Hi all. Level 2 Minotaur Fighter moving to battle master next session for all of the fun physical maneuvers Push, Trip and Disarm. Went point buy with CHA as my third best stat to multiclass into a CHA caster. A few sessions in, I now really want to dip three levels of Totem Warrior after level 5. I really want to lean heavy on all of the tough physical stuff and advantage for GWM. Only problem I see: My DEX is 10. So barring magic items I have no control over, is AC 16 (Half plate plus Defensive Fighting Style) viable at level 10? I thought about taking TOUGH at level 4 and GWM at level 8 or 9.
Thanks. I am really trying to get more chances at advantage so I can go GWM. Might be better off staying straight fighter and taking Martial Adept for an extra die. First 3 will be Trip, Push and Disarm because they fit the character and will be the most fun for me. DM will allow me to stack the 10 ft push of Hammering Horns plus the Push Maneuver if I do both on a turn, so it isn't redundant for me. Would need Precision Attack for GWM (I know Trip can help, too) and don't want to wait until level 7 for that.
RAW, you can benefit from the bear totem's near-universal damage resistance while raging and wearing heavy armor. You just wouldn't receive the other benefits of rage.
Now, I would skip over push attack and take precision right off the bat. It's just that good. The push you get from hammering horns will serve you fine until you get more maneuvers.
Cheers! The dip will probably be too big of an investment to give up my AC and feats/ASI at 6 and 8. After your feedback, now looking at:
Lvl 3: Trip, Precision and Disarm/Push (again, sending NPC 25 ft off a cliff or into a Web spell is too much potential fun)
Lvl 4 PAM; Lvl 5 Extra Attack
Lvl 6 GWM
Lvl 7: Disarm/Push and Riposte
Lvl 8: +2 Str, , Tough or Martial Adept.
This gives me most of what I want. Previous 3 characters were all full casters Cleric, Bard, Wizard). Feels like Martial characters require more difficult choices but potential for lots of fun just owning the battlefield.
I wouldn't worry about your AC too much, if you are taking at least three levels in barbarian. I, currently, have a half orc 12 champion fighter / 3 bear totem barbarian. As long as you are raging, don't worry about being hit. In fact, because of Reckless Attacks your foes will get advantage attacking you, so whether your AC is 16, 18 or 20...you are going to get hit fairly often. I just assume I'm going to be hit and don't worry about it. That way, I'm just pleasantly surprised when I'm NOT hit, rather than bummed that I was! lol :)
RAW, you can benefit from the bear totem's near-universal damage resistance while raging and wearing heavy armor.You just wouldn't receive the other benefits of rage.
Now, I would skip over push attack and take precision right off the bat. It's just that good. The push you get from hammering horns will serve you fine until you get more maneuvers.
I wouldn't worry about your AC too much, if you are taking at least three levels in barbarian. I, currently, have a half orc 12 champion fighter / 3 bear totem barbarian. As long as you are raging, don't worry about being hit. In fact, because of Reckless Attacks your foes will get advantage attacking you, so whether your AC is 16, 18 or 20...you are going to get hit fairly over. I just assume I'm going to be hit and don't worry about it. That way, I'm just pleasantly surprised when I'm NOT hit, rather than bummed that I was! lol :)
That's not how AC works. Higher AC makes reckless attack and resistance (s) better not worse. The difference between 14 and 17 AC is almost a HD worth of EHP every encounter. That means you can use reckless more often and potentially even when you aren't raging.
What are you talking about? "That's not how AC works?" Yes, I know how AC works. We all do. My point is when your opponents have a decent to hit and near constant advantage against you, they are going to hit quite often. I just did the old school Gary Gygax's "Against the Giants." At one point, my AC was 19, but then we lost our armor and my AC went to 15. I was playing against giants with a +9 to hit me. But throughout the life of my barbarian, when using Reckless Attacks, I just assume I'm going to be hit. By making that assumption, it leaves me not upset or disappointed when I do get hit and pleasantly surprised when the DM rolls twice and misses me. It's in the mindset of a barbarian imo, just assume you are going to be hit.
I wouldn't worry about your AC too much, if you are taking at least three levels in barbarian. I, currently, have a half orc 12 champion fighter / 3 bear totem barbarian. As long as you are raging, don't worry about being hit. In fact, because of Reckless Attacks your foes will get advantage attacking you, so whether your AC is 16, 18 or 20...you are going to get hit fairly over. I just assume I'm going to be hit and don't worry about it. That way, I'm just pleasantly surprised when I'm NOT hit, rather than bummed that I was! lol :)
That's not how AC works. Higher AC makes reckless attack and resistance (s) better not worse. The difference between 14 and 17 AC is almost a HD worth of EHP every encounter. That means you can use reckless more often and potentially even when you aren't raging.
