Once when I was about fourteen a couple of players used foul sorcery to get crits whenever they wanted to. They had one d20 lying on a 20 just beyond the DM screen, rolled another identical D20 which they snatched away through said damnable sorcery and then when I lifted the DM screen to look, it was a crit.

Since then I haven't had any player who I seriously suspected of cheating with dice. Until now, that is. I will not go into any detail about the player right now but what he or she does is probably this: he/she picks up the d20 to "look at the result" (the numbers are not filled in properly on it) right after making the roll, thus making the roll invalid-- at least that's how I see it. I believe he/she then simply makes up a result that suits him/her.

I'm thinking of forcing this player to roll a d20 with highly contrasting numbers in the center of the table, and then tell him/her that if she touches the die, the roll doesn't count.

What would you do? Have you encountered players who do this sort of thing?  

Here's one big question to ask before making a decision I would say; is this player having more favorable outcomes with this than failures or less than favorable outcomes? Or does the outcome seem much less random than it should? If so, then I would ask them to either get a new set of dice that can be more easily read and/or if they do not want to purchase new die, offer one to them. Or you could even just pick them up a new set of dice and gift it to them as a gesture of saying "Hey, I know that you've been having a difficult time reading your d20, so I thought perhaps you might like a new set." Just an option, but if things seem balanced it is very possibly just that they cannot read the dice numbers. In which case, see my above suggestion of being a nice person and providing them with something that is easier for them to see.

I have only really dealt with a cheating player once, thankfully, and it was on PbP format over at the Paizo forums. They would make a post that might contain an important die roll, see if the roll was the outcome the preferred, and then if it was not they would delete the post and make a new post with a new die roll result. I confronted that player with my suspicions and they confirmed it and were quite apologetic. I let the player know that sort of behavior was unacceptable at my online tables and if I caught them doing it again they would be ousted.

People make mistakes from time to time for various reasons. I have found that sometimes walking softly with the big stick can garner better results than bashing someone over the head with it.

A fundamental tenet of D&D is trust. 

If you can't trust your player(s) are rolling honestly, recording correctly, and not abusing your trust, then something has gone wrong. It works both ways; if players suspect the DM is 'out to get them', then there's a breakdown in the relationship. 

In your shoes, I would highlight the fact that you and your players are on the same team. It's a shared experience, a narrative that's shaped by individual decisions, and sometimes random outcomes on a dice. This isn't a game that can be 'won' in the traditional sense, and 'beating' the DM should never be the objective.

If the suspected player is cheating, then they've lost sight of the purpose of playing D&D, and they'd be better off playing a game with do-overs and save games.

With the philosophical bit out of the way. Some practical advice would be to privately chat with the other players - ask if they've seen anything suspicious, and if not, to keep an eye on the rolls. They'll be just as interested in keeping things honest.

Rolling in the centre of the table would be fine, but you don't want to impose rules that slow things down, punish everyone, or make an the atmosphere one of mistrust; it'll only make everyone feel scrutinised. Better to nip the behaviour in the bud.

Ultimately, cheating is an alien concept in D&D, because it misses the point. I'd tackle that mindset before imposing practical solutions. If you do discover he's definitely cheating, I'd seriously consider whether he's the type of player you want at your table.

Quote from Chequers >>

A fundamental tenet of D&D is trust. 

If you can't trust your player(s) are rolling honestly, recording correctly, and not abusing your trust, then something has gone wrong. It works both ways; if players suspect the DM is 'out to get them', then there's a breakdown in the relationship. 

In your shoes, I would highlight the fact that you and your players are on the same team. It's a shared experience, a narrative that's shaped by individual decisions, and sometimes random outcomes on a dice. This isn't a game that can be 'won' in the traditional sense, and 'beating' the DM should never be the objective.

If the suspected player is cheating, then they've lost sight of the purpose of playing D&D, and they'd be better off playing a game with do-overs and save games. 

 

 I've discussed the things you're talking about with my brother and several other DM:s. I've basically come to the conclusion that while I as DM am not out to get the PCs, the antagonists and sometimes the entire environment (if they're in a dungeon type situation) is sometimes out to get them. For me the dice are there to make that part of the experience feel fair or at least impersonal for the players. Its that conflict which is still making D&D progress I think; are we in a sandbox playing together, or is this a tabletop game for competing adults?

