I think it is worth noting that the OP clearly does not want to have arrow scarcity and tracking ammunition part of their game, and that’s fine. Maybe they have a player who does a bad job at tracking it in the midst of combat, so are constantly fielding "drat, how many arrows did I fire off again?” questions (plenty of players who get so caught up in the combat they forget to do the busy work of ticking down their ammo). Or maybe their group is just not into the survival elements. Or perhaps they are, but a survival element that only hampers one person in the party and would leave them twiddling their thumbs during combat while everyone else is still at 100% fighting ability is not their thing.
The reality is that each group is different - what might be fun for some groups is not fun for others. If the OP does not want one of their players to track ammunition - and that is literally the premise of the thread - then that is their prerogative. It is not like the OP is responding asking follow-up questions about “I did not really think about the survival element, I want to consider that more.”
But, of course, this is the D&D Beyond forums, where a question of “I do not really like the taste of fish, what other protein should I have for dinner?” would result in a few responsive suggestions of pork, beef, etc…. and a ten page discussion of the nutritional merits of eating fish.
Which is, of course, not to say that posts saying “beef is a good option for you/I agree with some of the other options presented, but have you considered that fish has omega-3s you cannot get from other sources easily?” are inherently unhelpful posts - they can help folks see another perspective they might not have considered. Yet aggressively defending the other perspective without (a) answering the actual question and (b) the OP actually inviting such a defence seems to happen on every single thread, and that is unhelpful. It is really no wonder that so few OPs actually end up responding to their own threads - they stop becoming their threads rather quickly.
So, for the OP’s benefit, if you are still following this thread. You are welcome to consider the advantages of limited ammunition; you are also welcome to use any of the homebrew or other solutions presented here to your underlying problem. Neither answer is right or wrong - do what works best for your table.
I think to clarify, the party are now at level 6/7 we have been doing the tracking ammo bit up to now because money and resources where tight, but, they have just received about 8000 gold each as rewards for completing the first major milestone of the campaign (killing the Aboleth that has been plaguing the area since they where level 1), so tracking arrows is not a concern of mine now, I had already told them, buy a big bundle and don't worry too much about tracking, every now and then i will just ask the party to chuck a few gold in to cover what has been used, (out of a party of 8 4 are bow users currently). This particular player however from a RP perspective wanted to know if there was a solution, or a magic item they could buy in my world to cover that situation. I have magic shops and magic items are all over the place to be found or bought by the party, he had returned back to his home (elven town that exists in the material and the Fey Wild) and asked if there where 2 things available to buy there, Bracers of Archery (which was a yes they are there, cost you 1500) and a quiver or bow that doesn't require ammunition. I am going to save the dragon bow from Fizbangs which I didn't know about until this thread because the next major fight they will have at about level 8 will be their first Dragon battle and that bow looks perfect to put in the treasure trove there.
And this is the biggest mistake I think DM's make, you are not recreating a novel, if you want that then write a book. Yes the story only picked out specific moments in the plot, but, the hobbits where travelling for a long time, during that time there where undoubtably things that happened that never made the page.
I fully respect a DM who chooses not to use random encounters, I will however argue with a DM who claims that they are only suitable to certain situations. Random encounters can be utilised in any setting if you want to use them. Towns or City's can have random acts of violence, a house catching fire, a run away cart or horse that needs catching. In a forest you can have monsters, but also the party might get lost, so add a day, or might have an environmental issue to navigate.
I also find Random Encounters is a great way to just add flavour, either you tell your players "you spend 10 days hiking through the land, you see mountains in the distance and the ground is firm in some places and marshy in others" or you can make your random encounters add to the flavour, it might not be an encounter, it might trigger a descriptive event. I find it just helps me create better descriptive accounts of the journey.
I don't use random encounters, in the sense that I roll dice and consult a table to see what shows up
I do use "random" encounters, in the sense that they aren't directly part of whatever quest or mission the party might be on at the time, but they do still have a purpose -- filling in the world around the party, introducing an NPC who might become important later, that sort of thing
No, it's not like writing a novel, but it is part of telling a story. Truly random fights don't further the story
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Active characters:
Carric Aquissar, elven wannabe artist in his deconstructionist period (Archfey warlock) Lan Kidogo, mapach archaeologist and treasure hunter (Knowledge cleric) Mardan Ferres, elven private investigator obsessed with that one unsolved murder (Assassin rogue) Xhekhetiel, halfling survivor of a Betrayer Gods cult (Runechild sorcerer/fighter)
I mean it depends on the world, in my world there is a lot of undiscovered wilderness so yes, there is stuff happening every day, monsters hunting smaller monsters for food, and now a smaller yet food source has walked into the area.
