Hi, I have a question I’ve been quite confused about. How many 1/4 challenge level enemies and one challenge level 2 enemy would I need to challenge a group of 4 players (not including dm)? Thanks so much, I’d love to hear the answer.
That depends on what level the PCs are. D&D Beyond’s encounter builder is a good first step for figuring these things out, and if you own Xanathar’s Guide to Everything, the section on encounter building is even better.
I tried to use the encounter builder, and I can not use it considering I’m not subscribed. I also do not own the book. How hard would it be for four level 3 players? I’m sorry I’m making you do the math, lmao.
It varies a lot based on how depleted the party's resources are. If they're coming into this fresh, having just rested, then even a deadly encounter is likely to be easy as the spellcasters burn all their big AOE spells. If they're low on HP and spell slots, even a much simpler fight might be a risk.
It varies a lot based on how depleted the party's resources are. If they're coming into this fresh, having just rested, then even a deadly encounter is likely to be easy as the spellcasters burn all their big AOE spells. If they're low on HP and spell slots, even a much simpler fight might be a risk.
That calculator says that it's a hard fight with 2 CR 1/4 monsters and the CR2 boss. I'm not sure where you're getting 5 from.
But yeah, actual difficulty is going to be hugely affected by party resources. The nature of my game is such that it's pretty common for the party to only really have one fight before getting to take a long rest, so I routinely throw much more difficult encounters at them than the Dungeon Master's Guide would suggest.
And KFC suggests that a party of 4 3rd-level characters will have a medium fight with, say, one Bandit Captain and one Acolyte. Upping it to two Acolytes makes it somewhere between a "hard" and "deadly" encounter.
With all that being said there's one last piece to the puzzle:
CR is going to become skewed as you continue to level up the heroes. Where one party may struggle with 3 opponents, another party will easily succeed. You are going to have to learn what your party's strengths and weaknesses are and how to use them to make fights interesting. You'll have to adjust the fight on the fly in many instances. You may add a monster or three, reduce the hp of a particularly challenging monster, increase the AC of the opponent if they're getting overrun, and so forth. As well, for the sake of keeping things really interesting, don't forget tactics and strategy! Not all fights are going to be to the death, heck most of them shouldn't be, the terrain, tools, and approach to combat should allow for more than just standing toe to toe and swinging weapons around.
5e is built with the intention that any monster can be deadly in enough numbers. Outnumber the party with enemies, and the enemies have a significant edge to the battle because they have more chances to attack. One monster less than the party, the encounter will be much, much easier. So if you want to make a challenging encounter, a good rule of thumb is to always have 1-2 more opponents than the party size.
I usually go for 1 Big Bad in the middle that is stronger than the rest, maybe a leader of the smaller opponents, that bark commands or heals them. That can be a level or two above the party in CR. Then the rest are lower CR minions that are smarter, more mobile and utilize guerilla warfare and stealth tactics.
If you're looking for a good example, check out Lost Mines of Phandelver and the Goblin cave in particular.
You can also adjust the difficulty of the battle as it's happening. You're the DM, after all. Maybe terrain gets difficult because one of the monsters/players slammed the ground and cause it to fracture, or you were in a magic swamp all along that has vines that whip the players if they get too close to the tree line and the mud is sticky on their feet, etc. As a DM you'll have to do some improv to see what is too hard and what is too easy in the moment. Combat is dynamic and hard to totally preplan for.
With all that being said there's one last piece to the puzzle:
CR is going to become skewed as you continue to level up the heroes. Where one party may struggle with 3 opponents, another party will easily succeed. You are going to have to learn what your party's strengths and weaknesses are and how to use them to make fights interesting. You'll have to adjust the fight on the fly in many instances. You may add a monster or three, reduce the hp of a particularly challenging monster, increase the AC of the opponent if they're getting overrun, and so forth. As well, for the sake of keeping things really interesting, don't forget tactics and strategy! Not all fights are going to be to the death, heck most of them shouldn't be, the terrain, tools, and approach to combat should allow for more than just standing toe to toe and swinging weapons around.
