This thread is a technical discussion about the Rules As Written. Everyone agrees that the DM has "Rule Zero" to override any rule that feels less useful or less fun to a particular table. At the same time, it is a fallacy to say that Rule Zero means that less useful or less clear Rules As Written dont need updates or clarifications.
Many DMs prefer to play according to the Rules As Written. I prefer to do so. Heh, I think of Rule Zero as the nuclear option, a last resort if the Rules As Written seem unworkable for a particular setting concept or play style.
In the spirit of myself and other forumers, enjoy the game in any way you and your players wish.
The simple fact is, we disagree on the functional part of the language in the rules for Custom Lineage for determining ones race(not repeating that part here as it would be a copy paste of my previous posts). You will not get a definitive answer on these forums because Wizards of the Coast are not involved in these forums. If you want clarification from wizards of the coast, the closest you will get short of an errata is an answer from sage advice.
For running your game in a vacuum where you don't have an official clarification, it sounds like you have made your personal ruling and have been given feedback from your peers on either side of the topic. I am not convinced of your stated interpretation of RAW and you are not convinced of mine, this is fine as in a conflict like this whoever is running the game gets priority on any ruling.
"Next month, we’ll get back to our regular questions and answers, and we’ll begin compiling my most relevant rules answers from Twitter. If you have questions for a future installment of Sage Advice, please send them to sageadvice@wizards.com."
RAW, I would interpret that as Custom Lineage is its own thing and wholly separate from an existing game's race, thus disqualifying it from being able to take racial feats specific to the game's race. It does not say it is allowing you to customize an existing race and allowing it to qualify for their racial feat. And it does not mention ignoring the qualifications of racial feats.
I agree "Custom Lineage" is its own thing. However, I disagree it is "wholly separate" from race.
Note, the technical term "race" is being used to mean two different things. • Race as an origin category, alongside other origin categories of ability scores, class, and background. • Race as a particular kind of race, such as elf, dwarf, and dragonborn.
There is a difference in meaning because Custom Lineage allows the player to control the origin-race category. The player can decide to create a new race to fill the slot for the race category. But the player can even fill the race category with something that is not a race.
Ultimately, it appears the origin categories are: • ability scores • lineage (!) • class • background
Then, a player can use a race as their lineage, or use something else as their lineage.
Some forumers view "lineage" as a subset of race, so that lineage itself is its own kind of official weird miscellaneous race, alongside other official races like elf, dwarf, and dragonborn.
However, I view lineage as the bigger category. The race is a subset of lineage. The lineage can be a race like an elf or dwarf, but the lineage can also be a non-race like like werewolf, mutant, experiment, magical ritual, or so on. Lineage is a big category that includes many kinds of subsets to choose from.
Custom Lineage allows the player to choose something else instead of "one of the game's races". A variant race isnt a "game's" race. For example, a variant elf isnt "game's" elf. Thus a player can use Custom Lineage to create a variant elf. This variant elf character is still an "elf" even if not the "elf" that the game describes. Thus the variant elf can qualify for a feat that prerequires "elf" as the lineage of the character.
The spirit of the rules in Tashas is to end any unintentionally "racist" rules. The purpose of the tools in the Tashas is to empower the player to control the concept of race and even to jettison it. The goal is for the player to have a character that the reallife player can be comfortable with. The fact that Xanathars continues to have such race-based rules, seems to be an oversight, due to more attention looking at the Players Handbook. I suspect, in the future, we will never see an other feat that prerequires a race.
Despite WotC being hesitant to implement errata, I hope to see an erratum that removes the race prerequisites from the Xanathars feats, similar to the way that an erratum removed the race prequisite from the Bladesinger Wizard subclass. Thus, the erratum would remove any confusion about the Xanathars feats.
Even so, it is possible to read the Tashas rules in a way that Custom Lineage can access the Xanathars feats now. This ability to override race rules appears to be the intent of the game designers who wrote the rules.
If you bring 'the spirit of the rules' into it, this is hardly a technical discussion of the rules as written.
