The players want to make health potions .... what do they need? Herbal-ism Kit? Medicine Skill? High Wisdom? If the ranger or druid spends time looking for the ingredients should this decrease the cost?
What if the players wanted to sell the potions? could this be profitable?
This is a fantastic question. You could approach it with different Adventure Hooks. For example:
Adventure Hook 1: A ranking member of a particular faction contacts the character to help restock its standing stores for other characters/NPCs. For the character's trouble said potion is awarded (including 1 Reputation Point, if you so desire). Storage materials are provided, bottles and vials, crates and straw, for transport. Does the caravan master hire the PCs to escort the cargo? Sure, why not. Road trip! But before all of that, have the character attempt a History or Nature roll to know the location of the core ingredients, which then of course, leads to a simple 1-hour Quest. When the ingredients are combined, have the character make an Arcana roll. The DC is up to you. A (2d4 +2) healing potion might have a DC 11. Increase the DC by 2 or 3 points for every healing potion tier. Helping the faction could lead to repeat business... which leads to other adventures. Help the war effort!
Adventure Hook 2: A local Alchemist (A Sage with the Alchemist background feature) is in sore need of an apprentice. The wizard is simply overwhelmed with the backorders that keep piling up on his/her desk because said wizard DIDN'T study magic to become a brewer. So, said wizard needs to expand the business. In exchange, the Sage reduces the amount of downtime the character would spend to learn alchemy. Wizard collects a fee for use of his/her laboratory. The characters have made an ally, and perhaps a lead for a future adventure down the road.
Adventure Hook 3: The ranger or druid or barbarian or moon elf or wood elf or firbolg or kenku or triton is familiar with foods that are safe to eat; the herbs, roots, plants, flowers, and fruits in a specific region that have medicinal properties. A DC 8 or 9 Nature, History, or Survival check is all that is required for the character to know the location. Gathering the ingredients might take a little bit more skill. So I might be tempted to increase the challenge to a DC 11, just so that character knows HOW to safely clip the flower, or pull the root without killing the plant. From there it's a simple DC 11 Arcana check to combine the ingredients, and viola, the (2d4 +2) healing potion is created.
If you want the experience to have an effect on game play, have the character expend a spell slot. You could also have the character make a series of rolls, applying the character's Spell Bonus. I might be tempted to increase the Arcana roll to DC 13 for a (2d4+2) healing potion.
Also, keep in mind where the adventurers are located. Word of mouth might spread around leading to future business or a prisoner of war scenario in which the characters have to save their spell caster, because he/she has been kidnapped by a warlord who needs to keep healing potions readily available for his fiendish troops.
I'd go about it this way: For healing potions they should have proficiency with the herbalism kit. They should also have the kit and the herbs/raw materials in question (whether bought or scrounged). If you want them to have access you can make it cheaper for them if they gather the goods, but that's really your call IMO. And then to do the actual crafting, they need to make successful checks of the appropriate DC for whatever they are trying to create. A failure makes a failed batch of whatever.
Healing potions are NOT healing kits or jars of Penicillin. They are potions. Magical potions. Their effects are almost instantaneous. They are more effective than ANYTHING we in the 21st Century can get our hands on for healing wounds. I find it hard to believe that just mixing a few ingredients and performing some basic chemistry is going to produce them. And I have no trouble suspending belief for liches, dragons, elves, or sober dwarves. I am not arguing with the responses above, but saying that the ability to enchant the potion has to be considered; and that can make it even more fun.
"What if the players wanted to sell the potions? could this be profitable? " ???
So....if it was easy, everybody would be doing it and healing potions would be cheaper than deep fried potatoes; if it required the blood of a unicorn and moss gathered from the royal privvy of Gauntlegrim, then these hedge alchemists might decide snake oil is easier to produce.
