I haven't read through the thread so others may have expressed my opinion as well, I just wanted to throw my own two cents into the ring.
I like the idea of a motivation system over alignment. It would add some complexity and thought into people's characters and help flesh out the RP more like the background stuff has done. Morality and motivation are more complex, maybe aside from demons, than someone wearing a black hat and a goatee making someone want to do evil. People acting out of psychological motivations is way more interesting to me than people acting out of some sort of moral essence.
That said, certain groups of actions can be essentialized as being evil and some good, or at least relatively worse and better. If someone, or a whole group of someones, reliably act in greedy, violent ways towards others that generally and reliably act in prosocial, productive ways I'm fine calling those good and evil as a shorthand. I guess I don't think that someone has an evil essence which leads them to mostly act in certain ways (greedy, violent), I think that someone who usually acts in certain negative ways is definitionally evil.
I feel like this is just another way to say "alignment", but instead of using two words to allow someone a baseline to guide their character in situations, you are using several sentences to do the same thing. (eg: I'm not Lawful, I like to follow the rules and believe people working in groups and following rules is better and lends strength. I'm not Neutral, but I prefer to take actions based on how they would benefit me or further an objective I feel is important. I would definitely put my life on the line to save someone in trouble if they meant enough to me or there was a good reward in it!!)
Motivations are a GREAT tool!! I think they should be used alongside alignment to flesh out something more specific - I feel a strong tie to my deity and temple and will preform whatever duties I can for their cause, for instance. You could be N/G, L/N or even C/E and have this motivation (evil worshipper of Vecna looking for an artifact to preform an evil ritual).
Personally, I think the AL system is great as a way to gauge your character's response to any situation they may find themselves in. Any flaws, ideals, background or motivations are further fleshing out the character as examples (in case you aren't sure how to use your AL in that case). I'm a little confused why there is so much talk of wanting to do away with AL? It definitely has its place in humanity as a generalized descriptor of attitudes and actions. I have seen some argue that a type of monster is pigeon holed to an alignment - are all of them really C/E?? Well, no. AL is a generalization of that monster type. Having said that, there are exceptions. Additionally, these are monsters, which in this game, are not considered to be a race of humanity. They are "the bad guys". Although since 3E you can actually play "bad guys" as character classes, the rest of them are, generally, x/x alignment. The exceptions are often outcasts of those monster societies. The point was to have a game of good guys vs. bad guys and also (with some DM creativity) some not so clear cut/black and white situations (Hey, these two demons seem to be expressing LOVE!! What gives? And do we smite them or give them a chance? They're still C/E, but...they have a different motivation....)
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Pallutus
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I haven't read through the thread so others may have expressed my opinion as well, I just wanted to throw my own two cents into the ring.
I like the idea of a motivation system over alignment. It would add some complexity and thought into people's characters and help flesh out the RP more like the background stuff has done. Morality and motivation are more complex, maybe aside from demons, than someone wearing a black hat and a goatee making someone want to do evil. People acting out of psychological motivations is way more interesting to me than people acting out of some sort of moral essence.
That said, certain groups of actions can be essentialized as being evil and some good, or at least relatively worse and better. If someone, or a whole group of someones, reliably act in greedy, violent ways towards others that generally and reliably act in prosocial, productive ways I'm fine calling those good and evil as a shorthand. I guess I don't think that someone has an evil essence which leads them to mostly act in certain ways (greedy, violent), I think that someone who usually acts in certain negative ways is definitionally evil.
I feel like this is just another way to say "alignment", but instead of using two words to allow someone a baseline to guide their character in situations, you are using several sentences to do the same thing. (eg: I'm not Lawful, I like to follow the rules and believe people working in groups and following rules is better and lends strength. I'm not Neutral, but I prefer to take actions based on how they would benefit me or further an objective I feel is important. I would definitely put my life on the line to save someone in trouble if they meant enough to me or there was a good reward in it!!)
Motivations are a GREAT tool!! I think they should be used alongside alignment to flesh out something more specific - I feel a strong tie to my deity and temple and will preform whatever duties I can for their cause, for instance. You could be N/G, L/N or even C/E and have this motivation (evil worshipper of Vecna looking for an artifact to preform an evil ritual).
Personally, I think the AL system is great as a way to gauge your character's response to any situation they may find themselves in. Any flaws, ideals, background or motivations are further fleshing out the character as examples (in case you aren't sure how to use your AL in that case). I'm a little confused why there is so much talk of wanting to do away with AL? It definitely has its place in humanity as a generalized descriptor of attitudes and actions. I have seen some argue that a type of monster is pigeon holed to an alignment - are all of them really C/E?? Well, no. AL is a generalization of that monster type. Having said that, there are exceptions. Additionally, these are monsters, which in this game, are not considered to be a race of humanity. They are "the bad guys". Although since 3E you can actually play "bad guys" as character classes, the rest of them are, generally, x/x alignment. The exceptions are often outcasts of those monster societies. The point was to have a game of good guys vs. bad guys and also (with some DM creativity) some not so clear cut/black and white situations (Hey, these two demons seem to be expressing LOVE!! What gives? And do we smite them or give them a chance? They're still C/E, but...they have a different motivation....)
Pallutus