Technically, the only thing that appears to matter is if choosing your creature type includes a humanoid subtype (race) or not. The rules don't tell you what you can't do, they tell you what you can do. Custom Lineage tells you there are exactly 7 things you can do. Nothing else. Choosing the creature type is the only thing that might allow you to make a character with a custom lineage a member of a specific race. If that doesn't allow it, custom lineage doesn't allow it. Technically, as written, period.
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Want to start playing but don't have anyone to play with? You can try these options: [link].
Discussing the spirit of the rules, as well as the original intent of the rules, can sometimes be useful when interpreting ambiguous rules.
In this case, the writers of these rules as still alive and will presumably write more rules in the future.
So interpreting current rules in a way that is coherent with future rules still to come, seems useful enough.
In any case, the Rules As Written allow the player to create a variant "elf" that isnt the "game's" elf (as the game officially describes elf), and that can qualify for an elf feat.
Technically, the only thing that appears to matter is if choosing your creature type includes a humanoid subtype (race) or not. ... Choosing the creature type is the only thing that might allow you to make a character with a custom lineage a member of a specific race. If that doesn't allow it, custom lineage doesn't allow it. Technically, as written, period.
Custom Lineage allows a "creature type" that is a "humanoid" ... that has a "kin".
This "kin" can be a race, such as elf. Or a subrace, such as "high elf". Or the kin can be something else instead of a race, such as a magical transformation that others might have undergone.
1) Discussing the spirit of the rules, as well as the original intent of the rules, can sometimes be useful when interpreting ambiguous rules.
In this case, the writers of these rules as still alive and will presumably write more rules in the future.
So interpreting current rules in a way that is coherent with future rules still to come, seems useful enough.
2) In any case, the Rules As Written allow the player to create a variant "elf" that isnt the "game's" elf (as the game officially describes elf), and that can qualify for an elf feat.
1) It's not particularly useful for determining what the actual rule is with definite certainty, particularly when the spirit of the rules is a bit nebulus to begin with.
2) If that were true in any case, why did you create this thread?
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Want to start playing but don't have anyone to play with? You can try these options: [link].
Technically, the only thing that appears to matter is if choosing your creature type includes a humanoid subtype (race) or not. ... Choosing the creature type is the only thing that might allow you to make a character with a custom lineage a member of a specific race. If that doesn't allow it, custom lineage doesn't allow it. Technically, as written, period.
Custom Lineage allows a "creature type" that is a "humanoid" ... that has a "kin".
This "kin" can be a race, such as elf. Or a subrace, such as "high elf". Or the kin can be something else instead of a race, such as a magical transformation that others might have undergone.
Being able to choose to look like your "Kin" does not impart any of the rules of being that race, If it did then why wouldn't you benefit from everything else that race has to offer such as Fey Ancestry?
That being said, there is no rules for "Kin" in any of the books that have been published.
Also there is no possible way for Custom Lineage to be used to create a subrace.
Also there is no possible way for Custom Lineage to be used to create a subrace.
If high elf is the character's origin, then there is both a race and a subrace. Some races require the player to select a subrace. Here the elf race is kin, and specifically the high subrace is kin.
A player can create a new subrace. For example, if the origin is "sky elf", then the character has the elf race as kin, and specifically the sky subrace as kin. Since the player wants this sky elf to be a separate subrace, the character isnt wood elf, high elf, eladrin, sea elf, shadar-kai, nor so on. The player wants sky elf to be its own subrace of elf.
The mechanics of this character is normal: +2 ability score, feat, plus skill/darkvision.
That being said, there is no rules for "Kin" in any of the books that have been published.
Tashas introduces three new technical terms: "origin", "lineage", and "kin".
In context, "kin" is the group that shares the same "lineage", whether the lineage is a race, subrace, or some comparable aspect of ones "origin".
"Origin" includes the basic building blocks to build a character concept: abilities, lineage (whether race, subrace, or something else), class, and background.
