Way of the Closed Fist An off-shoot of the Open Palm Monastic tradition, the Closed Fist focuses on an aggressive approach to combat. Their philosophy is that if violence is unavoidable it is better to take initiative and end the conflict swiftly and decisively. In the process of modifying their teachings the Closed Fist tradition has lost and replaced some of the techniques of the Open Palm Tradition either completely or retained an incomplete understanding of them. Thoughts and suggestions are welcome.
3rd level
Closed Fist Technique
Fist of Fury: Starting when you choose this tradition at 3rd level, you can manipulate your enemy’s ki when you harness your own. When you hit a creature with one of your flurry of blows attacks you can impose the following effect upon the creature; creature has to make a strength saving throw or be pushed back 10ft. (This could be modified to "choose one of the three Open palm effects, once chosen it cannot be changed" as Closed Fist sacrifices variety for more effect)
Intercepting Fist: If a creature hits you with a melee attack you can, as a reaction, spend 1 ki point to make an unarmed attack of opportunity. If it hits the creature has to make a strenght saving throw. If the save fails the creature is pushed back 5ft and the attack misses. *If the creature attacked with Reach your counterattack does not push the creature back or deal damage as, rather than attacking the creature, it swats away the weapon (alternatively, for simplicitys sake it cannot be used against a Reach attack)
6th level
Clinch Fighting: Your monastic training allows you greater maneuvering in a grapple. You can apply your Acrobatics (Dex) instead of Athletics (Str) to all Grapple checks. Your unarmed attacks have advantage in a Grapple While grappling, or after a successful Throw(see below), you can make an additional grapple check to pin the opponent if successful both you and your opponent are Restrained until your grapple ends.
Throw: You can attempt to make a Grapple check to knock a creature prone. If you are successful you can land the prone creature on any square around you instead of its own square. The thrown creature cannot be more than one size category larger than you. If the square is occupied by another creature it has to make a Reflex saving throw or be pushed back 5ft. If the save is successful the thrown creature lands on an adjacent square. *If the second creature is more than one size category larger than the thrown creature it cannot be pushed back.
11th level
Extended Flurry: You can make one additional unarmed attack with your Flurry of Blows.
17th level
Quivering Fist: At 17th level, you gain the ability to set up lethal vibrations in someone’s body. When you hit a creature with an unarmed strike, you can spend 3 ki points to start these imperceptible vibrations. The vibrations are harmless unless you use your action to end them. To do so, you and the target must be on the same plane of existence. When you use this action, the creature must make a Constitution saving throw. If it fails, it is reduced to 0 hit points. If it succeeds, it takes 10d10 necrotic damage. As the Monastic tradition of the Closed Fist focuses on resolving the conflict as quickly as possible they lack the strategic longetivity of the Open Palm regarding this technique. The vibrations must be activated before the monk takes a short rest. However this immediate violent burst leads to greater damage to the creature inflicted. The dies of the necrotic damage are rolled twice each and the better result taken. You can have only one creature under the effect of this feature at a time. You can choose to end the vibrations harmlessly without using an action.
Parry Blows: An alternative to Intercepting Fist modeled after Deflect Missiles
Parry Blows: You can use your reaction to parry a melee attack. When you do so, the damage you take from the attack is reduced by 1d10 + your Dexterity modifier + your monk level. If you reduce the damage to 0 the attack misses and you can, as a part of the same reaction, spend 1 ki point to make an unarmed attack of opportunity against the creature that attacked you. If it hits the creature has to make a strenght saving throw. If the save fails the creature is pushed back 5ft *If the creature attacked with Reach you cannot attempt this
Alternative Parry Blows: You can use your reaction to parry a melee attack. When you do so, the damage you take from the attack is reduced by 1d10 + your Dexterity modifier + your monk level.If you reduce the damage to 0 the attack misses and you can, as a part of the same reaction, spend 1 ki point to make a grapple attempt against the creature that attacked you. *If the creature attacked with Reach it has an advantage against your grapple attempt as you try to pull it into your grapple from a distance using the creatures own Reach weapon
Sounds like some interesting stuff, although I think at low levels the 'parry blows' feature is a bit overpowered. Assuming a level 3 monk with a 16 dexterity, you're reducing an attack by on average 11 damage every round (7 - 16 damage in total). The only possible way to beat that damage output at 3rd level is to either play a variant human and take great weapon master as your feat:
2d6 Greatsword Damage, + 3 str mod + 10 GWM, 15 - 25 damage per attack, average of 18
Or be a paladin with the same build and use a smite.
