Using two-weapon fighting and Hunter's Mark (even without the Dual Wielder Feat) they have more damage than most other martial builds at levels 1-10, and they have good spells like Absorb Elements, Fog Cloud, Pass without Trace, etc.
However, in tier 3, there is a seriously fall off in performance and I'm not sure how to build after 5. Lacking
I wanted to know if anyone has though of any multiclass ideas after getting extra attack.
If you go Druid, you can still get Dual Wielder as a feat and combine it with Conjure Minor Elementals or Fountain of Moonlight by 12. However, it feels like there are a lot of wasted features from 6-11 for a of two weapon based build. Taking levels in Rogue or Fighter are another option. What do you think?
Are we talking a straight 2014 ranger, a Tasha’s ranger or a 2024 ranger? It sorta helps to know where to start. 2014 ranger: you might want to reconsider not going to L8, L6 gives you expertise ( effectively) in another creature type and another landscape type. Of the two I grant the creature type is probably more useful but both are actually fairly powerful. L7 gives you landstride adding 10’ to your movement - also more powerful than often thought. Then there is L8 with the ASI/feat. If you don’t need the ASI for stats I recommend alert that edge in initiative is very useful. Tasha,s ranger: go at least to L6, that gets you roving with a 5’ speed as well as swimming and climbing speeds. That’s actually bigger than most folks think as it makes many climbing scenarios stop being difficult terrain and you can use any weapons without disadvantage underwater with a swimming speed. Personally I prefer favored enemy to favored foe and so the extra enemy type is useful here as well. L7 still gives you Landstride making a total of 15’ extra movement and L8 again grants you the ASI. For 2014/Tasha level 8-9 is a natural break point as there is no class feature ( other than L3 spells) to gain at L9. This isn’t true of the 2024 Ranger which gets either a class or subclass feature every level.
2024 Ranger; L6 gives you roving like Tasha but it’s now 10’ not 5’. L7 now gets a subclass feature so we need to know what subclass and check that. L8 is the ASI still and well worth waiting and getting. L9 gets you 2 Expertises which are very useful and L 10 gets you tireless. Generally the 2024 ranger is strong enough at every level that I’m not sure I would want to multiclass.
then there is what to multiclass into. Druid and cleric are obvious choices as you already have the wisdom needed from the basic ranger MADness. If you have the charisma ( or can get it with L8 ASI’s) then 2 of my favorites are warlock and sorceror. Warlock gives you Eldritch blast which replaces your bow - especially if your focused on melee not ranged as a ranger. Sorceror lets you focus on adding blasting to your combat abilities. In either case you’re probably going to want to take warcaster at L12. Other options include artificer and barbarian.
With the exception of a Barbarian GWM with Rage, Hunters Mark + 3 attacks with Vex and Nick is one the best DPRs in the game today.
However, there are some small details that can greatly increase TWF effectiveness:
- Once you cast Hunters Mark, after the second round, if your target is still alive, don’t bother to spare your bonus action. Sheath your scimitar, draw your shortsword (always carry two of them) and start Vexing around without impunity.
- Nick property with scimitar has only one function: allow you to cast and change your Hunters Mark target with your bonus action; your main weapon will always be a trustworthy pair of shortswords.
- Thinking on this logic, you can also cast Magic Weapon in your second round, after HM is up, specially if you already have one magic weapon; this compensates for characters who wield two weapons.
- Assuming damage is not the best route in a combat (which I usually doubt, TWF Rangers now are strikers and should always prioritize DPR), you can leverage Nick property to attack 3 times and perhaps cast Ensnaring Strike.
Well, reason I’m saying this is because Rangers are a very good class even after level 5. However, Fighter multiclass is always an amazing option. Action Surge, more Weapon Masteries. If you manage to start as Fighter to nail CON prof, then it’s even better.
My individual opinion is to multi-class ranger with rogue. The combination would provide sneak attack, skills and additional bonus actions. There are even thematic combinations that already exist...
Swashbuckler rogue with fey wanderer ranger based on wisdom-charisma relations and melee attacks
Scout rogue with hunter or gloom stalker for ranged attacking and skills
Barbarian interferes with HM and requires strength based attacks. Not very useful. Fighter offers some toys from the subclasses and action surge in the short term. Not too bad. Rogue offers increased damage via sneak and some subclass toys. Not too bad. Monk isn't really useful, paladin is too difficult to pull off ability score wise, Warlock doesn't add much.
On the caster front Druid and Cleric have some interesting 3rd level spells (spirit guardians) and a faster track on upcasting. One of the more interesting pieces here is that the Ranger gets 2nd level spells at 5th level and 3rd at 9th. Meanwhile a 5/5 Ranger cleric gets 3rd level spells one level later AND would have upcastable slots to pour things into. So if you wanted to get your increased damage from Conjure Animals it is stronger to multiclass at 5 than to stay Ranger. Rangers also don't have concentration protection so melee emanation using is a little rough.
