That's why I am waiting on the official response. It doesn't make sense if two blind people are fighting to say "oh they cancel out so it's normal attacks". That would mean they are no longer 'blind". And to everyone they are in combat like they see each other. Which is incredibly dumb. IMO
There is no shortage of RAW that doesn't make sense. This isn't a close call, it's quite clearly how the rules work.
Partly I'd assume this is because that was considered an edge case scenario; how often has anyone actually had a case where both sides of a fight are blinded? Plus, it keeps play moving when the field is equal, rather than stalling things out with a bunch of additional misses on both sides.
Not seeing someone and not knowing where someone is are two separate issues. Advantage and disadvantage cancelling out is under the assumption that the attacker is attacking the correct position, whether that's from knowing where the target is or just getting lucky picking a random spot.
Partly I'd assume this is because that was considered an edge case scenario; how often has anyone actually had a case where both sides of a fight are blinded? Plus, it keeps play moving when the field is equal, rather than stalling things out with a bunch of additional misses on both sides.
You've never had two characters without dark vision fighting at night?
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If you're not willing or able to to discuss in good faith, then don't be surprised if I don't respond, there are better things in life for me to do than humour you. This signature is that response.
Sage questions for when SAC starts accepting questions:
1) Blindsight: If you have Blindsight and the caster cast fog cloud on you, but they are outside the fog, can you pierce through the fog and see the caster? Or is Blindsight like an off on switch, meaning it overrides your natural sight until you leave the fog? Seems kind of silly because then people can fire missiles at you with advantage from the outside.
2) Darkness: If you and another creature, fight in the dark wouldn't you both have disadvantage, since you don't know each other's position? Some believe that since you also have advantage when attacking someone can't see you/know your position, that both disadvantage and advantage cancel each other out. But if that happens, it would be like you weren't in darkness anymore.
2) RAW, in that scenario, you won't have disadvantage or advantage. They cancel out. Some traits, features, feats or spells could help you see through darkness to turn things in your favor.
That's why I am waiting on the official response. It doesn't make sense if two blind people are fighting to say "oh they cancel out so it's normal attacks". That would mean they are no longer 'blind". And to everyone they are in combat like they see each other. Which is incredibly dumb. IMO
I could agree it's not common sense, but it's not about "seeing each other", it's just a consequence of how Advantage/Disadvantage works. It a simple mechanic, so it can lead to this kind of behavior.
In another place I left my personal opinion about having some modifiers included in the rules like those in AD&D or 3e, at least as a guideline for DMs, could help give a slight advantage to one side or the other.
Anyway, an official response is always welcome for sure.
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There is no shortage of RAW that doesn't make sense. This isn't a close call, it's quite clearly how the rules work.
Partly I'd assume this is because that was considered an edge case scenario; how often has anyone actually had a case where both sides of a fight are blinded? Plus, it keeps play moving when the field is equal, rather than stalling things out with a bunch of additional misses on both sides.
I wasn't asking a question, just waiting for the official response from SAC.
Not seeing someone and not knowing where someone is are two separate issues. Advantage and disadvantage cancelling out is under the assumption that the attacker is attacking the correct position, whether that's from knowing where the target is or just getting lucky picking a random spot.
You've never had two characters without dark vision fighting at night?
If you're not willing or able to to discuss in good faith, then don't be surprised if I don't respond, there are better things in life for me to do than humour you. This signature is that response.
I could agree it's not common sense, but it's not about "seeing each other", it's just a consequence of how Advantage/Disadvantage works. It a simple mechanic, so it can lead to this kind of behavior.
In another place I left my personal opinion about having some modifiers included in the rules like those in AD&D or 3e, at least as a guideline for DMs, could help give a slight advantage to one side or the other.
Anyway, an official response is always welcome for sure.