I would like to introduce you to Sir Volund Starfire, my Paladin character. He’s fully built and is about to run through a 0-level before embarking on a full campaign. I’d like some feedback from the community at large to see what you all think.
Sir Volund Starfire Race: Variant Human Background: Knight (Noble) Class: Paladin/Warlock Attributes: Str 16(+3), Dex 8(-1), Con 14(+2), Int 10(+0), Wis 12(+1), Cha 14(+2) Skills: Athletics, Insight, Intimidation, Persuasion, Religion Feats: Shield Master
Leveling Roadmap:
Level 2 (Paladin 1/Warlock 1). My patron is the Raven Queen. My cantrips are Booming Blade and Toll the Dead. Spells are Hex and Cause Fear. Also, part of the Raven Queen’s package is a Sentinel Raven named Poe.
Levels 3-5 (Paladin 4/Warlock 1). I take my Defense fighting style, because this character is a tank. In addition, to add to the tankiness, I take Oath of the Crown. I end this block with the Sentinel feat. Spell-wise, I’m looking at Shield of Faith, Bless, Compelled Duel, Searing Smite, and Cure Wounds.
Levels 6-8 (Paladin 4/Warlock 4). I am going Pact of the Blade. My Invocations are Fiendish Vigor (who doesn’t like at-will temporary hit points) and Eldritch Armor. It ends with Inspiring Leader. Spell-wise, I take Hellish Rebuke, Hold Person, and Crown of Madness, with True Strike added as a cantrip later.
Levels 9-12 (Paladin 8/Warlock 4). Divine Allegiance gives good tanking bonuses and so does my Aura of Protection. I also take the Tough feat for more HP. Spells are swapping Searing Smite for Branding Smite, Aid, and Lesser Restoration.
Levels 13-16 (Paladin 8/Warlock 8). This is the height of my Warlock trip. I get Soul of the Raven and the Invocations Relentless Hex and Whispers of the Grave. I end with the feat Athlete (shield shoves to the prone are good for tanking). My spells are Counterspell, Vampiric Touch, Banishment, and Charm Monster.
Levels 17-20 (Paladin 12/Warlock 8). Here’s the Home Stretch. I get my Aura of Courage and Improved Divine Smite. I switch Branding Smite out for Blinding Smite, gain Aura of Vitality, and Crusader’s Mantle. I end with the feat Slasher.
First, pick up warcaster right away, cause otherwise you won't be able to use your spells much without a free hand if you're going sword-n-board. Consider switching the starting scores for both CHA and STR since you're multiclassing hexblade anyways.
Second, replace toll the dead with eldritch blast, and pick up agonizing blast as one of your invocations, and keep it at all times. BTW, I'm assuming you meant armor of shadows for the invocations you'd pick up during your first 4 levels of warlock, I'd recommend you replace that one because mage armor doesn't work with heavy armor, something I'm assuming your paladin will be wearing.
Third, if you want to be a tank, you should pick out Shield and Armor of Agathys instead of hex and cause fear for your first level warlock spells.
If you follow these recommendations, you'll be solid no matter what you do.
First, pick up warcaster right away, cause otherwise you won't be able to use your spells much without a free hand if you're going sword-n-board. Consider switching the starting scores for both CHA and STR since you're multiclassing hexblade anyways.
Second, replace toll the dead with eldritch blast, and pick up agonizing blast as one of your invocations, and keep it at all times. BTW, I'm assuming you meant armor of shadows for the invocations you'd pick up during your first 4 levels of warlock, I'd recommend you replace that one because mage armor doesn't work with heavy armor, something I'm assuming your paladin will be wearing.
Third, if you want to be a tank, you should pick out Shield and Armor of Agathys instead of hex and cause fear for your first level warlock spells.
If you follow these recommendations, you'll be solid no matter what you do.
Good points. I didn't even read it thoroughly. I just got stuck on the point about not having a 2nd attack, either paladin or hexblade, because of neither being 5th level, when overall level 8. One of the largest jumps in power for most classes occurs at 5th level, with 2nd attack for martial classes and 3rd level spells for full casters. Volund will want to head to 5th level in one class imo, before multi-classing. In fact, 2nd attack and the paladin's 6th level aura are so strong, I would probably go paladin to 6, then start on the hexblade.
Eldritch Blast is one of the best damage cantrips, if not THE best. EB with agonizing blast is fantastic, no reason not to take it. Way better than Toll the Dead, listen to Cgarciao. He/she's spot on with that.
