't be identical because they aren't just clones of each other. If they both have the same AC or Equipment or Spells; it makes combat tedious and repetitive.  

 I agree with you for the most part. The only issue with it I can see is those running modules. If someone were to try and run OotA as their first ever campaign, and just have faith in WOTC to have good conversions, then it will make for some really weird gameplay. Drow is probably the only one where that matters, because their poison is very important gameplay wise to the campaign as they are trying to capture their targets alive. God forbid you change the dow priestess of lolth for the Fiend Cultist, that fight becomes drastically different. Or worse the Drow Mage for the bandit deceiver which are absolutely nothing alike at all. One is a spell caster and the other is not at all. This really only effects brand new DMs, but just as a reminder the people generally using stuff like this are brand new DMs. Though in WOTC defense this would always be an issue if they weren't going to properly reprint every single entry. 

As someone who is currently running OotA using 2024 rules, I can safely say that converting them was easy enough, and Renwick Larkin has even posted more accurate conversions as well. I will admit that trying to convert stronger enemies in general is proving a challenge, like all the demon lords who have no easy template to compare to in 2024 MM, and DMG doesn't give anything to really help with that other than find a template that doesn't actually exist yet, but as far as this appendix goes it is only an issue for a first time DM in my opinion.

Quote from theron >>

Quote from SamTheDoomMaster >>

Quote from tdomingo >>

As the conversion for your typical Drow, it just doesn't match anything you've seen before. I realize you could swap DEX and STR, switch the mace for a short sword, switch Radiant Flame's damage type necrotic, and maybe swap light for dancing lights, and it'd be much closer to the old stat block and still be on CR. I just think it's a lazy conversion.

 Again, I think it was merely an example and not so much laziness on WotC; because as I said -- you can take any non-specific humanoid Stat Block and give it a Drow Species Tag.

Honestly,  reading through the various similar sounding comments on other stat blocks -- I am getting the general sense that people would rather complain that all of the work wasn't done for them.

But you yourself gave an GM answer. The stat blocks as they are can be used as is, straight out of the book, with little to no changes but where is the fun in that? As a GM, you should already be using the stat blocks as a foundation and making minor tweaks.

1st -- this stat block is for a general Priest Acolyte but nowhere does WotC mention any Deities or Demon Princes; not only to keep it setting non-specific but also so that they don't have to just copy & paste the stat block a hundred different ways with minor tweaks.

A Human Acolyte Priest of Tyr is not going to be the same as a Mountain Dwarf Priest of Moardin; or a Silver Dragonborn Acolyte Priest of Bahamut -- and they shouldn't have the same stats, but they all share a similar foundation. 

2nd -- if you had 2 Drow Acolyte Priests; they shouldn't be identical because they aren't just clones of each other. If they both have the same AC or Equipment or Spells; it makes combat tedious and repetitive.  

 I agree with you for the most part. The only issue with it I can see is those running modules. If someone were to try and run OotA as their first ever campaign, and just have faith in WOTC to have good conversions, then it will make for some really weird gameplay. Drow is probably the only one where that matters, because their poison is very important gameplay wise to the campaign as they are trying to capture their targets alive. God forbid you change the dow priestess of lolth for the Fiend Cultist, that fight becomes drastically different. Or worse the Drow Mage for the bandit deceiver which are absolutely nothing alike at all. One is a spell caster and the other is not at all. This really only effects brand new DMs, but just as a reminder the people generally using stuff like this are brand new DMs. Though in WOTC defense this would always be an issue if they weren't going to properly reprint every single entry. 

As someone who is currently running OotA using 2024 rules, I can safely say that converting them was easy enough, and Renwick Larkin has even posted more accurate conversions as well. I will admit that trying to convert stronger enemies in general is proving a challenge, like all the demon lords who have no easy template to compare to in 2024 MM, and DMG doesn't give anything to really help with that other than find a template that doesn't actually exist yet, but as far as this appendix goes it is only an issue for a first time DM in my opinion.

 I haven't had an opportunity for OotA yet with the 2024 update, although I suppose it wouldn't be difficult to do -- but I agree that for new DM's who still believe that you have to follow everything in the Module, instead of as a framework -- it has potential for being a little harder.

That said -- as a thought exercise more than anything, I did start going through CoS and honestly -- a lot of "conversions" were rather simple. Granted that is because I am not the type of GM to just take a statblock RAW and am always tweaking them during prep for my table.

exactly. Like I said, the only ones that should even care about the conversion appendix at all would be first time DMs, anyone else complaining really doesn't have a reason to. Frankly, if you are an experienced DM how often do you actually use RAW statblocks anyways? I barely even used the MM half the time anymore, and I run more homebrew campaigns then I do modules, so I can't really say what the issue is. I will say OotA is proving challenging only for the Demon Lords, because we don't have anything to compare them to. The only somewhat close statblocks are Ancient Dragons, who are really weird to use as a template because demon lords don't have breath weapons, or the Colossus which is a good comparison but when you have numerous demon lords who are supposed to be super unique basing them all off of the colossus or maybe the Empyrean is somewhat challenging. I cannot imagine Acererak or Halaster Blackstaff would be easy either honestly, but nothing an hour of work couldn't easily fix. Hopefully they release some kind of updated MPMM though, because things like BGDIA and OotA would be a nightmare for a brand new DM.

Quote from tdomingo >>

How is this a suitable substitute for Drow, thematically or mechanically?

It isn't. It's being used as a substitute because it's the only CR 1/4 humanoid in the 2025 monster manual. It's a poor fit and I'd definitely use the 2014 drow stat block instead. 

Why is a basic NPC worse than it's previous incarnation? It only gets one 1st level spell per day and doesn't even have cure wounds. It's cool and all that it has extra damage to its attacks, but one useful spell per day is just pathetic. It's worse than any first level spellcaster.