I'm looking for tips on making combat more engaging! I've found it difficult to incorporate narrative into combat without bogging down the pace. Any help would be awesome!
It really comes down to narrating the action. My group has a few campaigns which we all sue Roll20 for. Last couple of weeks we swapped to whispering all the rolls, so rather than it just being "you hit", we've ended up changing it up to something like the following:
PC: *rolls dice which him and DM see* I swing my short sword up under his guard, twisting to try and catch him under his armor Rest of PCs: *siting there nervously cause they STILL dont know what is happening DM: He doesnt manage to raise his shield in time and you hear a deep grunt as the bugbear snarls. PC: *whispers damage to DM* Rest of PCs: OH GOD, Is he down yet? WHAT IS GOING ON!?
Much better than you hit and do x damage (which then people start trying to calculate how much has been done. We've stopped metagaming a lot just from doing that, and combat jsut got WAY more exciting.
One of the many reasons I'd probably shy away from using Roll20 and other platforms. Honestly I'd probably just do skype, and get the kind of players that I know wouldn't fake die rolls and such.
Best way to make combat more interesting is providing details about what is going on but....
Make sure to add extra things in combat. Have places to hide, ropes to swing from, rocks to fall. Make sure the environment isn't just a typical everyday forest, but maybe add some quicksand.
Make sure the monsters aren't predictable. A goblin with an explosive that runs toward the PCs is something a crazy goblin would do and it is out of the norm. Maybe there is a monk Goblin or a Goblin Cleric. You can also give a Goblin a whip to attack with instead of the same old Sword. Maybe one of the Goblins can rage and take half damage!
Also try to use some unique creatures beyond the standard Goblin, Hobgoblin, Orc, etc. Also making villains 3 dimensional is a good way to make combat more interesting. If you wonder in a dungeon to find a vampire and slay him is dull. But if you have to talk your way into the vampires castle, discover his "resting place" and slay the vampire before nightfall, the eventual combat encounter is going to benefit from the previous events.
Be descriptive about the action taken by monsters. And use all the possible actions. Even if mechanically does not change much, changing actions instils curiosity in the players.
Use simple initiative, especially if you've got a large group! Simple initiative really speeds up the pace of combat. Just roll d6 and have a "team captain" roll d6 and whoever gets the highest result goes first. Reroll ties. Repeat the process at the start of each round until the combat's over.
It won't be to everyone's taste, but I've found that running combats for my 7-player group using simple initiative went from being an absolute chore to being the best part of the session.
It really comes down to narrating the action. My group has a few campaigns which we all sue Roll20 for. Last couple of weeks we swapped to whispering all the rolls, so rather than it just being "you hit", we've ended up changing it up to something like the following:
PC: *rolls dice which him and DM see* I swing my short sword up under his guard, twisting to try and catch him under his armor Rest of PCs: *siting there nervously cause they STILL dont know what is happening DM: He doesnt manage to raise his shield in time and you hear a deep grunt as the bugbear snarls. PC: *whispers damage to DM* Rest of PCs: OH GOD, Is he down yet? WHAT IS GOING ON!?
Much better than you hit and do x damage (which then people start trying to calculate how much has been done. We've stopped metagaming a lot just from doing that, and combat jsut got WAY more exciting.
This...is...fantastic! Great idea and I could really see how this would add to the drama!
Matt Colville did a video on this a while back. Basically he suggests stealing from other editions, especially 4e, to make combat more fun. If 4e did one thing right it was to make combat more interesting.
Totally agree with that idea Monbo, 4th had awesome combats. All the early 4e monsters (CR 0 - 5, give or take) have stats which require only a small amount of effort to convert (I sent my players against a 4e Ochre Jelly in a 5e game and it made for a delightful fight), and while the monster stats quickly escalate out of control, you can use the handy guide in the DMG for monster "stat brackets" to convert things into game-able encounters.
I definitely like the idea of using the 4E powers as rewards, or at the very least guidelines for how something like a "shield bash" might work. I have toyed with the idea of using them as feats. I also use the idea of minions in this addition as well.
I have been playing and DMing for a LONG time (~1978ish) and I admit I am always looking for something new to make my games better. I found a posting on the Angry GM site that I stole and used two weeks ago. Had a long term player said he really enjoyed it. So I have a small sample, but I think it is better!
Here's how it looks:
GM: The goblin leaps aside, dodging your axe. He tries to dart past you to close with Dave. You get an opportunity attack. Roll it. Bob: 11. GM: The goblin dodges that too and dashes forward, lunging at Dave with his shortsword. Dave, what’s your AC? Dave: 13. GM: Ouch. He stabs you in the side for 6 piercing damage, sending you stumbling backwards while the other two goblins draw to a stop and face Alice and Bob head on. Alice, the goblin recovers his breath from your blow and thrusts his shortsword. A crit! You take 12 damage. Alice: Damn it! I’m really hurt! GM: The other goblin closes with Bob as he’s trying to stop the one getting past him. But… Bob sees him coming and dodges the blow. That’s a miss. Bob: Phew. GM: The goblins range themselves in front of Alice and Bob while a third goblin is ready to strike another blow at Dave. Carol, they seem to be ignoring you. What do you?