Cgarciao is also right about War Caster. It will give you advantage on concentration checks (con save) to maintain concentration on a spell (paladins and warlocks have a ton of concentration spells) when you take damage. But as important or maybe more important to you, as a sword and board is...you need a free hand to cast a spell with a somatic component. So you are constantly having to sheathe your free item interaction to sheathe your sword, cast the spell, next turn remember to draw the sword, etc. It can be cumbersome without War Caster and interfere with your regular attacks otherwise.
Cgarciao, I agree with you about flipping the Str and Cha, since Volund is going hexblade early on (which I would not do). Hexblade's will utilize Cha for the modifier, so Str is less important. Drawbacks of this are...no armor heavier than Chain Mail, unless willing to take some movement penalties. Also Armor of Agathys is fantastic! Temp hp AND does damage when they hit you!
Eh, I'm personally not too concerned with when multi attack is achieved so long as they have some scaling option. Sure, at lvl 5 they won't be able to attack twice with their sword, but they will be able to use EB twice, with agonizing blast which is even better than hitting things with a sword.
I kinda get why'd they pick up hexblade early. Fact of the matter is paladin has basically no solid options for ranged attacks. Picking up EB soon is a great way, if not the best way, to shore up that weakness.
I personally love optimization and min-maxing, but I also believe in trying to preserve the spirit of what ever it is the player wants to achieve. If they want to go to lvl 8 on a 4/4 split, then so be it, here's how I'd make it work.
Eh, I'm personally not too concerned with when multi attack is achieved so long as they have some scaling option. Sure, at lvl 5 they won't be able to attack twice with their sword, but they will be able to use EB twice, with agonizing blast which is even better than hitting things with a sword.
I kinda get why'd they pick up hexblade early. Fact of the matter is paladin has basically no solid options for ranged attacks. Picking up EB soon is a great way, if not the best way, to shore up that weakness.
I personally love optimization and min-maxing, but I also believe in trying to preserve the spirit of what ever it is the player wants to achieve. If they want to go to lvl 8 on a 4/4 split, then so be it, here's how I'd make it work.
As a sword and board tank, something will generally be right in front of you. So EB isn't a great option in that situation. Other than that, Volund will only have one weapon attack, instead of two. Yes, paladins lack ranged damage options. This is generally more of a problem at higher levels, than lower imo. At lower levels, get a javelin for the one ranged attack, right before the two sides start meleeing. :)
Also might swap dex and int. -1 to AC and dex saves can be rough. Int saves about never come up. There’s a lot of skills attached to both, so that’s a wash. It’s not that big of a difference, but personally I’d say it’s the better choice. Though from an rp standpoint, it can be harder to play something below average int than something of average int.
Don’t take true strike. Never take true strike. It’s the worst, most useless spell in the game.
Pally spells don’t work like warlock spells. Pally spells, you can change every day, at the end of a long rest. Warlock spells are where you’re stuck with them until you level. So don’t worry about swapping pally spells by level -you’ll be swapping them daily if you like. Also, those smite spells will rarely, if ever be used. It’s nice to have a couple for the rare cases when you, for example, fight something with fire vulnerability, but in general you’re better off just regular smiting instead of spell smiting.
Which fighting style? Defense is good for the ac bonus if you are tanking, dueling will give you a nice damage boost, I’d go for one of those.
Just a general note. I appreciate your enthusiasm, and theory crafting is really fun. Just don’t stay so focused on ticking the boxes of your build that you never consider other options. You may realize you aren’t doing something as much as you thought you would, and decide to change something up. Keep an open mind as you’re playing, you may decide you want to stick more with one class or the other, or change a feat.
Also might swap dex and int. -1 to AC and dex saves can be rough.
True about Dex saves and initiative will be lacking. There will be no penalty to AC though, since Volund is likely to be wearing heavy armor imo. You are correct, overall, though, about the benefits of Dex.
Good catch. I swore negative dex bonuses applied to AC, but I may just be remembering an earlier edition.
They do if unless you're wearing heavy armor.
Yeah. I was unclear in my earlier phrasing. I mean I think the negative used to apply even in heavy armor. Or maybe it didn't? I've been playing this game for too long. Too many old editions and houserules bumping together in my head. It's really immaterial now, though. It doesn't currently and I apologize for confusing the issue.
