Yes. I would DM that if it works for missile weapons and you have PAM then you would get the reach from the weapon. Furthermore if you have sentinel you could freeze the opponent in its tracks. Pretty lethal!
old thread but a lot of this stuff is incorrect. echos cannot do skill checks, nor even interact with things other than in the form of an attack action. thats all they can do is attack actions. not pull the door open actions or anything like that. they also are floating and dont weigh anything so they wouldnt activate most pressure traps and arent creatures they are animated objects so most trap conditions wouldnt be satisfied going off. they cannot sneak and if you use the 7th level ability it specifically says they are glowing so that wouldnt be very sneaky anyways. they have conditional and damage immunities similar to a construct and thus can be damaged by AOE things that arent that damage type. so a fireball with them in it catches them on fire dealing atleast 1 dmg. they also dont benefit from any of the knights abilities or reach for the most part and most feats dont apply to them unless it explicitly states as an attack action the polearm sentinel combo most of yall use with this also does not work because the echo themselves dont have a reaction and you would need to use yours to switch places in the first place. do they have utility? sure about as much as anything allowing you to see around corners except this one has a range of about 75 feet the round after you initially summoned it and then it disappears on the end of your turn.
most of the utility is simply being able to make an extra attack action from a different space than you occupy. the majority of the fluff yall are making up isnt possible.
old thread but a lot of this stuff is incorrect. echos cannot do skill checks, nor even interact with things other than in the form of an attack action. thats all they can do is attack actions.
An echo cannot take any actions, including the attack action. It is an object. Objects do not take turns and do not have an action economy.
You are correct that they cannot make checks, either.
not pull the door open actions or anything like that. they also are floating
There is absolutely no evidence echoes can float.
and dont weigh anything
There is absolutely no evidence echoes have 0 weight.
so they wouldnt activate most pressure traps
See above.
and arent creatures they are animated objects
Extremely correct.
so most trap conditions wouldnt be satisfied going off.
Good luck finding a DM willing to apply spell constraints to a trap. As a general rule, traps will go off when triggered by an object, because they can't tell creatures and objects apart.
they cannot sneak
That's true. We also have no idea how much noise they make.
and if you use the 7th level ability it specifically says they are glowing
This is just false. I just checked the description and it does not mention glowing anywhere.
so that wouldnt be very sneaky anyways. they have conditional and damage immunities similar to a construct
Constructs have no condition or damage immunities built in.
However, echoes, being objects, are immune to psychic and poison damage. As they are explicitly magical objects, they have resistance to the other 11 damage types. Echoes explicitly have immunity to all conditions.
and thus can be damaged by AOE things that arent that damage type. so a fireball with them in it catches them on fire dealing atleast 1 dmg.
No. Unlike traps, spells do have constraints. Fireball won't damage objects. It will "ignite" the echo if and only if the echo is "flammable", but not only do we have no evidence the echo is flammable, we have no basis for assuming ignition does damage. Even if it did, because echoes have fire resistance, 1 point of fire damage will do 0 to them and they'll be fine.
they also dont benefit from any of the knights abilities or reach for the most part
This is correct. Reach is not even defined for objects.
and most feats dont apply to them unless it explicitly states as an attack action the polearm sentinel combo most of yall use with this also does not work because the echo themselves dont have a reaction and you would need to use yours to switch places in the first place.
If you're saying that an Echo Knight with PAM+Sentinel can't make OAs when someone approaches their echo, then you are correct.
do they have utility? sure about as much as anything allowing you to see around corners except this one has a range of about 75 feet the round after you initially summoned it and then it disappears on the end of your turn.
Not at level 7.
most of the utility is simply being able to make an extra attack action from a different space than you occupy. the majority of the fluff yall are making up isnt possible.
A good deal of the utility of an echo is based on assumptions with no basis in the RAW, true, but you yourself agreed with some of them - like the wholly unfounded theory that echoes float. An echo that can float lets an echo knight fly. That's incredible utility.
old thread but a lot of this stuff is incorrect. echos cannot do skill checks, nor even interact with things other than in the form of an attack action. thats all they can do is attack actions.
