I have an idea for a ‘fallen cleric’ subclass but I’m not sure if it’ll work lore wise? (The idea is that the god has either died or the cleric goes against their god)
Clerics draw power from the realms of the gods and harness it to work miracles. Blessed by a deity, a pantheon, or another immortal entity, a Cleric can reach out to the divine magic of the Outer Planes—where gods dwell—and channel it to bolster people and battle foes.
So, you can kind of see ways they don’t have a specific god (a pantheon or other immortal entity). But the implication is that the source of their power is still alive. But maybe, if you want a dead god, it could be something like, The Once Great Oz died, but some of its conduits to the outer plains remain open, and a cleric is still able to access them. Though to me that feels almost more warlock-y.
As for going against their god, that seems more like changing subclasses to reflect the cleric finding a new god.
A cleric with out a god would be more of a shaman (imo). I love shamans but D&D doesn’t. I wouldn’t be mad at your table to be godless and be merely more of a shaman.
Versions of the game have had official settings where withdrawal of the gods resulted in no true Clerics for a long time (Dragonlance) and settings that had Clerics that did not worship dieties at all (Dark Sun.)
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🎵I'm on top of the world, looking down on creation, wreaking death and devastation with my mind.
As the power that I've found erupts freely from the ground, I will cackle from the top of the world.🎵
So it doesn't say the cleric has to be getting their power from a god. It just says they're getting it from the realm of the gods. So let's say some "immortal entity" snuck its way into the Outer Planar realm of a particular deity, that entity could be siphoning divine power to the cleric without the deity of that realm even noticing. Kinda like when your neighbor plugs an extension cord into your patio outlet while you're on vacation and gets free juice from your socket for a week. Heck, maybe the cleric doesn't even know they're getting hijacked juice! Maybe the cleric thinks their prayers and their offerings are being answered with legit divine power, but really there's some shady trickster entity intercepting those prayers, doling out some magic, and skimming a bit for itself on the side. Like money laundering, but with magic.
Just work it out with your DM. Flavor may be free, but the setting isn't yours.
As for the flavor you can explain it away in a myriad of ways. Perhaps the god's power store is still open for a limited time, or the collective belief in the god fuels the spells. Perhaps you have an item long ago enchanted that allows you to harness this power. Perhaps a different god is answering your spells. Long term storywise it can be how a god gets brought back after being dead. It is probably more of a warlock idea, but if you work with your DM you might be able to find a way to role play it. It sounds like it could be a fun character.
So it doesn't say the cleric has to be getting their power from a god. It just says they're getting it from the realm of the gods. So let's say some "immortal entity" snuck its way into the Outer Planar realm of a particular deity, that entity could be siphoning divine power to the cleric without the deity of that realm even noticing. Kinda like when your neighbor plugs an extension cord into your patio outlet while you're on vacation and gets free juice from your socket for a week. Heck, maybe the cleric doesn't even know they're getting hijacked juice! Maybe the cleric thinks their prayers and their offerings are being answered with legit divine power, but really there's some shady trickster entity intercepting those prayers, doling out some magic, and skimming a bit for itself on the side. Like money laundering, but with magic.
Yeah. That’s an option. To me, the line between god and immortal entity is pretty thin, but it’s there. Though at that point it feels more like a warlock than a cleric. And either way, I don’t think what you’re describing is what the OP was talking about — I read it as there being no living entity at the other end.
I'm fascinated by abandoned places. The liminal space between "civilized" and "uncivilized". It feels almost righteous, the way nature creeps back in, reconquering what we once stole from it. And nature never judges us for that, because by then there is no one left to judge.
Someone builds a big beautiful house in a remote area with lots of privacy. They bring with them every possible convenience of modern life. This is their Shangri-La, their Xanadu, their Home. But then something happens that they hadn't anticipated. Suddenly, they're gone. They're gone and the house doesn't care. Nature doesn't care. There's no one to do maintenance, no one to clean the pool, no one to board up broken windows, no one to keep the animals out, no one to patch the roof. The power is turned off, the heat is turned off, the memories that had been made here are turned off. That once beautiful Home, that Haven - Heaven - is now just an empty shell, bereft of purpose, because the god who once lived there is gone.