This isn't a criticism of your world, but that isn't realistic. Commoners would get slaughtered and humanity would either go extinct or adapt so much it would be unrecognisable. People have to go into forests all the time and frequently would have spent all day there. If attacks by monsters capable of presenting a threat to a heroic party occurred on a daily basis, then commoners would be slaughtered, they wouldn't even stand a chance. Those conditions wouldn't be confined to forests either - they'd start raiding farms and so forth. Humanity would either be hunted to extinction or change so much to survive that we wouldn't recognise it anymore.
This isn't a criticism by any means. It's something that is part of a game or story to make it interesting and fun. But realism isn't a term you could apply here. You're applying unrealistic conditions to produce a certain atmosphere and dynamic. Again, that's not a criticism, but arguing that it makes things feel more realistic is not the argument for having those encounters, at least not regularly.
But it isn't just that, the part come across a boggy area, there is a chance they might get stuck and lose time or lose supplies. That 7 day trek to get to where the big bad is ends up taking 10-12 days because of events, and yes, long rests have been had but, if you are tracking supplies, arrows might be starting to run low (if the party forgot to buy additional ones before hand) javelins are lost, spell components have been used up, there is only so much diamond dust, diamonds or other special components that are needed for spells.
Right, and that's why I argue for the Tolkien model. When food is plentiful, ignore it. When you have easy access to arrows, ignore them. Just assume that the characters are intelligent enough to forage and hunt as they go. When they come to an area where it starts getting restricted, like when Frodo and Sam entered Mordor, then we can start spending game time talking about how they procure food.
If you tell a party, you leave place A you get to place B and fight the big bad, then yes you need to throw lots at them in one day to use stuff up. If you instead draw out that travel, make lots of interesting things that have the chance of happening, use those random encounters to paint a picture of the land around them, to help the party really get under the skin of the environment they are in then the act of reaching the big bad, surviving encounters, maybe burning a diamond or 2 to revivify on the journey and suddenly, things are looking tight. Then as players you start asking questions like. "In this world is there a magic item that means I will never run out of arrows, cos I am running low"
That can be interesting, but I think it depends on the style of the game. You have limited time at the table and time spent fighting bears is time not spent fighting BBEG and his minions. Some games it's suited for to have the environment act as a co-BBEG and have all these things going on, others it's just a distraction from the real story, and you're better off spending that time rescuing fair maidens or developing relationships with NPCs, or discovering lore. It's just about spending time wisely. Sometimes having random encounters can help, other times they're annoying obstacles to the fun stuff. It all depends on the campaign and party.
My current game is real time 55 sessions 4 hours a session, and the party just made level 6. It took them a year of real time to get to the first BBEG (an Aboleth) I completely understand your point but for me all those random encounters, including a bear fight, feed into the feel of the land and the game, and every encounter has a purpose. For instance at the start of the campaign the party had random encounters with Wolves and Owl bears as they where trying to find and rescue someone from a bandit cave. The Bandits had moved into the area and upset the food chain meaning that the wolves and owl bears where more willing to take the risk of attacking the party because they where hungry. In fact I told one of the party members, an elf ranger from the area, after the 3rd encounter like this, that it seemed that something was up as normally these types of encounters would not happen. Once the bandits where dealt with then a few moths later of game time an NPC mentioned in passing that the ways through the forest seemed less dangerous and wild beasts seemed to be leaving the locals alone more.
There's a difference between a random encounter, and having emergent storylines and plot. No, Trippy Koala 421 can't fill the niche of Shelob or the Balrog. Not unless you start making a thing of him, giving him a backstory, incorporating him into the plot...at which point he stops being a random encounter, and starts being a planned one. You even pointed this out yourself when you made the point about Shelob not being satsifactorily replaced by a cliff.
We're not discussing utilising randomly determined elements to create a story, but random encounters, which are "right, you've travelled a day, and you *rolls* come across a pack of *rolls* 6 wolves in the *rolls* morning, I guess you're rolling initiative". If you're using rolls beforehand to determine that they encounter pack of 6 wolves and then decide that they're actually servants of the BBEG that have been sent to waylay the party, that's a very different situation. One advances the plot, teaches the party more about the BBEG's personality and powers, allows you to explore lore a bit more, it is a very useful event for the plot. A bunch of random hungry wolves deciding to prey on the party does not fulfil this role and the two are not interchangeable. Perhaps, like in my RotFM campaign, hungry wolves actually serve my purpose better, but generally, the servants of evil plotline is far more effective.
