In that sense, Barbs might be considered "Ohh Pee" because it cracks the paradigm of not letting casters use their bonus actions or reactions for useful stuff...but I'd ask why people think that paradigm is okay in the first place? Why should spellcasters, which already have to pay for their spells with bad armor, bad HP, nonexistent weapon combat, limited usage via spell slots, and often drastically fewer and less impactful class features than martial characters, also have to give up making full use of their turn every turn the way so many martial characters can? Is there a particular reason, beyond "spells are too powerful!", that people can think of as to why spellcasters shouldn't be given more options to fully utilize their turn in the game?
In all honesty? yes that is the main reason, because spells are already so powerful. Our exampled polearm master fighter for instance at lvl 13 drops 3 attacks at d10+5 and a BA d4+5, can get an op attack for another d10+5. If he gets to use his reaction, and lands every attack in a turn we're looking at an average of what 49 dmg or so? (average of 4d10 is 22, d4 is 2, +25 for ability mod) which is respectable, but stuff around cr9+ is easily over the 100hp threshold by that point, so the impact isn't just.. run up smash something it dies and thank god that happened
But than our spell casters at level 13 or so come up slinging single action spell like Force Cage, Banishment, polymorph, animate objects (10d4+40 dmg a turn for 10 turns) hold monster, wall of force/stone, chain lightning, contingency, disentegrate, draconic transformation, plane shift, reverse gravity, simulacrum, teleport.. and just more and more.
These are abilities that while limited can spin the game to a halt and often do. They look at 49 dmg a turn (if all attacks hit using action, BA and reaction) and go "yeah thats nice.. hold my beer"
So do casters need more power in the form of a strong reaction spell that has many applications? Well obviously that's up for each table to decide but has obviously left me going "hell no" Divination wizards where already considered amazing with portent being able to swap 2 d20 rolls a day. Barbs is not a guarantee because its a reroll but can be used off someone like a wizard up to 8 times in a day.
If strixhaven is allowed in our next game I'm going divination wizard with barbs or abberant mind sorcerer with barbs. Haven't made up my mind on which yet
Yurei, I think the argument here is that up until this point, the game has been balanced. Martial and caster classes can hold their own, and neither truly outshines the other. Action Economy was not really a factor for spellcasters as it is for martial classes up until this point.
A paradigm shift like this has a chance to unbalance the game. Unless you are contending that casters currently fall behind martial classes up until now, which I, and I believe most others, would heartily disagree. Giving caster such a huge boost in a use of a resource that they almost never use can easily tip the balance in their favor, making them outshine everyone else.
I do contend that casters currently fall behind martial classes, actually. People assume otherwise because a save-or-suck control spell landed against a single powerful enemy with no minions or support critters can end a fight...but high-level D&D is almost never "hey, let's set up our wizard to cast a bomb-ass spell that helps us win the fight!", it's "Hey, our barbarian can do, like...seventy damage a turn with his insane greataxe swings! Let's set the barbarian up to rip the enemy's face all the way off while we cheer from the background!" And frankly the whole "I cast Save-Or-Suck on the one single giant enemy with a weak save!" thing is a sign of a bad/inexperienced DM more than a sign of caster Ohh-Peeness.
High-level spellcasters are rarely the stars of the show in endgame combat - it's the martial characters that can deal absolutely withering round-over-round damage whilst having dozens of useful class features and the ability to stand toe-to-toe with the heaviest threats while the casters in the back can only hope they can keep up with their best limited-use high-level support spells. A spellcaster can keep up with a well-built endgame martial's completely free, at-will, resourceless damage only by blowing through spell slots as fast as the game allows on the best single-target damage spells in D&D, which they can usually keep up for maybe four rounds tops.
Heh, after all - the most egregiously overpowered 'damage' spell in all of 5e works by creating a small army of martial attackers that overwhelm their enemy with a tsunami of attack rolls, simulating the abilities of a high-level martial character. The ability to summon lightning, to incinerate your foes with arcane fire, to smite them with light from the Heavens - it all pales next to throwing a bag of forks at the enemy and yelling "SIC' EM, FARQUOD!" Why should I believe that spellcasters are the kings of the battlefield?