Good catch. I swore negative dex bonuses applied to AC, but I may just be remembering an earlier edition.
They do if unless you're wearing heavy armor.
Yeah. I was unclear in my earlier phrasing. I mean I think the negative used to apply even in heavy armor. Or maybe it didn't? I've been playing this game for too long. Too many old editions and houserules bumping together in my head. It's really immaterial now, though. It doesn't currently and I apologize for confusing the issue.
It did in previous editions, yes.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
I'd switch out crown of madness for suggestion. You may also want to switch out searing smite with thunderous smite. Also, don't take true strike, unless there are lots of attacks that you absolutely need advantage on. Otherwise, your build looks pretty solid. You might want to consider taking armor of Agathys though. I have seen so many enemies die to it.
I would like to introduce you to Sir Volund Starfire, my Paladin character. He’s fully built and is about to run through a 0-level before embarking on a full campaign. I’d like some feedback from the community at large to see what you all think.
Sir Volund Starfire
Race: Variant Human
Background: Knight (Noble)
Class: Paladin/Warlock
Attributes: Str 16(+3), Dex 8(-1), Con 14(+2), Int 10(+0), Wis 12(+1), Cha 14(+2)
Skills: Athletics, Insight, Intimidation, Persuasion, Religion
Feats: Shield Master
Leveling Roadmap:
Level 2 (Paladin 1/Warlock 1). My patron is the Raven Queen. My cantrips are Booming Blade and Toll the Dead. Spells are Hex and Cause Fear. Also, part of the Raven Queen’s package is a Sentinel Raven named Poe.
Levels 3-5 (Paladin 4/Warlock 1). I take my Defense fighting style, because this character is a tank. In addition, to add to the tankiness, I take Oath of the Crown. I end this block with the Sentinel feat. Spell-wise, I’m looking at Shield of Faith, Bless, Compelled Duel, Searing Smite, and Cure Wounds.
Levels 6-8 (Paladin 4/Warlock 4). I am going Pact of the Blade. My Invocations are Fiendish Vigor (who doesn’t like at-will temporary hit points) and Eldritch Armor. It ends with Inspiring Leader. Spell-wise, I take Hellish Rebuke, Hold Person, and Crown of Madness, with True Strike added as a cantrip later.
Levels 9-12 (Paladin 8/Warlock 4). Divine Allegiance gives good tanking bonuses and so does my Aura of Protection. I also take the Tough feat for more HP. Spells are swapping Searing Smite for Branding Smite, Aid, and Lesser Restoration.
Levels 13-16 (Paladin 8/Warlock 8). This is the height of my Warlock trip. I get Soul of the Raven and the Invocations Relentless Hex and Whispers of the Grave. I end with the feat Athlete (shield shoves to the prone are good for tanking). My spells are Counterspell, Vampiric Touch, Banishment, and Charm Monster.
Levels 17-20 (Paladin 12/Warlock 8). Here’s the Home Stretch. I get my Aura of Courage and Improved Divine Smite. I switch Branding Smite out for Blinding Smite, gain Aura of Vitality, and Crusader’s Mantle. I end with the feat Slasher.
So you are going to be level 8 overall (4 paladin/4 warlock), but without a 2nd attack? Yeah, might want to rethink that one. ;)
Alright, here's a couple changes I'd suggest:
First, pick up warcaster right away, cause otherwise you won't be able to use your spells much without a free hand if you're going sword-n-board. Consider switching the starting scores for both CHA and STR since you're multiclassing hexblade anyways.
Second, replace toll the dead with eldritch blast, and pick up agonizing blast as one of your invocations, and keep it at all times. BTW, I'm assuming you meant armor of shadows for the invocations you'd pick up during your first 4 levels of warlock, I'd recommend you replace that one because mage armor doesn't work with heavy armor, something I'm assuming your paladin will be wearing.
Third, if you want to be a tank, you should pick out Shield and Armor of Agathys instead of hex and cause fear for your first level warlock spells.
If you follow these recommendations, you'll be solid no matter what you do.
Good points. I didn't even read it thoroughly. I just got stuck on the point about not having a 2nd attack, either paladin or hexblade, because of neither being 5th level, when overall level 8. One of the largest jumps in power for most classes occurs at 5th level, with 2nd attack for martial classes and 3rd level spells for full casters. Volund will want to head to 5th level in one class imo, before multi-classing. In fact, 2nd attack and the paladin's 6th level aura are so strong, I would probably go paladin to 6, then start on the hexblade.