An echo cannot take any actions, including the attack action. It is an object. Objects do not take turns and do not have an action economy.
While the Echo itself is not a creature, the Echo Knight can attack from the position of the Echo. This includes the ability to attack other objects from a relatively safe distance.
Also, Objects can have an action economy via certain spells, such as Animate Objects.
old thread but a lot of this stuff is incorrect. echos cannot do skill checks, nor even interact with things other than in the form of an attack action. thats all they can do is attack actions.
An echo cannot take any actions, including the attack action. It is an object. Objects do not take turns and do not have an action economy.
You are correct that they cannot make checks, either.
not pull the door open actions or anything like that. they also are floating
There is absolutely no evidence echoes can float.
To clarify Echoes created by the Echo Knight can move in any direction, including vertically to the full extent allowed by the rules. See Sage Advice.
Also according to Sage Advice, the Echo itself can float in the air.
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Yes. I would DM that if it works for missile weapons and you have PAM then you would get the reach from the weapon. Furthermore if you have sentinel you could freeze the opponent in its tracks. Pretty lethal!
old thread but a lot of this stuff is incorrect. echos cannot do skill checks, nor even interact with things other than in the form of an attack action. thats all they can do is attack actions. not pull the door open actions or anything like that. they also are floating and dont weigh anything so they wouldnt activate most pressure traps and arent creatures they are animated objects so most trap conditions wouldnt be satisfied going off. they cannot sneak and if you use the 7th level ability it specifically says they are glowing so that wouldnt be very sneaky anyways. they have conditional and damage immunities similar to a construct and thus can be damaged by AOE things that arent that damage type. so a fireball with them in it catches them on fire dealing atleast 1 dmg. they also dont benefit from any of the knights abilities or reach for the most part and most feats dont apply to them unless it explicitly states as an attack action the polearm sentinel combo most of yall use with this also does not work because the echo themselves dont have a reaction and you would need to use yours to switch places in the first place. do they have utility? sure about as much as anything allowing you to see around corners except this one has a range of about 75 feet the round after you initially summoned it and then it disappears on the end of your turn.
most of the utility is simply being able to make an extra attack action from a different space than you occupy. the majority of the fluff yall are making up isnt possible.
An echo cannot take any actions, including the attack action. It is an object. Objects do not take turns and do not have an action economy.
You are correct that they cannot make checks, either.
There is absolutely no evidence echoes can float.
There is absolutely no evidence echoes have 0 weight.
See above.
Extremely correct.
Good luck finding a DM willing to apply spell constraints to a trap. As a general rule, traps will go off when triggered by an object, because they can't tell creatures and objects apart.
That's true. We also have no idea how much noise they make.
This is just false. I just checked the description and it does not mention glowing anywhere.
Constructs have no condition or damage immunities built in.
However, echoes, being objects, are immune to psychic and poison damage. As they are explicitly magical objects, they have resistance to the other 11 damage types. Echoes explicitly have immunity to all conditions.
No. Unlike traps, spells do have constraints. Fireball won't damage objects. It will "ignite" the echo if and only if the echo is "flammable", but not only do we have no evidence the echo is flammable, we have no basis for assuming ignition does damage. Even if it did, because echoes have fire resistance, 1 point of fire damage will do 0 to them and they'll be fine.
This is correct. Reach is not even defined for objects.
If you're saying that an Echo Knight with PAM+Sentinel can't make OAs when someone approaches their echo, then you are correct.
Not at level 7.
A good deal of the utility of an echo is based on assumptions with no basis in the RAW, true, but you yourself agreed with some of them - like the wholly unfounded theory that echoes float. An echo that can float lets an echo knight fly. That's incredible utility.
While the Echo itself is not a creature, the Echo Knight can attack from the position of the Echo. This includes the ability to attack other objects from a relatively safe distance.
Also, Objects can have an action economy via certain spells, such as Animate Objects.
To clarify Echoes created by the Echo Knight can move in any direction, including vertically to the full extent allowed by the rules. See Sage Advice.
Also according to Sage Advice, the Echo itself can float in the air.