In other forum posts on this subject the consensus seems to be that magical armor can become Arcane Armor. That magical armor can’t be infused. But at level 9, you can infuse things other than the chest piece. Of course, there’s significant discussion and dissent because of the lack of clarity on those rules’ interactions noted in the OP.
I think the consensus makes the most sense because 5e generally allows players to use magical gauntlets, boots, etc. with magical armor, ignoring that in some instances (like plate armor) it would require replacing part of the armor. It would seem to require an express statement that Armorers can’t do that if that’s what was intended. And since artificers can create helms of awareness, gauntlets of ogre strength, winged boots, etc. by infusion, it would be particularly weird if they couldn’t use those items too just because they had a +1 breastplate.
From a flavor standpoint, though there are lots of ways to imagine how thunder gauntlets might mesh with magical/infused gauntlets like gauntlets of ogre strength, I think the easiest are to imagine brass knuckles or a piece that sits on the back of the gauntlet that emits the thunder damage. That in turn connects to your Arcane Armor with wires, pipes, ribbons, or whatever stylistically works for your Armorer.
In other forum posts on this subject the consensus seems to be that magical armor can become Arcane Armor. That magical armor can’t be infused. But at level 9, you can infuse things other than the chest piece. Of course, there’s significant discussion and dissent because of the lack of clarity on those rules’ interactions noted in the OP.
I think the consensus makes the most sense because 5e generally allows players to use magical gauntlets, boots, etc. with magical armor, ignoring that in some instances (like plate armor) it would require replacing part of the armor. It would seem to require an express statement that Armorers can’t do that if that’s what was intended. And since artificers can create helms of awareness, gauntlets of ogre strength, winged boots, etc. by infusion, it would be particularly weird if they couldn’t use those items too just because they had a +1 breastplate.
From a flavor standpoint, though there are lots of ways to imagine how thunder gauntlets might mesh with magical/infused gauntlets like gauntlets of ogre strength, I think the easiest are to imagine brass knuckles or a piece that sits on the back of the gauntlet that emits the thunder damage. That in turn connects to your Arcane Armor with wires, pipes, ribbons, or whatever stylistically works for your Armorer.
Yeah the Arcane Armor does not specify that you cannot use magic armor for it and I think that is fine.
I would draw the line at infusion as that part is abundantly clear that you cannot infuse a magic item. Each part of that armor is magical not just the breastplate so I would rule you cannot use magical armor with artificer infusions but you could use it as Arcane Armor....which is not really ideal as you would want to use the extra infusion slots at level 9 but if you do not plan on going that high in the class then its a good deal as you can focus on a shield or weapon.
The part of the 9th level ability that specifically contradicts and supersedes the general rule in the 2nd level ability is the very first statement in the description "You learn how to use your artificer infusions to specially modify your Arcane Armor.". This allows the Artificer to infuse his Arcane Armor and does not exclude magical Arcane Armor as you would have normally been able to infuse non-magical Arcane Armor without this feature anyway. If you interperet it that the 2nd Level ability cannot infuse magical Arcane Armor then you would not be able to add the 2nd and 3rd and further infusions because the first infusion makes the armor magical.
From 2nd level ability "Whenever you finish a long rest, you can touch a non-magical object and imbue it with one of your artificer infusions, turning it into a magic item."
The part of the 9th level ability that specifically contradicts and supersedes the general rule in the 2nd level ability is the very first statement in the description "You learn how to use your artificer infusions to specially modify your Arcane Armor.". This allows the Artificer to infuse his Arcane Armor and does not exclude magical Arcane Armor as you would have normally been able to infuse non-magical Arcane Armor without this feature anyway. If you interperet it that the 2nd Level ability cannot infuse magical Arcane Armor then you would not be able to add the 2nd and 3rd and further infusions because the first infusion makes the armor magical.
From 2nd level ability "Whenever you finish a long rest, you can touch a non-magical object and imbue it with one of your artificer infusions, turning it into a magic item."
That does not Interfere or Supercede. your using a partial Quote. it tells you that it splits up into multiple items for the purposes of infusing. it does not in any way ALTER the level 2 abilities restriction about what can be infused.
The Arcane Armor actually takes up multiple slots that infusions could be put into until the level 9 ability comes into play. That is what being changed. Not restrictions about Magical or non-Magical. That is always controlled by Infusions and is not changed by the part you are trying to Quote. The ability tells you exactly what changes and how it changes. That change is merely to the different slots that Arcane Armor takes up thta can now have infusions on them and the Number of Infusions. it does not in any way change the Magical Item Restriction on Infusions and would say specifically if it did.
So, I know I'm like, 4 years late, but I just saw this and thought I'd give answering a go.
