So I am curious as to what is the most common handling of spell scrolls at people's tables. I know RAW the spell has to be on your list, but do any of you simply allow scrolls to be read by non-caster characters? I know a most fictional fantasy stuff allows anyone to "read" a scroll, and in many cases the reader doesn't even know what is about to happen. I ask because I noticed our own DM has allowed a scroll to be read by a non-caster, after it had been identified. Perhaps that homebrew ruling of needing it identified was his method of "allowing" it to be used?
I plan to use a similar mechanism when my players get any scrolls (which they shall upon opening a chest revealed at the end of the last session) If the player is a caster with that spell on their list, they will be permitted to simply read the spell and BINGO. Non casters will have to give either an Arcana check (if proficient) or a straight Intelligence check, as a way of indicating they properly pronounce the words on the scroll. My description would be that they don't know what any of the words are but are able to "read" them (the letter arrangements make sounds, but not words they recognize) Likely give any caster who doesn't have the spell advantage on the check, as saying strange words is part of their current normal routine anyway, these are just different.
My mindset is that I will likely want to send the party out with a scroll of Revivify or something similar and I wanted to ensure they would be able to use it if the Cleric was the one to go down. Enough on MY plans, what happens at your tables, RAW, or homebrew tweaks to it?
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Talk to your Players.Talk to your DM. If more people used this advice, there would be 24.74% fewer threads on Tactics, Rules and DM discussions.
In older editions there was a skill that allowed a PC to use a scroll even if they weren't magic users. However no such rule exists in 5E.
The usual way to give the party a useful spell is in the form of a potion - as a DM, you can create a potion containing almost any spell. I'd stick to single target spells, but revivify could be one to pour over the body instead of forcing it down the neck of an unconscious body.
I don’t much like the spell scroll RAW. Spell scrolls RAW don’t seem to be that useful. You save a spell slot, and for classes that don’t have access to all the spells on their list, they are valuable, but for most classes they’re not very interesting. I would also like a house rule to allow any class to use a spell scroll. It would add an opportunity for non-casters to have fun with magic from time to time.
The trick is, what is the DC or attack modifier? Spells don’t say which of the player’s stats to use; that’s up to the class. One option is to just specify the DC with the scroll. Maybe you could standardize it by spell level. So a l1 spell scroll might have a DC 13, l5 DC 16, and l7 DC 18. This is how most permanent magic items that cast spells work.
Alternatively you could have the scroll specify the spellcasting stat. Again, you could set it on a case-by-case basis, or maybe the stat depends on the spell school: Charisma for Enchantment, Intelligence for Illusion, Wisdom for Divination, etc. This would make spell scrolls weaker for non-casters, who may be likely to have weaker mental stats. That could be a plus or a minus depending on your intent. You could even make some spell schools depend on physical stats, if you wanted to encourage non-casters to use them. I could buy Constitution being used for Necromancy, for example.
The trick is, what is the DC or attack modifier? Spells don’t say which of the player’s stats to use; that’s up to the class. One option is to just specify the DC with the scroll. Maybe you could standardize it by spell level. So a l1 spell scroll might have a DC 13, l5 DC 16, and l7 DC 18. This is how most permanent magic items that cast spells work.
If they aren't a spellcaster then they don't have a spellcasting stat, and their base DC for saves would be 8 - the reader isn't a wielder of magic, so he doesn't really know how to help the spell penetrate through a target's defenses. This is mentioned in the section about magic items somewhere.
I find that my players do two things with scrolls they find. They either add the spell to their spell book or they totally forget all about the scroll even when I hint heavily about it. Don't make a spell on a scroll a major plot device.
So now I just hand out general use scrolls - camping scrolls and eavesdropping scrolls which anybody can use.
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"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
Ok, I see the notion of a salve being a better choice, so as to not toss RAW out the window entirely on scrolls. Could load a wand, too, now that options have come up, lol. My mind just went to scroll immediately for a spell they don't HAVE yet, or as I mentioned Revivify if it's the Cleric who gets bitten in half or some such. I have already sketched up a handful of homebrew things, to specifically suit the party I was running through, so getting a rez stick should be easy enough. Now the challenge will be to make them earn it (and maybe not need it right after the fight lol)
Potion/salve I think I might use. Smear the potion over the body and activate it with fresh blood from a willing donor. Not a sacrifice, per say, but one of the companions must slash his/her hand and drip their blood over the salve to kickstart the effect. Yeah, I like that.....<runs off to make a homebrew potion>
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Talk to your Players.Talk to your DM. If more people used this advice, there would be 24.74% fewer threads on Tactics, Rules and DM discussions.