Exactly, throw as many enemies as you want ranging from cr 1/8 to cr 2) at my party and there beat it (there level 5) but one super tough enemy and it's a much tougher fight. You really need to find your parties strengths and weaknesses.
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The 6 most hated words in all of d&d history: make me a dex saving throw .
Hi, I have a question I’ve been quite confused about. How many 1/4 challenge level enemies and one challenge level 2 enemy would I need to challenge a group of 4 players (not including dm)? Thanks so much, I’d love to hear the answer.
From,
A Goat
That depends on what level the PCs are. D&D Beyond’s encounter builder is a good first step for figuring these things out, and if you own Xanathar’s Guide to Everything, the section on encounter building is even better.
I tried to use the encounter builder, and I can not use it considering I’m not subscribed. I also do not own the book. How hard would it be for four level 3 players? I’m sorry I’m making you do the math, lmao.
You can also play around with http://dhmstark.co.uk/rpgs/encounter-calculator-5th/ . According to that you need 5 of the cr 1/4 minions with a CR2 boss to make it a hard fight.
It varies a lot based on how depleted the party's resources are. If they're coming into this fresh, having just rested, then even a deadly encounter is likely to be easy as the spellcasters burn all their big AOE spells. If they're low on HP and spell slots, even a much simpler fight might be a risk.
That calculator says that it's a hard fight with 2 CR 1/4 monsters and the CR2 boss. I'm not sure where you're getting 5 from.
But yeah, actual difficulty is going to be hugely affected by party resources. The nature of my game is such that it's pretty common for the party to only really have one fight before getting to take a long rest, so I routinely throw much more difficult encounters at them than the Dungeon Master's Guide would suggest.
There's always Kobold Fight Club for encounter building.
And KFC suggests that a party of 4 3rd-level characters will have a medium fight with, say, one Bandit Captain and one Acolyte. Upping it to two Acolytes makes it somewhere between a "hard" and "deadly" encounter.
With all that being said there's one last piece to the puzzle:
CR is going to become skewed as you continue to level up the heroes. Where one party may struggle with 3 opponents, another party will easily succeed. You are going to have to learn what your party's strengths and weaknesses are and how to use them to make fights interesting. You'll have to adjust the fight on the fly in many instances. You may add a monster or three, reduce the hp of a particularly challenging monster, increase the AC of the opponent if they're getting overrun, and so forth. As well, for the sake of keeping things really interesting, don't forget tactics and strategy! Not all fights are going to be to the death, heck most of them shouldn't be, the terrain, tools, and approach to combat should allow for more than just standing toe to toe and swinging weapons around.
5e is built with the intention that any monster can be deadly in enough numbers. Outnumber the party with enemies, and the enemies have a significant edge to the battle because they have more chances to attack. One monster less than the party, the encounter will be much, much easier. So if you want to make a challenging encounter, a good rule of thumb is to always have 1-2 more opponents than the party size.
I usually go for 1 Big Bad in the middle that is stronger than the rest, maybe a leader of the smaller opponents, that bark commands or heals them. That can be a level or two above the party in CR. Then the rest are lower CR minions that are smarter, more mobile and utilize guerilla warfare and stealth tactics.
If you're looking for a good example, check out Lost Mines of Phandelver and the Goblin cave in particular.
You can also adjust the difficulty of the battle as it's happening. You're the DM, after all. Maybe terrain gets difficult because one of the monsters/players slammed the ground and cause it to fracture, or you were in a magic swamp all along that has vines that whip the players if they get too close to the tree line and the mud is sticky on their feet, etc. As a DM you'll have to do some improv to see what is too hard and what is too easy in the moment. Combat is dynamic and hard to totally preplan for.
Exactly, throw as many enemies as you want ranging from cr 1/8 to cr 2) at my party and there beat it (there level 5) but one super tough enemy and it's a much tougher fight. You really need to find your parties strengths and weaknesses.
The 6 most hated words in all of d&d history: make me a dex saving throw .
Thank you guys, that was some much needed help!