"You don't really need a system per say just some logic and a basic core formula to keep it balanced." Hmmm, sounds like a system to me. :)
"What if the players wanted to sell the potions? could this be profitable? " The question really should be "Who is going to get upset when I start cutting in on their livelihoods, and what actions are they going to take?" Tread on the toes of the Church, the Alchemist's Guild, or the Arch Mage with caution....
1) you need the appropriate Kit proficiency in order to do it. If you don't have proficiency with blacksmithing tools, then no, you can't forge your own weapons. Want to be an alchemist, you need alchemist kits. No magic or spell levels required for any crafting. Slightly different than the normal D&D everyone-can-do-anything rules, but I'm making an exception here.
2) you need the appropriate materials. For simple, low level items, this is just stopping by the store and buying the ingredients. For more complex items, like a Potion of Haste, this requires some legwork and hunting them down through contacts, visiting an auction house, or mini-adventures in their own right. Buying purple worm venom isn't as simple as walking down the street to the local alchemist. I determine the number of such difficult-to-find ingredients based on the rarity of the item - common require none, uncommon require one, rare require two, very rare need three, legendary need four, artifacts would require five. I have no exact criteria for how to obtain them beyond the needs of the story at the given moment.
3) time to do the creation. The books suggest times in weeks and months, but I find that to be rather insanely long for a D&D game. I know, historically, it took a long time to purify metals, and you need to let drinks ferment, but that's just annoying in game. So, I tend to just say that it takes one downtime per ingredient, and one to actually make the item. I allow multiple iterations of the item to be made for potions or poisons or the like (assuming necessary ingredients), but everything else is just a flat one per downtime.
4) Make the roll, usually Int + Proficency. I use the CRs from Xanathar's Guide - 3, 8, 12, 18, 24 and 30 respectively for each level. Guidance cantrip and bardic inspirations are permitted, as are enchanted equipment (if you can find them!) Failure usually ruins the ingredients.
The DMG has the (optional) rules for creating and selling magic items, which is what potions of healing are.
Xanathar's Guide to Everything has another, in my opinion better, set of rules for creating magic items, including specific rules for potions of healing. It also has rules for selling magic items.
i was thinking about making the ingredients relatively common but needing a high number of them.
for example, if we have a "Health Root" (obviously this will not be the final name) it would take 16 units of it to make a simple health potion (lets say 2d4 +2) this of course would be during a long rest. The player would have to make a relatively difficult Skill Check ... something like D20+Medicine+Herbalist Kit > 20 (this would allow ... in theory someone to roll at natural 20, have no proficiency and still pull it off) ... as the potion got stronger it would require more units of the like 32 Units of "Health Root" and now require a DC 25 to make a 4d4+4 potion. 64 units and DC 30 to make a 6D4 + 6 ... and on and on ....
Critical Rolls, I think on a natural 20 i would give them two potions .... and on a Natural 1 it would like brew a simple poison ... or perhaps explode destroying the herbalist kit...
Does this system seem like it would break the game?
The DMG has the (optional) rules for creating and selling magic items, which is what potions of healing are.
Xanathar's Guide to Everything has another, in my opinion better, set of rules for creating magic items, including specific rules for potions of healing. It also has rules for selling magic items.
You know, you might want to present the idea to your gaming group. See what input they may have. Establishing Table Rules for homebrew adventurers/campaign settings is one of the perks of having an at-home gaming group. Over time a sort of compendium grows. What’s allowed, what’s not, what’s adjustable, what’s inflexible, these rules pertinent to your group flavor the Table. And such a discussion invites a different kind of participation game play does not always include: consensus.
Also, I’ve found, once players reach Tier 2 game play—especially Tier 3—they develop a want to affect the setting itself. You never know, a spell caster or fighter in the group, for examples, might want to buy or build a potion shop somewhere along the High Road in Faerûn, or clear a trail from the Coast Way near Baldur's Gate to the shop’s front door. Maybe the players want to set up shop near Yartar. Plenty of business flowing from that caravan crossroad.