Being able to choose to look like your "Kin" does not impart any of the rules of being that race, if it did, then why wouldn't you benefit from everything else that race has to offer such as Fey Ancestry?
If your custom lineage is stout halfling, then your origin is stout halfling. The halfling race and the stout subrace are your kin.
However, you control how this origin shapes you. In other words, you decide your own mechanics by choosing your own feat etcetera to build your character concept.
If you want a halfling race feat from Xanathars, you qualify because your origin and kin are the halfling race. You are a halfling.
However, you can be medium size if you want, because you dont need to resemble other halflings − even tho you yourself are a halfling. Whether you choose to be small or medium size, your speed is 30, not 25.
You dont get the halfling feature to hide behind other characters, unless there is a feat that grants this, and you choose this for your custom lineage feat.
None of that is supported by anything published in TCoE.
The word Kin is used once as part of a what your physical description may be. It is not in any way a technical term.
Origin is the sum total of the Race, Class, Background etc. and it little more than another word for character.
Subrace is a well established term in D&D 5e and has a specific meaning with in the rules. Elf, Dwarf, Halfling and Gnome are examples of races. High, Wood and Drow are sub races of Elf. Without a Primary race you can't have a sub race. Custom Lineage is a Primary race choice that does not have a subrace option.
Also, you are only a Stout Halfling if you select Halfling and then the subrace of Stout. Changing the name of Custom Lineage to Stout Halfling does not alter the rules for Custom Lineage which are limited to exactly what is in the blue box.
None of that is supported by anything published in TCoE.
The word Kin is used once as part of a what your physical description may be. It is not in any way a technical term.
Origin is the sum total of the Race, Class, Background etc. and it little more than another word for character.
Subrace is a well established term in D&D 5e and has a specific meaning with in the rules. Elf, Dwarf, Halfling and Gnome are examples of races. High, Wood and Drow are sub races of Elf. Without a Primary race you can't have a sub race. Custom Lineage is a Primary race choice that does not have a subrace option.
Also, you are only a Stout Halfling if you select Halfling and then the subrace of Stout. Changing the name of Custom Lineage to Stout Halfling does not alter the rules for Custom Lineage which are limited to exactly what is in the blue box.
In its context, "kin" is a technical term in the same way that "creature type" and "humanoid" are technical terms.
In the case where the origin is high elf, both the primary race elf is "kin" and the subrace high elf is "kin".
Wrong, Creature type and Humanoid are well defined within the rules of D&D.
The information on what Creature Type means with in the rules of D&D can be found on page 6 of the Monster Manual and Humanoid can be found on page 7.
Tashas introduces new nomenclature to the rules of D&D 5e.
These new terms are in technical contexts and have technical meanings.
For example, instead of a "race", you gain a "lineage" that controls the "origin".
The terms "lineage" and "origin" are as technical as the term "race".
The technical term "kin" refers to the technical term "lineage".
So the "technical term" kin in D&D doesn't refer to a half-elf's human and elven parents, or more generally speaking to any family member related to a character but from a different lineage? Or am I missing something?
edit: to skip ahead a step already, what's the technical definition of 'kin'? Not this 'refers to' bit, please be specific and if possible cite the text.
In the Monster Manual, every "humanoid" creature type includes a "tag". The tag is normally a race, such as: "humanoid (elf)". But there are also other kinds of tags, such as "humanoid (human, shapechanger)".
In any case, there is no such thing as a "generic humanoid". Every humanoid has a tag specifying its kin.
Thus it is impossible to be "humanoid" without specifying a "race" as part of the tag, except that custom lineage allows the player to invent a new kind of tag, instead of a race, if the player wants. For example, a player who wants can choose to have "humanoid (shapeshifter)", and count shapeshifters as kin.
With regard to Custom Lineage, being a humanoid must also specify the race (or something comparable) with this "kin" adding parenthetically as a tag.
The reference to kin means race and subrace, or something else comparable to this instead.
Where kin refers to a race, it can also include a subrace, if any.