I find that my players do two things with scrolls they find. They either add the spell to their spell book or they totally forget all about the scroll
Yes, this has happened to me a few times. Rogue fails find traps... nobody remembers they have a Find Traps scroll. Fighter is cursed and keeps failing his save against it.... nobody remembers the Remove Curse scroll I gave them "just in case" back when the cleric was too low a level to cast it.
I wonder if they will retire at 20th level and still have the unused Find Traps and Remove Curse... LOL.
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WOTC lies. We know that WOTC lies. WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. We know that WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. And still they lie.
Because of the above (a paraphrase from Orwell) I no longer post to the forums -- PM me if you need help or anything.
Even if I know I have spell scrolls and potions, I never use them. Just like in video games with single use items... I'll hoard them because they are a "precious" resource and get to the end game with all these little trinkets that would have made my life easier, but once you use it you don't have it. Not sure if it is OCD or what, but I'll rarely use any of that unless I am a caster and can add it to my spellbook.
As for who gets to use them.... yeah, I stick with spell lists and if it is on yours you can cast it. If you don't have a high enough level yet, you can try with an arcana or other casting check...
I know, it is a habit many of us have. I still hoard many of my long-recharge powers in City of Heroes and then end up going a whole mission or even story arc and not using them... and I do this for many levels.
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WOTC lies. We know that WOTC lies. WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. We know that WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. And still they lie.
Because of the above (a paraphrase from Orwell) I no longer post to the forums -- PM me if you need help or anything.
The problem with consumables is: why spend them if you'll win without it? Most of the consumables that actually get handed out are not that potent, and even if they are (say, a scroll of Fireball for a third level party facing a horde of 20 lizardfolk) that means the DM is relying on the players to remember one specific tactic, and if they forget, it's a TPK.
The exception is super-cheap consumables, like arrows.
Most of the time I follow RAW for spell scrolls. Sometimes I hand out a home brewed magical scroll that allows any class to use it, but when I do that I specify that it’s a special item and isn’t a spell scroll.
So I am curious as to what is the most common handling of spell scrolls at people's tables. I know RAW the spell has to be on your list, but do any of you simply allow scrolls to be read by non-caster characters? I know a most fictional fantasy stuff allows anyone to "read" a scroll, and in many cases the reader doesn't even know what is about to happen. I ask because I noticed our own DM has allowed a scroll to be read by a non-caster, after it had been identified. Perhaps that homebrew ruling of needing it identified was his method of "allowing" it to be used?
I plan to use a similar mechanism when my players get any scrolls (which they shall upon opening a chest revealed at the end of the last session) If the player is a caster with that spell on their list, they will be permitted to simply read the spell and BINGO. Non casters will have to give either an Arcana check (if proficient) or a straight Intelligence check, as a way of indicating they properly pronounce the words on the scroll. My description would be that they don't know what any of the words are but are able to "read" them (the letter arrangements make sounds, but not words they recognize) Likely give any caster who doesn't have the spell advantage on the check, as saying strange words is part of their current normal routine anyway, these are just different.
My mindset is that I will likely want to send the party out with a scroll of Revivify or something similar and I wanted to ensure they would be able to use it if the Cleric was the one to go down. Enough on MY plans, what happens at your tables, RAW, or homebrew tweaks to it?
Talk to your Players. Talk to your DM. If more people used this advice, there would be 24.74% fewer threads on Tactics, Rules and DM discussions.
In older editions there was a skill that allowed a PC to use a scroll even if they weren't magic users. However no such rule exists in 5E.
The usual way to give the party a useful spell is in the form of a potion - as a DM, you can create a potion containing almost any spell. I'd stick to single target spells, but revivify could be one to pour over the body instead of forcing it down the neck of an unconscious body.
I use RAW. You have to have it on your list to be able to read the scroll.
WOTC lies. We know that WOTC lies. WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. We know that WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. And still they lie.
Because of the above (a paraphrase from Orwell) I no longer post to the forums -- PM me if you need help or anything.
I don’t much like the spell scroll RAW. Spell scrolls RAW don’t seem to be that useful. You save a spell slot, and for classes that don’t have access to all the spells on their list, they are valuable, but for most classes they’re not very interesting. I would also like a house rule to allow any class to use a spell scroll. It would add an opportunity for non-casters to have fun with magic from time to time.
