Cantrips arent necessarily simple spells, they're just spells people have practiced with so much you cast them without thinking too much or expending a lot of arcane energy.
The lore/mechanic divide here is immense. It comes down to the fact that an unlike previous editions, 4e & 5e are pretty game-ified as a whole. Here's my solution to the dilemma, personally. Cantrips shouldn't be interchangeable as simply as spells. They are an unlimited resource, so not breaking the game with them is quite important. Wizards as a whole value spell versatility higher than any other class, yet ironically have a small pool of cantrips that cannot change over time. So... Laying out the mechanics in a way that aligns with how the lore makes sense, but still keeping Wizards as Wizards:
Cantrips can be written in the spellbook, though they are not by default. To write a cantrip into the spellbook takes 1 page and 25gp.
Cantrip scrolls are very rare and not often traded, they are the coveted building blocks of wizardry and are commonly guarded by institutions of learning, given only to wizard students.
A wizard may only prepare a number of cantrips up to the 'cantrips known' number on the Wizard Table at any given time (plus any granted through feats, multiclassing, etc.).
Cantrips become fixed in the mind, becoming difficult to dislodge. When preparing spells, a wizard can choose to swap a single cantrip out for another cantrip in their book.
If the wizard chooses to do this, they may prepare one spell less than normal for that day, as the mental effort of freeing and preparing something so deeply lodged requires focus.
This is how I, personally, will bring these incongruities into line.
There is no place in the PHB that says anything about gaining more cantrips when you multiclass into different spellcasters? Anyone have an idea on how that works?
There is no place in the PHB that says anything about gaining more cantrips when you multiclass into different spellcasters? Anyone have an idea on how that works?
You just get more cantrips based on the class you chose. If you're Wizard 2/Cleric 3, you get as many cantrips as Wizard 2 does + whatever Cleric 3 gets.
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There is no place in the PHB that says anything about gaining more cantrips when you multiclass into different spellcasters? Anyone have an idea on how that works?
Basically the spells known is separate for each class, so when picking spells you almost count as two separate characters. For spell slots however you combine all of the spell casting classes together, which gets complicated (but is fortunately automated on D&D Beyond), so two full casting classes don't slow slot progression, but won't have access to as high level spells.
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Forest Gnome Illusionist will have 7. I won’t even consider multiclassing Wizard more than 1 level, so you won’t see Book of Secrets or multiple multiclassing shenanigans from me, but Magic Initiate is acceptable, so that adds 2.
Start with a Strixhaven background (Witherbloom for the healing spells), take Magic Initiate and Spell Sniper, and start with a High Elf and you can have 11 without multiclassing.
Start with a Strixhaven background (Witherbloom for the healing spells), take Magic Initiate and Spell Sniper, and start with a High Elf and you can have 11 without multiclassing.
I don't think it's good to advise using a background that's not intended for general use; the Strixhaven backgrounds are only supposed to be used in a Strixhaven campaign where everybody starts with one, otherwise they're not balanced. You'd have to run this through your DM at the very least so they can balance players taking normal backgrounds.
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With the Tasha's optional features, your DM can permit you to have cantrip versatility at Wizard 3. This allows you to prepare from the wizard spell list any number of wizard cantrips every day. So to that end, any wizard knows every wizard cantrip--just not all at once.
With the Tasha's optional features, your DM can permit you to have cantrip versatility at Wizard 3. This allows you to prepare from the wizard spell list any number of wizard cantrips every day. So to that end, any wizard knows every wizard cantrip--just not all at once.
and the reading is somewhat subjective, "Whenever you finish a long rest and consult those formulas in your spellbook, you can replace one wizard cantrip you know with another cantrip from the wizard spell list."
That can also be read as one - uno, cantrip an changed our per long rest, I'd tend to agree with the idea that Wizards should simply prepare Cantrips like any other spell.
When it comes to balacing, I think it's fair as it is. Wizards already have the most versatility in all other areas of magic and are not exactly what any sane person would consider an under-powered class. Therefore some limitations on cantrips are very well justified.
As other people already mentioned, you can get additional cantrips from feats and racial traits. While you multiclass to get additional cantrips, multiclassing has it's own disadvantages. You either need to raise a stat that wouldn't give you many other benefits or you need to take a half-caster class like artificer. Personally I think multiclassing is not worth the effort, if you only want some additional cantrips.