I also feel this is a big misconception, when I drop a wall and cut off half the enemies from the battle so the party can mop of whats left and than engage the other half, was it the barbs dmg that carried the day or was it the wall making the combat a breeze that carried the day?
" People assume otherwise because a save-or-suck control spell landed against a single powerful enemy with no minions or support critters can end a fight" That is not the assumption people make at all, the assumption is that you remove the BIGGEST threat from the fight and your essentially ending the fight. You've tipped the balance so heavily in your favor by removing the heavy hitter that you easily take out the garbage, than down the bigger target.
If the damage a martial does is what makes them the star of a fight than that's really downplaying how much the control spells a wizard dropped cheesed the fight to allow the martials to mop up. If I polymorph the biggest creature and that leads to an easy fight.. it wasn't the damage of the martials that made that fight easy, it was removing the threat. same if we polymorph the martial into a trex at lower levels. It wasn't the martial, it was the polymorph.
And yeah you can go dmg spells, burn up your slots do a lot of dmg in a short fight or the right fight and that's a resource dump vs the limitless swinging a fighter does. No argument there, but uh what is the fighter doing outside of combat? I'm assuming these campaigns aren't just hackmaster where we go from one fight to the next and that's it until the bbeg. So how is the barb helping to cross the giant chasm or get back to the city under siege or really any plethora of stuff that happens in the campaign where the wizard goes "oh I got a spell for that".. teleport, or gate or casting fly, plane shifting, yadda yadda.. what exactly is the barb doing that's making you feel like the wizard is falling behind?
Damage is a vital part of combat, but I never feel it's the star of combat its the inevitable outcome, what is the star is the things that force multiply that dmg or remove the enemies ability to bring theirs to bare that are the stars.
Perhaps its feeling that dmg on spells is poor hence martials are outshining the casters? because I'd agree there, that 'blasting' as a caster is a terrible idea. It's inefficient in most circumstances as control options are much more powerful, compare something like fireball to hypnotic pattern in just about any situation HP is a better option unless you've found yourself fighting a horde of weak stuff that FB is gong to wipe out, BUT that's just something casters can do, their real strength lies in those control spells.
This is an ability found on the Order Domain. Order Clerics have used this ability, historically, to grant one of their party members a free attack once a round. optimally, this is being used on a rogue to snag them another sneak attack per round of combat.
Enter Silvery Barbs. A spell you use as a reaction, but that also targets an ally, even grants them advantage. Bam, now order clerics have another way to give out more attacks per round than before and even guarantee they'll get sneak attack because of the advantage.
So instead of just one attack from Voice of Authority per round they'll be giving out 2 extra attacks per round.
Aside from just the spell itself being powerful you really got to take this into consideration too. Easily the most DPR you'll ever get from a 1st level spell slot is a sneak attack from your rogue.
It is apparently so hard to program Aberrant Mind and Clockwork Soul spell-swapping into dndbeyond they had to remake the game without it rather than implement it.
Timing-wise, if you hit enemies with an area cc of some sort, and two of them save, could a sorcerer use twin spell on silvery barbs or is the timing of saving throws such that you can't?
Timing-wise, if you hit enemies with an area cc of some sort, and two of them save, could a sorcerer use twin spell on silvery barbs or is the timing of saving throws such that you can't?
Silvery Barbs cannot be twinned because it already targets more than one creature by default.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I'm probably laughing.
It is apparently so hard to program Aberrant Mind and Clockwork Soul spell-swapping into dndbeyond they had to remake the game without it rather than implement it.
This is an ability found on the Order Domain. Order Clerics have used this ability, historically, to grant one of their party members a free attack once a round. optimally, this is being used on a rogue to snag them another sneak attack per round of combat.
Enter Silvery Barbs. A spell you use as a reaction, but that also targets an ally, even grants them advantage. Bam, now order clerics have another way to give out more attacks per round than before and even guarantee they'll get sneak attack because of the advantage.
So instead of just one attack from Voice of Authority per round they'll be giving out 2 extra attacks per round.
Aside from just the spell itself being powerful you really got to take this into consideration too. Easily the most DPR you'll ever get from a 1st level spell slot is a sneak attack from your rogue.
Ooh. That's spicy.
