This may seem like a fairly basic question. I’ve always wondered about the best way to handle this to make it a believable player experience.
I imagine that Medieval combat sounds like part zoo, part mosh pit, and part car wreck, all with a bit of shrieking added in, just for feels. It’s loud. I mean, really loud.
You are the DM. Your players engage with a group of What-its in a room. How far will the sound of that combat extend? D&D is fantasy, it’s true, but realistically I’m certain that I could hear a a$$kicking being administered by a gang of heroes on a group of villains at 500 feet. Where do you draw the audible line?
Realistically... any dungeon you can reasonably fit on a map is small enough that combat will be pretty obvious anywhere in the dungeon, and thus any encounter becomes "and then you fight the entire dungeon". However, that's usually conveniently ignored, because it means that if you want multiple encounters, you either have to have multiple maps or some special explanation for why it doesn't get noticed.
I like the table. For those that want more think about sound from the physics point of view. It’s a wall of air moving outwards at 760 mph but it’s energy/loudness follows the inverse square law - double the distance 1/4 the energy/volume (welcome to why the moshe pit is so loud but the back top rows are often conversational at concerts). Then you add all the bends, doorways etc that breakup the sound and it’s not surprising that sound that might travel hundreds of feet in a straight line outside barely makes it past 50 ft in a dungeon.
I have had the same thought about sound, especially in Dungeons that are man-made as the surfaces tend to be smoother and would echo sounds down corridors.
I have created a few One-Shots for our group of players that take this into account, and I'll inform them through DM-Speak with statements like "As you make your way down the corridor, you can hear your footsteps echo off of the walls. You get the impression that sound in this dungeon travels far, and if you are attacked that noise might alert other creatures" (or something along those lines).
Some of the players would get the meaning, and others either didn't care or didn't get the suggestion.
In some one-shots they will try and stay quiet, and others not so much. If they are glaringly loud, I'll have monsters that I thought would have heard the commotion come join the fight.
Now, with that said, not all Monsters will join the fight if they hear it at a distance. You have to look at what kind of monster is it. Would it defend it's territory, either by advancing or taking a position closer to the fight to see what comes out of it, and then attack? Is it intelligent enough to hear the fight, create a trap and lie-in-wait? Would it be scared and move further into the Dungeon? Etc.
There was one of these One-Shots that ended in a TPK as they alerted the entire dungeon to their presence, and almost everyone joined in (depending on distance they came in at different initiative counts, etc).
I don't use any of this for pre-made adventures unless something in the module is mentioned about it.
Breathe, dragons; sing of the First World, forged out of chaos and painted with beauty. Sing of Bahamut, the Platinum, molding the shape of the mountains and rivers; Sing too of Chromatic Tiamat, painting all over the infinite canvas. Partnered, they woke in the darkness; partnered, they labored in acts of creation.
Its not really that straightforward. Sound will travel further in a stone dungeon that in one of dirt walls. Doors will have an impact. Twists and turns, and ups and downs as well. Ambient and other noise will impact things. So you have to apply some level of common sense.
Agreed. In situations where I ( as a player) Don’t want to alert others I often cast silence - at the far end of the foe. If placed right it tends to force the foe’s casters closer to the melee while blocking the battle sounds from carrying into areas not cleared.
I can't see the table Ace linked to, unfortunately. I'd be very curious to know what it says, however I am not "upgrading" to 5e 2024 as of now.
For me, I follow this rule of thumb, assuming the dungeon/cave system/castle/etc is basically comprised of a series of "rooms" and "hallways":
If the party is attempting to be quiet/stealthy, noises they make are only heard in the room they are in (this excludes combat unless anyone casts the Silence spell or something similar.
If the party is in a room and in combat or does something that makes an average "loud" noise (dropping something, knocking something over, etc) it can be heard in the room they are in and all rooms connected to the room they are in by a door (this includes hallways).
If the party is in a hallway and in combat or does something that makes an average "loud" noise (dropping something, knocking something over, etc) it can be heard in each room connected to that stretch of hallway (given a reasonable length of hallway, not like a 100 yard-long hallway), where a stretch of hallway is the section of hallway between two corners. It can also be heard in the (potentially) two stretches of hallways connected to the hallway the party is in, but not the rooms in those connected hallways.
For things like Thunderwave or very loud noises, they can be heard much farther, and in general is probably a "the entire dungeon comes looking for you" situation.
*edited to remove picture (not working) and add context for extremely loud noises.
The table is basically, roll 2d6 and multiply it by a number of feet depending on whether it's quiet, normal or loud.
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If you're not willing or able to to discuss in good faith, then don't be surprised if I don't respond, there are better things in life for me to do than humour you. This signature is that response.
For me it is so variable based on the dungeon. Not much noise is getting through 3 feet of stone imo. But if there is a obvious path or tunnel with no doors etc to the next creature it will travel pretty far.
The other questions is what are the monsters in the dungeon doing? If you've got a bunch of orcs that are drinking and brawling with each other, the dungeon is likely to be pretty noisy. If there's an iron golem guarding a doorway, that's really quiet. An iron golem patrolling a corridor that has stone floors is the opposite of quiet.
