Last session a player wanted to use cast Cloud of Daggers inside a giant so it would destroy it internally etc, etc, as frost giants (the specific giant fought) probably have a torso of about 5ft cubed.
The wording of the spell does state it is cast "centered on a point you choose within range" rather than a point the PC can see. I allowed this last session but what do you guys think about it? Should I allow it, should it do extra damage?
Last session a player wanted to use cast Cloud of Daggers inside a giant so it would destroy it internally etc, etc, as frost giants (the specific giant fought) probably have a torso of about 5ft cubed.
The wording of the spell does state it is cast "centered on a point you choose within range" rather than a point the PC can see. I allowed this last session but what do you guys think about it? Should I allow it, should it do extra damage?
Regardless of sight restrictions, a spellcaster always needs line of effect to the target of their spell without specific wording to the contrary. As TexasDevin suggests, a point inside the giant has total cover and cannot be targeted.
That said, I also agree with the other point: "Sure, that's cool" and then just treat the effect exactly the same as I would if the spell were targeting a point outside the giant.
No. Spells don't work this way. They can't be cast inside a solid object.
"A CLEAR PATH TO THE TARGET To target something, you must have a clear path to it, so it can't be behind total cover, If you place an area of effect at a point that you can't see and an obstruction, such as a wall, is between you and that point, the point of origin comes into being on the near side of that obstruction."
PHB p204
You can't see a point inside a giant. If you target that point with your spell then the spell comes into effect on the near side of the obstruction which would be just outside the giant.
The insides of the giant have total cover from the spell.
"A target with total cover can't be targeted directly by an attack or a spell, although some spells can reach such a target by including it in an area of effect. A target has total cover if it is completely concealed by an obstacle."
The surface of the giant clearly completely conceals all its insides :)
Last session a player wanted to use cast Cloud of Daggers inside a giant so it would destroy it internally etc, etc, as frost giants (the specific giant fought) probably have a torso of about 5ft cubed.
The wording of the spell does state it is cast "centered on a point you choose within range" rather than a point the PC can see. I allowed this last session but what do you guys think about it? Should I allow it, should it do extra damage?
Regardless of sight restrictions, a spellcaster always needs line of effect to the target of their spell without specific wording to the contrary. As TexasDevin suggests, a point inside the giant has total cover and cannot be targeted.
That said, I also agree with the other point: "Sure, that's cool" and then just treat the effect exactly the same as I would if the spell were targeting a point outside the giant.
Awesome, totally cover is the thing i should have thought about, thanks peoples 😊
Honestly, it's just flavor - the effect is the same as if you cast it at the ground between the giant's feet. You just have to be prepared to tell the player the cloud doesn't create actual physical daggers, and that the casting target is a *location* not an object. The cloud doesn't move if the giant moves.
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Last session a player wanted to use cast Cloud of Daggers inside a giant so it would destroy it internally etc, etc, as frost giants (the specific giant fought) probably have a torso of about 5ft cubed.
The wording of the spell does state it is cast "centered on a point you choose within range" rather than a point the PC can see.
I allowed this last session but what do you guys think about it? Should I allow it, should it do extra damage?
This may be a weird way of saying this, but the Frost Giant's skin would provide full cover to that point inside the giant's body.
Easy answer: "OK, cool. That's a novel application of the spell." and treat the spell normal.
"Not all those who wander are lost"
Regardless of sight restrictions, a spellcaster always needs line of effect to the target of their spell without specific wording to the contrary. As TexasDevin suggests, a point inside the giant has total cover and cannot be targeted.
That said, I also agree with the other point: "Sure, that's cool" and then just treat the effect exactly the same as I would if the spell were targeting a point outside the giant.
No. Spells don't work this way. They can't be cast inside a solid object.
"A CLEAR PATH TO THE TARGET
To target something, you must have a clear path to it, so it can't be behind total cover, If you place an area of effect at a point that you can't see and an obstruction, such as a wall, is between you and that point, the point of origin comes into being on the near side of that obstruction."
PHB p204
You can't see a point inside a giant. If you target that point with your spell then the spell comes into effect on the near side of the obstruction which would be just outside the giant.
The insides of the giant have total cover from the spell.
"A target with total cover can't be targeted directly by an attack or a spell, although some spells can reach such a target by including it in an area of effect. A target has total cover if it is completely concealed by an obstacle."
The surface of the giant clearly completely conceals all its insides :)
Yeah, that would work the same as if the cloud of daggers was cast on the hex or square the giant was standing in. They could just walk out.
You don't get to just attach an AOE spell to an enemy so they can't walk out of it (unless the spell says so, of course.)
Awesome, totally cover is the thing i should have thought about, thanks peoples 😊
Honestly, it's just flavor - the effect is the same as if you cast it at the ground between the giant's feet. You just have to be prepared to tell the player the cloud doesn't create actual physical daggers, and that the casting target is a *location* not an object. The cloud doesn't move if the giant moves.