The trick is, what is the DC or attack modifier? Spells don’t say which of the player’s stats to use; that’s up to the class. One option is to just specify the DC with the scroll. Maybe you could standardize it by spell level. So a l1 spell scroll might have a DC 13, l5 DC 16, and l7 DC 18. This is how most permanent magic items that cast spells work.
Alternatively you could have the scroll specify the spellcasting stat. Again, you could set it on a case-by-case basis, or maybe the stat depends on the spell school: Charisma for Enchantment, Intelligence for Illusion, Wisdom for Divination, etc. This would make spell scrolls weaker for non-casters, who may be likely to have weaker mental stats. That could be a plus or a minus depending on your intent. You could even make some spell schools depend on physical stats, if you wanted to encourage non-casters to use them. I could buy Constitution being used for Necromancy, for example.
If they aren't a spellcaster then they don't have a spellcasting stat, and their base DC for saves would be 8 - the reader isn't a wielder of magic, so he doesn't really know how to help the spell penetrate through a target's defenses. This is mentioned in the section about magic items somewhere.
I find that my players do two things with scrolls they find. They either add the spell to their spell book or they totally forget all about the scroll even when I hint heavily about it. Don't make a spell on a scroll a major plot device.
So now I just hand out general use scrolls - camping scrolls and eavesdropping scrolls which anybody can use.
"Sooner or later, your Players are going to smash your railroad into a sandbox."
-Vedexent
"real life is a super high CR."
-OboeLauren
"............anybody got any potatoes? We could drop a potato in each hole an' see which ones get viciously mauled by horrible monsters?"
-Ilyara Thundertale
Ok, I see the notion of a salve being a better choice, so as to not toss RAW out the window entirely on scrolls. Could load a wand, too, now that options have come up, lol. My mind just went to scroll immediately for a spell they don't HAVE yet, or as I mentioned Revivify if it's the Cleric who gets bitten in half or some such. I have already sketched up a handful of homebrew things, to specifically suit the party I was running through, so getting a rez stick should be easy enough. Now the challenge will be to make them earn it (and maybe not need it right after the fight lol)
Potion/salve I think I might use. Smear the potion over the body and activate it with fresh blood from a willing donor. Not a sacrifice, per say, but one of the companions must slash his/her hand and drip their blood over the salve to kickstart the effect. Yeah, I like that.....<runs off to make a homebrew potion>
Talk to your Players. Talk to your DM. If more people used this advice, there would be 24.74% fewer threads on Tactics, Rules and DM discussions.
Yes, this has happened to me a few times. Rogue fails find traps... nobody remembers they have a Find Traps scroll. Fighter is cursed and keeps failing his save against it.... nobody remembers the Remove Curse scroll I gave them "just in case" back when the cleric was too low a level to cast it.
I wonder if they will retire at 20th level and still have the unused Find Traps and Remove Curse... LOL.
WOTC lies. We know that WOTC lies. WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. We know that WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. And still they lie.
Because of the above (a paraphrase from Orwell) I no longer post to the forums -- PM me if you need help or anything.
Even if I know I have spell scrolls and potions, I never use them. Just like in video games with single use items... I'll hoard them because they are a "precious" resource and get to the end game with all these little trinkets that would have made my life easier, but once you use it you don't have it. Not sure if it is OCD or what, but I'll rarely use any of that unless I am a caster and can add it to my spellbook.
As for who gets to use them.... yeah, I stick with spell lists and if it is on yours you can cast it. If you don't have a high enough level yet, you can try with an arcana or other casting check...
I know, it is a habit many of us have. I still hoard many of my long-recharge powers in City of Heroes and then end up going a whole mission or even story arc and not using them... and I do this for many levels.
WOTC lies. We know that WOTC lies. WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. We know that WOTC knows that we know that WOTC lies. And still they lie.
Because of the above (a paraphrase from Orwell) I no longer post to the forums -- PM me if you need help or anything.
The problem with consumables is: why spend them if you'll win without it? Most of the consumables that actually get handed out are not that potent, and even if they are (say, a scroll of Fireball for a third level party facing a horde of 20 lizardfolk) that means the DM is relying on the players to remember one specific tactic, and if they forget, it's a TPK.
The exception is super-cheap consumables, like arrows.
Most of the time I follow RAW for spell scrolls. Sometimes I hand out a home brewed magical scroll that allows any class to use it, but when I do that I specify that it’s a special item and isn’t a spell scroll.
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