I find my players get bored during protracted fights but have done a few things that work for my group to help keep them engaged. First, my group seems to prefer a lower number of powerful creatures instead of lots of enemies, so 2 ogres instead of 12 zombies or similar. This also saves a lot of book keeping as there are fewer combatants. Secondly,I try to have interesting battlefields and environments for them- unusual topography, they can maneuver around such as hight or water features. Thirdly, if the group has powers that work better in certain environments I try to provide those environments- if they have a spell that requires a tree or water feature I make sure to include one or two of those so that the players get to use all the cool powers they selected their character for, such as walking on water or slow falling from a hight or catching projectiles out of the air. My players WANT to be these characters so I feel it's important to help them look cool even if they are getting mauled in the process so they can go down swinging.
Use simple initiative, especially if you've got a large group! Simple initiative really speeds up the pace of combat. Just roll d6 and have a "team captain" roll d6 and whoever gets the highest result goes first. Reroll ties. Repeat the process at the start of each round until the combat's over.
It won't be to everyone's taste, but I've found that running combats for my 7-player group using simple initiative went from being an absolute chore to being the best part of the session.
I agree. Our group switched over to this method a year ago. The battles are faster and the players coordinate their attacks better.
This is an awesome thread; I'm playing in a combat-free campaign because all of my friends think that combat is slow and sluggish, and normally I'd agree with them. However, after watching shows like Critical Role, I'm confident that there's a way to make 5E combat fun and awesome. Thanks a ton, guys!
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I'm actually allergic to Fudgesicles, believe it or not.
There are several very good articles here and videos on youtube on how to help speed combat up. If your fights go faster, you'll have time to embellish.
Something else to remember is that not EVERY action needs a description. If the BBEG has 20 bad guys narrating everything they do would take forever. Only narrate the important stuff and/or group minions together if possible.
"Those four Skeletons draw their bows and fire at Konrad. Two of the arrows go wide while two of them hit. One is a flesh would for 2 points but the other is a Crit for ten points as the arrow pierces Konrad's chest!"
Play with 8 players, run initiative as is, there is nothing hard or slow about getting players to roll a single dice, roll for monsters, and then right a list of names on a bit of paper. I genuinely don't understand what about that slows down combat, at most it takes my table a few minutes and there is a moment of tension of working out what the order is, how did everyone roll. By ignoring Initiative you immediately tell Barbarians that they can make Dex a dump stat, it no longer means anything to them. You also promote any player that has chosen a poor dex.
As for the question it was how to make it more engaging, not speed it up. Although one does flow into the other, first of all my players all know to make decision swiftly, I make sure I always remind whoever is up next, and then after them, so they are preparing.
When it comes to the flow I have just found that practice helps me to describe the attacks, just a sentence or 2 and then flow to the next person in initiative order, over time I have learnt to get more creative with my descriptions based on the person fighting and the monster being fought.
I'm looking for tips on making combat more engaging! I've found it difficult to incorporate narrative into combat without bogging down the pace. Any help would be awesome!
It really comes down to narrating the action. My group has a few campaigns which we all sue Roll20 for. Last couple of weeks we swapped to whispering all the rolls, so rather than it just being "you hit", we've ended up changing it up to something like the following:
PC: *rolls dice which him and DM see* I swing my short sword up under his guard, twisting to try and catch him under his armor
Rest of PCs: *siting there nervously cause they STILL dont know what is happening
DM: He doesnt manage to raise his shield in time and you hear a deep grunt as the bugbear snarls.
PC: *whispers damage to DM*
Rest of PCs: OH GOD, Is he down yet? WHAT IS GOING ON!?
Much better than you hit and do x damage (which then people start trying to calculate how much has been done. We've stopped metagaming a lot just from doing that, and combat jsut got WAY more exciting.
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One of the many reasons I'd probably shy away from using Roll20 and other platforms. Honestly I'd probably just do skype, and get the kind of players that I know wouldn't fake die rolls and such.
Best way to make combat more interesting is providing details about what is going on but....
Make sure to add extra things in combat. Have places to hide, ropes to swing from, rocks to fall. Make sure the environment isn't just a typical everyday forest, but maybe add some quicksand.
Make sure the monsters aren't predictable. A goblin with an explosive that runs toward the PCs is something a crazy goblin would do and it is out of the norm. Maybe there is a monk Goblin or a Goblin Cleric. You can also give a Goblin a whip to attack with instead of the same old Sword. Maybe one of the Goblins can rage and take half damage!