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Cantrips arent necessarily simple spells, they're just spells people have practiced with so much you cast them without thinking too much or expending a lot of arcane energy.
The lore/mechanic divide here is immense. It comes down to the fact that an unlike previous editions, 4e & 5e are pretty game-ified as a whole. Here's my solution to the dilemma, personally. Cantrips shouldn't be interchangeable as simply as spells. They are an unlimited resource, so not breaking the game with them is quite important. Wizards as a whole value spell versatility higher than any other class, yet ironically have a small pool of cantrips that cannot change over time. So... Laying out the mechanics in a way that aligns with how the lore makes sense, but still keeping Wizards as Wizards:
This is how I, personally, will bring these incongruities into line.
There is no place in the PHB that says anything about gaining more cantrips when you multiclass into different spellcasters? Anyone have an idea on how that works?
You just get more cantrips based on the class you chose. If you're Wizard 2/Cleric 3, you get as many cantrips as Wizard 2 does + whatever Cleric 3 gets.
Please check out my homebrew, I would appreciate feedback:
Spells, Monsters, Subclasses, Races, Arcknight Class, Occultist Class, World, Enigmatic Esoterica forms
It's covered in the Spellcasting section of the multiclassing rules, there's a lot to read though so it's easy to miss the details.
Basically the spells known is separate for each class, so when picking spells you almost count as two separate characters. For spell slots however you combine all of the spell casting classes together, which gets complicated (but is fortunately automated on D&D Beyond), so two full casting classes don't slow slot progression, but won't have access to as high level spells.
Former D&D Beyond Customer of six years: With the axing of piecemeal purchasing, lack of meaningful development, and toxic moderation the site isn't worth paying for anymore. I remain a free user only until my groups are done migrating from DDB, and if necessary D&D, after which I'm done. There are better systems owned by better companies out there.
I have unsubscribed from all topics and will not reply to messages. My homebrew is now 100% unsupported.
Forest Gnome Illusionist will have 7.
I won’t even consider multiclassing Wizard more than 1 level, so you won’t see Book of Secrets or multiple multiclassing shenanigans from me, but Magic Initiate is acceptable, so that adds 2.
That gives Nine cantrips, no Multiclassing.
Start with a Strixhaven background (Witherbloom for the healing spells), take Magic Initiate and Spell Sniper, and start with a High Elf and you can have 11 without multiclassing.
I don't think it's good to advise using a background that's not intended for general use; the Strixhaven backgrounds are only supposed to be used in a Strixhaven campaign where everybody starts with one, otherwise they're not balanced. You'd have to run this through your DM at the very least so they can balance players taking normal backgrounds.
Former D&D Beyond Customer of six years: With the axing of piecemeal purchasing, lack of meaningful development, and toxic moderation the site isn't worth paying for anymore. I remain a free user only until my groups are done migrating from DDB, and if necessary D&D, after which I'm done. There are better systems owned by better companies out there.
I have unsubscribed from all topics and will not reply to messages. My homebrew is now 100% unsupported.
exactly, just convince dm to give you the hat of wizardry sometimes you fail and makes for funny rp but still useful
With the Tasha's optional features, your DM can permit you to have cantrip versatility at Wizard 3. This allows you to prepare from the wizard spell list any number of wizard cantrips every day. So to that end, any wizard knows every wizard cantrip--just not all at once.
The portion being referred to is this:
https://www.dndbeyond.com/sources/tcoe/wizard#CantripFormulas
and the reading is somewhat subjective, "Whenever you finish a long rest and consult those formulas in your spellbook, you can replace one wizard cantrip you know with another cantrip from the wizard spell list."
That can also be read as one - uno, cantrip an changed our per long rest, I'd tend to agree with the idea that Wizards should simply prepare Cantrips like any other spell.
When it comes to balacing, I think it's fair as it is. Wizards already have the most versatility in all other areas of magic and are not exactly what any sane person would consider an under-powered class. Therefore some limitations on cantrips are very well justified.
As other people already mentioned, you can get additional cantrips from feats and racial traits. While you multiclass to get additional cantrips, multiclassing has it's own disadvantages. You either need to raise a stat that wouldn't give you many other benefits or you need to take a half-caster class like artificer. Personally I think multiclassing is not worth the effort, if you only want some additional cantrips.
+ Instaboot to murderhobos + I don't watch Critical Role, and no, I really shouldn't either +