First thing's first, I am a new DM running HotDQ with a number of personal modifications (from both the interwebs and my own headspace). We have done several sessions and two of my PC's have faced some pretty unique situations.
One of my PC's (Wild Magic Sorcerer) recently experienced something that, to me, was rather small. They experienced a small trick of the eye where it seemed their spell was ineffective when, in reality, the rest of the party saw this incredible and powerful display of arcing magic.
The PC's backstory is different and more deep than I first thought or read (i.e. there was a lot unwritten in terms of tone and personality). My intent was to try and get the PC to engage with the party and ask questions along the lines of "did you see what I saw?" I expressed this to the player and was told that wasn't at all how the PC would think and they would be more likely to hermit themselves away because they don't want to lose control or put others at risk of magic.
My fear is, okay, I obviously made an oops as a DM. I let the player know the entire history and intent of what happened and why it happened. It is all part of a sub-plot of a deity of chaos attempting to break into the plane through utilizing the chaotic nature of the Cult of the Dragon. But I don't want this to be blown out of proportion and have a PC become a hermit because of personality traits I was unaware of.
Don't get me wrong, I absolutely love RP, character story and development, but this really blindsided me. Any tips on how to navigate this would be appreciated. I totally understand I am new and learning, so am bound to make mistakes. I have also told my players that they have an open line of communication to me to discuss any issues they may have or things they would like me to do/improve on to make their experience enjoyable.
So, to all the DM's out there. Help me figure out where I went wrong and what I can do to improve.
If the character isolates himself because of his magic, how come he left his cave in the first place? I understand the player wanting to roleplay hesitation over concern for others. But that needs to be balanced with the understanding that the character is a *hero* and needs to be open to adventure and going through difficult situations.
In your boots, this is how I'd go onward:
Suggest that, if the character has been traumatised by releasing powerful magic, the player might have him seek out help from another character. Someone to talk to, someone to confide in. That will build relationships between characters and should give the player their opportunity to roleplay "oh shit my magic" without removing their character from the narrative.
That was absolutely my intent. This PC has been a pretty isolated form of CN, but it hasn't had a major effect on the adventure thus far.
For example, during the siege of the Greenest Keep when Escovert (NPC) asked the party to stand guard in the keep courtyard to keep the townspeople who are barricaded there calm, the PC said, "Nope, not risking my neck for them." So, I had Escovert hint at a ballista at the top of the keep (to make the coming dragon encounter easier as we don't have a healing PC) as he was escorting the other PC's to the courtyard, and the PC in question ended up going to the ballista and playing an instrumental role in diverting the dragon while the rest of the PC's were frightened.
But, all that to say, the potential for total non-interaction is there and is deeply etched into the PC's backstory. Based on my conversation with the player, the PC is driven by the magic and seemingly adrift in chaos. After reaching out to the player and stating, hey, my intent was for the character to speak with other party members so they could describe the absolutely epic magic they saw. I mean, I made sure to really describe to them how incredible the magic was upon it's release. The intent was to bring him into the fold and have the rest of the party provide some comfort and be in awe of the power. Their response was, that's not how the PC would react at all. They would do this. So now I'm thinking, well... shit.
It was also meant to plant the seed of this sub-plot.
I just feel like I screwed up royally.
I appreciate the suggestion. What is your opinion on approaching another PC and have them mention to the sorcerer how incredible the display was?
If the player is up for it I'd say that's a reasonable thing to suggest.
I'd also remind a player like this that "my character wouldn't do that" is secondary to the shared story you're trying to tell. Ok, their character wouldn't do that.... normally, but in this instance the story needs to move forward and their character needs to move with it. Taking (a little) time out from the main storyline to highlight this character's troubles, and how he makes a friend to help him begin working through it, that's a good way to have his angst and retain the feeling of plot development.
I don't think you've messed up at all, by the way. Things haven't worked out as you expected and you're taking good steps to amend your thinking for the future.
I actually have a character pretty similar in terms of fear of her own wild magic. In her case, she was basically raised as a science experiment and hid her magic in order to protect herself from the terrifying experiments and such that her mother would enact.