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Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.
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This may seem like a fairly basic question. I’ve always wondered about the best way to handle this to make it a believable player experience.
I imagine that Medieval combat sounds like part zoo, part mosh pit, and part car wreck, all with a bit of shrieking added in, just for feels. It’s loud. I mean, really loud.
You are the DM. Your players engage with a group of What-its in a room. How far will the sound of that combat extend? D&D is fantasy, it’s true, but realistically I’m certain that I could hear a a$$kicking being administered by a gang of heroes on a group of villains at 500 feet. Where do you draw the audible line?
I’d appreciate your thoughts and ideas. Thanks!
Realistically... any dungeon you can reasonably fit on a map is small enough that combat will be pretty obvious anywhere in the dungeon, and thus any encounter becomes "and then you fight the entire dungeon". However, that's usually conveniently ignored, because it means that if you want multiple encounters, you either have to have multiple maps or some special explanation for why it doesn't get noticed.
They actually provide a table for sound radiating in the new DMG here.
I like the table. For those that want more think about sound from the physics point of view. It’s a wall of air moving outwards at 760 mph but it’s energy/loudness follows the inverse square law - double the distance 1/4 the energy/volume (welcome to why the moshe pit is so loud but the back top rows are often conversational at concerts). Then you add all the bends, doorways etc that breakup the sound and it’s not surprising that sound that might travel hundreds of feet in a straight line outside barely makes it past 50 ft in a dungeon.
Wisea$$ DM and Player since 1979.
Greetings Kgbuller,
I have had the same thought about sound, especially in Dungeons that are man-made as the surfaces tend to be smoother and would echo sounds down corridors.
I have created a few One-Shots for our group of players that take this into account, and I'll inform them through DM-Speak with statements like "As you make your way down the corridor, you can hear your footsteps echo off of the walls. You get the impression that sound in this dungeon travels far, and if you are attacked that noise might alert other creatures" (or something along those lines).
Some of the players would get the meaning, and others either didn't care or didn't get the suggestion.
In some one-shots they will try and stay quiet, and others not so much. If they are glaringly loud, I'll have monsters that I thought would have heard the commotion come join the fight.
Now, with that said, not all Monsters will join the fight if they hear it at a distance.
You have to look at what kind of monster is it.
Would it defend it's territory, either by advancing or taking a position closer to the fight to see what comes out of it, and then attack?
Is it intelligent enough to hear the fight, create a trap and lie-in-wait?
Would it be scared and move further into the Dungeon?
Etc.
There was one of these One-Shots that ended in a TPK as they alerted the entire dungeon to their presence, and almost everyone joined in (depending on distance they came in at different initiative counts, etc).
I don't use any of this for pre-made adventures unless something in the module is mentioned about it.
Hope this helps :)
Cheers!
Breathe, dragons; sing of the First World, forged out of chaos and painted with beauty.
Sing of Bahamut, the Platinum, molding the shape of the mountains and rivers;
Sing too of Chromatic Tiamat, painting all over the infinite canvas.
Partnered, they woke in the darkness; partnered, they labored in acts of creation.
Its not really that straightforward. Sound will travel further in a stone dungeon that in one of dirt walls. Doors will have an impact. Twists and turns, and ups and downs as well. Ambient and other noise will impact things. So you have to apply some level of common sense.
Agreed. In situations where I ( as a player) Don’t want to alert others I often cast silence - at the far end of the foe. If placed right it tends to force the foe’s casters closer to the melee while blocking the battle sounds from carrying into areas not cleared.
Wisea$$ DM and Player since 1979.
I can't see the table Ace linked to, unfortunately. I'd be very curious to know what it says, however I am not "upgrading" to 5e 2024 as of now.
For me, I follow this rule of thumb, assuming the dungeon/cave system/castle/etc is basically comprised of a series of "rooms" and "hallways":
For things like Thunderwave or very loud noises, they can be heard much farther, and in general is probably a "the entire dungeon comes looking for you" situation.
*edited to remove picture (not working) and add context for extremely loud noises.
The table is basically, roll 2d6 and multiply it by a number of feet depending on whether it's quiet, normal or loud.
If you're not willing or able to to discuss in good faith, then don't be surprised if I don't respond, there are better things in life for me to do than humour you. This signature is that response.
In Homebrew it's up to the DM. Adventure modules will specifically say who hears what, depending on the activity.
For me it is so variable based on the dungeon. Not much noise is getting through 3 feet of stone imo. But if there is a obvious path or tunnel with no doors etc to the next creature it will travel pretty far.
The other questions is what are the monsters in the dungeon doing? If you've got a bunch of orcs that are drinking and brawling with each other, the dungeon is likely to be pretty noisy. If there's an iron golem guarding a doorway, that's really quiet. An iron golem patrolling a corridor that has stone floors is the opposite of quiet.
Find your own truth, choose your enemies carefully, and never deal with a dragon.
"Canon" is what's factual to D&D lore. "Cannon" is what you're going to be shot with if you keep getting the word wrong.