What are you talking about? "That's not how AC works?" Yes, I know how AC works. We all do. My point is when your opponents have a decent too hit and near constant advantage against you, they are going to hit quite often. I just did the old school Gary Gygax's "Against the Giants." At one point, my AC was 19, but then we lost our armor and my AC went to 15. I was playing against giants with a +9 to hit me. But throughout the life of my barbarian, when using Reckless Attacks, I just assume I'm going to be hit. By making that assumption, it leaves me not upset or disappointed when I do get hit and pleasantly surprised when the DM rolls twice and misses me. It's in the mindset of a barbarian imo, just assume you are going to be hit.
But yes, higher AC is better, we know that.
You say that but I don't think you realize do. For most Giants there's no reason to reckless attack to begin with because their AC is low enough so all you are doing is throwing away resources for a relatively tiny damage increase.
To put this in perspective the amount of damage that you gain with RA+GWM is lower than the increased damage you receive from one frost giants normal 2 attacks at the lower AC you had. If you had the higher value you can recklessly attack for almost 400% longer and if you didn't RA you could mitigate a extra HD worth of EHP every 2 attacks.
It's about a 30 pt dpr difference, with my build and weapons against AC 16 using RA (advantage) and GWM vs not using RA. Normal attacks with or without GWM is almost exactly the same (it really needs the advantage). It's a 13 pt difference in favor of RA and GWM vs just RA.
I wouldn't worry about your AC too much, if you are taking at least three levels in barbarian. I, currently, have a half orc 12 champion fighter / 3 bear totem barbarian. As long as you are raging, don't worry about being hit. In fact, because of Reckless Attacks your foes will get advantage attacking you, so whether your AC is 16, 18 or 20...you are going to get hit fairly over. I just assume I'm going to be hit and don't worry about it. That way, I'm just pleasantly surprised when I'm NOT hit, rather than bummed that I was! lol :)
That's not how AC works. Higher AC makes reckless attack and resistance (s) better not worse. The difference between 14 and 17 AC is almost a HD worth of EHP every encounter. That means you can use reckless more often and potentially even when you aren't raging.
What are you talking about? "That's not how AC works?" Yes, I know how AC works. We all do. My point is when your opponents have a decent too hit and near constant advantage against you, they are going to hit quite often. I just did the old school Gary Gygax's "Against the Giants." At one point, my AC was 19, but then we lost our armor and my AC went to 15. I was playing against giants with a +9 to hit me. But throughout the life of my barbarian, when using Reckless Attacks, I just assume I'm going to be hit. By making that assumption, it leaves me not upset or disappointed when I do get hit and pleasantly surprised when the DM rolls twice and misses me. It's in the mindset of a barbarian imo, just assume you are going to be hit.
But yes, higher AC is better, we know that.
You say that but I don't think you realize do. For most Giants there's no reason to reckless attack to begin with because their AC is low enough so all you are doing is throwing away resources for a relatively tiny damage increase.
To put this in perspective the amount of damage that you gain with RA+GWM is lower than the increased damage you receive from one frost giants normal 2 attacks at the lower AC you had. If you had the higher value you can recklessly attack for almost 400% longer and if you didn't RA you could mitigate a extra HD worth of EHP every 2 attacks.
It's about a 30 pt dpr difference, with my build and weapons against AC 16 using RA (advantage) and GWM vs not using RA. Normal attacks with or without GWM is almost exactly the same (it really needs the advantage). It's a 13 pt difference in favor of RA and GWM vs just RA.
How? I can't get that math if you have automatically hit with reckless.
I am using this dpr calculator. I find it very useful. In the module, I had the greatsword, Waythe, which is legendary and in the first module. It's really only good against giant class monsters, though.
That is not a bad idea. I have the CHA for it, and Vengeance Pally gets all kinds of tools to help GWM and that would allow me to keep my heavy armor. Chewing on the following:
Battle Master to 5, +2 Str @ level 4. Vengeance Paladin from level 6. GWM @ level 9. This gives me GWF style, Lay on Hands, Vow of Enmity and Hunter's Mark + Smites. Fighter has more or less dead levels for me at levels 7, 9 and 10. 7 and 10 are just slight increases to the maneuvers I get at level 3. The only ones I care about adding would be precision and menacing attack, but the Pally would have the equivalent just one level with so much more flexibility.