From her point of view, her magic is dangerous and disgusting, and she refuses to share the depths of her hatred for it with her group( although she is pretty much an open book... so I don't think she hides it too well.) As far as personality, it would seem that the mine and your sorcerers are highly different, but methods of dealing with them should be similar.
First, I dont think you messed up majorly. Part of the job of a DM is to stretch and grow characters outside of their comfort zones. The player may be displeased, BUT if their character has fears then they should expect the DM to bring them up to face them. It's part of storytelling. Some of the BEST games I've had as a player is when my character has to face something that they DONT WANT TO. If the player isn't willing to grow their character, its likely either because this isn't how they wanted to grow, or because they aren't interested in this character anymore.
Second, the character trying to leave the group to protect them is all well and good, but what do they think about it? Will they just let him leave? Dont forget the power other characters have to pull someone out of their darkness. Are they even aware there is a struggle?
My suggestions based on experience playing as this sort of character would be A, get the players state of mind first. If they have a fear, that means they intended for it to be part of their character. If this isn't the way they wanted it to go, then back off this route and go a different way. Find a NPC or some world even to bring in the story line you are working on.
B, if the player DOES like this method of pulling the characters demons to the forefront, but just wants to stay true to their character running away, work with them. You can always make them running away part of the story line(Them being captured by this cult would be an AWESOME part of an arc, and you can have them play an evil character posing as them or a companion for a while). Figure out what the player wants out of this, and then build a different direction with the players desires as the core. Dont forget the other players though! They might not let the sorcerer leave.
C, If the player is ok with it, force the character in a corner. Make an even that reveals EVERYTHING they fear to the other players and make it impossible for them to leave, either physically or through holding them with something they value. You dont have to reveal your plans, but ask the player questions. " What does your character value most?" "How do you feel like the characters fears will manifest?" If they like complex backstories, have them write out some examples of past situations that brought about the fear. This will help you understand what they want to happen better.
In short, I'd say keep in contact with the players desires for the character, and don't be afraid of some intense scenes. There are no limits to how you can flex the game, so don't be afraid of going off script. Don't be concerned so much with the characters reactions to events and investigate the player's feelings a bit more.
Not sure if all this will apply to your situation, but hope this helps! If you have any further questions about my character, please let me know. I can get some info from my DM on how he deals with her and share it with you.
Is the player confrontational or a spotlight hog at all? At first glance this all reads like the player is being difficult just to do so. It seems like you have thrown some pretty nice character work and rp moments their way just for them to go "Nah my character wouldn't be down with any of this" and if that is the case you probably need to sit the player down and explain its a team game about a GROUP of HEROES.
I would need more info about the player and the situations to give better insight though, like I said at first glance it reads kind of like a selfish player being a curmudgeon and not understanding how characters are meant to grow and be faced with obstacles that shape and define them.
If the character is THAT scared of their power and gravitates towards being a hermit then why is that character even around?
they would be more likely to hermit themselves away because they don't want to lose control or put others at risk of magic.
The "reluctant hero" concept is fine (you see it all the time in the movies), you just need to ask your player "What sort of events would cause your PC to go on this adventure? I mean, I don't want you to miss out, but I also don't want to railroad you. I want something that's cool with your character concept".
This is all extremely helpful. I continued the dialog and asked a few of the questions listed here and the player admitted it may have been a knee jerk reaction and he’s working on a new way to respond to the situation.
If this continues I will certainly have that conversation. This individual isn’t a spotlight hog in any way shape or form, I genuinely think it is some deep devotion to a set character path that they’ve been thinking about for a long time. It’s been an adjustment to have me, as a DM, to challenge these preconceived notions and place them in a unique situation.
I really appreciate everything you all have listed here!
I think the only real mistake you made was divulging the entire conspiracy/plot behind the phenomenon that the sorcerer was experiencing. In fact the entire idea seems to remove a lot of agency from the player, making his character a sock puppet for your plot. After making similar mistakes in the past I've come to the conclusion that it isn't fun for anyone (not even the DM) when the characters have roles in a play that the DM is writing in his head. Sometimes you have to give the players both the carrot and the stick to get things started, but then the development of their characters should be largely up to them. Within the confines of the rules, of course.
