First-time homebrewer here. I'm thinking about making submarines a major part of a homebrew campaign I'm planning, and I'm wondering how I should handle that. Any homebrew mechanics I should add? How should I deal with attacks on submerged subs? As a reference, the campaign is set in an era where steam power is slowly replacing sailing ships, and the goal of the campaign is to be semi-realistic. That means that the submarine has no sonar, and all targeting must be made at periscope depth. The plan is that (at least for most of the campaign) the party will not be in one of these, and the submarines will instead serve as the main antagonistical force, using Major Image to make their attacks on passenger/shipping/military vessels look like strikes from sea monsters. I can provide what details I have come up with if that helps.
Thank you,
Flamboyant
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Tank, submarine, plane, and D&D nerd. I'm just here for the forum games and maybe some D&D every once in a while.
First thing: your players are going to try their hardest to get their hands on a submarine as soon as they know they exist. They will succeed. (Unless you use DM fiat to block all their clever plans.)
The underwater combat, object HP, and damage threshold rules are all going to get a major workout, and you're going to learn that they're mediocre. (They're very simple, which makes sense given their low importance.) You'll either have to homebrew better ones or live with them. (I strongly suggest learning to live with them.) You will need to make rules for flooding of submarines as they take damage. Keep them simple. (Possibly as simple as "subs have low HP, which represents not when they're destroyed, but when they're damaged enough to flood.")
In addition to what the above posters said, I’ll point out that lots of spells and abilities require you to be able to see the target, so decide how you want to handle that— can they see it at periscope depth? How deep before they lose sight of it from the deck?
Underwater rules are pretty bare bones, besides fire damage being halved. People often want, for example, lightning bolt or electrical attacks to be conducted through the water, so make decisions there.
Adding in depth is, effectively like adding in flight in you having a 3rd dimension. Many rules get confusing, defy all logic or just plain fall apart in 3 dimensions, so be ready for those complications.
Also, with vehicles in general, what is effectively the ground ( the deck of the ship) is moving, so if you cast a spell like, say, wall of fire on the ship, but then the ship moves, does the wall stay anchored to the deck of the ship, or does it stay in place as the ship moves through it? (Personally, I go with anchored to the ship, but you’ll need to decide how for yourself.)
In addition to what the above posters said, I’ll point out that lots of spells and abilities require you to be able to see the target, so decide how you want to handle that— can they see it at periscope depth? How deep before they lose sight of it from the deck?
Underwater rules are pretty bare bones, besides fire damage being halved. People often want, for example, lightning bolt or electrical attacks to be conducted through the water, so make decisions there.
Adding in depth is, effectively like adding in flight in you having a 3rd dimension. Many rules get confusing, defy all logic or just plain fall apart in 3 dimensions, so be ready for those complications.
Also, with vehicles in general, what is effectively the ground ( the deck of the ship) is moving, so if you cast a spell like, say, wall of fire on the ship, but then the ship moves, does the wall stay anchored to the deck of the ship, or does it stay in place as the ship moves through it? (Personally, I go with anchored to the ship, but you’ll need to decide how for yourself.)
First thing: your players are going to try their hardest to get their hands on a submarine as soon as they know they exist. They will succeed. (Unless you use DM fiat to block all their clever plans.)
The underwater combat, object HP, and damage threshold rules are all going to get a major workout, and you're going to learn that they're mediocre. (They're very simple, which makes sense given their low importance.) You'll either have to homebrew better ones or live with them. (I strongly suggest learning to live with them.) You will need to make rules for flooding of submarines as they take damage. Keep them simple. (Possibly as simple as "subs have low HP, which represents not when they're destroyed, but when they're damaged enough to flood.")
Thank you for the tips!
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Tank, submarine, plane, and D&D nerd. I'm just here for the forum games and maybe some D&D every once in a while.
First thing: your players are going to try their hardest to get their hands on a submarine as soon as they know they exist. They will succeed.
