We are playing Icewind Dale: Rime of the Frostmaiden in a home game (not-AL). We rolled for stats and the DM allowed everyone to take a "free" feat at level 1 despite race choices (there were no variant human characters - I presume she would give 2 feats to a variant human). I made a High Elf Bladesinger with Warcaster as my choice and the following stats (after racial modifiers and at level 2):
STR - 12 DEX - 16 CON - 14 INT - 18 WIS - 12 CHA - 10 HP (rolled) - 13
I joined one session after everyone else, so my character started at level 2 - which allowed me to select spells carefully to synergize with the subclass. I picked Minor Illusion as the racial cantrip along with Booming Blade, Fire Bolt, Green-Flame Blade, Absorb Elements, Chromatic Orb, Detect Magic (which I don't keep prepared), Feather Fall, Find Familiar (which I also intend to only use as ritual), Mage Armor, Shield and Thunderwave. I'm considering Mirror Image and Misty Step once the character reaches 3rd level. The party has one druid, one fighter, and another character whose class I still didn't manage to figure out.
My question here is about the ASI on level 4 and spell progression/choices in general. Most forums tell the players to "race to 20" with INT when using this class and play it like a "normal wiz with melee option", but that 18 can probably hold on nicely until level 8. And I would surely like to see what that subclass can do on melee, since this is my first time playing with it and this definitely looks like the entire point of the bladesinger - if anyone wants to play a "normal" wizard, why picking the bladesinger in the first place?
Anyway, would putting the first ASI into DEX or picking up the Tough feat be more advisable than raising INT? Are there any spells I'm overlooking that would improve survivability, specially considering how unforgiving the climate of Icewind Dale is? The campaign is being survival-focused, so Tiny Hut is starting to look mandatory - but I would like to have Counterspell and Fireball, and maybe Haste or Dispel Magic. Which one to pick first when the 5th level comes? Are there other feat options I'm overlooking here (Alert, maybe)?
Several forums advise picking the Mobile or Resilient(CON) feat, but those look completely bizarre to me. With the high AC this subclass provides (in the case of my character, 20 AC at 2nd level with bladesong and mage armor active), mobile looks overrated on the first levels - which, let's be honest, are the levels that matter the most on any campaign. Resilient, on the other hand, looks useless when the CON score is already even and you already have Warcaster + bladesong. Some even advise Dual Wielder, which would only make sense if all spells chosen lacked material components (left hand is being used to hold the spell focus, you know).
Feel free to correct any typos or grammar mistakes, English is not my primary language. But please, don't post adventure-specific spoilers.
PS: On a side note, gold from quests has been scarce so far. Is it going to get better as the adventure progresses? It would be a shame to find a spellbook or a scroll and remain unable to learn the spells due to lack of funds.
It IS overkill to get res:con just for concentration, ontop of everything else. But con saves are very common in icewind dale to ward off the exhausting effects of the extreme cold, so, that's probably why it gets recommended frequently.
Go for DEX. an 18 in your INT is perfectly fine until 8, as is the intended progression of the game. It's obvious that you want to live out the fantasy of a melee caster, and while raising INT will absolutely benefit your AC and concentration, it won't help your chance to land those SCAG cantrips in the first place, where much of your sustainable cantrip+attack damage comes from. I left my bladesinger's dex at 16 and went straight for increasing INT, but the difference is I was playing in AL where I was given a guaranteed +1 rapier at lvl 5, so it wasn't so necessary in order for me to live out my gish dreams. Plus, it will help your initiative and may better increase the chance of catching everything with a web/fireball/hypnotic pattern or your choice of AoE spell before they disperse on their turn.
Anyway, would putting the first ASI into DEX or picking up the Tough feat be more advisable than raising INT?
The basic math of D&D assumed you're INT 16 from levels 1-3, 18 from 4-7, and 20 from 8 onward. Since you're already at 18, you can spend you level 4 ASI however you like without "fal
ling behind". The Tough feat is broadly speaking a poor choice here - you chose a subclass that makes your AC obscene. Might as well lean into it. +2 Dex is one such method.
Are there any spells I'm overlooking that would improve survivability, specially considering how unforgiving the climate of Icewind Dale is? The campaign is being survival-focused, so Tiny Hut is starting to look mandatory - but I would like to have Counterspell and Fireball, and maybe Haste or Dispel Magic. Which one to pick first when the 5th level comes? Are there other feat options I'm overlooking here (Alert, maybe)?