Eldritch Blast is one of the best damage cantrips, if not THE best. EB with agonizing blast is fantastic, no reason not to take it. Way better than Toll the Dead, listen to Cgarciao. He/she's spot on with that.
Cgarciao is also right about War Caster. It will give you advantage on concentration checks (con save) to maintain concentration on a spell (paladins and warlocks have a ton of concentration spells) when you take damage. But as important or maybe more important to you, as a sword and board is...you need a free hand to cast a spell with a somatic component. So you are constantly having to sheathe your free item interaction to sheathe your sword, cast the spell, next turn remember to draw the sword, etc. It can be cumbersome without War Caster and interfere with your regular attacks otherwise.
Cgarciao, I agree with you about flipping the Str and Cha, since Volund is going hexblade early on (which I would not do). Hexblade's will utilize Cha for the modifier, so Str is less important. Drawbacks of this are...no armor heavier than Chain Mail, unless willing to take some movement penalties. Also Armor of Agathys is fantastic! Temp hp AND does damage when they hit you!
Eh, I'm personally not too concerned with when multi attack is achieved so long as they have some scaling option. Sure, at lvl 5 they won't be able to attack twice with their sword, but they will be able to use EB twice, with agonizing blast which is even better than hitting things with a sword.
I kinda get why'd they pick up hexblade early. Fact of the matter is paladin has basically no solid options for ranged attacks. Picking up EB soon is a great way, if not the best way, to shore up that weakness.
I personally love optimization and min-maxing, but I also believe in trying to preserve the spirit of what ever it is the player wants to achieve. If they want to go to lvl 8 on a 4/4 split, then so be it, here's how I'd make it work.
As a sword and board tank, something will generally be right in front of you. So EB isn't a great option in that situation. Other than that, Volund will only have one weapon attack, instead of two. Yes, paladins lack ranged damage options. This is generally more of a problem at higher levels, than lower imo. At lower levels, get a javelin for the one ranged attack, right before the two sides start meleeing. :)
Also might swap dex and int. -1 to
AC anddex saves can be rough. Int saves about never come up. There’s a lot of skills attached to both, so that’s a wash. It’s not that big of a difference, but personally I’d say it’s the better choice. Though from an rp standpoint, it can be harder to play something below average int than something of average int.Don’t take true strike. Never take true strike. It’s the worst, most useless spell in the game.
Pally spells don’t work like warlock spells. Pally spells, you can change every day, at the end of a long rest. Warlock spells are where you’re stuck with them until you level. So don’t worry about swapping pally spells by level -you’ll be swapping them daily if you like. Also, those smite spells will rarely, if ever be used. It’s nice to have a couple for the rare cases when you, for example, fight something with fire vulnerability, but in general you’re better off just regular smiting instead of spell smiting.
Which fighting style? Defense is good for the ac bonus if you are tanking, dueling will give you a nice damage boost, I’d go for one of those.
Just a general note. I appreciate your enthusiasm, and theory crafting is really fun. Just don’t stay so focused on ticking the boxes of your build that you never consider other options. You may realize you aren’t doing something as much as you thought you would, and decide to change something up. Keep an open mind as you’re playing, you may decide you want to stick more with one class or the other, or change a feat.
True about Dex saves and initiative will be lacking. There will be no penalty to AC though, since Volund is likely to be wearing heavy armor imo. You are correct, overall, though, about the benefits of Dex.
Good catch. I swore negative dex bonuses applied to AC, but I may just be remembering an earlier edition.
They do if unless you're wearing heavy armor.
Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
Yeah. I was unclear in my earlier phrasing. I mean I think the negative used to apply even in heavy armor. Or maybe it didn't? I've been playing this game for too long. Too many old editions and houserules bumping together in my head. It's really immaterial now, though. It doesn't currently and I apologize for confusing the issue.
It did in previous editions, yes.
Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
I'd switch out crown of madness for suggestion. You may also want to switch out searing smite with thunderous smite. Also, don't take true strike, unless there are lots of attacks that you absolutely need advantage on. Otherwise, your build looks pretty solid. You might want to consider taking armor of Agathys though. I have seen so many enemies die to it.
Erean Cabenrith a Variant Human Cleric (Light Domain)
Eliem Lightblossom a High Elf Blood Hunter
Check out my Extended Signature Here