If the players are looking to get into the business of selling potions, let ‘em. Such a responsibility would certainly come with employees, a rotating mercenary or adventuring guard. A visiting Harper perhaps from time to time. A local tax collector? Building maintenance too. Good reason to have a Charisma score with a positive modifier, or not. A grumpy business owner—never heard of that!
As a DM, I like watching the players develop a living history for their characters. Gives me a chance to say: You wake suddenly from a fretful dream. A voice cries out from the dark, calling for you. The voice at first is warbled, indistinct, but minutes later the voice is crystal clear, and its warning strikes like a thunderbolt. A message spell has been cast. You recognize the voice. It’s your shopkeep. “Help! Come quick! They’ve taken everything! Every last potion and gold coin collected for the last month!”
With the proviso that this is how it is in my game world, and no one else's .... :) ....
As The_Plundered_Tombspointed out, healing potions are far in advance of anything humans have ever produced in medical arts, or - barring the development of cheap, easy and safe nanotechnology - are likely to ever produce. In my opinion - only - healing potions are horrifically broken from a pseudo-realism perspective, but they exist as they do for perfectly good game mechanic reasons.
I don't see healing potions as being chemical or alchemical in world: dump these ingredients together, into this process, and you get a potion - or economics would either make them way more expensive than they are due to the high demand of a rare commodity, or they would be super common - to the point that they'd really warp the shape of the societies in the fantasy world ( farming communities keep a keg of the stuff on hand for accidents, middle class and up households have one or more on hand for emergencies, at all times, etc. - maybe in your world, this is how it is ).
From a game perspective, you have to have a game-mechanical process to do exactly that - unless you go for a completely deus ex machina origin for healing potions like "Healing potions are not created by mortals at all. They are a natural resources, slowly dripping from the rocks of certain caves which are sites considered Holy by the God of Healing ...", which could be an interesting spin on things ( It certainly would bypass "Skill + Materials (cost) + Time" ).
I'm of the opinion that if healing potions existed in game, they would be more akin to repositories for healing spells - you could create an alchemical potion base, which essentially acts a kind of Ring of Spell Storing for a healing spell - which means that you would need a healing spellcaster to create one, although other classes might be able to help participate in creating the alchemical base to store the magical energies.
So if you want a game mechanic recipe, then I'd say:
Obtaining the knowledge on how to create the alchemical base potion ( this might be hard to come by if jealously guarded ).
Making relatively high Survival skill roll to find and harvest the ingredients properly. I'd probably have these not something you could buy; they would need to be harvested at very specific times, in a very specific way, with a very short "shelf life".
Having an alchemical workspace to brew the base potion.
Making a relatively high Medicine skill roll to prepare the base correctly
Having a ritual space set up for the infusion of the spell energies into the alchemical base ( this could be as cheap as finding a "holy grove" in the woods, or as expensive as setting up a richly appointed consecrated temple space - depending on the DM's approach ).
Casting the healing spell
Making a relatively high Religion or Arcana check to see if it all "took".
Note that steps 2, 4, and 6-7 could all be done by different people.
It's not how I handle healing potions ( or healing potion analogues ) in my world, but I think it's a reasonable "simple" approach.
Poisons would be easier.
I'd say that the same steps could be used, but the mystical aspects would not be needed - and I'd allow a lot more leeway on harvesting and storing ingredients. Perhaps those ingredients could be purchased from herbalists, if you knew where to look.
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nope, DND 5e does an absolutely terrible job of anything crafting related. I also have players who rather make all of there own gear then buy or find anything.
Here is how i do it.
I only require one "Main" Ingredient.
Then i use a homebrew system i call "Effort"
First you turn the cost of the Poison (this info can be found in the DMG) and that is the amount of effort required to craft the item.
For each 8 hours a character uses to work on the crafted item i let them Roll a number of D20 equal to their proficiency modifier.
A Nat 1 counts for 0 effort gained and symbolizes wasted effort (I usually role play this as getting distracted or falling asleep, etc.)
A Nat 20 gives the player the 20 points of effort as well as an additional role.