Also try to use some unique creatures beyond the standard Goblin, Hobgoblin, Orc, etc. Also making villains 3 dimensional is a good way to make combat more interesting. If you wonder in a dungeon to find a vampire and slay him is dull. But if you have to talk your way into the vampires castle, discover his "resting place" and slay the vampire before nightfall, the eventual combat encounter is going to benefit from the previous events.
Be descriptive about the action taken by monsters. And use all the possible actions. Even if mechanically does not change much, changing actions instils curiosity in the players.
Use simple initiative, especially if you've got a large group! Simple initiative really speeds up the pace of combat. Just roll d6 and have a "team captain" roll d6 and whoever gets the highest result goes first. Reroll ties. Repeat the process at the start of each round until the combat's over.
It won't be to everyone's taste, but I've found that running combats for my 7-player group using simple initiative went from being an absolute chore to being the best part of the session.
https://dreadweasel.blogspot.com/
Matt Colville did a video on this a while back. Basically he suggests stealing from other editions, especially 4e, to make combat more fun. If 4e did one thing right it was to make combat more interesting.
Totally agree with that idea Monbo, 4th had awesome combats. All the early 4e monsters (CR 0 - 5, give or take) have stats which require only a small amount of effort to convert (I sent my players against a 4e Ochre Jelly in a 5e game and it made for a delightful fight), and while the monster stats quickly escalate out of control, you can use the handy guide in the DMG for monster "stat brackets" to convert things into game-able encounters.
https://dreadweasel.blogspot.com/
I definitely like the idea of using the 4E powers as rewards, or at the very least guidelines for how something like a "shield bash" might work. I have toyed with the idea of using them as feats. I also use the idea of minions in this addition as well.
I don't really find 4th edition combat more interesting. Though I suppose you could argue that for a fighter it might be more interesting.
I have been playing and DMing for a LONG time (~1978ish) and I admit I am always looking for something new to make my games better. I found a posting on the Angry GM site that I stole and used two weeks ago. Had a long term player said he really enjoyed it. So I have a small sample, but I think it is better!
Here's how it looks:
--
DM -- Elanon -- Homebrew world
Gronn -- Tiefling Warlock -- Amarath
Slim -- Halfling Cleric -- CoS (future Lord of Waterdeep 😁)
Bran -- Human Wizard - RoT
Making D&D mistakes and having fun since 1977!
That was an awesome read Windrunner, going to definitely implement some of these suggestions.
I find my players get bored during protracted fights but have done a few things that work for my group to help keep them engaged. First, my group seems to prefer a lower number of powerful creatures instead of lots of enemies, so 2 ogres instead of 12 zombies or similar. This also saves a lot of book keeping as there are fewer combatants. Secondly,I try to have interesting battlefields and environments for them- unusual topography, they can maneuver around such as hight or water features. Thirdly, if the group has powers that work better in certain environments I try to provide those environments- if they have a spell that requires a tree or water feature I make sure to include one or two of those so that the players get to use all the cool powers they selected their character for, such as walking on water or slow falling from a hight or catching projectiles out of the air. My players WANT to be these characters so I feel it's important to help them look cool even if they are getting mauled in the process so they can go down swinging.
This is an awesome thread; I'm playing in a combat-free campaign because all of my friends think that combat is slow and sluggish, and normally I'd agree with them. However, after watching shows like Critical Role, I'm confident that there's a way to make 5E combat fun and awesome. Thanks a ton, guys!
I'm actually allergic to Fudgesicles, believe it or not.
How do you change the settings to be this way?
I second Windrunners suggestion. The Angry GM way to do combat is really fun and engaging. Fast too.
There are several very good articles here and videos on youtube on how to help speed combat up. If your fights go faster, you'll have time to embellish.
Something else to remember is that not EVERY action needs a description. If the BBEG has 20 bad guys narrating everything they do would take forever. Only narrate the important stuff and/or group minions together if possible.
"Those four Skeletons draw their bows and fire at Konrad. Two of the arrows go wide while two of them hit. One is a flesh would for 2 points but the other is a Crit for ten points as the arrow pierces Konrad's chest!"
As an idea, you could either add more enemies for your players to fight or add a twist into the combat so your players won’t get bored of the fight.
Play with 8 players, run initiative as is, there is nothing hard or slow about getting players to roll a single dice, roll for monsters, and then right a list of names on a bit of paper. I genuinely don't understand what about that slows down combat, at most it takes my table a few minutes and there is a moment of tension of working out what the order is, how did everyone roll. By ignoring Initiative you immediately tell Barbarians that they can make Dex a dump stat, it no longer means anything to them. You also promote any player that has chosen a poor dex.
As for the question it was how to make it more engaging, not speed it up. Although one does flow into the other, first of all my players all know to make decision swiftly, I make sure I always remind whoever is up next, and then after them, so they are preparing.
When it comes to the flow I have just found that practice helps me to describe the attacks, just a sentence or 2 and then flow to the next person in initiative order, over time I have learnt to get more creative with my descriptions based on the person fighting and the monster being fought.