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Hi all. Level 2 Minotaur Fighter moving to battle master next session for all of the fun physical maneuvers Push, Trip and Disarm. Went point buy with CHA as my third best stat to multiclass into a CHA caster. A few sessions in, I now really want to dip three levels of Totem Warrior after level 5. I really want to lean heavy on all of the tough physical stuff and advantage for GWM. Only problem I see: My DEX is 10. So barring magic items I have no control over, is AC 16 (Half plate plus Defensive Fighting Style) viable at level 10? I thought about taking TOUGH at level 4 and GWM at level 8 or 9.
Thanks. I am really trying to get more chances at advantage so I can go GWM. Might be better off staying straight fighter and taking Martial Adept for an extra die. First 3 will be Trip, Push and Disarm because they fit the character and will be the most fun for me. DM will allow me to stack the 10 ft push of Hammering Horns plus the Push Maneuver if I do both on a turn, so it isn't redundant for me. Would need Precision Attack for GWM (I know Trip can help, too) and don't want to wait until level 7 for that.
RAW, you can benefit from the bear totem's near-universal damage resistance while raging and wearing heavy armor. You just wouldn't receive the other benefits of rage.
Now, I would skip over push attack and take precision right off the bat. It's just that good. The push you get from hammering horns will serve you fine until you get more maneuvers.
Cheers! The dip will probably be too big of an investment to give up my AC and feats/ASI at 6 and 8. After your feedback, now looking at:
Lvl 3: Trip, Precision and Disarm/Push (again, sending NPC 25 ft off a cliff or into a Web spell is too much potential fun)
Lvl 4 PAM; Lvl 5 Extra Attack
Lvl 6 GWM
Lvl 7: Disarm/Push and Riposte
Lvl 8: +2 Str, , Tough or Martial Adept.
This gives me most of what I want. Previous 3 characters were all full casters Cleric, Bard, Wizard). Feels like Martial characters require more difficult choices but potential for lots of fun just owning the battlefield.
I wouldn't worry about your AC too much, if you are taking at least three levels in barbarian. I, currently, have a half orc 12 champion fighter / 3 bear totem barbarian. As long as you are raging, don't worry about being hit. In fact, because of Reckless Attacks your foes will get advantage attacking you, so whether your AC is 16, 18 or 20...you are going to get hit fairly often. I just assume I'm going to be hit and don't worry about it. That way, I'm just pleasantly surprised when I'm NOT hit, rather than bummed that I was! lol :)
Oh Lordy! Not this one again! lol :)
What are you talking about? "That's not how AC works?" Yes, I know how AC works. We all do. My point is when your opponents have a decent to hit and near constant advantage against you, they are going to hit quite often. I just did the old school Gary Gygax's "Against the Giants." At one point, my AC was 19, but then we lost our armor and my AC went to 15. I was playing against giants with a +9 to hit me. But throughout the life of my barbarian, when using Reckless Attacks, I just assume I'm going to be hit. By making that assumption, it leaves me not upset or disappointed when I do get hit and pleasantly surprised when the DM rolls twice and misses me. It's in the mindset of a barbarian imo, just assume you are going to be hit.
But yes, higher AC is better, we know that.
It's about a 30 pt dpr difference, with my build and weapons against AC 16 using RA (advantage) and GWM vs not using RA. Normal attacks with or without GWM is almost exactly the same (it really needs the advantage). It's a 13 pt difference in favor of RA and GWM vs just RA.
I am using this dpr calculator. I find it very useful. In the module, I had the greatsword, Waythe, which is legendary and in the first module. It's really only good against giant class monsters, though.
Copy of LudicSavant and AureusFulgen's DPR Calculator (v2.51) - Google Sheets
That is not a bad idea. I have the CHA for it, and Vengeance Pally gets all kinds of tools to help GWM and that would allow me to keep my heavy armor. Chewing on the following:
Battle Master to 5, +2 Str @ level 4. Vengeance Paladin from level 6. GWM @ level 9. This gives me GWF style, Lay on Hands, Vow of Enmity and Hunter's Mark + Smites. Fighter has more or less dead levels for me at levels 7, 9 and 10. 7 and 10 are just slight increases to the maneuvers I get at level 3. The only ones I care about adding would be precision and menacing attack, but the Pally would have the equivalent just one level with so much more flexibility.