The answer is odd, but to be short, it is Yes. This is based on the wording of the level 9 feature which is:
-
"You learn how to use your artificer infusions to specially modify your Arcane Armor. That armor now counts as separate items for the purposes of your Infuse Items feature: armor (the chest piece), boots, helmet, and the armor's special weapon. Each of those items can bear one of your infusions, and the infusions transfer over if you change your armor's model with the Armor Model feature. In addition, the maximum number of items you can infuse at once increases by 2, but those extra items must be part of your Arcane Armor."
-
So, before level 9, your +1 breastplate just cannot bare an infusion, as it is already a magic item.
Now, this becomes a yes because the level 9 artificer armorer ability, which specifically states that the armor that is turned into the Arcane Armor is the chest piece, meaning the boots, helmet, and special weapon count as separate items that do not bare the armors magical properties.
Now, here's why you are limited by the infusion requirements. Enhanced Defense can only be applied to a suit of armor or a shield. Unfortunately, the wording of the feature doesn't give you that. Your suit of armor is the magic item, and cannot be infused. Your helmet, boots, and special weapon are not magical, and can bare certain infusions.
Here's a good Example:
So, say you have a +1 breastplate as a 10 artificer, for simplicities sake. Let's go with Infiltrator because I personally like it the best 😂
You have turned it into a set of Arcane Armor, and the level 9 feature has specified that the armor is the chest. You can now only infuse the helmet, boots, and weapon, BUT only if they meet the requirements of certain infusions.
You meet the level requirement to use the "Boots of the Winding Path" infusion, and you now have a pair of nonmagical boots! Boom! One infusion!
You also meet the requirements for the "Helm of Awareness" Infusion by level and item!
Finally, Let's also throw in the "Enhanced Weapon" infusion for the special weapon!
Your Arcane Infiltrator Armor would now:
(Chest)
- Give you a +5 Movement speed
- Grant Advantage on Stealth checks
- Ignore Strength requirements
- Have a built in simple ranged weapon that deals lightning damage
- Have a +1 to AC
(Helmet)
- grants advantage on initiative rolls.
- Makes it so you can't be surprised, provided you aren't incapacitated.
(Boots)
- Gives you a nifty ability to teleport up to 15 feet as a bonus action to an unoccupied space that you can see if you have occupied that space at some point during the current turn.
(Lightning Launcher)
- Enhance your built in ranged weapon with a +2 to attack and damage rolls!
That would be the proper way to do your armor based on level and infusion requirements, while also following the feature by the letter. I may be a year late and a copper short, but I think I have answered this pretty well!
This is clear as day to me. I'm seeing a lot of trying to justify breaking the rules here.
L2 - you cannot Infuse magical items. That's it. End of discussion. If you make magical armor into your Arcane Armor later on, it still can't be infused. Period.
Level 9 merely states that the Arcane Armor is considered as 4 separate things for the purpose of being targeted for infusion. All those pieces are still magical if the initial armor was magical. "Chest (armor)" is clarifying *which piece* can accept an infusion for use on armor. The other pieces are now considered a helmet, boots and weapon for the purposes of determining which infusions you can use on them. But they are all still magical and therefore un-infusable, if the original armor was magical to start.
"That armor now counts as separate items for the purposes of your Infuse Items feature" Emphasis mine. They aren't actually separate items.
In other forum posts on this subject the consensus seems to be that magical armor can become Arcane Armor. That magical armor can’t be infused. But at level 9, you can infuse things other than the chest piece. Of course, there’s significant discussion and dissent because of the lack of clarity on those rules’ interactions noted in the OP.
I think the consensus makes the most sense because 5e generally allows players to use magical gauntlets, boots, etc. with magical armor, ignoring that in some instances (like plate armor) it would require replacing part of the armor. It would seem to require an express statement that Armorers can’t do that if that’s what was intended. And since artificers can create helms of awareness, gauntlets of ogre strength, winged boots, etc. by infusion, it would be particularly weird if they couldn’t use those items too just because they had a +1 breastplate.
From a flavor standpoint, though there are lots of ways to imagine how thunder gauntlets might mesh with magical/infused gauntlets like gauntlets of ogre strength, I think the easiest are to imagine brass knuckles or a piece that sits on the back of the gauntlet that emits the thunder damage. That in turn connects to your Arcane Armor with wires, pipes, ribbons, or whatever stylistically works for your Armorer.
Yeah the Arcane Armor does not specify that you cannot use magic armor for it and I think that is fine.
I would draw the line at infusion as that part is abundantly clear that you cannot infuse a magic item. Each part of that armor is magical not just the breastplate so I would rule you cannot use magical armor with artificer infusions but you could use it as Arcane Armor....which is not really ideal as you would want to use the extra infusion slots at level 9 but if you do not plan on going that high in the class then its a good deal as you can focus on a shield or weapon.
