Let me preface this by saying that I have never paid to play an RPG except at a con. I HAVE been paid to run games but through a third party (the players paid the store owner and he paid me by the hour). All of that being said, I am permanently disabled and due to my long years of gaming experience and current financial situation, I am considering running an online game and charging to play. I expect $5 or so per player per session will be fair but I need to look into that.
If you were going to play in a paid game, what sorts of things would you expect from the DM aside from an interesting plot and other such things that we all appreciate in a good game? Would you insist on a Roll-20 style of digital map (I've never done that and I'm old so the tech intimidates me), painted minis, color maps, a deep backstory?
Would you be content paying five bucks to see 4-6 faces on your screen and a flat battlemat with erasable marker-drawn terrain and miniatures as long as the story was fun?
Let me preface this by saying that I do not intend to pay for DMing services, though I see no issue with someone doing so. If a transaction is agreed upon prior to playing and everyone walks away satisfied with said transaction? Cool.
That said? No, the physical props are not necessary, at least to me. What I would expect, if I am paying someone to DM a game, is for the DM to have confidence and style. To know the game very well and to be able to DM on the fly with grace. Someone eminently comfortable behind the screen and who does not need to hem and haw for five minutes every time some odd edge case shows up. If I'm paying someone to run the game, I expect them to run the game. Smoothly and with authority. No need to be a draconian jackboot-kicking jerk, but I am not paying for someone to figure out DMing as they go. That's something you do with your buddies on your own time. I've heard of too many cases where a pay-to-play DM had a big collection of all the props and minis but couldn't DM for shit, and universally the players considered it a waste of money.
If you have the experience and confidence to wrangle hobo-cats without blinking, give it a shot. If you don't? No amount of props will salvage the transaction.
Let me preface this by saying that I do not intend to pay for DMing services, though I see no issue with someone doing so. If a transaction is agreed upon prior to playing and everyone walks away satisfied with said transaction? Cool.
That said? No, the physical props are not necessary, at least to me. What I would expect, if I am paying someone to DM a game, is for the DM to have confidence and style. To know the game very well and to be able to DM on the fly with grace. Someone eminently comfortable behind the screen and who does not need to hem and haw for five minutes every time some odd edge case shows up. If I'm paying someone to run the game, I expect them to run the game. Smoothly and with authority. No need to be a draconian jackboot-kicking jerk, but I am not paying for someone to figure out DMing as they go. That's something you do with your buddies on your own time. I've heard of too many cases where a pay-to-play DM had a big collection of all the props and minis but couldn't DM for shit, and universally the players considered it a waste of money.
If you have the experience and confidence to wrangle hobo-cats without blinking, give it a shot. If you don't? No amount of props will salvage the transaction.
For $5/session/player? I'd just expect a properly run game (consistent rules, sessions are prepared, things get done) with a DM who deals with me correctly (starts on time, doesn't have to reschedule other than because of an emergency, is responsive to questions, that sort of thing. Nothing more. That'll amount to $10/hour total at most, and that's assuming shortish sessions and hours spent preparing aren't counted. Realistically it'll be less than $5/hour most likely, and expecting massive production value for that would be silly (particularly since that'd require more hours, possibly reducing the takeaway to less than $1/hour - might as well do it for free then, and you won't have to deal with expectations).
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Want to start playing but don't have anyone to play with? You can try these options: [link].
For $5/session/player? I'd just expect a properly run game (consistent rules, sessions are prepared, things get done) with a DM who deals with me correctly (starts on time, doesn't have to reschedule other than because of an emergency, is responsive to questions, that sort of thing. Nothing more. That'll amount to $10/hour total at most, and that's assuming shortish sessions and hours spent preparing aren't counted. Realistically it'll be less than $5/hour most likely, and expecting massive production value for that would be silly (particularly since that'd require more hours, possibly reducing the takeaway to less than $1/hour - might as well do it for free then, and you won't have to deal with expectations).
