So, I've been playing a Tabaxi rogue with Mobile feature, Scout subclass. That got my speed to 50. So I added the UA Ranger rules and picked the movement speed boost from Deft Explorer. Our DM didn't go with the Hunter's Mark boost, though, sadly. I picked up the two weapon fighting style as I've always been dashing in and stabbing and running out of combat. I planned on Gloom Stalker for the bonus speed and initiative bonus at the beginning of combat, but our last adventure had us helping purify the winter realm of the Fey, and so instead I chose Fey Wanderer as I leveled up at the end of the adventure and passed out under a dryad tree to recuperate. Now butterflies follow my Tabaxi everywhere they go! (Stern whispered discussions during stealthy infiltration actions are now commonplace.)
For spells, I have longstrider to buff before big combats to get my speed up to 65, hunter's mark, and cure wounds. My role is to grief spell casters and drive by stabbings of whoever the barbarian is bashing.
At 10 rogue/3 Ranger my plan is.
Rouge 11 (reliable talent)
Rogue 12 (ASI - Wisdom)
Rogue 13 (Ambush Master)
At this point, I am undecided on if I should do Ranger 4 then 5 for ASI/Second Attack and 2nd level spells or continue straight up the Rogue ladder to 17. Blindsense and Slippery mind at 14 and 15 are legit awesome, but might be worth a postponing for ASI/Second Attack, and then giving up an ASI and Sudden Strike (1st round of combat you can use a second Sneak Attack on separate targets)
Given than I already dual wield, the second attack isn't as important, but it's not nothing. Is the second attack and 2nd level spells and slots worth losing a d6 sneak attack damage? I already dual wield frost brands and fey wanderer will give me a further d6 psychic damage, so I'll be doing 1d6 + 6 + 1d6 cold + 1d6 psychic damage for successful hits on most turns. The second attack will usually give me more flexibility with my bonus action, but the d6 psychic damage requires my bonus action, so saving the bonus action also reduces damage slightly.
The level 17 Rogue Scout ability is very good. Getting a chance every round to do a second sneak attack dealing 9D6 damage (on top of the damage you already do with your attacks) is pretty crazy. I think Rogue 17 Ranger 3 is the best choice.
Losing one or two sneak attack die for an extra attack is kind of a wash. 2D6 sneak attack = 7avg damage. 1 extra attack = 1D6 + dex (assuming 5 at level 15 rogue, 5 ranger) so 8.5 avg damage. 2 attacks also equals 2 chances to crit, and you get to decide which attack your sneak attack applies to (if your sneak attack applies to that target.)
The real question is what abilities do you gain or lose when you take it from 3 to 5 levels? What do you prefer?
Losing one or two sneak attack die for an extra attack is kind of a wash. 2D6 sneak attack = 7avg damage. 1 extra attack = 1D6 + dex (assuming 5 at level 15 rogue, 5 ranger) so 8.5 avg damage. 2 attacks also equals 2 chances to crit, and you get to decide which attack your sneak attack applies to (if your sneak attack applies to that target.)
The real question is what abilities do you gain or lose when you take it from 3 to 5 levels? What do you prefer?
At least in my game, you don't get to see whether or not your second attacks hits before you decide whether or not to use Sneak Attack on your first attack. If your game allows you to see the results of both attacks before you decide whether or not to use Sneak Attack on the first attack, that's a pretty big boost to Rogues doing multiple attacks.
At this point, I am undecided on if I should do Ranger 4 then 5 for ASI/Second Attack and 2nd level spells or continue straight up the Rogue ladder to 17. Blindsense and Slippery mind at 14 and 15 are legit awesome, but might be worth a postponing for ASI/Second Attack, and then giving up an ASI and Sudden Strike (1st round of combat you can use a second Sneak Attack on separate targets)
The way I read the ability, you can get a second sneak attack every round, and not just the first round of combat. Am I reading an outdated version of the ability?
Rules as written, you decide if you deal sneak attack damage entirely.
Sneak attack: Beginning at 1st level, you know how to strike subtly and exploit a foe’s distraction. Once per turn, you can deal an extra 1d6 damage to one creature you hit with an attack if you have advantage on the attack roll. The attack must use a finesse or a ranged weapon.
As long the criteria for your sneak attack apply, you can decide which attack it applies to, or even if you're applying it at all. Furthermore, Jeremy Crawford supports this statement.
Rules as written, you decide if you deal sneak attack damage entirely.
Sneak attack: Beginning at 1st level, you know how to strike subtly and exploit a foe’s distraction. Once per turn, you can deal an extra 1d6 damage to one creature you hit with an attack if you have advantage on the attack roll. The attack must use a finesse or a ranged weapon.
As long the criteria for your sneak attack apply, you can decide which attack it applies to, or even if you're applying it at all. Furthermore, Jeremy Crawford supports this statement.