Edit: Two different allies, though. Likely a Rogue and a Paladin, would be the strongest ordinary party comp setup.
I only read the first 3 pages of the thread (at 10 atm) but hadn't seen anyone mention Aberrant Mind sorcerers and their psionic spells feature.
I'm playing one in Avernus right now and am debating whether to pick this spell up. My DM approved it but it feels even more unbalanced in my particular character's hands.
He is more of a controller/manipulator than dps and devils have magic resistance so this spell would really help. But as a 1st level psionic sorcery spell in only takes 1 sorcery point (and a reaction) to cast for disadvantage on a save or suck spell. Compare that with heightened spell metamagic at 3 sorcery points and has to be claimed before the spell is cast rather than after. On top of that I'll be taking a 2 level warlock dip soon, so 4 1st level slots plus 2 1st level pact slots and X sorcery points means I can be casting this spell all day to give enemies disadvantage and buffing allies. The only real cost will be to use up my reaction making me more vulnerable.
So anyway it would obviously be a powerful pickup. At the same time though I'm hesitant because it kind of feels like cheating.
I only read the first 3 pages of the thread (at 10 atm) but hadn't seen anyone mention Aberrant Mind sorcerers and their psionic spells feature.
I'm playing one in Avernus right now and am debating whether to pick this spell up. My DM approved it but it feels even more unbalanced in my particular character's hands.
He is more of a controller/manipulator than dps and devils have magic resistance so this spell would really help. But as a 1st level psionic sorcery spell in only takes 1 sorcery point (and a reaction) to cast for disadvantage on a save or suck spell. Compare that with heightened spell metamagic at 3 sorcery points and has to be claimed before the spell is cast rather than after. On top of that I'll be taking a 2 level warlock dip soon, so 4 1st level slots plus 2 1st level pact slots and X sorcery points means I can be casting this spell all day to give enemies disadvantage and buffing allies. The only real cost will be to use up my reaction making me more vulnerable.
So anyway it would obviously be a powerful pickup. At the same time though I'm hesitant because it kind of feels like cheating.
I say go for it. If your DM says it's okay, then by definition it cannot be cheating. It'll be interesting to know what the results of that are.
I got here while searching for this spell because I couldn't understand it. The description is incredibly bad and non-standard.
“You magically distract the triggering creature and turn its momentary uncertainty into encouragement for another creature. The triggering creature must reroll the d20 and use the lower roll.”
What is a triggering creature? Turn uncertainty into encouragement? Reroll what d20? There's no context.
Edit: I just noticed the asterisk for the Reaction. Why isn't that in the main description? This text style is normally used for material components. It's so confusing!
I only read the first 3 pages of the thread (at 10 atm) but hadn't seen anyone mention Aberrant Mind sorcerers and their psionic spells feature.
I'm playing one in Avernus right now and am debating whether to pick this spell up. My DM approved it but it feels even more unbalanced in my particular character's hands.
He is more of a controller/manipulator than dps and devils have magic resistance so this spell would really help. But as a 1st level psionic sorcery spell in only takes 1 sorcery point (and a reaction) to cast for disadvantage on a save or suck spell. Compare that with heightened spell metamagic at 3 sorcery points and has to be claimed before the spell is cast rather than after. On top of that I'll be taking a 2 level warlock dip soon, so 4 1st level slots plus 2 1st level pact slots and X sorcery points means I can be casting this spell all day to give enemies disadvantage and buffing allies. The only real cost will be to use up my reaction making me more vulnerable.
So anyway it would obviously be a powerful pickup. At the same time though I'm hesitant because it kind of feels like cheating.
Give it a shot. We all need actual hard playtest data to see how it performs.
Heh...see, the fun part is that with Heightened Spell you can double-hedge your bets on powerful save-or-sucks. Heighten the original spell to negate resistance or impose disadvantage, and if they manage to push through that hit them again with the Barbs. Make them shoot for worst-of-three. Devils are ******** anyway, they deserve it.
I got here while searching for this spell because I couldn't understand it. The description is incredibly bad and non-standard.
“You magically distract the triggering creature and turn its momentary uncertainty into encouragement for another creature. The triggering creature must reroll the d20 and use the lower roll.”