When this running total surpasses the required effort they have are able to add it to there inventory.
Why I like this system.
Because the prof mod goes up with level, it allows a level 20 player to craft any item faster then it would take a level 1 player almost automatically.
Feel freed to private message me if anyone has further questions about my system.
DnD is horrible at crafting because it is not an economic simulator, it is a killing monster simulator. Make it too easy, and why adventure at all really, much safer making coin selling goods. Make it too hard and then it questions why those items are EVER for sale, since the cost of making would far outweigh the prices they are listed.
Combining time, effort, and coin using adventure hooks, skill checks, etc. is a pretty good combination. Personally I don't let characters craft anything magical and rarely anything mundane. It takes years of specialization to be an artisan or crafter, and that time would have taken up the time to learn the skills to ADVENTURE. Thus, I tend to give out "hooks" for ingredients which result in "discounts" for the characters from the listed price. Which usually results in them not only getting the ingredients/materials the crafter needs, but also some coin to offset the cost and of course, XP and more interaction opportunities with the world.
No real right or wrong way though, just putting out the method I use most often.
What is the point of the Tool Proficiency ? If your players accept this kind of system them all means do it, but my players would never do it.
To address your second point: They do.
To address your first point: You tell me, some of them make sense, some of them don't. Certain ones, like Disguise or Thieves, a penalty is applied to the check without them. For others like Brewer's, downtime only activity, can offset living expenses. Overall, most tool proficiencies are associated with backgrounds, more something they use to do, but don't do anymore. Can get some benefits or problems from it from time to time, but not the main focus. For us, downtime is always handled away from the table. Whether it is hours, days, or years, doesn't really matter, table time is for role play, intrigue, and combat, not working 9-5 to obtain something that can be had in a day of encounters.
I got a cleric at the table that bought a "Alchemy for dummies" book and started practicing with that. As well a rogue wanting to tinker and create stuff, including poisons and such.
1. When traveling they can declare the desire to look for stuff in the wild. I have them roll a Survival/Nature check to see if they find something. Through a random table it is generated what they find, what it can be turned into and for how many doses. 2. Working on Alchemy and preparations they can spend 2-3 hours before sleep and then let the distillation process etc run while they sleep. I'm nice that way. With a simple Int check with a DC19 they get the full doses prepared. At 17 only 1 or 2 doses are successfully made. After 9 months in game through application of Alchemy, or learning from a trainer somewhere, they can become proficient and gain the proficiency bonus to make the rolls easier. 3. For healing potions I require the cleric to use Nature/Wilderness Check to find the ingredients. An Alchemy Check to make the liquid substance. Then 8 hours of Divine Prayer to infuse the liquid with its full healing properties. This prevents the players from flooding the market with their own potions...to a degree hehehe. 4. The cleric now wants to start a business for alchemy creations. In town there is a magic store that dabbles some into alchemy. Will be interesting to see how the cleric will get the deed to a store and deal with possible competition. For this its best to keep it as simple as possible. Nobody likes extensive book keeping. ---Once a month roll on a table. Outcome will range from "Massive loss", "minor loss", "break even", "minor profit", "Massive profit". The "break even" price is what the DM has to come up with in relation to the economy in the game. As a DM just turn that roll into a narrative explanation. Employee X went out to find the ingredients but ran into a group of Bullywugs in the swamp. They prevented him to get what was required. Employee Y saw a need in the community and started to focus on brewing this one particular elixir... etc etc. And some made up descriptions might cause the Cleric to go on a quest to deal with whatever was going on.
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The players want to make health potions .... what do they need? Herbal-ism Kit? Medicine Skill? High Wisdom? If the ranger or druid spends time looking for the ingredients should this decrease the cost?
What if the players wanted to sell the potions? could this be profitable?
I just want to hear peoples thoughts?