Along comes an explorer, wandering through the lost and forgotten landscape. They venture inside this ruined shell, hoping to find something - anything - that will help them on their way. They are hungry, they are thirsty, they are tired, and they have been lost since before they even began this journey. They're not looking for anything fancy. What good is a widescreen tv out here? What good is jewelry in the wilderness? The water was turned off long ago and the pipes are full of algae, but in a closet they find sealed jugs with the words "Poland Spring" on the side. The refrigerator door hangs open, the smell of rotten food filling the room. But in a cabinet they find metal cans - Campbell's, Del Monte, Chef Boyardee. Sure, the expiration dates are a year or more out of code, but the cans are sealed. Maybe they're worth the risk.
Suddenly you're not lost. You have water. You have food. The pile of unopened mail on the kitchen table tells you where you are, or at least where where you are used to be. The former owner of this house, the former resident God, has long since departed this realm, but what they left behind is enough to sustain a simple mortal creature. The remains of that God, the lingering remnants of its long lost glory, will feed you and give you safety. After a good long rest under most of a roof, and a questionable meal, you feel your strength returning. You feel Hope returning.
That God is dead. But the echoes of that God have given you strength. So... in a way... that God saved you.
You can be a Cleric worshipping a dead diety, or believed so, as seen in the FORGOTEN REALMS with Leira or Mask where other dieties still granted spells to their Clerics.
You can be a Cleric fallen out of favor after having violated your diety's ethos for exemple.
Such Cleric would still draw on power from the Outer Planes.
I suggest you speak to your DM about your character concept you would like to play but rule-wise it breaks nothing.
Leira was not really dead. She merely deceived people into thinking she was dead, but it was eventually revealed that she was alive. So any cleric that continued to worship her even after it was believed she was dead would have still been able to draw power from her.
Long answer: If your table decides that they don't then they don't. But for the base setting it is assumed that a Cleric draws their power from one or more gods.
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I have an idea for a ‘fallen cleric’ subclass but I’m not sure if it’ll work lore wise? (The idea is that the god has either died or the cleric goes against their god)
Well, the class description starts with:
Clerics draw power from the realms of the gods and harness it to work miracles. Blessed by a deity, a pantheon, or another immortal entity, a Cleric can reach out to the divine magic of the Outer Planes—where gods dwell—and channel it to bolster people and battle foes.
So, you can kind of see ways they don’t have a specific god (a pantheon or other immortal entity). But the implication is that the source of their power is still alive. But maybe, if you want a dead god, it could be something like, The Once Great Oz died, but some of its conduits to the outer plains remain open, and a cleric is still able to access them. Though to me that feels almost more warlock-y.
As for going against their god, that seems more like changing subclasses to reflect the cleric finding a new god.
A cleric with out a god would be more of a shaman (imo). I love shamans but D&D doesn’t. I wouldn’t be mad at your table to be godless and be merely more of a shaman.
Versions of the game have had official settings where withdrawal of the gods resulted in no true Clerics for a long time (Dragonlance) and settings that had Clerics that did not worship dieties at all (Dark Sun.)
🎵I'm on top of the world, looking down on creation, wreaking death and devastation with my mind.
As the power that I've found erupts freely from the ground, I will cackle from the top of the world.🎵
Charisma Saving Throw: DC 18, Failure: 20d6 Psychic Damage, Success: Half damage
So it doesn't say the cleric has to be getting their power from a god. It just says they're getting it from the realm of the gods. So let's say some "immortal entity" snuck its way into the Outer Planar realm of a particular deity, that entity could be siphoning divine power to the cleric without the deity of that realm even noticing. Kinda like when your neighbor plugs an extension cord into your patio outlet while you're on vacation and gets free juice from your socket for a week. Heck, maybe the cleric doesn't even know they're getting hijacked juice! Maybe the cleric thinks their prayers and their offerings are being answered with legit divine power, but really there's some shady trickster entity intercepting those prayers, doling out some magic, and skimming a bit for itself on the side. Like money laundering, but with magic.
Anzio Faro. Protector Aasimar light cleric. Lvl 18.
Viktor Gavriil. White dragonborn grave cleric. Lvl 20.