In the Monster Manual, the entry mentions the subrace when relevant. An entry can mention the subrace and even the class, both of which are part of the origin. Subrace is part of the lineage. For example, "Drow humanoid (elf)", "Drow Mage humanoid (elf)". Elsewhere we have "Githyanki Gish humanoid (gith)".
Note, in the Monster Manual, in Appendix B, many of the Non-Player Characters list as "humanoid (any race)". This term "(any race)" corroborates that being humanoid also requires a more specific race (or some comparable tag). But also. Where the entry is the NPC "Archmage humanoid (any race)" this requirement of "any race" can be a "high elf Archmage", thus this mention of "race" also includes the possibility of a more specific subrace, if any.
With regard to a custom lineage, this lineage must be human and must have a race (or something comparable instead) and can specify a subrace for a race that divides up by subrace.
An example of a lineage is: Eladrin humanoid (elf). All members of the group that share this lineage are a "kin".
Everything you just posted about "Kin" is made up by you not WotC. You can't use your homebrew to make rulings on RAW. The reason you can't quote an actual rule for "Kin" is because it does not exist. Everything you said, you made up on your own. It is not in ANY book.
No where does is say under Humanoid on page 8 of the monster manual that the tag is required. No where under Custom Lineage does it provide you with a tag beyond humanoid as that is all that matters in this case.
Lineage is always used in conjunction with being related to something, however, being related to something does not confer any abilities that are not explicitly stated within the entries that the word appears. This is most notable in Sorcerers as Lineage is commonly used when referring to a character's blood line/source of magic.
At this point you must realize that your literally making this up. You haven't directly quoted any rule from the book in regards to Kin or Lineage. The only new term that has been defined in TCoE is Origin and it is just another word for Character.
In the Monster Manual, every "humanoid" creature type must include a "tag". The tag is normally a race, such as: "humanoid (elf)". But there are also other kinds of tags, such as "humanoid (human, shapechanger)".
In any case, there is no such thing as a "generic humanoid". Every humanoid has a tag specifying its kin.
PCs play by a very different and much more restrictive set of rules compared to NPCs and monsters. NPCs and monsters can be built however the GM wants, and GMs are only limited by their imagination. PCs on the other hand follow a very strict guideline, and they can only have more freedom with their builds if the GM allows.
Custom Lineage uses the generic humanoid tag. It does not say you can be humanoid (elf) or humanoid (Aarakora). You can only be generic humanoid. In addition to that, it does not say you are your kin, it only says you are free to choose your appearance to resemble whoever you want.
Actually, now that you mentioned the tag thing, I am pretty certain now that RAW disallows Custom Lineage taking racial feats. Mechanically, Custom Lineage does not have the qualifying racial tag.
With regard to Custom Lineage, being a humanoid must also specify the race (or something comparable) with this "kin" adding parenthetically as a tag.
The reference to kin means race and subrace, or something else comparable to this instead.
Where kin refers to a race, it can also include a subrace, if any.
In the Monster Manual, the entry mentions the subrace when relevant. An entry can mention the subrace and even the class, both of which are part of the origin. Subrace is part of the lineage. For example, "Drow humanoid (elf)", "Drow Mage humanoid (elf)". Elsewhere we have "Githyanki Gish humanoid (gith)".
Note, in the Monster Manual, in Appendix B, many of the Non-Player Characters list as "humanoid (any race)". This term "(any race)" corroborates that being humanoid also requires a more specific race (or some comparable tag). But also. Where the entry is the NPC "Archmage humanoid (any race)" this requirement of "any race" can be a "high elf Archmage", thus this mention of "race" also includes the possibility of a more specific subrace, if any.
Custom Lineage does NOT say humanoid (any race). If anything, it ONLY says humanoid, and you cannot add any racial tag to it. The only thing it specifies is that "instead of choosing one of the game's races", meaning Custom Lineage is disqualified from being one of the game's existing races, at least from a mechanical standpoint. Appearance and flavor wise, you can make Custom Lineage look like an elf, but mechanically speaking, it does not qualify as an elf.