I agree. I'm very new to online play and truth be told I didn't even know that there were paid DMs until I saw the term used some time ago.
I figure one game with myself and 3-5 players once a week would keep me in gas money and occasionally pay for a new book (because everyone wants to use Tasha's now). If I can handle the load I might do 2 campaigns a week with different players because I can't see people committing $10 a week to a D&D game.
People will spend ten bucks for a two-hour movie ticket. if your three to four-hour gaming session is worth as much as a movie, I'd say you should be good. Someone who can afford five bucks a session can afford ten, especially if presented as "this is also paying for my out-of-session prep time and acquiring new books/materials to DM with."
I will say that you'll likely want to run Session Zero meetings for free, perhaps even let players have the first actual play session with your game for free to see if they mesh with your style/the other players. Sort of a Free Sample approach, and also make sure you're not signing up to paid-DM for a player you can't stand.
People will spend ten bucks for a two-hour movie ticket. if your three to four-hour gaming session is worth as much as a movie, I'd say you should be good. Someone who can afford five bucks a session can afford ten, especially if presented as "this is also paying for my out-of-session prep time and acquiring new books/materials to DM with."
I will say that you'll likely want to run Session Zero meetings for free, perhaps even let players have the first actual play session with your game for free to see if they mesh with your style/the other players. Sort of a Free Sample approach, and also make sure you're not signing up to paid-DM for a player you can't stand.
I agree. My plan was to do Session Zero (one or more, if necessary) and the first actual session for free so the players and I could all see how the game flows. If people want to drop at that point, no harm no foul.
Curious about this too. Since I haven't found a place that provides a lot of objective reviews for paid DMs, it seems pretty inconsistent. My one experience with a paid DM was a mess; 60 for the month, up front, and the DM was self-admittedly drunk on session zero, basically having the players figure out connections and other details. He was out of the country for the week ahead of the first session, so unavailable for any followup, and then through no fault of his own had to delay that session with minimal communication. Buyer beware, of course, but with no way to know how good a DM is, it seems like you could randomly nat 1 or nat 20 with no modifiers...
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"You think you have won! What is light without dark?
What are you without me? I am a part of you all. You can never defeat me. We are brothers eternal!"
I luv this game, I luv DM'ing and I enjoy myself while playing D&D thus I would find it hard to charge for a game. I am also pretty restrictive on what I allow into my games IE keeping out the creepy players, Certain races or classes I think that are not agreeable to the world I am running. Paladins in my campaign can only be Human and Lawful Good. But if I was a pay to play DM and I want to make money, then ya, I would allow anybody into the game and have no restrictions what so ever on what the little munchkins wanted to play.
If I was playing online, using my precious time, and didn't want to DM, I would only select a paid DM because I would want the best experience possible with someone who had the right tools, content, experience and personality.
But at $5 that is so close to free that I wouldn't consider that a paid DM.
For a 3 hour session I would expect the group to pay $20 to $50 per person. That would hopefully weed out the teenagers who probably aren't going to turn up consistently anyway.
As well intended as some of the feedback here is, I'd strongly recommend reaching out to folks who gig as paid DMs regularly rather than relying on "If I were to pay a DM..." or "If I was charging players" feedback. Some ideas as to how to get quality and qualified guidance:
I'd look at a site like Startplayinggames which takes a lot of the administrative/scheduling/payment processing out of the DMs hair (I'm presuming for a cut). See if there's a way to interface with DMs and see if someone "your style" based on their game ads may be willing to have a mentoring conversation with you. Some may be happy or flattered that you see a connection between their style and your ambition and be happy to talk (flattery doesn't get you everywhere, but it does get you a lot of places). Others may be more of "you know, why don't you sign up for a session and see what I deliver." I also know some DM/GMs actually offer "spectator" tickets, usually free. It's designed for people considering hiring the DM and gives the prospect a chance to see the DM at work.