Why precisely would they even want a submarine? And why do you feel they'll automatically succeed? At the very least, it feels like it would depend on a high number of variables. Like their level, and the difficulty of entering the sub, and the amount of time they have before it dives =)
Anyways, in my homebrew campaign dwarves have subs. Goblins kinda do too, but well ... the goblins kinda understand steam power, and that's a little complicated underwater. The dwarves have a basic battery technology, so theirs are kinda more clever, but with rather suboptimal range. So the dwarves have treadmills to (re-)generate power if they have to stay under, and steam apparatus to do so while surfaced. Goblins - mostly to spite the dwarves - also work on submarines, but ... well, theirs don't work because you can't really run a steam engine without an exhaust, and they can't get that working underwater.
Humans who feel the need to travel under water would magic it in my world.
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Blanket disclaimer: I only ever state opinion. But I can sound terribly dogmatic - so if you feel I'm trying to tell you what to think, I'm really not, I swear. I'm telling you what I think, that's all.
First thing: your players are going to try their hardest to get their hands on a submarine as soon as they know they exist. They will succeed.
Why precisely would they even want a submarine?
Because it's shiny, and I've met players. I've even been one.
More importantly, when a DM says "the plan is that the players won't have thing X", that DM needs to plan for the contingency that the players will get thing X well before they're supposed to.
And why do you feel they'll automatically succeed?
They have the ability to be persistent, clever, and they have access to a wide variety of spells and other powers.
Because it's shiny, and I've met players. I've even been one.
More importantly, when a DM says "the plan is that the players won't have thing X", that DM needs to plan for the contingency that the players will get thing X well before they're supposed to.
I have been one too. But also, I've had players encounter a sub, and they weren't even curious. Of course, it was in a river, to kind of a limited usage situation. Still, they didn't even check it out.
Furthermore, they could have had it for all I care, and that would just have opened new possible paths. It was an open world game, so ... all bet's are on.
They have the ability to be persistent, clever, and they have access to a wide variety of spells and other powers.
Sure. But it's also level dependent, no? A steel hull is pretty damn hard to breach if you're below level 9 or so, and the crew inside are taking active countermeasures. Such as diving. Breaching an steel hull you want to be able to use after is even harder.
Anyways, it's not that I don't see your point, at all - it just seems like the truth is a bit more variable =)
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Blanket disclaimer: I only ever state opinion. But I can sound terribly dogmatic - so if you feel I'm trying to tell you what to think, I'm really not, I swear. I'm telling you what I think, that's all.
Just to throw out an option. Combine magical with technological options. Each Submarine is slightly different as the "base" for each sub is an aquatic creature. Ships, akin to whaling fleets, go out and kill some large critter such as a whale and bring it back where the magical folks get to work adding armour plates, living quaters inside it, weapons etc. Particularly fearsome beasties, such as Krakens, make for extra special submarines as they have innate weapons and defenses which can be utilised. You could also probably usurp the spelljammer ships and rebrand them as submarines with a bit of homebrewing.
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Hello,
First-time homebrewer here. I'm thinking about making submarines a major part of a homebrew campaign I'm planning, and I'm wondering how I should handle that. Any homebrew mechanics I should add? How should I deal with attacks on submerged subs? As a reference, the campaign is set in an era where steam power is slowly replacing sailing ships, and the goal of the campaign is to be semi-realistic. That means that the submarine has no sonar, and all targeting must be made at periscope depth. The plan is that (at least for most of the campaign) the party will not be in one of these, and the submarines will instead serve as the main antagonistical force, using Major Image to make their attacks on passenger/shipping/military vessels look like strikes from sea monsters. I can provide what details I have come up with if that helps.
Thank you,
Flamboyant
Tank, submarine, plane, and D&D nerd. I'm just here for the forum games and maybe some D&D every once in a while.
For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.-John 3:16
First thing: your players are going to try their hardest to get their hands on a submarine as soon as they know they exist. They will succeed. (Unless you use DM fiat to block all their clever plans.)