Tiny Hut and a source of heat are all you need - and if you need the latter, you can always swap Create Bonfire into your cantrip list in the future. I wouldn't worry about survival too much - it's not like you'll run out of water any time soon, for example! Most Bladesingers prioritize Haste, for obvious reasons. You will need a ruling from your DM on how Haste works with your L6 ability, and don't let anyone tell you the RAW is definitive on it. Also don't argue with your DM, of course. Alert's a perfectly fine feat for you, and the only one I can think of you might be overlooking is Lucky, especially since you want to be able to deal with rolling very badly on a save. Oh, and Telekinetic, Bladesingers love Telekinetic. You'll want to ask your DM to fix it - RAW, the spell's buff to Mage Hand's range does nothing, because the Hand dissipates if it's more than 30 feet from you, regardless of the spell's range. And Elven Accuracy - all elves love Elven Accuracy - if you plan to take spells that will grant you advantage, like Greater Invisibility and Maximilian's Earthen Grasp. Since you have even Int, you should only plan on taking one half-feat with Int if you also plan on a second.
Several forums advise picking the Mobile or Resilient(CON) feat, but those look completely bizarre to me. With the high AC this subclass provides (in the case of my character, 20 AC at 2nd level with bladesong and mage armor active), mobile looks overrated on the first levels - which, let's be honest, are the levels that matter the most on any campaign. Resilient, on the other hand, looks useless when the CON score is already even and you already have Warcaster + bladesong. Some even advise Dual Wielder, which would only make sense if all spells chosen lacked material components (left hand is being used to hold the spell focus, you know).
Don't take Dual Wielder, but do feel free to engage in two-weapon fighting - you can always drop a weapon to cast if you need to, then pick it back up with your free Use Item interaction 1/turn. Resilient Con is great, but as you point out, most builds planning on that have an odd Con score. If you want Resilient Con, you'll want a second half-feat for Con. Skill Expert might fit the bill, or, if you can convince your DM to let you acquire a Bludgeoning rapier of some kind (which would be entirely homebrew), Crusher.
Thanks for the advice, both of you. I'm used to playing martial classes or half-casters (except when it comes to my NPCs when I occasionally DM), hence so many questions.
Hey! I have a question about bladesinger progression aswell, but I dont feel like overfloating the forum with threats so I post it here:
For an early campain, is it worth it to start as fighter and multiclass into wizard later? Are there drawbacks for going this route?
I did the exact same thing. Bladesinger can't use armor nor shields if you want to bladesong. So, all you get from starting as fighter is a fighting style and con save proficiency, which doesn't get used much because you get insane AC, so things rarely hit you.
Still, this isn't a totally bad thing. Another fighter lvl and you get action surge, which is worth it. You just have to understand that doing so puts you behind a full spell lvl behind a pure caster. In your typical campaign, by the time reach end game other wizards will be able to cast wall of force and animate objects, while you can cast fireball twice a round. That's up to you to decide if it's worth it.
For bladesinger I would always put my highest score in Dex, followed by Con. It is true that you suffer minor setbacks mainly involving the amount of spells you can prepare but as a front-liner, you get more mileage out of Dex and Con than you do for Int. Int can help with your AC during bladesong but a higher Dex will give you higher AC outside bladesong plus you will hit more consistently. Additionally, most spells you will be using will be augmenting your front-line prowess and they rarely rely on your Int score such as shadowblade, summon fey, animate objects etc. It is easier to have higher Dex and grab a headband of intellect later than the other way around.
Resilient (Con) is a must in my opinion. Most of your front line augmenting spells such as those mentioned above will require your concentration and failing a save will feel utterly underwhelming to say the least. You might feel safe due to your AC in that respect but remember spells can hit you just as easily.
It will feel a bit disapointing if you try hypnotic pattern for example and everyone succeeds your 12-13 DC. But remember, bladesinger is not ''supposed'' to be a wizard who can do a bit of melee, but an excellent front-liner who can wizard a little bit when he needs to :)
We are playing Icewind Dale: Rime of the Frostmaiden in a home game (not-AL). We rolled for stats and the DM allowed everyone to take a "free" feat at level 1 despite race choices (there were no variant human characters - I presume she would give 2 feats to a variant human). I made a High Elf Bladesinger with Warcaster as my choice and the following stats (after racial modifiers and at level 2):
STR - 12 DEX - 16 CON - 14 INT - 18 WIS - 12 CHA - 10 HP (rolled) - 13
I joined one session after everyone else, so my character started at level 2 - which allowed me to select spells carefully to synergize with the subclass. I picked Minor Illusion as the racial cantrip along with Booming Blade, Fire Bolt, Green-Flame Blade, Absorb Elements, Chromatic Orb, Detect Magic (which I don't keep prepared), Feather Fall, Find Familiar (which I also intend to only use as ritual), Mage Armor, Shield and Thunderwave. I'm considering Mirror Image and Misty Step once the character reaches 3rd level. The party has one druid, one fighter, and another character whose class I still didn't manage to figure out.