With regard to a custom lineage, this lineage must be human and must have a race (or something comparable instead) and can specify a subrace for a race that divides up by subrace.
An example of a lineage is: Eladrin humanoid (elf). All members of the group that share this lineage are a "kin".
From how I read the rules, Custom Lineage must be humanoid, BUT it has to be a humanoid with no racial tag, or else it would have put (any race) in there. Nowhere does the rules state that you are allowed to put (any race) tag in there. If anything, putting a racial tag in there would be homebrew and definitely not RAW.
The sentence from Tasha's which uses the word "kin".
Your elf might not have the keen senses associated with your kin and could take proficiency in a different skill, such as Performance.
This suggests that the newly created origin is an Elf, but different from the "standard" published elf.
Good quote. Here "kin" means "race", elf.
No, Kin mean relative and nothing more. It does not have any mechanical bearing on the rules of the game. You could create a character that is related to a Dwarf, Elf, Kobold and a Bugbear, but you are not any of those things within the rules as they currently stand.
In the Monster Manual, every "humanoid" creature type must include a "tag". The tag is normally a race, such as: "humanoid (elf)". But there are also other kinds of tags, such as "humanoid (human, shapechanger)".
In any case, there is no such thing as a "generic humanoid". Every humanoid has a tag specifying its kin.
PCs play by a very different and much more restrictive set of rules compared to NPCs and monsters. NPCs and monsters can be built however the GM wants, and GMs are only limited by their imagination. PCs on the other hand follow a very strict guideline, and they can only have more freedom with their builds if the GM allows.
Custom Lineage uses the generic humanoid tag. It does not say you can be humanoid (elf) or humanoid (Aarakora). You can only be generic humanoid. In addition to that, it does not say you are your kin, it only says you are free to choose your appearance to resemble whoever you want.
Actually, now that you mentioned the tag thing, I am pretty certain now that RAW disallows Custom Lineage taking racial feats. Mechanically, Custom Lineage does not have the qualifying racial tag.
With regard to Custom Lineage, being a humanoid must also specify the race (or something comparable) with this "kin" adding parenthetically as a tag.
The reference to kin means race and subrace, or something else comparable to this instead.
Where kin refers to a race, it can also include a subrace, if any.
In the Monster Manual, the entry mentions the subrace when relevant. An entry can mention the subrace and even the class, both of which are part of the origin. Subrace is part of the lineage. For example, "Drow humanoid (elf)", "Drow Mage humanoid (elf)". Elsewhere we have "Githyanki Gish humanoid (gith)".
Note, in the Monster Manual, in Appendix B, many of the Non-Player Characters list as "humanoid (any race)". This term "(any race)" corroborates that being humanoid also requires a more specific race (or some comparable tag). But also. Where the entry is the NPC "Archmage humanoid (any race)" this requirement of "any race" can be a "high elf Archmage", thus this mention of "race" also includes the possibility of a more specific subrace, if any.
Custom Lineage does NOT say humanoid (any race). If anything, it ONLY says humanoid, and you cannot add any racial tag to it. The only thing it specifies is that "instead of choosing one of the game's races", meaning Custom Lineage is disqualified from being one of the game's existing races, at least from a mechanical standpoint. Appearance and flavor wise, you can make Custom Lineage look like an elf, but mechanically speaking, it does not qualify as an elf.
With regard to a custom lineage, this lineage must be human and must have a race (or something comparable instead) and can specify a subrace for a race that divides up by subrace.
An example of a lineage is: Eladrin humanoid (elf). All members of the group that share this lineage are a "kin".
From how I read the rules, Custom Lineage must be humanoid, BUT it has to be a humanoid with no racial tag, or else it would have put (any race) in there. Nowhere does the rules state that you are allowed to put (any race) tag in there. If anything, putting a racial tag in there would be homebrew and definitely not RAW.
As mentioned above (which might not be on your screen yet if without refreshing).