If I wanted to stick with the DDB community, I'd check the LFP board, see if you can find someone who postings and web activity suggests they're hustling and see if they'll have a PM convo with you.
It just seems talking to people who actually do it, or pay for it, rather than relying on a (again well intended) chorus of "I'd never but if I did..." voices will ultimately be more productive than these threads, and there are a lot of them, tend to play out.
DISCLAIMER: I do know a couple of folks who GM through Start Playing Games. This post isn't intended to give them or that platform business. However, my experience with Start Playing Games may shape my biases on this subject. I myself have used the platform to try out some new to me game systems during lockdown and have had largely positive experiences.
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Jander Sunstar is the thinking person's Drizzt, fight me.
I pay $5 per session for the game I've been in for almost five months now and consider it to be a good bargain. I was a bit dubious at first, but the DM offered the first session for free to decide and I was pleasantly surprised to find the DM and the game a great fit for what I was looking for.
For an online game I, and I suspect most paying players, would expect much the same as others have said. A coherently run, well prepared game with a DM that clearly puts effort into it. For $5 a session one shouldn't expect too much but a decent adventure plot and engagement with the player characters is probably a bare minimum. Talk with players before the game starts to establish their characters in your world, at least with basic backstories and their reasons for being in a position to join the party for the campaign to begin with. Also figure out what your players are looking for in their gaming experience (combat or roleplay heavy, or a mix; lighthearted "bright" fantasy that's a bit goofy or grimdark edginess, does their character have a long term goal related to their origin that you should work into the overall story, etc). Just as important is establishing what players don't want and knowing what to make off limits as far as subject material. You could try doing all that stuff as a collective session zero or spend some time with each player one on one then just go over a quick review of general rules, protocol, and boundaries at the beginning of the first session.
Players in an online game will also probably expect the use of a VTT (Virtual TableTop), at least for combat encounters. Theater of the mind typically works just fine for pure roleplaying sessions but if the party is exploring an area with traps and puzzles (such as an archetypical dungeon) or fighting a battle they're going to expect to see the environment somehow. Roll 20 is a pretty good system that isn't very hard to learn and you can get the basic functionality for just maps and tokens with a free account. Digital source material for incorporating various classes, races, etc have to be purchased and do make things go easier and smoother but aren't required; you can just use the VTT for maps on a grid and moving tokens (virtual minis) around and use the built in dice roller and just track everything else on physical character sheets if you want without any more effort than doing so for an in person game. There are tutorial videos for the basic functionality on YouTube and plenty of free maps that can be found with a google search (you just import the image file and overlay the combat grid onto it with a few clicks). So I would definitely suggest investing a few hours to learn at least Roll 20 basics, or try another VTT though most of my personal experience is with Roll 20 hence that recommendation.
I've played in a few different paid games, one thing I've noticed is that the easiest games to join are ones where you can tell what type of game they are going to be. So if your using roll twenty for example just put on the page what type of game it will be. It can be all theatre of the mind or have lots of map. You can create lots of lore or just stick to what relevant for the game. One thing to level expectations might be to use a pre set game like ghosts of salt marsh. That way the players will know how to flavour characters before session zero.
I'd expect them to be good at DMing, able to keep the game moving, working with players, and generally being professional. (Being on time to sessions, consistent with scheduling etc. Sometimes things happen on short notice, but there shouldn't be any chronic issues of poor communication etc.) If money is involved then it's no longer just a hobby among friends, it's a service being paid form, and I would expect a certain level of professionalism from them.
Curious about this too. Since I haven't found a place that provides a lot of objective reviews for paid DMs, it seems pretty inconsistent. My one experience with a paid DM was a mess; 60 for the month, up front, and the DM was self-admittedly drunk on session zero, basically having the players figure out connections and other details. He was out of the country for the week ahead of the first session, so unavailable for any followup, and then through no fault of his own had to delay that session with minimal communication. Buyer beware, of course, but with no way to know how good a DM is, it seems like you could randomly nat 1 or nat 20 with no modifiers...
