You don’t really need the context, so I’ll abreviate :
We’re running a string of high level 1 shots ( lvl 11 ). And we do 3 each, it’s my turn soon, and except : go hit that dragon, it’s big and scary! I don’t have much else to throw at my party.
When it’s at lower levels, there are more options because sneaking in isn’t as easy, or climbing a mountain, or whatever. But I need original challenge ideas that aren’t combat, and just rolling dice isn’t enough for me as a DM. I want my players to think outside the box, I don’t want the problem to be solved with teleport. ( or fireball, I’m looking at you, pyromaniac wizards ). The solution might be to try an acrobatics trick whilst the wizard casts a spell that does something, or a ticking clock situation, where every round matters and it’s a question of life or death...
Two dukes have declared war with each other because their children both want to marry the princess (their cousin). The king loves his siblings, the dukes, very much, and hires the party to broker peace between them.
Meanwhile, the princess fakes her own kidnapping so she can run off and become a pirate. The plan is very stupid, but she is not in the habit of letting her own stupidity stop her. She frames the party for her kidnapping.
Double meanwhile, there's a dragon who allegedly wants to eat the princess, and a man who looks uncannily like Henry Cavill has wandered into town. Rumors say he's a dragonslayer. That's unlikely to resolve itself quietly.
I don't have trouble coming up with non-combat challenges, but coming up with challenges that all the PCs can contribute to is harder. Largely because of fighters, barbarians, and the like, who have neither ridiculous skills nor 'I solve the problem' spells.
I don't have trouble coming up with non-combat challenges, but coming up with challenges that all the PCs can contribute to is harder. Largely because of fighters, barbarians, and the like, who have neither ridiculous skills nor 'I solve the problem' spells.
Try as people might, D&D is not designed as a murder mystery, or soap opera, or anything else but a combat based game. Like my previous post says, some, or all, players will become very bored. As you said, some char builds are simply not designed for anything but combat.
I don't have trouble coming up with non-combat challenges, but coming up with challenges that all the PCs can contribute to is harder. Largely because of fighters, barbarians, and the like, who have neither ridiculous skills nor 'I solve the problem' spells.
Try as people might, D&D is not designed as a murder mystery, or soap opera, or anything else but a combat based game. Like my previous post says, some, or all, players will become very bored. As you said, some char builds are simply not designed for anything but combat.
Conan does not play chess.
Conan actually has a pretty wide range of skills, and he wasn't dealing with magicians on anything like the scale of D&D magic. If you want examples of warriors who compete with opponents on the scale of D&D magicians, you're talking demigods, superheroes, and the like. It's one of the flaws with higher level D&D; the game can't decide whether it wants to be operating on the scale of Conan or Doctor Strange.
I don't have trouble coming up with non-combat challenges, but coming up with challenges that all the PCs can contribute to is harder. Largely because of fighters, barbarians, and the like, who have neither ridiculous skills nor 'I solve the problem' spells.
Try as people might, D&D is not designed as a murder mystery, or soap opera, or anything else but a combat based game.
Honestly Vince, because combat is the most complex part of most games, it is also the part which occupies the most place in the rules. But the groups I've played with have always played most games including D&D with much more exploration and social than with combat, and this was true even with AD&D and BECMI where there were not even social skills.
At higher levels, our groups has almost always followed the BECMI route of dominions, negociations, social and political intrigue, spiced up with a lot of magic, planes, etc.
There are some classes, (Rogues, Paladin's, Bards, to name a few) that can thrive in just about any environment. I am currently playing a Scout Rogue who will probably never have any magical abilities, but does have 9 skills, including Persuasion and Insight. He would do fine in such a game. But that same game has a Champion Fighter. None of his features or skills lend themselves to non-combat situations.
For every player that might enjoy such a game (personally, I love well done intrigue and non-combat situations, if they are indeed well done), there is one that will hate it.
Give the characters a goal to achieve that isn't directly combat oriented. It can have things to fight/kill on the way, but it doesn't have to revolve around pointing them at a specific thing and saying "go kill it!".
Some options:
• An artefact is rumored to be in this dungeon, so we need some adventurers to go in and get it. There are traps and things to overcome, but they all result in the party not being killed, but being flushed out of the dungeon and climbing out of a river next to the entrance, allowing them to go back in for another go.