Why are those wolves so hungry as to attack a group of humanoids they would most likely otherwise avoid? There’s a point that can be used to foreshadow something related to the story or setting. Is it not? Anything can be tied back to either setting development or story arch given a little creativity and the willingness to try.
Again, if you are putting that much thought into it, how is it random? You could work out the entire ecosystem in fine detail, tie it all into the plot. That does not equal random.
A random encounter is "You have encountered a <rolls> just-rolled-up-thing! What do you do???" And then you as a DM have to figure out how it makes any sense for just rolled up thing to be there at all. Wolves are pretty easy. Deep wilderness, adventurers are not known as being scary. The adventurers themselves have likely frightened prey away, either simply by being there or by hunting said prey to supplement their own rations. Plus even if not hungry, Wolves are territorial.
i never use the stock standard random encounter tables, if i am using one I make my own for the specific area, it helps t explain the route the party have taken or the chance of a thing crossing there path on the way. It is still a random table, but it might only apply once in the entire campaign.
And this is the biggest mistake I think DM's make, you are not recreating a novel, if you want that then write a book. Yes the story only picked out specific moments in the plot, but, the hobbits where travelling for a long time, during that time there where undoubtably things that happened that never made the page.
I fully respect a DM who chooses not to use random encounters, I will however argue with a DM who claims that they are only suitable to certain situations. Random encounters can be utilised in any setting if you want to use them. Towns or City's can have random acts of violence, a house catching fire, a run away cart or horse that needs catching. In a forest you can have monsters, but also the party might get lost, so add a day, or might have an environmental issue to navigate.
I also find Random Encounters is a great way to just add flavour, either you tell your players "you spend 10 days hiking through the land, you see mountains in the distance and the ground is firm in some places and marshy in others" or you can make your random encounters add to the flavour, it might not be an encounter, it might trigger a descriptive event. I find it just helps me create better descriptive accounts of the journey.
I don't use random encounters, in the sense that I roll dice and consult a table to see what shows up
I do use "random" encounters, in the sense that they aren't directly part of whatever quest or mission the party might be on at the time, but they do still have a purpose -- filling in the world around the party, introducing an NPC who might become important later, that sort of thing
No, it's not like writing a novel, but it is part of telling a story. Truly random fights don't further the story
So I never use a generic random encounter table, I make a table based on where they are, but I do get my players to roll and then the table shifts and changes based on what they have already rolled, so, some things (getting lost, bad weather) can come up multiple times but certain encounters will just happen once, and if encounter A happens then it might trigger encounter B 3 days later (if they are still travelling). I find it is a bit more fun for me in terms of being a bit on the fly with my prose (I only ever bullet point things) then having a straight 12 day journey already scouted out. That doesn't mean I won't have fixed events happen regardless of what the players roll on certain days.
But I would say, random fights can be a very fun useful experiance, I run milestone so it isn't about gaining XP but, if the party have just levelled up then a couple of random encounters letting them feel out new spells, skills and abilities, or use a new magic item, can be really rewarding for players and does not need to remotely advance the story. Sometimes as well players just want a session with a bit of hitting of stuff, which again could just be a random monster they come across but it can be about feeling the flow of the real room as well as the flow of the story.
I guess it comes down to how you want to play and, yes, when you only get to play for 3 hours once per month you might not be that interested in tracking items, or the DM rolling for random encounters every day of travel.
We always tracked this stuff in AD&D. But the group and DM I play with now, not so much. We really don’t even bother tracking treasure, except magic items. Early on we had an adventure where we recovered a lot of gold and gems. It went into the party’s bag of holding and if someone wants something they moneys just there. We don’t even split it among the PC’s. It’s just a party slush fund. Although at level 13 only once was there a need to “buy” something and it was for the M component of Awaken so I could awaken the rangers panther companion. And even then the DM just said I had it available.
We don’t go shopping in town swapping out gear etc. like we did in the 80’s (characters XP was earned by how much GP you got)
And I personally haven’t complained once about boring travel. He makes it interesting when it needs to be.
As for a cantrip resource, I wouldn’t want it. I don’t need an AD&D magic-user that resorted to their dagger (with their d4 hit die for HP) to run into melee because they used up all their spells. I’ve done that plenty of times in the past with a trail of dead PC’s to prove it.