60 for a month? Wow...I was thinking 5 per session ramping up to 10 if the players wanted me to get into a VTT sort of thing. For 60 a month the DM had better provide a mini for me, painted, and I might ask for a foot rub from time to time
I've played in a few different paid games, one thing I've noticed is that the easiest games to join are ones where you can tell what type of game they are going to be. So if your using roll twenty for example just put on the page what type of game it will be. It can be all theatre of the mind or have lots of map. You can create lots of lore or just stick to what relevant for the game. One thing to level expectations might be to use a pre set game like ghosts of salt marsh. That way the players will know how to flavour characters before session zero.
I've played in a few different paid games, one thing I've noticed is that the easiest games to join are ones where you can tell what type of game they are going to be. So if your using roll twenty for example just put on the page what type of game it will be. It can be all theatre of the mind or have lots of map. You can create lots of lore or just stick to what relevant for the game. One thing to level expectations might be to use a pre set game like ghosts of salt marsh. That way the players will know how to flavour characters before session zero.
I am also pretty restrictive on what I allow into my games IE keeping out the creepy players
How do you keep out creepy players, do you ask for photos first?
What makes you think a photo will tell you if a player is creepy or not? I'm not that good at judging people based on a photo alone.
Essentially, creepers will be creepin so if anything starts to get weird during session Zero, I keep my eye on that person. I encourage players to email me between sessions anyway so if a player is being a nusance, I'll try to warn them off the first time. If they persist, they get bounced. Players come to play...to get away from real life for a while. Nobody needs that crap.
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Let me preface this by saying that I have never paid to play an RPG except at a con. I HAVE been paid to run games but through a third party (the players paid the store owner and he paid me by the hour). All of that being said, I am permanently disabled and due to my long years of gaming experience and current financial situation, I am considering running an online game and charging to play. I expect $5 or so per player per session will be fair but I need to look into that.
If you were going to play in a paid game, what sorts of things would you expect from the DM aside from an interesting plot and other such things that we all appreciate in a good game? Would you insist on a Roll-20 style of digital map (I've never done that and I'm old so the tech intimidates me), painted minis, color maps, a deep backstory?
Would you be content paying five bucks to see 4-6 faces on your screen and a flat battlemat with erasable marker-drawn terrain and miniatures as long as the story was fun?
Thanks in advance.
Let me preface this by saying that I do not intend to pay for DMing services, though I see no issue with someone doing so. If a transaction is agreed upon prior to playing and everyone walks away satisfied with said transaction? Cool.
That said? No, the physical props are not necessary, at least to me. What I would expect, if I am paying someone to DM a game, is for the DM to have confidence and style. To know the game very well and to be able to DM on the fly with grace. Someone eminently comfortable behind the screen and who does not need to hem and haw for five minutes every time some odd edge case shows up. If I'm paying someone to run the game, I expect them to run the game. Smoothly and with authority. No need to be a draconian jackboot-kicking jerk, but I am not paying for someone to figure out DMing as they go. That's something you do with your buddies on your own time. I've heard of too many cases where a pay-to-play DM had a big collection of all the props and minis but couldn't DM for shit, and universally the players considered it a waste of money.
If you have the experience and confidence to wrangle hobo-cats without blinking, give it a shot. If you don't? No amount of props will salvage the transaction.
Please do not contact or message me.
Very well said.
For $5/session/player? I'd just expect a properly run game (consistent rules, sessions are prepared, things get done) with a DM who deals with me correctly (starts on time, doesn't have to reschedule other than because of an emergency, is responsive to questions, that sort of thing. Nothing more. That'll amount to $10/hour total at most, and that's assuming shortish sessions and hours spent preparing aren't counted. Realistically it'll be less than $5/hour most likely, and expecting massive production value for that would be silly (particularly since that'd require more hours, possibly reducing the takeaway to less than $1/hour - might as well do it for free then, and you won't have to deal with expectations).