But I think the fundamental question comes down to how you want your damage to go and both work: Martial: Rogue and fighter both offer some tricks Caster: Cleric and druid both offer some tricks
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Using two-weapon fighting and Hunter's Mark (even without the Dual Wielder Feat) they have more damage than most other martial builds at levels 1-10, and they have good spells like Absorb Elements, Fog Cloud, Pass without Trace, etc.
However, in tier 3, there is a seriously fall off in performance and I'm not sure how to build after 5. Lacking
I wanted to know if anyone has though of any multiclass ideas after getting extra attack.
If you go Druid, you can still get Dual Wielder as a feat and combine it with Conjure Minor Elementals or Fountain of Moonlight by 12. However, it feels like there are a lot of wasted features from 6-11 for a of two weapon based build. Taking levels in Rogue or Fighter are another option. What do you think?
Are we talking a straight 2014 ranger, a Tasha’s ranger or a 2024 ranger? It sorta helps to know where to start.
2014 ranger: you might want to reconsider not going to L8, L6 gives you expertise ( effectively) in another creature type and another landscape type. Of the two I grant the creature type is probably more useful but both are actually fairly powerful. L7 gives you landstride adding 10’ to your movement - also more powerful than often thought. Then there is L8 with the ASI/feat. If you don’t need the ASI for stats I recommend alert that edge in initiative is very useful.
Tasha,s ranger: go at least to L6, that gets you roving with a 5’ speed as well as swimming and climbing speeds. That’s actually bigger than most folks think as it makes many climbing scenarios stop being difficult terrain and you can use any weapons without disadvantage underwater with a swimming speed. Personally I prefer favored enemy to favored foe and so the extra enemy type is useful here as well. L7 still gives you Landstride making a total of 15’ extra movement and L8 again grants you the ASI.
For 2014/Tasha level 8-9 is a natural break point as there is no class feature ( other than L3 spells) to gain at L9. This isn’t true of the 2024 Ranger which gets either a class or subclass feature every level.
2024 Ranger; L6 gives you roving like Tasha but it’s now 10’ not 5’. L7 now gets a subclass feature so we need to know what subclass and check that. L8 is the ASI still and well worth waiting and getting. L9 gets you 2 Expertises which are very useful and L 10 gets you tireless. Generally the 2024 ranger is strong enough at every level that I’m not sure I would want to multiclass.
then there is what to multiclass into. Druid and cleric are obvious choices as you already have the wisdom needed from the basic ranger MADness. If you have the charisma ( or can get it with L8 ASI’s) then 2 of my favorites are warlock and sorceror. Warlock gives you Eldritch blast which replaces your bow - especially if your focused on melee not ranged as a ranger. Sorceror lets you focus on adding blasting to your combat abilities. In either case you’re probably going to want to take warcaster at L12. Other options include artificer and barbarian.
Wisea$$ DM and Player since 1979.
With the exception of a Barbarian GWM with Rage, Hunters Mark + 3 attacks with Vex and Nick is one the best DPRs in the game today.
However, there are some small details that can greatly increase TWF effectiveness:
- Once you cast Hunters Mark, after the second round, if your target is still alive, don’t bother to spare your bonus action. Sheath your scimitar, draw your shortsword (always carry two of them) and start Vexing around without impunity.
- Nick property with scimitar has only one function: allow you to cast and change your Hunters Mark target with your bonus action; your main weapon will always be a trustworthy pair of shortswords.
- Thinking on this logic, you can also cast Magic Weapon in your second round, after HM is up, specially if you already have one magic weapon; this compensates for characters who wield two weapons.
- Assuming damage is not the best route in a combat (which I usually doubt, TWF Rangers now are strikers and should always prioritize DPR), you can leverage Nick property to attack 3 times and perhaps cast Ensnaring Strike.
Well, reason I’m saying this is because Rangers are a very good class even after level 5. However, Fighter multiclass is always an amazing option. Action Surge, more Weapon Masteries. If you manage to start as Fighter to nail CON prof, then it’s even better.
My individual opinion is to multi-class ranger with rogue. The combination would provide sneak attack, skills and additional bonus actions. There are even thematic combinations that already exist...
Swashbuckler rogue with fey wanderer ranger based on wisdom-charisma relations and melee attacks
Scout rogue with hunter or gloom stalker for ranged attacking and skills
Barbarian interferes with HM and requires strength based attacks. Not very useful.
Fighter offers some toys from the subclasses and action surge in the short term. Not too bad.
Rogue offers increased damage via sneak and some subclass toys. Not too bad.
Monk isn't really useful, paladin is too difficult to pull off ability score wise, Warlock doesn't add much.
On the caster front Druid and Cleric have some interesting 3rd level spells (spirit guardians) and a faster track on upcasting. One of the more interesting pieces here is that the Ranger gets 2nd level spells at 5th level and 3rd at 9th. Meanwhile a 5/5 Ranger cleric gets 3rd level spells one level later AND would have upcastable slots to pour things into. So if you wanted to get your increased damage from Conjure Animals it is stronger to multiclass at 5 than to stay Ranger. Rangers also don't have concentration protection so melee emanation using is a little rough.
But I think the fundamental question comes down to how you want your damage to go and both work:
Martial: Rogue and fighter both offer some tricks
Caster: Cleric and druid both offer some tricks