This is a fantastic question. You could approach it with different Adventure Hooks. For example:
Adventure Hook 1: A ranking member of a particular faction contacts the character to help restock its standing stores for other characters/NPCs. For the character's trouble said potion is awarded (including 1 Reputation Point, if you so desire). Storage materials are provided, bottles and vials, crates and straw, for transport. Does the caravan master hire the PCs to escort the cargo? Sure, why not. Road trip! But before all of that, have the character attempt a History or Nature roll to know the location of the core ingredients, which then of course, leads to a simple 1-hour Quest. When the ingredients are combined, have the character make an Arcana roll. The DC is up to you. A (2d4 +2) healing potion might have a DC 11. Increase the DC by 2 or 3 points for every healing potion tier. Helping the faction could lead to repeat business... which leads to other adventures. Help the war effort!
Adventure Hook 2: A local Alchemist (A Sage with the Alchemist background feature) is in sore need of an apprentice. The wizard is simply overwhelmed with the backorders that keep piling up on his/her desk because said wizard DIDN'T study magic to become a brewer. So, said wizard needs to expand the business. In exchange, the Sage reduces the amount of downtime the character would spend to learn alchemy. Wizard collects a fee for use of his/her laboratory. The characters have made an ally, and perhaps a lead for a future adventure down the road.
Adventure Hook 3: The ranger or druid or barbarian or moon elf or wood elf or firbolg or kenku or triton is familiar with foods that are safe to eat; the herbs, roots, plants, flowers, and fruits in a specific region that have medicinal properties. A DC 8 or 9 Nature, History, or Survival check is all that is required for the character to know the location. Gathering the ingredients might take a little bit more skill. So I might be tempted to increase the challenge to a DC 11, just so that character knows HOW to safely clip the flower, or pull the root without killing the plant. From there it's a simple DC 11 Arcana check to combine the ingredients, and viola, the (2d4 +2) healing potion is created.
If you want the experience to have an effect on game play, have the character expend a spell slot. You could also have the character make a series of rolls, applying the character's Spell Bonus. I might be tempted to increase the Arcana roll to DC 13 for a (2d4+2) healing potion.
Also, keep in mind where the adventurers are located. Word of mouth might spread around leading to future business or a prisoner of war scenario in which the characters have to save their spell caster, because he/she has been kidnapped by a warlord who needs to keep healing potions readily available for his fiendish troops.
Honestly, the opportunities are endless.
... did this help?
I'd go about it this way: For healing potions they should have proficiency with the herbalism kit. They should also have the kit and the herbs/raw materials in question (whether bought or scrounged). If you want them to have access you can make it cheaper for them if they gather the goods, but that's really your call IMO. And then to do the actual crafting, they need to make successful checks of the appropriate DC for whatever they are trying to create. A failure makes a failed batch of whatever.
Healing potions are NOT healing kits or jars of Penicillin. They are potions. Magical potions. Their effects are almost instantaneous. They are more effective than ANYTHING we in the 21st Century can get our hands on for healing wounds. I find it hard to believe that just mixing a few ingredients and performing some basic chemistry is going to produce them. And I have no trouble suspending belief for liches, dragons, elves, or sober dwarves.
I am not arguing with the responses above, but saying that the ability to enchant the potion has to be considered; and that can make it even more fun.
"What if the players wanted to sell the potions? could this be profitable? " ???
So....if it was easy, everybody would be doing it and healing potions would be cheaper than deep fried potatoes; if it required the blood of a unicorn and moss gathered from the royal privvy of Gauntlegrim, then these hedge alchemists might decide snake oil is easier to produce.
"You don't really need a system per say just some logic and a basic core formula to keep it balanced." Hmmm, sounds like a system to me. :)
"What if the players wanted to sell the potions? could this be profitable? " The question really should be "Who is going to get upset when I start cutting in on their livelihoods, and what actions are they going to take?"
Tread on the toes of the Church, the Alchemist's Guild, or the Arch Mage with caution....
Roleplaying since Runequest.
Here's what I do.