You're dodging the question.
Do you get to know the outcome of the second attack roll before you decide whether or not to use Sneak Attack on your first attack? Or do you have to resolve the first attack entirely before you make the second attack?
Rules as written, you decide if you deal sneak attack damage entirely.
Sneak attack: Beginning at 1st level, you know how to strike subtly and exploit a foe’s distraction. Once per turn, you can deal an extra 1d6 damage to one creature you hit with an attack if you have advantage on the attack roll. The attack must use a finesse or a ranged weapon.
As long the criteria for your sneak attack apply, you can decide which attack it applies to, or even if you're applying it at all. Furthermore, Jeremy Crawford supports this statement.
You're dodging the question.
Do you get to know the outcome of the second attack roll before you decide whether or not to use Sneak Attack on your first attack? Or do you have to resolve the first attack entirely before you make the second attack?
Attacks are done in order. You roll one attack, decide if you want to apply stuff. After that you. decide if you want to move before making your next attack.
The way we're playing and the way I'm reading the RAW as a dual wielding rogue :
I have Attack, plus a bonus action attack as dual wielder. If I miss the first attack, I make the second attack to trigger my Sneak Attack.
At max level, I could have :
Melee :
15 Rogue/ 5 Ranger : 2 attacks to trigger sneak attack, Bonus attack with sneak attack (On a second creature NOT hit with first sneak attack.)
17 Rogue/3 Ranger : 1 Attack, 1 Bonus attack. Both attacks could trigger sneak atttack, but they have to have different targets if they both trigger.
In all of those, note that my bonus d6 damage for psychic damage may go away as I have to use the bonus attack to trigger the second sneak attack damage, or the bonus action to trigger the psychic damage. (Of course, bonus d6 psychic is not better than another sneak attack damage!, but would be nice for single target.)
Ranged :
15 Rogue/ 5 Ranger : 2 attacks, possible to have 1 sneak attack. Bonus action to hide.
17 Rogue/ 3 Ranger : 1 attack, Bonus attack, both can trigger sneak attack if aimed at different targets. No bonus action left to hide.
EDIT :
We resolve the first attack fully, so usually sneak attack is applied on the first attack. I have never 'held on' to my sneak attack hoping to crit on the second attack.
«Once per turn, you can deal an extra 1d6 damage to one creature you hit with an attack if you have advantage on the attack roll.»
Raw is clear that you cannot sneak attack more than once per turn. That said, you can sneak attack more than once per round if you manage to attack on someone elses turn, for instance through an attack of opportunity or the haste spell combined with the ready action moving your regular action to someone elses turn.
dual wielding is great though as it allows another chance to land sneak attack if you miss with the main hand.
«Once per turn, you can deal an extra 1d6 damage to one creature you hit with an attack if you have advantage on the attack roll.»
Raw is clear that you cannot sneak attack more than omce per turn. That said, you can sneak attack more than once per round if you manage to attack on someone elses turn, for instance through an attack of opportunity or the haste spell combined with the ready action moving your regular action to someone elses turn.
dual wielding is great though as it allows another chance to land sneak attack if you miss with the main hand.
The scout's 17th level ability lets them get 2 sneak attacks off, just not on the same target. That's why everyone is talking about it for this build. Mind you, that's level 20 for this character, so it may never get to there.
«Once per turn, you can deal an extra 1d6 damage to one creature you hit with an attack if you have advantage on the attack roll.»
Raw is clear that you cannot sneak attack more than omce per turn. That said, you can sneak attack more than once per round if you manage to attack on someone elses turn, for instance through an attack of opportunity or the haste spell combined with the ready action moving your regular action to someone elses turn.
dual wielding is great though as it allows another chance to land sneak attack if you miss with the main hand.
The scout's 17th level ability lets them get 2 sneak attacks off, just not on the same target. That's why everyone is talking about it for this build. Mind you, that's level 20 for this character, so it may never get to there.
Sry, reread now and I see that none implied what I thought :)
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So, I've been playing a Tabaxi rogue with Mobile feature, Scout subclass. That got my speed to 50. So I added the UA Ranger rules and picked the movement speed boost from Deft Explorer. Our DM didn't go with the Hunter's Mark boost, though, sadly. I picked up the two weapon fighting style as I've always been dashing in and stabbing and running out of combat. I planned on Gloom Stalker for the bonus speed and initiative bonus at the beginning of combat, but our last adventure had us helping purify the winter realm of the Fey, and so instead I chose Fey Wanderer as I leveled up at the end of the adventure and passed out under a dryad tree to recuperate. Now butterflies follow my Tabaxi everywhere they go! (Stern whispered discussions during stealthy infiltration actions are now commonplace.)
For spells, I have longstrider to buff before big combats to get my speed up to 65, hunter's mark, and cure wounds. My role is to grief spell casters and drive by stabbings of whoever the barbarian is bashing.