• A stranger offers to lead the party to the lair of a slain dragon, explaining that the dragon was killed some years ago but no-one has ever made it into their lair. He claims to have a secret entrance but hasn't the skills to make use of it. The party fight their way in with promise of jewels, and face constructs, traps, puzzles etc., to get to the end. When they get there, have a boss fight of sorts and then they see the treasure in a great mound, and the stranger they met on sitting on it. "Oh Dear", he says, "I guess I've got some improvements to make!". The stranger grills the party on how they got past everything, and then reveals himself as an ancient dragon, the owner of the horde. He offers each of them a single prize from his horde, and safe passage out of the lair. If they take it, all good, they get cool stuff. If they get greedy, they're fighting an ancient dragon.
If you want to include murder mystery elements and such, be aware that some players will not be into that sort of thing. Whilst the roleplay can make it work well, it will only ever work as far as the players care for it. If the whole table loves the murder mystery approach, then brilliant, go for it. If half of them love it and one or two of them just want to fight stuff and loot the corpses, then they are going to get bored. You can alleviate this potentially by making it a combined plot - perhaps the killer is still at large and might strike again, Perhaps the intrigue-types will be trying to work out who or what the killer is whilst the fighter players are trying to find where it is so they can kill it. Perhaps you could work out a cool set of events whereby the progress of the two parties are tied together (a bit railroady but that's not always a bad thing), and when the fighters find the boss, the others find out that the boss is a werewolf (so the fighters weapons will be useless), and the hunter can become the hunted as they try to get out of the lair of the beast without being killed. This would require giving the players some meta-knowledge that they aren't going to be able to kill it, so they need to run now, otherwise they might just try to fight anyway.
Another option would be to watch some Dr Who episodes and see what weird and creepy things you can filch from them.
How about a situation that forces them to use their skills differently. For example, half of the town has been infected (by a disease, a filed spell, a poison, whatever) and they are attacking the other half. The players have to defend one half, without trying to kill the other half. The fighter needs to knock people down/knock them out without killing them. No killer spells from the mage or backstabs by a rogue. if you want to make it challenging, let them start the day normal, so they are all normalized for their spells, then realize that their normal tactics are not gonna work. The mage has to swap spells to non-lethal.
The final conclusion could be where they each need to use their non-primary attributes to gain success - such as the wizard needing to perform a feat of athleticism, the rogue a feat of strength, and the fighter a feat of intelligence.
I have to ask: how used are the players to getting through challenges with rollplay? To be clear, I'm not passing judgment on playstyles - if you're having fun, you're having fun and good for you. But players who aren't used to not solving everything with a roll (or two, or three) of the dice can have a hard time wrapping their heads around not getting to do that. If you want your players to do more thinking for their characters, to find creative solutions for in-game problems, just presenting them with challenges and minimizing dice rolls might not cut the mustard.
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You don’t really need the context, so I’ll abreviate :
We’re running a string of high level 1 shots ( lvl 11 ). And we do 3 each, it’s my turn soon, and except : go hit that dragon, it’s big and scary! I don’t have much else to throw at my party.
When it’s at lower levels, there are more options because sneaking in isn’t as easy, or climbing a mountain, or whatever. But I need original challenge ideas that aren’t combat, and just rolling dice isn’t enough for me as a DM. I want my players to think outside the box, I don’t want the problem to be solved with teleport. ( or fireball, I’m looking at you, pyromaniac wizards ). The solution might be to try an acrobatics trick whilst the wizard casts a spell that does something, or a ticking clock situation, where every round matters and it’s a question of life or death...
So does anyone have ideas? Thanks in advance
Prison breaks, where being found and ensuing combat will guarantee huge problems.
Or working on that theme, infiltration of a Thieves' Guild and stealing something valuable back from said Guild.
But just to let you know, I have a DM that loves, just loves, mysteries. We can go an entire session without combat. It gets horribly boring.
Two dukes have declared war with each other because their children both want to marry the princess (their cousin). The king loves his siblings, the dukes, very much, and hires the party to broker peace between them.
Meanwhile, the princess fakes her own kidnapping so she can run off and become a pirate. The plan is very stupid, but she is not in the habit of letting her own stupidity stop her. She frames the party for her kidnapping.
Double meanwhile, there's a dragon who allegedly wants to eat the princess, and a man who looks uncannily like Henry Cavill has wandered into town. Rumors say he's a dragonslayer. That's unlikely to resolve itself quietly.
I don't have trouble coming up with non-combat challenges, but coming up with challenges that all the PCs can contribute to is harder. Largely because of fighters, barbarians, and the like, who have neither ridiculous skills nor 'I solve the problem' spells.
