I am speaking to officially published lore used in officially published settings and adventures, homebrew well is homebrew and that really comes down to an agreement between those at that particular table.
Not sure if this was acknowledged in there or not, but official lore is also an agreement between those at that particular table. Except you cannot discuss it with the author. Plus, since official lore does not involve those specific PC's and how they, specifically, react to and interact with anything from official lore, it becomes effectively homebrew pretty much instantly.
I think you are conflating homebrew and house rules, or are they the same thing?
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
CENSORSHIP IS THE TOOL OF COWARDS and WANNA BE TYRANTS.
We'll never get a no-lore core book because the lore is the thing they can copyright. It's actually not possible (at least in the United States) to copyright the rules of a game. This makes it very hard for whoever owns the D&D IP to sue someone producing a set of rules that is very obviously based on D&D; it's very easy, by contrast, to sue someone who uses the word "Illithid" without permission. Thus the flavor text you find peppered throughout the PHB is actually serving an important financial purpose. The lore is DRM.
I must say I am absolutely excited about the 2024 PHB with the class revisions we saw in the Unearth Arcana. The feedback was listened to and the content I saw was pretty stellar the last few months.
Seeing 3rd party Dungeon Dudes Drakenheim and 3rd party Humblewood on Dndbeyond was absolutely unexpected and very refreshing. I greatly appreciate those two publishers getting the additional exposure. It was a great move and very reassuring.
Does the content need to be better in the campaigns they present? Yes. Do they need to re-evaluate the approach from long 10 lvl books to a return to the shorter 3 to 4 level serials? Perhaps. But I am no way dismayed or worried about WoTC.
I worry about Hasbro and Chris Cocks. That guys clueless.
We'll never get a no-lore core book because the lore is the thing they can copyright.
While the exact boundaries on what can be copyrighted in this context has never been litigated and is best described as unclear, there's quite a bit more than lore that can be copyrighted. The core problem is that rules cannot be copyrighted, but expressions of rules can be (with certain caveats), and the border between those two is not well defined.
I am speaking to officially published lore used in officially published settings and adventures, homebrew well is homebrew and that really comes down to an agreement between those at that particular table.
Not sure if this was acknowledged in there or not, but official lore is also an agreement between those at that particular table. Except you cannot discuss it with the author. Plus, since official lore does not involve those specific PC's and how they, specifically, react to and interact with anything from official lore, it becomes effectively homebrew pretty much instantly.
I think you are conflating homebrew and house rules, or are they the same thing?
Any content player/DM/3rd party made up is homebrew.
Fair, what about disregarding certain content?
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
CENSORSHIP IS THE TOOL OF COWARDS and WANNA BE TYRANTS.
<snip> Lore in the PHB and other books aimed at players is different. A couple of campaigns ago I was trying to get my players onboarded during Session 0 and passed around the PHB, Xanathar’s, and Volo’s guide so people could create their characters and was utterly taken aback when a few of my friends created characters based on the lore and were subsequently very disappointed when I had to inform them that the lore in my world was different. It made me feel shitty.
<snip>
OT
That's why I like to create a campaign summary to give to the players as a first step. Explain species in your world; how Elves are barbaric eco terrorists, at least as far as the tyrannical halfing overlords are concerned. Classes which are not allowed or need GM approval. Optional rules and/or house rules which are being used. Which source material may be used. Et al.
Homebrew vs. house rules
I tend to view 'homebrew' as setting/background info: Elves are barbaric vs. house rules are mechanics based, e.g. in my game on a crit the first die/dice set always does full damage and you only roll for the additional. I'm by no means insisting I'm right, just how I use those terms. :-)
I'd like them to stop adding content in adventure books (talking about races, classes and feats). Now we have sourcebooks that barely have any source material and adventures with some little content. Make it a normal sourcebook/compendium like xanathar/phb/mordenkainen series, ...
And please no more half assed books like spelljammer
I'd like them to stop adding content in adventure books (talking about races, classes and feats). Now we have sourcebooks that barely have any source material and adventures with some little content. Make it a normal sourcebook/compendium like xanathar/phb/mordenkainen series, ...
And please no more half assed books like spelljammer
i dunno, i see plenty of utility in adding a race or two to adventures (like Witchlight) and then later scooping up a year's worth in some folio (or several years worth in a mordenkainen's). in this way you get more bang for your buck if you buy the adventure, you have the option to buy the race (or whatever) piece-meal digitally if all you want is the one thing right away, and maybe the devs aren't encouraged to rush out a splat book (like spelljammer) alongside the adventure just for those races (or feats or whatever). it's one thing to have a setting book come with a thin adventure (to show off it's features), it's another thing for an adventure to come with a thin setting pamphlet (to explain some things that didn't fit in the margins?).
...although, honestly, i think there'll be more Bigby's style books (no adventure, many hooks) than Spelljammer books in the future. but my same pattern recognition that gets me through highway traffic and office water cooler talk in an election year without wrecking seems to be less well calibrated to handle interpolation from wizards of the coast data points.
...what above post said, plus (for me) the wider issue seems to be the player base. I'd love to blame mobile phones, twitter and media in general, but I think that WOTC's just going with the trend here - nobody reads (much) anymore. That seems to be the demographic WOTC are going for - people that zone out after a few minutes of reading. "Nerd" isn't a culture anymore, it's a t-shirt slogan and I can't blame WOTC for leaning into it (cheaper/more profitable). I can't name a single 5e publication that's done anything to spur my imagination other than the odd reminder that I've got the 2nd/3rd/4th edition version of that book and "I'll need to dig that out to look for the Lore". I'm running my final D&D Campaign and when it wraps I'll move on to another system to GM.