Ikram Sahir ibn-Malik al-Sayyid Ra'ad. Brass dragonborn draconic sorcerer Lvl 9. Fire elemental devil.
Wrangler of cats.
Just work it out with your DM. Flavor may be free, but the setting isn't yours.
As for the flavor you can explain it away in a myriad of ways. Perhaps the god's power store is still open for a limited time, or the collective belief in the god fuels the spells. Perhaps you have an item long ago enchanted that allows you to harness this power. Perhaps a different god is answering your spells. Long term storywise it can be how a god gets brought back after being dead. It is probably more of a warlock idea, but if you work with your DM you might be able to find a way to role play it. It sounds like it could be a fun character.
Yeah. That’s an option. To me, the line between god and immortal entity is pretty thin, but it’s there. Though at that point it feels more like a warlock than a cleric. And either way, I don’t think what you’re describing is what the OP was talking about — I read it as there being no living entity at the other end.
Yes in my campaign clerics and paladins need to have a god. Other reasons joint make sense and more appeasement
I'm fascinated by abandoned places. The liminal space between "civilized" and "uncivilized". It feels almost righteous, the way nature creeps back in, reconquering what we once stole from it. And nature never judges us for that, because by then there is no one left to judge.
Someone builds a big beautiful house in a remote area with lots of privacy. They bring with them every possible convenience of modern life. This is their Shangri-La, their Xanadu, their Home. But then something happens that they hadn't anticipated. Suddenly, they're gone. They're gone and the house doesn't care. Nature doesn't care. There's no one to do maintenance, no one to clean the pool, no one to board up broken windows, no one to keep the animals out, no one to patch the roof. The power is turned off, the heat is turned off, the memories that had been made here are turned off. That once beautiful Home, that Haven - Heaven - is now just an empty shell, bereft of purpose, because the god who once lived there is gone.
Along comes an explorer, wandering through the lost and forgotten landscape. They venture inside this ruined shell, hoping to find something - anything - that will help them on their way. They are hungry, they are thirsty, they are tired, and they have been lost since before they even began this journey. They're not looking for anything fancy. What good is a widescreen tv out here? What good is jewelry in the wilderness? The water was turned off long ago and the pipes are full of algae, but in a closet they find sealed jugs with the words "Poland Spring" on the side. The refrigerator door hangs open, the smell of rotten food filling the room. But in a cabinet they find metal cans - Campbell's, Del Monte, Chef Boyardee. Sure, the expiration dates are a year or more out of code, but the cans are sealed. Maybe they're worth the risk.
Suddenly you're not lost. You have water. You have food. The pile of unopened mail on the kitchen table tells you where you are, or at least where where you are used to be. The former owner of this house, the former resident God, has long since departed this realm, but what they left behind is enough to sustain a simple mortal creature. The remains of that God, the lingering remnants of its long lost glory, will feed you and give you safety. After a good long rest under most of a roof, and a questionable meal, you feel your strength returning. You feel Hope returning.
That God is dead. But the echoes of that God have given you strength. So... in a way... that God saved you.
Anzio Faro. Protector Aasimar light cleric. Lvl 18.
Viktor Gavriil. White dragonborn grave cleric. Lvl 20.
Ikram Sahir ibn-Malik al-Sayyid Ra'ad. Brass dragonborn draconic sorcerer Lvl 9. Fire elemental devil.
Wrangler of cats.
You can be a Cleric worshipping a dead diety, or believed so, as seen in the FORGOTEN REALMS with Leira or Mask where other dieties still granted spells to their Clerics.
You can be a Cleric fallen out of favor after having violated your diety's ethos for exemple.
Such Cleric would still draw on power from the Outer Planes.
I suggest you speak to your DM about your character concept you would like to play but rule-wise it breaks nothing.
Ok, I’ve decided to rework the subclass into the background fallen healing, which I’ve shared
Leira was not really dead. She merely deceived people into thinking she was dead, but it was eventually revealed that she was alive. So any cleric that continued to worship her even after it was believed she was dead would have still been able to draw power from her.
Leira's cleric were not drawing power from her while she was ''dead'', but from Cyric.
Short answer: Yes
Long answer: If your table decides that they don't then they don't. But for the base setting it is assumed that a Cleric draws their power from one or more gods.