The part of the 9th level ability that specifically contradicts and supersedes the general rule in the 2nd level ability is the very first statement in the description "You learn how to use your artificer infusions to specially modify your Arcane Armor.". This allows the Artificer to infuse his Arcane Armor and does not exclude magical Arcane Armor as you would have normally been able to infuse non-magical Arcane Armor without this feature anyway. If you interperet it that the 2nd Level ability cannot infuse magical Arcane Armor then you would not be able to add the 2nd and 3rd and further infusions because the first infusion makes the armor magical.
From 2nd level ability "Whenever you finish a long rest, you can touch a non-magical object and imbue it with one of your artificer infusions, turning it into a magic item."
That does not Interfere or Supercede. your using a partial Quote. it tells you that it splits up into multiple items for the purposes of infusing. it does not in any way ALTER the level 2 abilities restriction about what can be infused.
The Arcane Armor actually takes up multiple slots that infusions could be put into until the level 9 ability comes into play. That is what being changed. Not restrictions about Magical or non-Magical. That is always controlled by Infusions and is not changed by the part you are trying to Quote. The ability tells you exactly what changes and how it changes. That change is merely to the different slots that Arcane Armor takes up thta can now have infusions on them and the Number of Infusions. it does not in any way change the Magical Item Restriction on Infusions and would say specifically if it did.
So, I know I'm like, 4 years late, but I just saw this and thought I'd give answering a go.
The answer is odd, but to be short, it is Yes. This is based on the wording of the level 9 feature which is:
-
"You learn how to use your artificer infusions to specially modify your Arcane Armor. That armor now counts as separate items for the purposes of your Infuse Items feature: armor (the chest piece), boots, helmet, and the armor's special weapon. Each of those items can bear one of your infusions, and the infusions transfer over if you change your armor's model with the Armor Model feature. In addition, the maximum number of items you can infuse at once increases by 2, but those extra items must be part of your Arcane Armor."
-
So, before level 9, your +1 breastplate just cannot bare an infusion, as it is already a magic item.
Now, this becomes a yes because the level 9 artificer armorer ability, which specifically states that the armor that is turned into the Arcane Armor is the chest piece, meaning the boots, helmet, and special weapon count as separate items that do not bare the armors magical properties.
Now, here's why you are limited by the infusion requirements. Enhanced Defense can only be applied to a suit of armor or a shield. Unfortunately, the wording of the feature doesn't give you that. Your suit of armor is the magic item, and cannot be infused. Your helmet, boots, and special weapon are not magical, and can bare certain infusions.
Here's a good Example:
So, say you have a +1 breastplate as a 10 artificer, for simplicities sake. Let's go with Infiltrator because I personally like it the best 😂
You have turned it into a set of Arcane Armor, and the level 9 feature has specified that the armor is the chest. You can now only infuse the helmet, boots, and weapon, BUT only if they meet the requirements of certain infusions.
You meet the level requirement to use the "Boots of the Winding Path" infusion, and you now have a pair of nonmagical boots! Boom! One infusion!
You also meet the requirements for the "Helm of Awareness" Infusion by level and item!
Finally, Let's also throw in the "Enhanced Weapon" infusion for the special weapon!
Your Arcane Infiltrator Armor would now:
(Chest)
- Give you a +5 Movement speed
- Grant Advantage on Stealth checks
- Ignore Strength requirements
- Have a built in simple ranged weapon that deals lightning damage
- Have a +1 to AC
(Helmet)
- grants advantage on initiative rolls.
- Makes it so you can't be surprised, provided you aren't incapacitated.
(Boots)
- Gives you a nifty ability to teleport up to 15 feet as a bonus action to an unoccupied space that you can see if you have occupied that space at some point during the current turn.
(Lightning Launcher)
- Enhance your built in ranged weapon with a +2 to attack and damage rolls!
That would be the proper way to do your armor based on level and infusion requirements, while also following the feature by the letter. I may be a year late and a copper short, but I think I have answered this pretty well!
This is clear as day to me. I'm seeing a lot of trying to justify breaking the rules here.
L2 - you cannot Infuse magical items. That's it. End of discussion. If you make magical armor into your Arcane Armor later on, it still can't be infused. Period.
Level 9 merely states that the Arcane Armor is considered as 4 separate things for the purpose of being targeted for infusion. All those pieces are still magical if the initial armor was magical. "Chest (armor)" is clarifying *which piece* can accept an infusion for use on armor. The other pieces are now considered a helmet, boots and weapon for the purposes of determining which infusions you can use on them. But they are all still magical and therefore un-infusable, if the original armor was magical to start.
"That armor now counts as separate items for the purposes of your Infuse Items feature" Emphasis mine. They aren't actually separate items.