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Hi all!
First thing's first, I am a new DM running HotDQ with a number of personal modifications (from both the interwebs and my own headspace). We have done several sessions and two of my PC's have faced some pretty unique situations.
One of my PC's (Wild Magic Sorcerer) recently experienced something that, to me, was rather small. They experienced a small trick of the eye where it seemed their spell was ineffective when, in reality, the rest of the party saw this incredible and powerful display of arcing magic.
The PC's backstory is different and more deep than I first thought or read (i.e. there was a lot unwritten in terms of tone and personality). My intent was to try and get the PC to engage with the party and ask questions along the lines of "did you see what I saw?" I expressed this to the player and was told that wasn't at all how the PC would think and they would be more likely to hermit themselves away because they don't want to lose control or put others at risk of magic.
My fear is, okay, I obviously made an oops as a DM. I let the player know the entire history and intent of what happened and why it happened. It is all part of a sub-plot of a deity of chaos attempting to break into the plane through utilizing the chaotic nature of the Cult of the Dragon. But I don't want this to be blown out of proportion and have a PC become a hermit because of personality traits I was unaware of.
Don't get me wrong, I absolutely love RP, character story and development, but this really blindsided me. Any tips on how to navigate this would be appreciated. I totally understand I am new and learning, so am bound to make mistakes. I have also told my players that they have an open line of communication to me to discuss any issues they may have or things they would like me to do/improve on to make their experience enjoyable.
So, to all the DM's out there. Help me figure out where I went wrong and what I can do to improve.
If the character isolates himself because of his magic, how come he left his cave in the first place? I understand the player wanting to roleplay hesitation over concern for others. But that needs to be balanced with the understanding that the character is a *hero* and needs to be open to adventure and going through difficult situations.
In your boots, this is how I'd go onward:
Suggest that, if the character has been traumatised by releasing powerful magic, the player might have him seek out help from another character. Someone to talk to, someone to confide in. That will build relationships between characters and should give the player their opportunity to roleplay "oh shit my magic" without removing their character from the narrative.
That was absolutely my intent. This PC has been a pretty isolated form of CN, but it hasn't had a major effect on the adventure thus far.
For example, during the siege of the Greenest Keep when Escovert (NPC) asked the party to stand guard in the keep courtyard to keep the townspeople who are barricaded there calm, the PC said, "Nope, not risking my neck for them." So, I had Escovert hint at a ballista at the top of the keep (to make the coming dragon encounter easier as we don't have a healing PC) as he was escorting the other PC's to the courtyard, and the PC in question ended up going to the ballista and playing an instrumental role in diverting the dragon while the rest of the PC's were frightened.
But, all that to say, the potential for total non-interaction is there and is deeply etched into the PC's backstory. Based on my conversation with the player, the PC is driven by the magic and seemingly adrift in chaos. After reaching out to the player and stating, hey, my intent was for the character to speak with other party members so they could describe the absolutely epic magic they saw. I mean, I made sure to really describe to them how incredible the magic was upon it's release. The intent was to bring him into the fold and have the rest of the party provide some comfort and be in awe of the power. Their response was, that's not how the PC would react at all. They would do this. So now I'm thinking, well... shit.
It was also meant to plant the seed of this sub-plot.
I just feel like I screwed up royally.
I appreciate the suggestion. What is your opinion on approaching another PC and have them mention to the sorcerer how incredible the display was?
If the player is up for it I'd say that's a reasonable thing to suggest.
I'd also remind a player like this that "my character wouldn't do that" is secondary to the shared story you're trying to tell. Ok, their character wouldn't do that.... normally, but in this instance the story needs to move forward and their character needs to move with it. Taking (a little) time out from the main storyline to highlight this character's troubles, and how he makes a friend to help him begin working through it, that's a good way to have his angst and retain the feeling of plot development.
I don't think you've messed up at all, by the way. Things haven't worked out as you expected and you're taking good steps to amend your thinking for the future.
Hey TheNewt,
I actually have a character pretty similar in terms of fear of her own wild magic. In her case, she was basically raised as a science experiment and hid her magic in order to protect herself from the terrifying experiments and such that her mother would enact.