Want to start playing but don't have anyone to play with? You can try these options: [link].
I agree. I'm very new to online play and truth be told I didn't even know that there were paid DMs until I saw the term used some time ago.
I figure one game with myself and 3-5 players once a week would keep me in gas money and occasionally pay for a new book (because everyone wants to use Tasha's now). If I can handle the load I might do 2 campaigns a week with different players because I can't see people committing $10 a week to a D&D game.
People will spend ten bucks for a two-hour movie ticket. if your three to four-hour gaming session is worth as much as a movie, I'd say you should be good. Someone who can afford five bucks a session can afford ten, especially if presented as "this is also paying for my out-of-session prep time and acquiring new books/materials to DM with."
I will say that you'll likely want to run Session Zero meetings for free, perhaps even let players have the first actual play session with your game for free to see if they mesh with your style/the other players. Sort of a Free Sample approach, and also make sure you're not signing up to paid-DM for a player you can't stand.
Please do not contact or message me.
I agree. My plan was to do Session Zero (one or more, if necessary) and the first actual session for free so the players and I could all see how the game flows. If people want to drop at that point, no harm no foul.
Curious about this too. Since I haven't found a place that provides a lot of objective reviews for paid DMs, it seems pretty inconsistent. My one experience with a paid DM was a mess; 60 for the month, up front, and the DM was self-admittedly drunk on session zero, basically having the players figure out connections and other details. He was out of the country for the week ahead of the first session, so unavailable for any followup, and then through no fault of his own had to delay that session with minimal communication. Buyer beware, of course, but with no way to know how good a DM is, it seems like you could randomly nat 1 or nat 20 with no modifiers...
"You think you have won! What is light without dark?
What are you without me? I am a part of you all. You can never defeat me. We are brothers eternal!"
I luv this game, I luv DM'ing and I enjoy myself while playing D&D thus I would find it hard to charge for a game. I am also pretty restrictive on what I allow into my games IE keeping out the creepy players, Certain races or classes I think that are not agreeable to the world I am running. Paladins in my campaign can only be Human and Lawful Good. But if I was a pay to play DM and I want to make money, then ya, I would allow anybody into the game and have no restrictions what so ever on what the little munchkins wanted to play.
If I was playing online, using my precious time, and didn't want to DM, I would only select a paid DM because I would want the best experience possible with someone who had the right tools, content, experience and personality.
But at $5 that is so close to free that I wouldn't consider that a paid DM.
For a 3 hour session I would expect the group to pay $20 to $50 per person. That would hopefully weed out the teenagers who probably aren't going to turn up consistently anyway.
As well intended as some of the feedback here is, I'd strongly recommend reaching out to folks who gig as paid DMs regularly rather than relying on "If I were to pay a DM..." or "If I was charging players" feedback. Some ideas as to how to get quality and qualified guidance:
I'd look at a site like Startplayinggames which takes a lot of the administrative/scheduling/payment processing out of the DMs hair (I'm presuming for a cut). See if there's a way to interface with DMs and see if someone "your style" based on their game ads may be willing to have a mentoring conversation with you. Some may be happy or flattered that you see a connection between their style and your ambition and be happy to talk (flattery doesn't get you everywhere, but it does get you a lot of places). Others may be more of "you know, why don't you sign up for a session and see what I deliver." I also know some DM/GMs actually offer "spectator" tickets, usually free. It's designed for people considering hiring the DM and gives the prospect a chance to see the DM at work.
If I wanted to stick with the DDB community, I'd check the LFP board, see if you can find someone who postings and web activity suggests they're hustling and see if they'll have a PM convo with you.
It just seems talking to people who actually do it, or pay for it, rather than relying on a (again well intended) chorus of "I'd never but if I did..." voices will ultimately be more productive than these threads, and there are a lot of them, tend to play out.