Maybe make the damage mitigation roll the same as your 'martial arts' die.
Thanks for the input. Thats good observation. I was wondering about that. I was trying to find a way to up monks AC and make him a little less glass canon, granted its not as bad as in the previous editions. The Deflect Missiles mechanic seemed good for that, though perhaps it could be transferred to higher level or replace it with the MA die as you suggested. Of course that was partly my reason for the Intercepting Fist which is not likely to see too much usage, at least on low levels as it always spends Ki points. Thanks for the improvement suggestion. :)
So I changed the Parry Blows as suggested, though renaming, and flavouring it as Intercepting Fist.
Does this work, or is it still a bit overpowered? If one was to stick with this should it change its place with Clinch Fighting at 6th level? Should I just stick with the original Intercepting Fist?
Intercepting Fist: If a creature hits you with a melee attack you can, as a reaction attack the weapon that strikes you in order to change its trajectory. When you do so, the damage you take from the attack is reduced by your martial arts die + your Dexterity modifier + your monk level. If you reduce the damage to 0 the attack misses. Upon a successful intercept you can, as a part of the same reaction, spend 1 ki point to impose the effect from the Fist of Fury upon the creature *If the creature attacked with Reach you cannot attempt imposing the Fist of Fury effect.
Extended Flurry: You can make one additional unarmed attack with your Flurry of Blows.
17th level
Quivering Fist: At 17th level, you gain the ability to set up lethal vibrations in someone’s body. When you hit a creature with an unarmed strike, you can spend 3 ki points to start these imperceptible vibrations. The vibrations are harmless unless you use your action to end them. To do so, you and the target must be on the same plane of existence. When you use this action, the creature must make a Constitution saving throw. If it fails, it is reduced to 0 hit points. If it succeeds, it takes 10d10 necrotic damage. As the Monastic tradition of the Closed Fist focuses on resolving the conflict as quickly as possible they lack the strategic longetivity of the Open Palm regarding this technique. The vibrations must be activated before the monk takes a short rest. However this immediate violent burst leads to greater damage to the creature inflicted. The dies of the necrotic damage are rolled twice each and the better result taken. You can have only one creature under the effect of this feature at a time. You can choose to end the vibrations harmlessly without using an action.
I like most of the design, esp. the ability to make the Monk more of a grappler.
I would suggest that you alter the level 17 ability a bit. If the character gets to roll every necrotic damage die a second time, that is like maximized advantage on damage that is completely unavoidable except never getting hit in the first place. Allowing re-roll of 1's would balance it out better, IMO.
Thank you for the feedback. Yeah I really liked that 5e went straight to dex with attack and damage unlike the previous editions where you had to sacrifice a feat for attack and still had to count damage with strength. This makes the monk less MAD. I thought that they could've allowed the same for grapples and sought to try to do it with this sub class. Good to know if that part works.
Thanks for the input with the Quivering Fist. Yeah you might be right with that. I did think that as Quivering Palm you can use the effect remotely after a long while that this balances that out but perhaps it shouldn't be with just any result. 1's or 1's and 2's like those other abilities allow with some other stuff may very well be enough to balance it.