From her point of view, her magic is dangerous and disgusting, and she refuses to share the depths of her hatred for it with her group( although she is pretty much an open book... so I don't think she hides it too well.) As far as personality, it would seem that the mine and your sorcerers are highly different, but methods of dealing with them should be similar.
First, I dont think you messed up majorly. Part of the job of a DM is to stretch and grow characters outside of their comfort zones. The player may be displeased, BUT if their character has fears then they should expect the DM to bring them up to face them. It's part of storytelling. Some of the BEST games I've had as a player is when my character has to face something that they DONT WANT TO. If the player isn't willing to grow their character, its likely either because this isn't how they wanted to grow, or because they aren't interested in this character anymore.
Second, the character trying to leave the group to protect them is all well and good, but what do they think about it? Will they just let him leave? Dont forget the power other characters have to pull someone out of their darkness. Are they even aware there is a struggle?
My suggestions based on experience playing as this sort of character would be A, get the players state of mind first. If they have a fear, that means they intended for it to be part of their character. If this isn't the way they wanted it to go, then back off this route and go a different way. Find a NPC or some world even to bring in the story line you are working on.
B, if the player DOES like this method of pulling the characters demons to the forefront, but just wants to stay true to their character running away, work with them. You can always make them running away part of the story line(Them being captured by this cult would be an AWESOME part of an arc, and you can have them play an evil character posing as them or a companion for a while). Figure out what the player wants out of this, and then build a different direction with the players desires as the core. Dont forget the other players though! They might not let the sorcerer leave.
C, If the player is ok with it, force the character in a corner. Make an even that reveals EVERYTHING they fear to the other players and make it impossible for them to leave, either physically or through holding them with something they value. You dont have to reveal your plans, but ask the player questions. " What does your character value most?" "How do you feel like the characters fears will manifest?" If they like complex backstories, have them write out some examples of past situations that brought about the fear. This will help you understand what they want to happen better.
In short, I'd say keep in contact with the players desires for the character, and don't be afraid of some intense scenes. There are no limits to how you can flex the game, so don't be afraid of going off script. Don't be concerned so much with the characters reactions to events and investigate the player's feelings a bit more.
Not sure if all this will apply to your situation, but hope this helps! If you have any further questions about my character, please let me know. I can get some info from my DM on how he deals with her and share it with you.
Good Luck!
thechimericalcookie
Is the player confrontational or a spotlight hog at all? At first glance this all reads like the player is being difficult just to do so. It seems like you have thrown some pretty nice character work and rp moments their way just for them to go "Nah my character wouldn't be down with any of this" and if that is the case you probably need to sit the player down and explain its a team game about a GROUP of HEROES.
I would need more info about the player and the situations to give better insight though, like I said at first glance it reads kind of like a selfish player being a curmudgeon and not understanding how characters are meant to grow and be faced with obstacles that shape and define them.
If the character is THAT scared of their power and gravitates towards being a hermit then why is that character even around?
The "reluctant hero" concept is fine (you see it all the time in the movies), you just need to ask your player "What sort of events would cause your PC to go on this adventure? I mean, I don't want you to miss out, but I also don't want to railroad you. I want something that's cool with your character concept".
This is all extremely helpful. I continued the dialog and asked a few of the questions listed here and the player admitted it may have been a knee jerk reaction and he’s working on a new way to respond to the situation.
If this continues I will certainly have that conversation. This individual isn’t a spotlight hog in any way shape or form, I genuinely think it is some deep devotion to a set character path that they’ve been thinking about for a long time. It’s been an adjustment to have me, as a DM, to challenge these preconceived notions and place them in a unique situation.
I really appreciate everything you all have listed here!
I think the only real mistake you made was divulging the entire conspiracy/plot behind the phenomenon that the sorcerer was experiencing. In fact the entire idea seems to remove a lot of agency from the player, making his character a sock puppet for your plot. After making similar mistakes in the past I've come to the conclusion that it isn't fun for anyone (not even the DM) when the characters have roles in a play that the DM is writing in his head. Sometimes you have to give the players both the carrot and the stick to get things started, but then the development of their characters should be largely up to them. Within the confines of the rules, of course.