DISCLAIMER: I do know a couple of folks who GM through Start Playing Games. This post isn't intended to give them or that platform business. However, my experience with Start Playing Games may shape my biases on this subject. I myself have used the platform to try out some new to me game systems during lockdown and have had largely positive experiences.
Jander Sunstar is the thinking person's Drizzt, fight me.
Heh. Fair cop and good advice, Midnight. I'll second it, best to get advice directly from the source if you can, Darkaiser.
Please do not contact or message me.
I pay $5 per session for the game I've been in for almost five months now and consider it to be a good bargain. I was a bit dubious at first, but the DM offered the first session for free to decide and I was pleasantly surprised to find the DM and the game a great fit for what I was looking for.
For an online game I, and I suspect most paying players, would expect much the same as others have said. A coherently run, well prepared game with a DM that clearly puts effort into it. For $5 a session one shouldn't expect too much but a decent adventure plot and engagement with the player characters is probably a bare minimum. Talk with players before the game starts to establish their characters in your world, at least with basic backstories and their reasons for being in a position to join the party for the campaign to begin with. Also figure out what your players are looking for in their gaming experience (combat or roleplay heavy, or a mix; lighthearted "bright" fantasy that's a bit goofy or grimdark edginess, does their character have a long term goal related to their origin that you should work into the overall story, etc). Just as important is establishing what players don't want and knowing what to make off limits as far as subject material. You could try doing all that stuff as a collective session zero or spend some time with each player one on one then just go over a quick review of general rules, protocol, and boundaries at the beginning of the first session.
Players in an online game will also probably expect the use of a VTT (Virtual TableTop), at least for combat encounters. Theater of the mind typically works just fine for pure roleplaying sessions but if the party is exploring an area with traps and puzzles (such as an archetypical dungeon) or fighting a battle they're going to expect to see the environment somehow. Roll 20 is a pretty good system that isn't very hard to learn and you can get the basic functionality for just maps and tokens with a free account. Digital source material for incorporating various classes, races, etc have to be purchased and do make things go easier and smoother but aren't required; you can just use the VTT for maps on a grid and moving tokens (virtual minis) around and use the built in dice roller and just track everything else on physical character sheets if you want without any more effort than doing so for an in person game. There are tutorial videos for the basic functionality on YouTube and plenty of free maps that can be found with a google search (you just import the image file and overlay the combat grid onto it with a few clicks). So I would definitely suggest investing a few hours to learn at least Roll 20 basics, or try another VTT though most of my personal experience is with Roll 20 hence that recommendation.
Good luck!
Hey Darkaiser
I've played in a few different paid games, one thing I've noticed is that the easiest games to join are ones where you can tell what type of game they are going to be. So if your using roll twenty for example just put on the page what type of game it will be. It can be all theatre of the mind or have lots of map. You can create lots of lore or just stick to what relevant for the game. One thing to level expectations might be to use a pre set game like ghosts of salt marsh. That way the players will know how to flavour characters before session zero.
How do you keep out creepy players, do you ask for photos first?
I'd expect them to be good at DMing, able to keep the game moving, working with players, and generally being professional. (Being on time to sessions, consistent with scheduling etc. Sometimes things happen on short notice, but there shouldn't be any chronic issues of poor communication etc.) If money is involved then it's no longer just a hobby among friends, it's a service being paid form, and I would expect a certain level of professionalism from them.
Not sure how photos weeds out creeps? That is a bit much
60 for a month? Wow...I was thinking 5 per session ramping up to 10 if the players wanted me to get into a VTT sort of thing. For 60 a month the DM had better provide a mini for me, painted, and I might ask for a foot rub from time to time
Good tips...thanks
What makes you think a photo will tell you if a player is creepy or not? I'm not that good at judging people based on a photo alone.
Essentially, creepers will be creepin so if anything starts to get weird during session Zero, I keep my eye on that person. I encourage players to email me between sessions anyway so if a player is being a nusance, I'll try to warn them off the first time. If they persist, they get bounced. Players come to play...to get away from real life for a while. Nobody needs that crap.