At 10 rogue/3 Ranger my plan is.
Rouge 11 (reliable talent)
Rogue 12 (ASI - Wisdom)
Rogue 13 (Ambush Master)
At this point, I am undecided on if I should do Ranger 4 then 5 for ASI/Second Attack and 2nd level spells or continue straight up the Rogue ladder to 17. Blindsense and Slippery mind at 14 and 15 are legit awesome, but might be worth a postponing for ASI/Second Attack, and then giving up an ASI and Sudden Strike (1st round of combat you can use a second Sneak Attack on separate targets)
Given than I already dual wield, the second attack isn't as important, but it's not nothing. Is the second attack and 2nd level spells and slots worth losing a d6 sneak attack damage? I already dual wield frost brands and fey wanderer will give me a further d6 psychic damage, so I'll be doing 1d6 + 6 + 1d6 cold + 1d6 psychic damage for successful hits on most turns. The second attack will usually give me more flexibility with my bonus action, but the d6 psychic damage requires my bonus action, so saving the bonus action also reduces damage slightly.
The level 17 Rogue Scout ability is very good. Getting a chance every round to do a second sneak attack dealing 9D6 damage (on top of the damage you already do with your attacks) is pretty crazy. I think Rogue 17 Ranger 3 is the best choice.
Losing one or two sneak attack die for an extra attack is kind of a wash. 2D6 sneak attack = 7avg damage. 1 extra attack = 1D6 + dex (assuming 5 at level 15 rogue, 5 ranger) so 8.5 avg damage. 2 attacks also equals 2 chances to crit, and you get to decide which attack your sneak attack applies to (if your sneak attack applies to that target.)
The real question is what abilities do you gain or lose when you take it from 3 to 5 levels? What do you prefer?
At least in my game, you don't get to see whether or not your second attacks hits before you decide whether or not to use Sneak Attack on your first attack. If your game allows you to see the results of both attacks before you decide whether or not to use Sneak Attack on the first attack, that's a pretty big boost to Rogues doing multiple attacks.
The way I read the ability, you can get a second sneak attack every round, and not just the first round of combat. Am I reading an outdated version of the ability?
Rules as written, you decide if you deal sneak attack damage entirely.
Sneak attack: Beginning at 1st level, you know how to strike subtly and exploit a foe’s distraction. Once per turn, you can deal an extra 1d6 damage to one creature you hit with an attack if you have advantage on the attack roll. The attack must use a finesse or a ranged weapon.
As long the criteria for your sneak attack apply, you can decide which attack it applies to, or even if you're applying it at all. Furthermore, Jeremy Crawford supports this statement.
You're dodging the question.
Do you get to know the outcome of the second attack roll before you decide whether or not to use Sneak Attack on your first attack? Or do you have to resolve the first attack entirely before you make the second attack?
Attacks are done in order. You roll one attack, decide if you want to apply stuff. After that you. decide if you want to move before making your next attack.
The way we're playing and the way I'm reading the RAW as a dual wielding rogue :
I have Attack, plus a bonus action attack as dual wielder. If I miss the first attack, I make the second attack to trigger my Sneak Attack.
At max level, I could have :
Melee :
15 Rogue/ 5 Ranger : 2 attacks to trigger sneak attack, Bonus attack with sneak attack (On a second creature NOT hit with first sneak attack.)
17 Rogue/3 Ranger : 1 Attack, 1 Bonus attack. Both attacks could trigger sneak atttack, but they have to have different targets if they both trigger.
In all of those, note that my bonus d6 damage for psychic damage may go away as I have to use the bonus attack to trigger the second sneak attack damage, or the bonus action to trigger the psychic damage. (Of course, bonus d6 psychic is not better than another sneak attack damage!, but would be nice for single target.)
Ranged :
15 Rogue/ 5 Ranger : 2 attacks, possible to have 1 sneak attack. Bonus action to hide.
17 Rogue/ 3 Ranger : 1 attack, Bonus attack, both can trigger sneak attack if aimed at different targets. No bonus action left to hide.
EDIT :
We resolve the first attack fully, so usually sneak attack is applied on the first attack. I have never 'held on' to my sneak attack hoping to crit on the second attack.
«Once per turn, you can deal an extra 1d6 damage to one creature you hit with an attack if you have advantage on the attack roll.»
Raw is clear that you cannot sneak attack more than once per turn. That said, you can sneak attack more than once per round if you manage to attack on someone elses turn, for instance through an attack of opportunity or the haste spell combined with the ready action moving your regular action to someone elses turn.
dual wielding is great though as it allows another chance to land sneak attack if you miss with the main hand.
The scout's 17th level ability lets them get 2 sneak attacks off, just not on the same target. That's why everyone is talking about it for this build. Mind you, that's level 20 for this character, so it may never get to there.
Sry, reread now and I see that none implied what I thought :)