Okay. Elf, Warcaster, good Int/Dex/Con perfect start. You got the melee cantrips, you're set.
Now... to ratchet this up a notch: Get a whip. Somehow make whip one of your proficiencies. If you can swap racial proficiencies with optional rule, get whip. If not, make it your subclass proficiency from Training in War and Song since you already have decent weapon options from elf training.
Why whip? Because having it in hand gives reach, and that means more Opportunity Attack options and opportunities. Since you have warcaster you can cast a full spell instead of a trigger opportunity attack and being able to trigger them from both 5ft and 10ft is a huge deal. Plus, since you will have a sword in the other hand, can two weapon fight if you find a free bonus action to burn.
Speaking of swords in the other hand... Your primary offensive DPS spell should probably be Shadow Blade and your feat choice should probably be Elven Accuracy. It is a silly fun combo and you're going to reliably crit often with this combo. Even without going the Elven Accuracy route (since for you it'd leave a stat on an odd number), really do re-read Shadow Blade, get to know this spell, and find a way to get it and use it early and often. At 3rd level, you'd be attacking with a +5 to hit (at advantage) and dealing 2d8+3 psychic damage. Alternatively, if your BA is available, you'd be Booming Blade/Green Flame Blade with the whip and offhand attacking with the shadowblade. The DPR on this gets nuts as you go up in levels too, and remains a consistently reliable source of low-resource-cost damage.
It is apparently so hard to program Aberrant Mind and Clockwork Soul spell-swapping into dndbeyond they had to remake the game without it rather than implement it.
Depending on how long you're going to play this character, I figured out the general solution to all the little issues with the bladesinger. It's 3 levels of battle smith artificer. Maybe ask DM about reflavoring artificer details as part of the magic of your bladesong etc., but it let's you swap to only NEEDING Int and Con once your Dex is 16.
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Hello, everyone.
We are playing Icewind Dale: Rime of the Frostmaiden in a home game (not-AL). We rolled for stats and the DM allowed everyone to take a "free" feat at level 1 despite race choices (there were no variant human characters - I presume she would give 2 feats to a variant human). I made a High Elf Bladesinger with Warcaster as my choice and the following stats (after racial modifiers and at level 2):
STR - 12
DEX - 16
CON - 14
INT - 18
WIS - 12
CHA - 10
HP (rolled) - 13
I joined one session after everyone else, so my character started at level 2 - which allowed me to select spells carefully to synergize with the subclass. I picked Minor Illusion as the racial cantrip along with Booming Blade, Fire Bolt, Green-Flame Blade, Absorb Elements, Chromatic Orb, Detect Magic (which I don't keep prepared), Feather Fall, Find Familiar (which I also intend to only use as ritual), Mage Armor, Shield and Thunderwave. I'm considering Mirror Image and Misty Step once the character reaches 3rd level. The party has one druid, one fighter, and another character whose class I still didn't manage to figure out.
My question here is about the ASI on level 4 and spell progression/choices in general. Most forums tell the players to "race to 20" with INT when using this class and play it like a "normal wiz with melee option", but that 18 can probably hold on nicely until level 8. And I would surely like to see what that subclass can do on melee, since this is my first time playing with it and this definitely looks like the entire point of the bladesinger - if anyone wants to play a "normal" wizard, why picking the bladesinger in the first place?
Anyway, would putting the first ASI into DEX or picking up the Tough feat be more advisable than raising INT? Are there any spells I'm overlooking that would improve survivability, specially considering how unforgiving the climate of Icewind Dale is? The campaign is being survival-focused, so Tiny Hut is starting to look mandatory - but I would like to have Counterspell and Fireball, and maybe Haste or Dispel Magic. Which one to pick first when the 5th level comes? Are there other feat options I'm overlooking here (Alert, maybe)?
Several forums advise picking the Mobile or Resilient(CON) feat, but those look completely bizarre to me. With the high AC this subclass provides (in the case of my character, 20 AC at 2nd level with bladesong and mage armor active), mobile looks overrated on the first levels - which, let's be honest, are the levels that matter the most on any campaign. Resilient, on the other hand, looks useless when the CON score is already even and you already have Warcaster + bladesong. Some even advise Dual Wielder, which would only make sense if all spells chosen lacked material components (left hand is being used to hold the spell focus, you know).
Feel free to correct any typos or grammar mistakes, English is not my primary language. But please, don't post adventure-specific spoilers.
PS: On a side note, gold from quests has been scarce so far. Is it going to get better as the adventure progresses? It would be a shame to find a spellbook or a scroll and remain unable to learn the spells due to lack of funds.
It IS overkill to get res:con just for concentration, ontop of everything else. But con saves are very common in icewind dale to ward off the exhausting effects of the extreme cold, so, that's probably why it gets recommended frequently.