What is a triggering creature? Turn uncertainty into encouragement? Reroll what d20? There's no context.
The spell states it's cast as a reaction, and gives the reaction trigger "When a creature you can see within 60 feet succeeds on an attack roll, ability check, or saving throw." All Barbs does is not bother repeating the trigger in the body of the spell.
I got here while searching for this spell because I couldn't understand it. The description is incredibly bad and non-standard.
“You magically distract the triggering creature and turn its momentary uncertainty into encouragement for another creature. The triggering creature must reroll the d20 and use the lower roll.”
What is a triggering creature? Turn uncertainty into encouragement? Reroll what d20? There's no context.
The triggering creature is the one that's succeeding on an attack roll, saving throw, or ability check, which is also the d20 that being rerolled. Turning uncertainty into encouragement is just the flavor text being used to describe the spell's effects.
I only read the first 3 pages of the thread (at 10 atm) but hadn't seen anyone mention Aberrant Mind sorcerers and their psionic spells feature.
I'm playing one in Avernus right now and am debating whether to pick this spell up. My DM approved it but it feels even more unbalanced in my particular character's hands.
He is more of a controller/manipulator than dps and devils have magic resistance so this spell would really help. But as a 1st level psionic sorcery spell in only takes 1 sorcery point (and a reaction) to cast for disadvantage on a save or suck spell. Compare that with heightened spell metamagic at 3 sorcery points and has to be claimed before the spell is cast rather than after. On top of that I'll be taking a 2 level warlock dip soon, so 4 1st level slots plus 2 1st level pact slots and X sorcery points means I can be casting this spell all day to give enemies disadvantage and buffing allies. The only real cost will be to use up my reaction making me more vulnerable.
So anyway it would obviously be a powerful pickup. At the same time though I'm hesitant because it kind of feels like cheating.
Give it a shot. We all need actual hard playtest data to see how it performs.
Heh...see, the fun part is that with Heightened Spell you can double-hedge your bets on powerful save-or-sucks. Heighten the original spell to negate resistance or impose disadvantage, and if they manage to push through that hit them again with the Barbs. Make them shoot for worst-of-three. Devils are ******** anyway, they deserve it.
You convinced me. It would be helpful to play test it.
Plus I did tell the DM I wouldn't put up a stink if he decided it needed modification.
Give it a shot. We all need actual hard playtest data to see how it performs.
Heh...see, the fun part is that with Heightened Spell you can double-hedge your bets on powerful save-or-sucks. Heighten the original spell to negate resistance or impose disadvantage, and if they manage to push through that hit them again with the Barbs. Make them shoot for worst-of-three. Devils are ******** anyway, they deserve it.
Oh, that would be delicious. Imagine if there were also either a Lore Bard or Eloquence Bard using their Cutting/Unsettling Words to nerf those rolls even further; just win encounters entirely by verbally bullying monsters to death...
Give it a shot. We all need actual hard playtest data to see how it performs.
Heh...see, the fun part is that with Heightened Spell you can double-hedge your bets on powerful save-or-sucks. Heighten the original spell to negate resistance or impose disadvantage, and if they manage to push through that hit them again with the Barbs. Make them shoot for worst-of-three. Devils are ******** anyway, they deserve it.
Oh, that would be delicious. Imagine if there were also either a Lore Bard or Eloquence Bard using their Cutting/Unsettling Words to nerf those rolls even further; just win encounters entirely by verbally bullying monsters to death...
Heh, there is an eloquence bard. And he's playing pretty much entirely as support so that has been a nice combo so far.
This is an ability found on the Order Domain. Order Clerics have used this ability, historically, to grant one of their party members a free attack once a round. optimally, this is being used on a rogue to snag them another sneak attack per round of combat.
Enter Silvery Barbs. A spell you use as a reaction, but that also targets an ally, even grants them advantage. Bam, now order clerics have another way to give out more attacks per round than before and even guarantee they'll get sneak attack because of the advantage.
So instead of just one attack from Voice of Authority per round they'll be giving out 2 extra attacks per round.
Aside from just the spell itself being powerful you really got to take this into consideration too. Easily the most DPR you'll ever get from a 1st level spell slot is a sneak attack from your rogue.