This. This right here. Totally agree.
Been playing D&D since 1st edition and played every edition since. What you said above is exactly what's been happening and why, sadly.
I've got two separate 5e games going, but when those wrap, I'm going to be moving on to a different system as well. Likely Zweihander, to put the grit back in my games. Either way, I don't see it being D&D anymore.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Shawn D. Robertson
"Deride not the differing views of others, for it is in thoughtful and considerate conversation we find our greatest friends."
That was great. RIP. I'm an old guy - been playing since the 80s expert box set. AD&D was awesome - the classic adventures riveting (I6 ravenloft, the UK series, Sourge of the Slavelords, Queen of the DemonWeb pits, etc...). Awesome. 2e was great too. Then stopped , got weird with "tana'ari, and ba'atezu" instead of devils and demons. 5e picked up again, now were seeing the slide. VTT is dead.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
I think you are conflating homebrew and house rules, or are they the same thing?
CENSORSHIP IS THE TOOL OF COWARDS and WANNA BE TYRANTS.
We'll never get a no-lore core book because the lore is the thing they can copyright. It's actually not possible (at least in the United States) to copyright the rules of a game. This makes it very hard for whoever owns the D&D IP to sue someone producing a set of rules that is very obviously based on D&D; it's very easy, by contrast, to sue someone who uses the word "Illithid" without permission. Thus the flavor text you find peppered throughout the PHB is actually serving an important financial purpose. The lore is DRM.
I must say I am absolutely excited about the 2024 PHB with the class revisions we saw in the Unearth Arcana. The feedback was listened to and the content I saw was pretty stellar the last few months.
Seeing 3rd party Dungeon Dudes Drakenheim and 3rd party Humblewood on Dndbeyond was absolutely unexpected and very refreshing. I greatly appreciate those two publishers getting the additional exposure. It was a great move and very reassuring.
Does the content need to be better in the campaigns they present? Yes. Do they need to re-evaluate the approach from long 10 lvl books to a return to the shorter 3 to 4 level serials? Perhaps. But I am no way dismayed or worried about WoTC.
I worry about Hasbro and Chris Cocks. That guys clueless.
While the exact boundaries on what can be copyrighted in this context has never been litigated and is best described as unclear, there's quite a bit more than lore that can be copyrighted. The core problem is that rules cannot be copyrighted, but expressions of rules can be (with certain caveats), and the border between those two is not well defined.
Fair, what about disregarding certain content?
CENSORSHIP IS THE TOOL OF COWARDS and WANNA BE TYRANTS.
OT
That's why I like to create a campaign summary to give to the players as a first step. Explain species in your world; how Elves are barbaric eco terrorists, at least as far as the tyrannical halfing overlords are concerned. Classes which are not allowed or need GM approval. Optional rules and/or house rules which are being used. Which source material may be used. Et al.
Homebrew vs. house rules
I tend to view 'homebrew' as setting/background info: Elves are barbaric vs. house rules are mechanics based, e.g. in my game on a crit the first die/dice set always does full damage and you only roll for the additional. I'm by no means insisting I'm right, just how I use those terms. :-)
I'd like them to stop adding content in adventure books (talking about races, classes and feats). Now we have sourcebooks that barely have any source material and adventures with some little content. Make it a normal sourcebook/compendium like xanathar/phb/mordenkainen series, ...
And please no more half assed books like spelljammer
i dunno, i see plenty of utility in adding a race or two to adventures (like Witchlight) and then later scooping up a year's worth in some folio (or several years worth in a mordenkainen's). in this way you get more bang for your buck if you buy the adventure, you have the option to buy the race (or whatever) piece-meal digitally if all you want is the one thing right away, and maybe the devs aren't encouraged to rush out a splat book (like spelljammer) alongside the adventure just for those races (or feats or whatever). it's one thing to have a setting book come with a thin adventure (to show off it's features), it's another thing for an adventure to come with a thin setting pamphlet (to explain some things that didn't fit in the margins?).
...although, honestly, i think there'll be more Bigby's style books (no adventure, many hooks) than Spelljammer books in the future. but my same pattern recognition that gets me through highway traffic and office water cooler talk in an election year without wrecking seems to be less well calibrated to handle interpolation from wizards of the coast data points.
unhappy at the way in which we lost individual purchases for one-off subclasses, magic items, and monsters?
tell them you don't like features disappeared quietly in the night: provide feedback!
I agree completely, keep sourcebooks as hubs for additional races/subclasses and leave adventure modules as pre-written quests.
This. This right here. Totally agree.
Been playing D&D since 1st edition and played every edition since. What you said above is exactly what's been happening and why, sadly.
I've got two separate 5e games going, but when those wrap, I'm going to be moving on to a different system as well. Likely Zweihander, to put the grit back in my games. Either way, I don't see it being D&D anymore.
Shawn D. Robertson
"Deride not the differing views of others, for it is in thoughtful and considerate conversation we find our greatest friends."
~Me~
That was great. RIP. I'm an old guy - been playing since the 80s expert box set. AD&D was awesome - the classic adventures riveting (I6 ravenloft, the UK series, Sourge of the Slavelords, Queen of the DemonWeb pits, etc...). Awesome. 2e was great too. Then stopped , got weird with "tana'ari, and ba'atezu" instead of devils and demons. 5e picked up again, now were seeing the slide. VTT is dead.