The technical term "kin", can specifically mean the "elf" race.
Tashas (page 8) "Your elf [ = elf race] might not have the keen senses associated with your kin [ = elf race]."
Thus.
"Custom Lineage ... Creature type. You are humanoid. You determine ... whether you resemble your kin."
Custom lineage grants the character the humanoid creature type, along with a more specific "kin", such as the elf race.
A player using Custom Lineage to control the lineage can choose the "elf" race as ones "kin".
In other words, you are an elf humanoid, who may or may not resemble other elf humanoids.
The simple fact is, we disagree on the functional part of the language in the rules for Custom Lineage for determining ones race(not repeating that part here as it would be a copy paste of my previous posts). You will not get a definitive answer on these forums because Wizards of the Coast are not involved in these forums. If you want clarification from wizards of the coast, the closest you will get short of an errata is an answer from sage advice.
For running your game in a vacuum where you don't have an official clarification, it sounds like you have made your personal ruling and have been given feedback from your peers on either side of the topic. I am not convinced of your stated interpretation of RAW and you are not convinced of mine, this is fine as in a conflict like this whoever is running the game gets priority on any ruling.
Here is the e-mail to reach out to from the official dnd site(from a quick google, im sure someone has a more recent link with the e-mail/twitter):https://dnd.wizards.com/articles/features/sage-advice-june2015
"Next month, we’ll get back to our regular questions and answers, and we’ll begin compiling my most relevant rules answers from Twitter. If you have questions for a future installment of Sage Advice, please send them to sageadvice@wizards.com."
If you bring 'the spirit of the rules' into it, this is hardly a technical discussion of the rules as written.
Technically, the only thing that appears to matter is if choosing your creature type includes a humanoid subtype (race) or not. The rules don't tell you what you can't do, they tell you what you can do. Custom Lineage tells you there are exactly 7 things you can do. Nothing else. Choosing the creature type is the only thing that might allow you to make a character with a custom lineage a member of a specific race. If that doesn't allow it, custom lineage doesn't allow it. Technically, as written, period.
Want to start playing but don't have anyone to play with? You can try these options: [link].
Discussing the spirit of the rules, as well as the original intent of the rules, can sometimes be useful when interpreting ambiguous rules.
In this case, the writers of these rules as still alive and will presumably write more rules in the future.
So interpreting current rules in a way that is coherent with future rules still to come, seems useful enough.
In any case, the Rules As Written allow the player to create a variant "elf" that isnt the "game's" elf (as the game officially describes elf), and that can qualify for an elf feat.
he / him
Custom Lineage allows a "creature type" that is a "humanoid" ... that has a "kin".
This "kin" can be a race, such as elf. Or a subrace, such as "high elf". Or the kin can be something else instead of a race, such as a magical transformation that others might have undergone.
he / him
1) It's not particularly useful for determining what the actual rule is with definite certainty, particularly when the spirit of the rules is a bit nebulus to begin with.
2) If that were true in any case, why did you create this thread?
Want to start playing but don't have anyone to play with? You can try these options: [link].
Being able to choose to look like your "Kin" does not impart any of the rules of being that race, If it did then why wouldn't you benefit from everything else that race has to offer such as Fey Ancestry?
That being said, there is no rules for "Kin" in any of the books that have been published.
Also there is no possible way for Custom Lineage to be used to create a subrace.
She/Her Player and Dungeon Master
If high elf is the character's origin, then there is both a race and a subrace. Some races require the player to select a subrace. Here the elf race is kin, and specifically the high subrace is kin.
A player can create a new subrace. For example, if the origin is "sky elf", then the character has the elf race as kin, and specifically the sky subrace as kin. Since the player wants this sky elf to be a separate subrace, the character isnt wood elf, high elf, eladrin, sea elf, shadar-kai, nor so on. The player wants sky elf to be its own subrace of elf.
The mechanics of this character is normal: +2 ability score, feat, plus skill/darkvision.
Tashas introduces three new technical terms: "origin", "lineage", and "kin".