Ooh. That's spicy.
Edit: Two different allies, though. Likely a Rogue and a Paladin, would be the strongest ordinary party comp setup.
By default you'd only need one ally.
Cast a spell on them during the cleric's turn. > VoA kicks in granting the, say Rogue a free attack. Cleric ends his turn and an enemy goes, the cleric Silvery Barbs them, grants the advantage to their Rogue > VoA kicks in again, and the Rogue gets another free attack, this time with that advantage.
To really spice it up! > Multiclass Order1/SorcX (my money on divine, aberrant, or clockwork) and then twin Haste. For this move you'd want your 2 high damage allies, pal+rog ideal, yes. <--- This monstrosity is now giving out 4 attacks per round to allies. 3 to the rogue and 1 to the paladin. That rogue would be potentially sneak attacking 4 whole times per round, its kinda crazy.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
I'm probably laughing.
It is apparently so hard to program Aberrant Mind and Clockwork Soul spell-swapping into dndbeyond they had to remake the game without it rather than implement it.
This is an ability found on the Order Domain. Order Clerics have used this ability, historically, to grant one of their party members a free attack once a round. optimally, this is being used on a rogue to snag them another sneak attack per round of combat.
Enter Silvery Barbs. A spell you use as a reaction, but that also targets an ally, even grants them advantage. Bam, now order clerics have another way to give out more attacks per round than before and even guarantee they'll get sneak attack because of the advantage.
So instead of just one attack from Voice of Authority per round they'll be giving out 2 extra attacks per round.
Aside from just the spell itself being powerful you really got to take this into consideration too. Easily the most DPR you'll ever get from a 1st level spell slot is a sneak attack from your rogue.
Ooh. That's spicy.
Edit: Two different allies, though. Likely a Rogue and a Paladin, would be the strongest ordinary party comp setup.
By default you'd only need one ally.
Cast a spell on them during the cleric's turn. > VoA kicks in granting the, say Rogue a free attack. Cleric ends his turn and an enemy goes, the cleric Silvery Barbs them, grants the advantage to their Rogue > VoA kicks in again, and the Rogue gets another free attack, this time with that advantage.
To really spice it up! > Multiclass Order1/SorcX (my money on divine, aberrant, or clockwork) and then twin Haste. For this move you'd want your 2 high damage allies, pal+rog ideal, yes. <--- This monstrosity is now giving out 4 attacks per round to allies. 3 to the rogue and 1 to the paladin. That rogue would be potentially sneak attacking 4 whole times per round, its kinda crazy.
Unfortunately, Voice of Authority only works if the targeted ally is able to use their reaction. The only way that would work is if the Rogue got to use their turn between each use of VoA and had their reaction free each time.
It's alright. People compare it to shield but this spell leaves you completely open to magic missile (making it more viable) and the bad guys can use it against you as well. Yes someone can have both shield and barbs but not only are you dedicating two prepared spells to defense (which can be rough at lvl1) but it's a really easy way to burn through your spell slots in the blink of an eye.
Also shield lasts until the beginning of your next turn whereas this is just against the one roll. I'd argue that to the former is stronger.
In all honesty? yes that is the main reason, because spells are already so powerful. Our exampled polearm master fighter for instance at lvl 13 drops 3 attacks at d10+5 and a BA d4+5, can get an op attack for another d10+5. If he gets to use his reaction, and lands every attack in a turn we're looking at an average of what 49 dmg or so? (average of 4d10 is 22, d4 is 2, +25 for ability mod) which is respectable, but stuff around cr9+ is easily over the 100hp threshold by that point, so the impact isn't just.. run up smash something it dies and thank god that happened
But than our spell casters at level 13 or so come up slinging single action spell like Force Cage, Banishment, polymorph, animate objects (10d4+40 dmg a turn for 10 turns) hold monster, wall of force/stone, chain lightning, contingency, disentegrate, draconic transformation, plane shift, reverse gravity, simulacrum, teleport.. and just more and more.