Thanks for the input. Thats good observation. I was wondering about that. I was trying to find a way to up monks AC and make him a little less glass canon, granted its not as bad as in the previous editions. The Deflect Missiles mechanic seemed good for that, though perhaps it could be transferred to higher level or replace it with the MA die as you suggested. Of course that was partly my reason for the Intercepting Fist which is not likely to see too much usage, at least on low levels as it always spends Ki points. Thanks for the improvement suggestion. :)
Sorry to recite an old post, but I am playing a monk who the DM gave the ability to use Deflect Missiles on melee attacks, and I can tell you that at higher levels, when almost every enemy has Multiattack, it is not that overpowered. Sure, by 11th level, you're reducing the damage of an attack by probably 16+1d10, so on average 21 damage, but then the enemy is making two more attacks against you and you spent your reaction so you can't deflect them. It's good when used tactically, to reduce the damage of a powerful strike, but when you're up against a creature who can attack 3 or 4 times a turn, it is not all that powerful.
Way of the Closed Fist
An off-shoot of the Open Palm Monastic tradition, the Closed Fist focuses on an aggressive approach to combat. Their philosophy is that if violence is unavoidable it is better to take initiative and end the conflict swiftly and decisively. In the process of modifying their teachings the Closed Fist tradition has lost and replaced some of the techniques of the Open Palm Tradition either completely or retained an incomplete understanding of them.
Thoughts and suggestions are welcome.
3rd level
Closed Fist Technique
Fist of Fury: Starting when you choose this tradition at 3rd level, you can manipulate your enemy’s ki when you harness your own. When you hit a creature with one of your flurry of blows attacks you can impose the following effect upon the creature; creature has to make a strength saving throw or be pushed back 10ft.
(This could be modified to "choose one of the three Open palm effects, once chosen it cannot be changed" as Closed Fist sacrifices variety for more effect)
Intercepting Fist: If a creature hits you with a melee attack you can, as a reaction, spend 1 ki point to make an unarmed attack of opportunity. If it hits the creature has to make a strenght saving throw. If the save fails the creature is pushed back 5ft and the attack misses.
*If the creature attacked with Reach your counterattack does not push the creature back or deal damage as, rather than attacking the creature, it swats away the weapon
(alternatively, for simplicitys sake it cannot be used against a Reach attack)
6th level
Clinch Fighting: Your monastic training allows you greater maneuvering in a grapple.
You can apply your Acrobatics (Dex) instead of Athletics (Str) to all Grapple checks.
Your unarmed attacks have advantage in a Grapple
While grappling, or after a successful Throw(see below), you can make an additional grapple check to pin the opponent if successful both you and your opponent are Restrained until your grapple ends.
Throw: You can attempt to make a Grapple check to knock a creature prone.
If you are successful you can land the prone creature on any square around you instead of its own square. The thrown creature cannot be more than one size category larger than you.
If the square is occupied by another creature it has to make a Reflex saving throw
or be pushed back 5ft. If the save is successful the thrown creature lands on an adjacent square.
*If the second creature is more than one size category larger than the thrown creature it cannot be pushed back.
11th level
Extended Flurry: You can make one additional unarmed attack with your Flurry of Blows.
17th level
Quivering Fist: At 17th level, you gain the ability to set up lethal vibrations in someone’s body. When you hit a creature with an unarmed strike, you can spend 3 ki points to start these imperceptible vibrations. The vibrations are harmless unless you use your action to end them. To do so, you and the target must be on the same plane of existence. When you use this action, the creature must make a Constitution saving throw. If it fails, it is reduced to 0 hit points. If it succeeds, it takes 10d10 necrotic damage.
As the Monastic tradition of the Closed Fist focuses on resolving the conflict as quickly as possible they lack the strategic longetivity of the Open Palm regarding this technique. The vibrations must be activated before the monk takes a short rest. However this immediate violent burst leads to greater damage to the creature inflicted. The dies of the necrotic damage are rolled twice each and the better result taken.
You can have only one creature under the effect of this feature at a time. You can choose to end the vibrations harmlessly without using an action.
Parry Blows: An alternative to Intercepting Fist modeled after Deflect Missiles
Parry Blows: You can use your reaction to parry a melee attack. When you do so, the damage you take from the attack is reduced by 1d10 + your Dexterity modifier + your monk level. If you reduce the damage to 0 the attack misses and you can, as a part of the same reaction, spend 1 ki point to make an unarmed attack of opportunity against the creature that attacked you.