In context, "kin" is the group that shares the same "lineage", whether the lineage is a race, subrace, or some comparable aspect of ones "origin".
"Origin" includes the basic building blocks to build a character concept: abilities, lineage (whether race, subrace, or something else), class, and background.
If your custom lineage is stout halfling, then your origin is stout halfling. The halfling race and the stout subrace are your kin.
However, you control how this origin shapes you. In other words, you decide your own mechanics by choosing your own feat etcetera to build your character concept.
If you want a halfling race feat from Xanathars, you qualify because your origin and kin are the halfling race. You are a halfling.
However, you can be medium size if you want, because you dont need to resemble other halflings − even tho you yourself are a halfling. Whether you choose to be small or medium size, your speed is 30, not 25.
You dont get the halfling feature to hide behind other characters, unless there is a feat that grants this, and you choose this for your custom lineage feat.
he / him
None of that is supported by anything published in TCoE.
The word Kin is used once as part of a what your physical description may be. It is not in any way a technical term.
Origin is the sum total of the Race, Class, Background etc. and it little more than another word for character.
Subrace is a well established term in D&D 5e and has a specific meaning with in the rules. Elf, Dwarf, Halfling and Gnome are examples of races. High, Wood and Drow are sub races of Elf. Without a Primary race you can't have a sub race. Custom Lineage is a Primary race choice that does not have a subrace option.
Also, you are only a Stout Halfling if you select Halfling and then the subrace of Stout. Changing the name of Custom Lineage to Stout Halfling does not alter the rules for Custom Lineage which are limited to exactly what is in the blue box.
She/Her Player and Dungeon Master
In its context, "kin" is a technical term in the same way that "creature type" and "humanoid" are technical terms.
In the case where the origin is high elf, both the primary race elf is "kin" and the subrace high elf is "kin".
he / him
Wrong, Creature type and Humanoid are well defined within the rules of D&D.
The information on what Creature Type means with in the rules of D&D can be found on page 6 of the Monster Manual and Humanoid can be found on page 7.
She/Her Player and Dungeon Master
Tashas introduces new nomenclature to the rules of D&D 5e.
These new terms are in technical contexts and have technical meanings.
For example, instead of a "race", you gain a "lineage" that controls the "origin".
The terms "lineage" and "origin" are as technical as the term "race".
The technical term "kin" refers to the technical term "lineage".
he / him
Provide the exact quote where it defines Lineage and Kin in TCoE. Not your definition, but the official one published by WotC.
She/Her Player and Dungeon Master
So the "technical term" kin in D&D doesn't refer to a half-elf's human and elven parents, or more generally speaking to any family member related to a character but from a different lineage? Or am I missing something?
edit: to skip ahead a step already, what's the technical definition of 'kin'? Not this 'refers to' bit, please be specific and if possible cite the text.
Want to start playing but don't have anyone to play with? You can try these options: [link].
In the Monster Manual, every "humanoid" creature type includes a "tag". The tag is normally a race, such as: "humanoid (elf)". But there are also other kinds of tags, such as "humanoid (human, shapechanger)".
In any case, there is no such thing as a "generic humanoid". Every humanoid has a tag specifying its kin.
Thus it is impossible to be "humanoid" without specifying a "race" as part of the tag, except that custom lineage allows the player to invent a new kind of tag, instead of a race, if the player wants. For example, a player who wants can choose to have "humanoid (shapeshifter)", and count shapeshifters as kin.
With regard to Custom Lineage, being a humanoid must also specify the race (or something comparable) with this "kin" adding parenthetically as a tag.
The reference to kin means race and subrace, or something else comparable to this instead.
Where kin refers to a race, it can also include a subrace, if any.
In the Monster Manual, the entry mentions the subrace when relevant. An entry can mention the subrace and even the class, both of which are part of the origin. Subrace is part of the lineage. For example, "Drow humanoid (elf)", "Drow Mage humanoid (elf)". Elsewhere we have "Githyanki Gish humanoid (gith)".