These are abilities that while limited can spin the game to a halt and often do. They look at 49 dmg a turn (if all attacks hit using action, BA and reaction) and go "yeah thats nice.. hold my beer"
So do casters need more power in the form of a strong reaction spell that has many applications? Well obviously that's up for each table to decide but has obviously left me going "hell no" Divination wizards where already considered amazing with portent being able to swap 2 d20 rolls a day. Barbs is not a guarantee because its a reroll but can be used off someone like a wizard up to 8 times in a day.
If strixhaven is allowed in our next game I'm going divination wizard with barbs or abberant mind sorcerer with barbs. Haven't made up my mind on which yet
I also feel this is a big misconception, when I drop a wall and cut off half the enemies from the battle so the party can mop of whats left and than engage the other half, was it the barbs dmg that carried the day or was it the wall making the combat a breeze that carried the day?
" People assume otherwise because a save-or-suck control spell landed against a single powerful enemy with no minions or support critters can end a fight" That is not the assumption people make at all, the assumption is that you remove the BIGGEST threat from the fight and your essentially ending the fight. You've tipped the balance so heavily in your favor by removing the heavy hitter that you easily take out the garbage, than down the bigger target.
If the damage a martial does is what makes them the star of a fight than that's really downplaying how much the control spells a wizard dropped cheesed the fight to allow the martials to mop up. If I polymorph the biggest creature and that leads to an easy fight.. it wasn't the damage of the martials that made that fight easy, it was removing the threat. same if we polymorph the martial into a trex at lower levels. It wasn't the martial, it was the polymorph.
And yeah you can go dmg spells, burn up your slots do a lot of dmg in a short fight or the right fight and that's a resource dump vs the limitless swinging a fighter does. No argument there, but uh what is the fighter doing outside of combat? I'm assuming these campaigns aren't just hackmaster where we go from one fight to the next and that's it until the bbeg. So how is the barb helping to cross the giant chasm or get back to the city under siege or really any plethora of stuff that happens in the campaign where the wizard goes "oh I got a spell for that".. teleport, or gate or casting fly, plane shifting, yadda yadda.. what exactly is the barb doing that's making you feel like the wizard is falling behind?
Damage is a vital part of combat, but I never feel it's the star of combat its the inevitable outcome, what is the star is the things that force multiply that dmg or remove the enemies ability to bring theirs to bare that are the stars.
Perhaps its feeling that dmg on spells is poor hence martials are outshining the casters? because I'd agree there, that 'blasting' as a caster is a terrible idea. It's inefficient in most circumstances as control options are much more powerful, compare something like fireball to hypnotic pattern in just about any situation HP is a better option unless you've found yourself fighting a horde of weak stuff that FB is gong to wipe out, BUT that's just something casters can do, their real strength lies in those control spells.
Voice of Authority.
This is an ability found on the Order Domain. Order Clerics have used this ability, historically, to grant one of their party members a free attack once a round. optimally, this is being used on a rogue to snag them another sneak attack per round of combat.
Enter Silvery Barbs. A spell you use as a reaction, but that also targets an ally, even grants them advantage. Bam, now order clerics have another way to give out more attacks per round than before and even guarantee they'll get sneak attack because of the advantage.
So instead of just one attack from Voice of Authority per round they'll be giving out 2 extra attacks per round.
Aside from just the spell itself being powerful you really got to take this into consideration too. Easily the most DPR you'll ever get from a 1st level spell slot is a sneak attack from your rogue.
I'm probably laughing.
It is apparently so hard to program Aberrant Mind and Clockwork Soul spell-swapping into dndbeyond they had to remake the game without it rather than implement it.
Timing-wise, if you hit enemies with an area cc of some sort, and two of them save, could a sorcerer use twin spell on silvery barbs or is the timing of saving throws such that you can't?
Silvery Barbs cannot be twinned because it already targets more than one creature by default.
I'm probably laughing.
It is apparently so hard to program Aberrant Mind and Clockwork Soul spell-swapping into dndbeyond they had to remake the game without it rather than implement it.
Ooh. That's spicy.
Edit: Two different allies, though. Likely a Rogue and a Paladin, would be the strongest ordinary party comp setup.
I only read the first 3 pages of the thread (at 10 atm) but hadn't seen anyone mention Aberrant Mind sorcerers and their psionic spells feature.
I'm playing one in Avernus right now and am debating whether to pick this spell up. My DM approved it but it feels even more unbalanced in my particular character's hands.