1) you need the appropriate Kit proficiency in order to do it. If you don't have proficiency with blacksmithing tools, then no, you can't forge your own weapons. Want to be an alchemist, you need alchemist kits. No magic or spell levels required for any crafting. Slightly different than the normal D&D everyone-can-do-anything rules, but I'm making an exception here.
2) you need the appropriate materials. For simple, low level items, this is just stopping by the store and buying the ingredients. For more complex items, like a Potion of Haste, this requires some legwork and hunting them down through contacts, visiting an auction house, or mini-adventures in their own right. Buying purple worm venom isn't as simple as walking down the street to the local alchemist. I determine the number of such difficult-to-find ingredients based on the rarity of the item - common require none, uncommon require one, rare require two, very rare need three, legendary need four, artifacts would require five. I have no exact criteria for how to obtain them beyond the needs of the story at the given moment.
3) time to do the creation. The books suggest times in weeks and months, but I find that to be rather insanely long for a D&D game. I know, historically, it took a long time to purify metals, and you need to let drinks ferment, but that's just annoying in game. So, I tend to just say that it takes one downtime per ingredient, and one to actually make the item. I allow multiple iterations of the item to be made for potions or poisons or the like (assuming necessary ingredients), but everything else is just a flat one per downtime.
4) Make the roll, usually Int + Proficency. I use the CRs from Xanathar's Guide - 3, 8, 12, 18, 24 and 30 respectively for each level. Guidance cantrip and bardic inspirations are permitted, as are enchanted equipment (if you can find them!) Failure usually ruins the ingredients.
The DMG has the (optional) rules for creating and selling magic items, which is what potions of healing are.
Xanathar's Guide to Everything has another, in my opinion better, set of rules for creating magic items, including specific rules for potions of healing. It also has rules for selling magic items.
Here's the rules for crafting nonmagical objects, like poisons.
The Forum Infestation (TM)
i was thinking about making the ingredients relatively common but needing a high number of them.
for example, if we have a "Health Root" (obviously this will not be the final name) it would take 16 units of it to make a simple health potion (lets say 2d4 +2) this of course would be during a long rest. The player would have to make a relatively difficult Skill Check ... something like D20+Medicine+Herbalist Kit > 20 (this would allow ... in theory someone to roll at natural 20, have no proficiency and still pull it off) ... as the potion got stronger it would require more units of the like 32 Units of "Health Root" and now require a DC 25 to make a 4d4+4 potion. 64 units and DC 30 to make a 6D4 + 6 ... and on and on ....
Critical Rolls, I think on a natural 20 i would give them two potions .... and on a Natural 1 it would like brew a simple poison ... or perhaps explode destroying the herbalist kit...
Does this system seem like it would break the game?
You know, you might want to present the idea to your gaming group. See what input they may have. Establishing Table Rules for homebrew adventurers/campaign settings is one of the perks of having an at-home gaming group. Over time a sort of compendium grows. What’s allowed, what’s not, what’s adjustable, what’s inflexible, these rules pertinent to your group flavor the Table. And such a discussion invites a different kind of participation game play does not always include: consensus.
Also, I’ve found, once players reach Tier 2 game play—especially Tier 3—they develop a want to affect the setting itself. You never know, a spell caster or fighter in the group, for examples, might want to buy or build a potion shop somewhere along the High Road in Faerûn, or clear a trail from the Coast Way near Baldur's Gate to the shop’s front door. Maybe the players want to set up shop near Yartar. Plenty of business flowing from that caravan crossroad.
If the players are looking to get into the business of selling potions, let ‘em. Such a responsibility would certainly come with employees, a rotating mercenary or adventuring guard. A visiting Harper perhaps from time to time. A local tax collector? Building maintenance too. Good reason to have a Charisma score with a positive modifier, or not. A grumpy business owner—never heard of that!