• Entry Format: [Subrace] [Class] humanoid ([race]).
Note, in the Monster Manual, in Appendix B, many of the Non-Player Characters list as "humanoid (any race)". This term "(any race)" corroborates that being humanoid also requires a more specific race (or some comparable tag). But also. Where the entry is the NPC "Archmage humanoid (any race)" this requirement of "any race" can be a "high elf Archmage", thus this mention of "race" also includes the possibility of a more specific subrace, if any.
With regard to a custom lineage, this lineage must be human and must have a race (or something comparable instead) and can specify a subrace for a race that divides up by subrace.
An example of a lineage is: Eladrin humanoid (elf). All members of the group that share this lineage are a "kin".
he / him
The sentence from Tasha's which uses the word "kin".
This suggests that the newly created origin is an Elf, but different from the "standard" published elf.
Good quote. Here "kin" means "race", elf.
he / him
Everything you just posted about "Kin" is made up by you not WotC. You can't use your homebrew to make rulings on RAW. The reason you can't quote an actual rule for "Kin" is because it does not exist. Everything you said, you made up on your own. It is not in ANY book.
No where does is say under Humanoid on page 8 of the monster manual that the tag is required. No where under Custom Lineage does it provide you with a tag beyond humanoid as that is all that matters in this case.
Lineage is always used in conjunction with being related to something, however, being related to something does not confer any abilities that are not explicitly stated within the entries that the word appears. This is most notable in Sorcerers as Lineage is commonly used when referring to a character's blood line/source of magic.
At this point you must realize that your literally making this up. You haven't directly quoted any rule from the book in regards to Kin or Lineage. The only new term that has been defined in TCoE is Origin and it is just another word for Character.
She/Her Player and Dungeon Master
PCs play by a very different and much more restrictive set of rules compared to NPCs and monsters. NPCs and monsters can be built however the GM wants, and GMs are only limited by their imagination. PCs on the other hand follow a very strict guideline, and they can only have more freedom with their builds if the GM allows.
Custom Lineage uses the generic humanoid tag. It does not say you can be humanoid (elf) or humanoid (Aarakora). You can only be generic humanoid. In addition to that, it does not say you are your kin, it only says you are free to choose your appearance to resemble whoever you want.
Actually, now that you mentioned the tag thing, I am pretty certain now that RAW disallows Custom Lineage taking racial feats. Mechanically, Custom Lineage does not have the qualifying racial tag.
Custom Lineage does NOT say humanoid (any race). If anything, it ONLY says humanoid, and you cannot add any racial tag to it. The only thing it specifies is that "instead of choosing one of the game's races", meaning Custom Lineage is disqualified from being one of the game's existing races, at least from a mechanical standpoint. Appearance and flavor wise, you can make Custom Lineage look like an elf, but mechanically speaking, it does not qualify as an elf.
From how I read the rules, Custom Lineage must be humanoid, BUT it has to be a humanoid with no racial tag, or else it would have put (any race) in there. Nowhere does the rules state that you are allowed to put (any race) tag in there. If anything, putting a racial tag in there would be homebrew and definitely not RAW.
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No, Kin mean relative and nothing more. It does not have any mechanical bearing on the rules of the game. You could create a character that is related to a Dwarf, Elf, Kobold and a Bugbear, but you are not any of those things within the rules as they currently stand.
She/Her Player and Dungeon Master
As mentioned above (which might not be on your screen yet if without refreshing).
The technical term "kin", can specifically mean the "elf" race.
Tashas (page 8) "Your elf [ = elf race] might not have the keen senses associated with your kin [ = elf race]."
Thus.
"Custom Lineage ... Creature type. You are humanoid. You determine ... whether you resemble your kin."
Custom lineage grants the character the humanoid creature type, along with a more specific "kin", such as the elf race.
A player using Custom Lineage to control the lineage can choose the "elf" race as ones "kin".
In other words, you are an elf humanoid, who may or may not resemble other elf humanoids.
he / him