If it hits the creature has to make a strenght saving throw. If the save fails the creature is pushed back 5ft
*If the creature attacked with Reach you cannot attempt this
Alternative Parry Blows: You can use your reaction to parry a melee attack. When you do so, the damage you take from the attack is reduced by 1d10 + your Dexterity modifier + your monk level.If you reduce the damage to 0 the attack misses and you can, as a part of the same reaction, spend 1 ki point to make a grapple attempt against the creature that attacked you.
*If the creature attacked with Reach it has an advantage against your grapple attempt as you try to pull it into your grapple from a distance using the creatures own Reach weapon
Sounds like some interesting stuff, although I think at low levels the 'parry blows' feature is a bit overpowered. Assuming a level 3 monk with a 16 dexterity, you're reducing an attack by on average 11 damage every round (7 - 16 damage in total). The only possible way to beat that damage output at 3rd level is to either play a variant human and take great weapon master as your feat:
2d6 Greatsword Damage, + 3 str mod + 10 GWM, 15 - 25 damage per attack, average of 18
Or be a paladin with the same build and use a smite.
Maybe make the damage mitigation roll the same as your 'martial arts' die.
Hi
Thanks for the input. Thats good observation. I was wondering about that. I was trying to find a way to up monks AC and make him a little less glass canon, granted its not as bad as in the previous editions. The Deflect Missiles mechanic seemed good for that, though perhaps it could be transferred to higher level or replace it with the MA die as you suggested.
Of course that was partly my reason for the Intercepting Fist which is not likely to see too much usage, at least on low levels as it always spends Ki points.
Thanks for the improvement suggestion. :)
So I changed the Parry Blows as suggested, though renaming, and flavouring it as Intercepting Fist.
Does this work, or is it still a bit overpowered? If one was to stick with this should it change its place with Clinch Fighting at 6th level? Should I just stick with the original Intercepting Fist?
Intercepting Fist: If a creature hits you with a melee attack you can, as a reaction attack the weapon that strikes you in order to change its trajectory. When you do so, the damage you take from the attack is reduced by your martial arts die + your Dexterity modifier + your monk level. If you reduce the damage to 0 the attack misses. Upon a successful intercept you can, as a part of the same reaction, spend 1 ki point to impose the effect from the Fist of Fury upon the creature
*If the creature attacked with Reach you cannot attempt imposing the Fist of Fury effect.
Not too over powered considering the monk is a glass canon
Thanks for the reply. Glad to hear it!
I like most of the design, esp. the ability to make the Monk more of a grappler.
I would suggest that you alter the level 17 ability a bit. If the character gets to roll every necrotic damage die a second time, that is like maximized advantage on damage that is completely unavoidable except never getting hit in the first place. Allowing re-roll of 1's would balance it out better, IMO.
Hi
Thank you for the feedback. Yeah I really liked that 5e went straight to dex with attack and damage unlike the previous editions where you had to sacrifice a feat for attack and still had to count damage with strength. This makes the monk less MAD. I thought that they could've allowed the same for grapples and sought to try to do it with this sub class.
Good to know if that part works.
Thanks for the input with the Quivering Fist. Yeah you might be right with that. I did think that as Quivering Palm you can use the effect remotely after a long while that this balances that out but perhaps it shouldn't be with just any result. 1's or 1's and 2's like those other abilities allow with some other stuff may very well be enough to balance it.
You're welcome. By the by, I posted a homebrew Sorcerer subclass in the Sorcerer thread, in case you're curious. I would appreciate your feedback.
Sorry to recite an old post, but I am playing a monk who the DM gave the ability to use Deflect Missiles on melee attacks, and I can tell you that at higher levels, when almost every enemy has Multiattack, it is not that overpowered. Sure, by 11th level, you're reducing the damage of an attack by probably 16+1d10, so on average 21 damage, but then the enemy is making two more attacks against you and you spent your reaction so you can't deflect them. It's good when used tactically, to reduce the damage of a powerful strike, but when you're up against a creature who can attack 3 or 4 times a turn, it is not all that powerful.
Hi
Thanks for the input. I'll take it into consideration in further developments :)