I also agree that 'cheating is an alien concept in D&D' and I believe that is why I've only seen it a handful of times, ever.

Quote from DMsven >>

I've basically come to the conclusion that while I as DM am not out to get the PCs, the antagonists and sometimes the entire environment (if they're in a dungeon type situation) is sometimes out to get them. 

Absolutely - and that's the key distinction. You want to create a world, creatures and encounters that will offer the PCs a real, satisfying challenge; where bad choices or rolls can lead to dire consequences, and the environment feels genuinely dangerous.

But then you want to celebrate with the players when they overcome it. 

I hope you manage to resolve the situation you're in with your player.

I would consider why the would cheat as well. If its in combat, just to do more damage, is it because they don't feel that their heroes actually are heroic enough? Perhaps introduce hero points (DMG)? Is it on skill throws when they fear missing out, like failing on Perception and thinking they won't find something vital? Then perhaps consider home brewing a mechanic of failing forward (like many games today have), where a failed roll does not mean you miss the vital clue, but you pay a price for it (you find the secret door/necessary evidence but trip an alarm, alert the guard etc). 

I never let my players touch the die after rolling it. On my latest session I had a younger player who was on their final death check, who was constantly picking the die up before anyone could see. The problem was easily resolved, though.

I have caught 2 players cheat at my tables over the years and I know as a fact most of my players have fudged the roll on a die in a critical moment at least a couple times. 

The players who've fudged a roll, whatever, people get caught up, they want to look epic, they don't want to let the party down, again, whatever. Minor infractions like that are purely human, and I'm not going to lose any sleep over it. 

The two cheaters however...now that was some fun, and I mean it, fun. Once I realized they were cheating, either by seeing it (one player rolled a one, picked up the die and told me he had a 17), or by having other players tell me (usually after a game), then I would do something about it. I never called the players out, that just creates drama, and I'm not about to deal with it. Instead I would watch, track, and pay attention to what they were rolling (one player never rolled less than a 13 in a years worth of gaming), after getting a feel for what they were doing I'd act. I did something simple, and very easy to play off, mostly because I play behind a screen so the players don't know what's happening, I gave them a negative modifier to all their rolls. 

By giving a straight -5 modifier to every roll that the players had it was enough to balance out the game a bit more. It didn't stop their cheating, it did slow down their effect on the game, and it allowed them to continue playing with their friends. I'm not going to get mad, I'm not going to get hurt, it's not worth my time or effort to get bent out of shape because of it. Instead a simple modifier, hidden behind the screen, to make life a bit more difficult on the cheating rolls. Now, I'm sure not every roll was bad, I'm sure that they gave me the straight rolls when they didn't feel it was important enough to cheat. However, when all is said and done, I'm not going to worry about it until the adventure is over.

That is the last piece of the puzzle, when the adventure is over, or when there is a good time to let a player go, then you approach the situation. One of the players was part of a game at my local shop, I found out later he was a known cheater. When the adventure hit a low point, where there was nothing going on, I put the game on hold, I told the table that I was going to take a break. I then pulled every player aside individually and talked to them about the game, my DMing, and their play styles. A sort of debriefing so that I could get better as a DM, they could learn as players and I could get an overall feel of how things went. The last person was the cheater, and I told him straight up that I caught him cheating and he was no longer allowed at my table again. I didn't offer him any chances to backtrack, give excuses or anything, I simply cut him off from my games. Later, when he apologized to me, I let him back in the game and he was a better player. 

The other player, the one that the table saw was cheating, I had to handle differently. When the game hit a slow point I couldn't just take a break, this game was at my house, every week, with 6 players. Instead I instituted a rule that said when the die hits the table you leave it alone, that took care of most of the problem. The other part of the solution was to have a player keep an eye on the roll since I could not always see it. By having this balance it was easy to keep the player on the honest side since it was that much harder to manipulate the results. It's an imperfect solution, but it mitigated most of the bad rolls and didn't interfere with the pace of the game. With this one I didn't have the chance to say anything to the player, the table got to them first and took care of it for me.

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I hope the situation gets resolved easily and painlessly. The game should be fun for everyone, even the DM, if it gets bad enough someone may have to leave the table. 

That's an interesting solution - my worry is that the party would catch on to what you're doing. For example, if multiple players are attacking an enemy, and the cheater attacks with an "18" (actually a 13 with your secret -5) and misses, but the next player also attacks with an 18 and hits, they'd notice something was up and might get frustrated that you're not being consistent with the enemy's AC (from their perspective).