I think to clarify, the party are now at level 6/7 we have been doing the tracking ammo bit up to now because money and resources where tight, but, they have just received about 8000 gold each as rewards for completing the first major milestone of the campaign (killing the Aboleth that has been plaguing the area since they where level 1), so tracking arrows is not a concern of mine now, I had already told them, buy a big bundle and don't worry too much about tracking, every now and then i will just ask the party to chuck a few gold in to cover what has been used, (out of a party of 8 4 are bow users currently). This particular player however from a RP perspective wanted to know if there was a solution, or a magic item they could buy in my world to cover that situation. I have magic shops and magic items are all over the place to be found or bought by the party, he had returned back to his home (elven town that exists in the material and the Fey Wild) and asked if there where 2 things available to buy there, Bracers of Archery (which was a yes they are there, cost you 1500) and a quiver or bow that doesn't require ammunition. I am going to save the dragon bow from Fizbangs which I didn't know about until this thread because the next major fight they will have at about level 8 will be their first Dragon battle and that bow looks perfect to put in the treasure trove there.
I don't use random encounters, in the sense that I roll dice and consult a table to see what shows up
I do use "random" encounters, in the sense that they aren't directly part of whatever quest or mission the party might be on at the time, but they do still have a purpose -- filling in the world around the party, introducing an NPC who might become important later, that sort of thing
No, it's not like writing a novel, but it is part of telling a story. Truly random fights don't further the story
Active characters:
Carric Aquissar, elven wannabe artist in his deconstructionist period (Archfey warlock)
Lan Kidogo, mapach archaeologist and treasure hunter (Knowledge cleric)
Mardan Ferres, elven private investigator obsessed with that one unsolved murder (Assassin rogue)
Xhekhetiel, halfling survivor of a Betrayer Gods cult (Runechild sorcerer/fighter)
My current game is real time 55 sessions 4 hours a session, and the party just made level 6. It took them a year of real time to get to the first BBEG (an Aboleth) I completely understand your point but for me all those random encounters, including a bear fight, feed into the feel of the land and the game, and every encounter has a purpose. For instance at the start of the campaign the party had random encounters with Wolves and Owl bears as they where trying to find and rescue someone from a bandit cave. The Bandits had moved into the area and upset the food chain meaning that the wolves and owl bears where more willing to take the risk of attacking the party because they where hungry. In fact I told one of the party members, an elf ranger from the area, after the 3rd encounter like this, that it seemed that something was up as normally these types of encounters would not happen. Once the bandits where dealt with then a few moths later of game time an NPC mentioned in passing that the ways through the forest seemed less dangerous and wild beasts seemed to be leaving the locals alone more.
i never use the stock standard random encounter tables, if i am using one I make my own for the specific area, it helps t explain the route the party have taken or the chance of a thing crossing there path on the way. It is still a random table, but it might only apply once in the entire campaign.
So I never use a generic random encounter table, I make a table based on where they are, but I do get my players to roll and then the table shifts and changes based on what they have already rolled, so, some things (getting lost, bad weather) can come up multiple times but certain encounters will just happen once, and if encounter A happens then it might trigger encounter B 3 days later (if they are still travelling). I find it is a bit more fun for me in terms of being a bit on the fly with my prose (I only ever bullet point things) then having a straight 12 day journey already scouted out. That doesn't mean I won't have fixed events happen regardless of what the players roll on certain days.
But I would say, random fights can be a very fun useful experiance, I run milestone so it isn't about gaining XP but, if the party have just levelled up then a couple of random encounters letting them feel out new spells, skills and abilities, or use a new magic item, can be really rewarding for players and does not need to remotely advance the story. Sometimes as well players just want a session with a bit of hitting of stuff, which again could just be a random monster they come across but it can be about feeling the flow of the real room as well as the flow of the story.
I guess it comes down to how you want to play and, yes, when you only get to play for 3 hours once per month you might not be that interested in tracking items, or the DM rolling for random encounters every day of travel.
We always tracked this stuff in AD&D. But the group and DM I play with now, not so much. We really don’t even bother tracking treasure, except magic items. Early on we had an adventure where we recovered a lot of gold and gems. It went into the party’s bag of holding and if someone wants something they moneys just there. We don’t even split it among the PC’s. It’s just a party slush fund. Although at level 13 only once was there a need to “buy” something and it was for the M component of Awaken so I could awaken the rangers panther companion. And even then the DM just said I had it available.
We don’t go shopping in town swapping out gear etc. like we did in the 80’s (characters XP was earned by how much GP you got)
And I personally haven’t complained once about boring travel. He makes it interesting when it needs to be.
As for a cantrip resource, I wouldn’t want it. I don’t need an AD&D magic-user that resorted to their dagger (with their d4 hit die for HP) to run into melee because they used up all their spells. I’ve done that plenty of times in the past with a trail of dead PC’s to prove it.
EZD6 by DM Scotty
https://www.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/397599/EZD6-Core-Rulebook?