Go for DEX. an 18 in your INT is perfectly fine until 8, as is the intended progression of the game. It's obvious that you want to live out the fantasy of a melee caster, and while raising INT will absolutely benefit your AC and concentration, it won't help your chance to land those SCAG cantrips in the first place, where much of your sustainable cantrip+attack damage comes from. I left my bladesinger's dex at 16 and went straight for increasing INT, but the difference is I was playing in AL where I was given a guaranteed +1 rapier at lvl 5, so it wasn't so necessary in order for me to live out my gish dreams. Plus, it will help your initiative and may better increase the chance of catching everything with a web/fireball/hypnotic pattern or your choice of AoE spell before they disperse on their turn.
Thanks for the advice, both of you. I'm used to playing martial classes or half-casters (except when it comes to my NPCs when I occasionally DM), hence so many questions.
Hey! I have a question about bladesinger progression aswell, but I dont feel like overfloating the forum with threats so I post it here:
For an early campain, is it worth it to start as fighter and multiclass into wizard later? Are there drawbacks for going this route?
I did the exact same thing. Bladesinger can't use armor nor shields if you want to bladesong. So, all you get from starting as fighter is a fighting style and con save proficiency, which doesn't get used much because you get insane AC, so things rarely hit you.
Still, this isn't a totally bad thing. Another fighter lvl and you get action surge, which is worth it. You just have to understand that doing so puts you behind a full spell lvl behind a pure caster. In your typical campaign, by the time reach end game other wizards will be able to cast wall of force and animate objects, while you can cast fireball twice a round. That's up to you to decide if it's worth it.
For bladesinger I would always put my highest score in Dex, followed by Con. It is true that you suffer minor setbacks mainly involving the amount of spells you can prepare but as a front-liner, you get more mileage out of Dex and Con than you do for Int. Int can help with your AC during bladesong but a higher Dex will give you higher AC outside bladesong plus you will hit more consistently. Additionally, most spells you will be using will be augmenting your front-line prowess and they rarely rely on your Int score such as shadowblade, summon fey, animate objects etc. It is easier to have higher Dex and grab a headband of intellect later than the other way around.
Resilient (Con) is a must in my opinion. Most of your front line augmenting spells such as those mentioned above will require your concentration and failing a save will feel utterly underwhelming to say the least. You might feel safe due to your AC in that respect but remember spells can hit you just as easily.
It will feel a bit disapointing if you try hypnotic pattern for example and everyone succeeds your 12-13 DC. But remember, bladesinger is not ''supposed'' to be a wizard who can do a bit of melee, but an excellent front-liner who can wizard a little bit when he needs to :)
Of course, your mileage may vary.
Example of a bladesinger I am currently playing in a short campaign: https://www.dndbeyond.com/profile/Alex_611/characters/50518775
Okay. Elf, Warcaster, good Int/Dex/Con perfect start. You got the melee cantrips, you're set.
Now... to ratchet this up a notch: Get a whip. Somehow make whip one of your proficiencies. If you can swap racial proficiencies with optional rule, get whip. If not, make it your subclass proficiency from Training in War and Song since you already have decent weapon options from elf training.
Why whip? Because having it in hand gives reach, and that means more Opportunity Attack options and opportunities. Since you have warcaster you can cast a full spell instead of a trigger opportunity attack and being able to trigger them from both 5ft and 10ft is a huge deal. Plus, since you will have a sword in the other hand, can two weapon fight if you find a free bonus action to burn.
Speaking of swords in the other hand... Your primary offensive DPS spell should probably be Shadow Blade and your feat choice should probably be Elven Accuracy. It is a silly fun combo and you're going to reliably crit often with this combo. Even without going the Elven Accuracy route (since for you it'd leave a stat on an odd number), really do re-read Shadow Blade, get to know this spell, and find a way to get it and use it early and often. At 3rd level, you'd be attacking with a +5 to hit (at advantage) and dealing 2d8+3 psychic damage. Alternatively, if your BA is available, you'd be Booming Blade/Green Flame Blade with the whip and offhand attacking with the shadowblade. The DPR on this gets nuts as you go up in levels too, and remains a consistently reliable source of low-resource-cost damage.
I'm probably laughing.
It is apparently so hard to program Aberrant Mind and Clockwork Soul spell-swapping into dndbeyond they had to remake the game without it rather than implement it.
Depending on how long you're going to play this character, I figured out the general solution to all the little issues with the bladesinger. It's 3 levels of battle smith artificer. Maybe ask DM about reflavoring artificer details as part of the magic of your bladesong etc., but it let's you swap to only NEEDING Int and Con once your Dex is 16.