Try as people might, D&D is not designed as a murder mystery, or soap opera, or anything else but a combat based game. Like my previous post says, some, or all, players will become very bored. As you said, some char builds are simply not designed for anything but combat.
Conan does not play chess.
Conan actually has a pretty wide range of skills, and he wasn't dealing with magicians on anything like the scale of D&D magic. If you want examples of warriors who compete with opponents on the scale of D&D magicians, you're talking demigods, superheroes, and the like. It's one of the flaws with higher level D&D; the game can't decide whether it wants to be operating on the scale of Conan or Doctor Strange.
That was amazing, but I’ll have to do it for our next one shots because it sounds like it’d take more then 2 hours
There are some classes, (Rogues, Paladin's, Bards, to name a few) that can thrive in just about any environment. I am currently playing a Scout Rogue who will probably never have any magical abilities, but does have 9 skills, including Persuasion and Insight. He would do fine in such a game. But that same game has a Champion Fighter. None of his features or skills lend themselves to non-combat situations.
For every player that might enjoy such a game (personally, I love well done intrigue and non-combat situations, if they are indeed well done), there is one that will hate it.
Give the characters a goal to achieve that isn't directly combat oriented. It can have things to fight/kill on the way, but it doesn't have to revolve around pointing them at a specific thing and saying "go kill it!".
Some options:
• An artefact is rumored to be in this dungeon, so we need some adventurers to go in and get it. There are traps and things to overcome, but they all result in the party not being killed, but being flushed out of the dungeon and climbing out of a river next to the entrance, allowing them to go back in for another go.
• A stranger offers to lead the party to the lair of a slain dragon, explaining that the dragon was killed some years ago but no-one has ever made it into their lair. He claims to have a secret entrance but hasn't the skills to make use of it. The party fight their way in with promise of jewels, and face constructs, traps, puzzles etc., to get to the end. When they get there, have a boss fight of sorts and then they see the treasure in a great mound, and the stranger they met on sitting on it. "Oh Dear", he says, "I guess I've got some improvements to make!". The stranger grills the party on how they got past everything, and then reveals himself as an ancient dragon, the owner of the horde. He offers each of them a single prize from his horde, and safe passage out of the lair. If they take it, all good, they get cool stuff. If they get greedy, they're fighting an ancient dragon.
If you want to include murder mystery elements and such, be aware that some players will not be into that sort of thing. Whilst the roleplay can make it work well, it will only ever work as far as the players care for it. If the whole table loves the murder mystery approach, then brilliant, go for it. If half of them love it and one or two of them just want to fight stuff and loot the corpses, then they are going to get bored. You can alleviate this potentially by making it a combined plot - perhaps the killer is still at large and might strike again, Perhaps the intrigue-types will be trying to work out who or what the killer is whilst the fighter players are trying to find where it is so they can kill it. Perhaps you could work out a cool set of events whereby the progress of the two parties are tied together (a bit railroady but that's not always a bad thing), and when the fighters find the boss, the others find out that the boss is a werewolf (so the fighters weapons will be useless), and the hunter can become the hunted as they try to get out of the lair of the beast without being killed. This would require giving the players some meta-knowledge that they aren't going to be able to kill it, so they need to run now, otherwise they might just try to fight anyway.
Another option would be to watch some Dr Who episodes and see what weird and creepy things you can filch from them.
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How about a situation that forces them to use their skills differently. For example, half of the town has been infected (by a disease, a filed spell, a poison, whatever) and they are attacking the other half. The players have to defend one half, without trying to kill the other half. The fighter needs to knock people down/knock them out without killing them. No killer spells from the mage or backstabs by a rogue. if you want to make it challenging, let them start the day normal, so they are all normalized for their spells, then realize that their normal tactics are not gonna work. The mage has to swap spells to non-lethal.
The final conclusion could be where they each need to use their non-primary attributes to gain success - such as the wizard needing to perform a feat of athleticism, the rogue a feat of strength, and the fighter a feat of intelligence.
I have to ask: how used are the players to getting through challenges with rollplay? To be clear, I'm not passing judgment on playstyles - if you're having fun, you're having fun and good for you. But players who aren't used to not solving everything with a roll (or two, or three) of the dice can have a hard time wrapping their heads around not getting to do that. If you want your players to do more thinking for their characters, to find creative solutions for in-game problems, just presenting them with challenges and minimizing dice rolls might not cut the mustard.
Want to start playing but don't have anyone to play with? You can try these options: [link].