Good point, and I had resolved that by dealing half damage, I recognize the roll as I would any other attack. It's a tough rule to adhere to, since I really want the players to win, it's their heroic tale after all. By dealing half damage, I figure it averages out the good and bad rolls simultaneously.

I require no touching of dice and to call out your roll before you may pick it back up.I also have everyone's char sheets so I know their mods, spell slots, etc. 

Cheating in life is maddening enough and to cheat at an unwinnable game is beyond stupid. Myself and my table (players watch either other) have no time for it so I am pretty harsh when it happens. Although we are a group of mutual friends one way or another so someone getting called out and embarrassed usually fixes it. But my general rule is

Caught cheating once and you are asked to leave the session. Twice and you are asked to leave the table for good. None of us have the time or patience to deal with it. 

The situation when I was a kid was all in good fun, we were all just being immature and besides, I was a little smart-ass DM back then and I deserved it (I'm still a smart-ass sometimes, regretfully)

But I think cheating at D&D as an adult is a sign of a seriously flawed personality and a lack of understanding of what the game is about, at its core. Another mistake is being what I call a "loot whore" i.e. someone who is always trying to bag all the items and treasure -- even if they really have no use for it. 

Some people are very afraid of conflict and will never really confront abusive players. In some ways this is unfair not just to the group, because it enables them and in the end they turn themselves into hopeless, friendless sociopathic basement dwellers (as I believe you would label people like that overseas)  

Confront your player directly and ask them to stop. Don't do as others suggested and try to be sly by adjusting the outcomes of the cheating player's rolls. The player is likely to catch on, and this is just going to engender even more distrust. Don't bring this up with your other players either, as this isn't their problem to solve. And don't wait until the adventure is over, allowing this problem to fester. Talk to them, address the issue politely, and do so as soon as possible.

But do ask your player why they're cheating. In the very rare case that I've seen this behavior or heard others mention they encountered it in their games, it's often be because the player either doesn't feel their character is heroic enough (having had a particularly bad run of luck with the dice) or because they feel like the DM isn't "playing fair." If it's the former, just discuss it with your player; everyone has bad luck sometimes, and the temptation to "nudge" the dice is definitely there. But if it's the latter, you should seriously consider whether there's anything you've been doing that might have caused this animosity.

While I agree that a player cheating in D&D is violating a fundamental principle of trust, many DMs may not see their own fudging of dice the same way. I'm not saying this is something you're doing, but I have heard of cases where a player started cheating because they felt the DM was railroading them or altering encounters on-the-fly to the detriment of the PCs. Even if the DM isn't doing this, if the players think they are, they might be more inclined to start fudging the dice themselves.

Quote from jreggers >>

 

While I agree that a player cheating in D&D is violating a fundamental principle of trust, many DMs may not see their own fudging of dice the same way. I'm not saying this is something you're doing, but I have heard of cases where a player started cheating because they felt the DM was railroading them or altering encounters on-the-fly to the detriment of the PCs. Even if the DM isn't doing this, if the players think they are, they might be more inclined to start fudging the dice themselves.

 I almost never fudge. In fact, I always roll all the dice straight in front of the players. The reason for this is to make it feel impersonal. I fudged once in that campaign by not adding the damage bonus to the dice roll (if I had, the lvl 1 rogue would have gone down and that would have been catastrophic to the party).

Reinforcements arriving, casters throwing unexpected spells etc. is clearly not fudging, the way I see it. I do this sometimes in the other campaign I run, and the meta-reason for this is to test the nerve and skill of the players. But it makes total sense from a in-world perspective I think. If monsters, characters and encounters deviate from the standard in published material and players object to this, they have also not understood the true spirit of RPGs as I interpret it.  

I think players of most games cheat for their own egotistical reasons, whatever they may be. "If the rules hadn't been unfair, I wouldn't have cheated" sounds like a weak rationalization to me.

I don't doubt that there are players that would do this for no other reason than their own egos, but I have encountered cases where "unfairness" by the DM, whether real or imagined, was a player's justification for this behavior.

I guess my general advice would be, don't assume the absolute worst of your player without talking to them first. Best to broach this discussion with them in a civil way. But if it turns out they're a toxic jerk, by all means do what you have to do.