The underwater combat, object HP, and damage threshold rules are all going to get a major workout, and you're going to learn that they're mediocre. (They're very simple, which makes sense given their low importance.) You'll either have to homebrew better ones or live with them. (I strongly suggest learning to live with them.) You will need to make rules for flooding of submarines as they take damage. Keep them simple. (Possibly as simple as "subs have low HP, which represents not when they're destroyed, but when they're damaged enough to flood.")
The Apparatus of Kwalish magic item can function as a sub. Maybe look at it for ideas?
In addition to what the above posters said, I’ll point out that lots of spells and abilities require you to be able to see the target, so decide how you want to handle that— can they see it at periscope depth? How deep before they lose sight of it from the deck?
Underwater rules are pretty bare bones, besides fire damage being halved. People often want, for example, lightning bolt or electrical attacks to be conducted through the water, so make decisions there.
Adding in depth is, effectively like adding in flight in you having a 3rd dimension. Many rules get confusing, defy all logic or just plain fall apart in 3 dimensions, so be ready for those complications.
Also, with vehicles in general, what is effectively the ground ( the deck of the ship) is moving, so if you cast a spell like, say, wall of fire on the ship, but then the ship moves, does the wall stay anchored to the deck of the ship, or does it stay in place as the ship moves through it? (Personally, I go with anchored to the ship, but you’ll need to decide how for yourself.)
Thank you for the tips!
Tank, submarine, plane, and D&D nerd. I'm just here for the forum games and maybe some D&D every once in a while.
For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.-John 3:16
Why precisely would they even want a submarine? And why do you feel they'll automatically succeed? At the very least, it feels like it would depend on a high number of variables. Like their level, and the difficulty of entering the sub, and the amount of time they have before it dives =)
Anyways, in my homebrew campaign dwarves have subs. Goblins kinda do too, but well ... the goblins kinda understand steam power, and that's a little complicated underwater. The dwarves have a basic battery technology, so theirs are kinda more clever, but with rather suboptimal range. So the dwarves have treadmills to (re-)generate power if they have to stay under, and steam apparatus to do so while surfaced. Goblins - mostly to spite the dwarves - also work on submarines, but ... well, theirs don't work because you can't really run a steam engine without an exhaust, and they can't get that working underwater.
Humans who feel the need to travel under water would magic it in my world.
Blanket disclaimer: I only ever state opinion. But I can sound terribly dogmatic - so if you feel I'm trying to tell you what to think, I'm really not, I swear. I'm telling you what I think, that's all.
Because it's shiny, and I've met players. I've even been one.
More importantly, when a DM says "the plan is that the players won't have thing X", that DM needs to plan for the contingency that the players will get thing X well before they're supposed to.
They have the ability to be persistent, clever, and they have access to a wide variety of spells and other powers.
I have been one too. But also, I've had players encounter a sub, and they weren't even curious. Of course, it was in a river, to kind of a limited usage situation. Still, they didn't even check it out.
Furthermore, they could have had it for all I care, and that would just have opened new possible paths. It was an open world game, so ... all bet's are on.
Sure. But it's also level dependent, no? A steel hull is pretty damn hard to breach if you're below level 9 or so, and the crew inside are taking active countermeasures. Such as diving. Breaching an steel hull you want to be able to use after is even harder.
Anyways, it's not that I don't see your point, at all - it just seems like the truth is a bit more variable =)
Blanket disclaimer: I only ever state opinion. But I can sound terribly dogmatic - so if you feel I'm trying to tell you what to think, I'm really not, I swear. I'm telling you what I think, that's all.
Just to throw out an option. Combine magical with technological options. Each Submarine is slightly different as the "base" for each sub is an aquatic creature. Ships, akin to whaling fleets, go out and kill some large critter such as a whale and bring it back where the magical folks get to work adding armour plates, living quaters inside it, weapons etc. Particularly fearsome beasties, such as Krakens, make for extra special submarines as they have innate weapons and defenses which can be utilised. You could also probably usurp the spelljammer ships and rebrand them as submarines with a bit of homebrewing.