He is more of a controller/manipulator than dps and devils have magic resistance so this spell would really help. But as a 1st level psionic sorcery spell in only takes 1 sorcery point (and a reaction) to cast for disadvantage on a save or suck spell. Compare that with heightened spell metamagic at 3 sorcery points and has to be claimed before the spell is cast rather than after. On top of that I'll be taking a 2 level warlock dip soon, so 4 1st level slots plus 2 1st level pact slots and X sorcery points means I can be casting this spell all day to give enemies disadvantage and buffing allies. The only real cost will be to use up my reaction making me more vulnerable.
So anyway it would obviously be a powerful pickup. At the same time though I'm hesitant because it kind of feels like cheating.
I say go for it. If your DM says it's okay, then by definition it cannot be cheating. It'll be interesting to know what the results of that are.
I got here while searching for this spell because I couldn't understand it. The description is incredibly bad and non-standard.
What is a triggering creature? Turn uncertainty into encouragement? Reroll what d20? There's no context.
Edit: I just noticed the asterisk for the Reaction. Why isn't that in the main description? This text style is normally used for material components. It's so confusing!
Give it a shot. We all need actual hard playtest data to see how it performs.
Heh...see, the fun part is that with Heightened Spell you can double-hedge your bets on powerful save-or-sucks. Heighten the original spell to negate resistance or impose disadvantage, and if they manage to push through that hit them again with the Barbs. Make them shoot for worst-of-three. Devils are ******** anyway, they deserve it.
Please do not contact or message me.
The spell states it's cast as a reaction, and gives the reaction trigger "When a creature you can see within 60 feet succeeds on an attack roll, ability check, or saving throw." All Barbs does is not bother repeating the trigger in the body of the spell.
Please do not contact or message me.
The triggering creature is the one that's succeeding on an attack roll, saving throw, or ability check, which is also the d20 that being rerolled. Turning uncertainty into encouragement is just the flavor text being used to describe the spell's effects.
EDIT: NVM, Yurei beat me to it.
You convinced me. It would be helpful to play test it.
Plus I did tell the DM I wouldn't put up a stink if he decided it needed modification.
Oh, that would be delicious. Imagine if there were also either a Lore Bard or Eloquence Bard using their Cutting/Unsettling Words to nerf those rolls even further; just win encounters entirely by verbally bullying monsters to death...
Heh, there is an eloquence bard. And he's playing pretty much entirely as support so that has been a nice combo so far.
Amunsol,
That is beautiful. And were I DMing that game, I would be sorely, sorely, *sorely* disappointed if that combo wasn't used to its fullest potential!
By default you'd only need one ally.
Cast a spell on them during the cleric's turn. > VoA kicks in granting the, say Rogue a free attack. Cleric ends his turn and an enemy goes, the cleric Silvery Barbs them, grants the advantage to their Rogue > VoA kicks in again, and the Rogue gets another free attack, this time with that advantage.
To really spice it up! > Multiclass Order1/SorcX (my money on divine, aberrant, or clockwork) and then twin Haste. For this move you'd want your 2 high damage allies, pal+rog ideal, yes. <--- This monstrosity is now giving out 4 attacks per round to allies. 3 to the rogue and 1 to the paladin. That rogue would be potentially sneak attacking 4 whole times per round, its kinda crazy.
I'm probably laughing.
It is apparently so hard to program Aberrant Mind and Clockwork Soul spell-swapping into dndbeyond they had to remake the game without it rather than implement it.
Unfortunately, Voice of Authority only works if the targeted ally is able to use their reaction. The only way that would work is if the Rogue got to use their turn between each use of VoA and had their reaction free each time.
It's alright. People compare it to shield but this spell leaves you completely open to magic missile (making it more viable) and the bad guys can use it against you as well. Yes someone can have both shield and barbs but not only are you dedicating two prepared spells to defense (which can be rough at lvl1) but it's a really easy way to burn through your spell slots in the blink of an eye.
Also shield lasts until the beginning of your next turn whereas this is just against the one roll. I'd argue that to the former is stronger.
I voted other.
It isnt broken. Punching above its weight class certainly.
As a L2 spell it wouldn't be OP.