As a DM, I like watching the players develop a living history for their characters. Gives me a chance to say: You wake suddenly from a fretful dream. A voice cries out from the dark, calling for you. The voice at first is warbled, indistinct, but minutes later the voice is crystal clear, and its warning strikes like a thunderbolt. A message spell has been cast. You recognize the voice. It’s your shopkeep. “Help! Come quick! They’ve taken everything! Every last potion and gold coin collected for the last month!”
Stuff like that.
Happy adventuring…
With the proviso that this is how it is in my game world, and no one else's .... :) ....
As The_Plundered_Tombs pointed out, healing potions are far in advance of anything humans have ever produced in medical arts, or - barring the development of cheap, easy and safe nanotechnology - are likely to ever produce. In my opinion - only - healing potions are horrifically broken from a pseudo-realism perspective, but they exist as they do for perfectly good game mechanic reasons.
I don't see healing potions as being chemical or alchemical in world: dump these ingredients together, into this process, and you get a potion - or economics would either make them way more expensive than they are due to the high demand of a rare commodity, or they would be super common - to the point that they'd really warp the shape of the societies in the fantasy world ( farming communities keep a keg of the stuff on hand for accidents, middle class and up households have one or more on hand for emergencies, at all times, etc. - maybe in your world, this is how it is ).
From a game perspective, you have to have a game-mechanical process to do exactly that - unless you go for a completely deus ex machina origin for healing potions like "Healing potions are not created by mortals at all. They are a natural resources, slowly dripping from the rocks of certain caves which are sites considered Holy by the God of Healing ...", which could be an interesting spin on things ( It certainly would bypass "Skill + Materials (cost) + Time" ).
I'm of the opinion that if healing potions existed in game, they would be more akin to repositories for healing spells - you could create an alchemical potion base, which essentially acts a kind of Ring of Spell Storing for a healing spell - which means that you would need a healing spellcaster to create one, although other classes might be able to help participate in creating the alchemical base to store the magical energies.
So if you want a game mechanic recipe, then I'd say:
Note that steps 2, 4, and 6-7 could all be done by different people.
It's not how I handle healing potions ( or healing potion analogues ) in my world, but I think it's a reasonable "simple" approach.
Poisons would be easier.
I'd say that the same steps could be used, but the mystical aspects would not be needed - and I'd allow a lot more leeway on harvesting and storing ingredients. Perhaps those ingredients could be purchased from herbalists, if you knew where to look.
Hope that helps.
My DM Philosophy, as summed up by other people: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1rN5w4-azTq3Kbn0Yvk9nfqQhwQ1R5by1/view
Disclaimer: This signature is a badge of membership in the Forum Loudmouth Club. We are all friends. We are not attacking each other. We are engaging in spirited, friendly debate with one another. We may get snarky, but these are not attacks. Thank you for not reporting us.
I have a rogue who uses poisons. Is there a source that says what herbs and plants could be used to make poisons?
nope, DND 5e does an absolutely terrible job of anything crafting related. I also have players who rather make all of there own gear then buy or find anything.
Feel freed to private message me if anyone has further questions about my system.
DnD is horrible at crafting because it is not an economic simulator, it is a killing monster simulator. Make it too easy, and why adventure at all really, much safer making coin selling goods. Make it too hard and then it questions why those items are EVER for sale, since the cost of making would far outweigh the prices they are listed.
Combining time, effort, and coin using adventure hooks, skill checks, etc. is a pretty good combination. Personally I don't let characters craft anything magical and rarely anything mundane. It takes years of specialization to be an artisan or crafter, and that time would have taken up the time to learn the skills to ADVENTURE. Thus, I tend to give out "hooks" for ingredients which result in "discounts" for the characters from the listed price. Which usually results in them not only getting the ingredients/materials the crafter needs, but also some coin to offset the cost and of course, XP and more interaction opportunities with the world.
No real right or wrong way though, just putting out the method I use most often.
What is the point of the Tool Proficiency ? If your players accept this kind of system them all means do it, but my players would never do it.
To address your second point: They do.
To address your first point: You tell me, some of them make sense, some of them don't. Certain ones, like Disguise or Thieves, a penalty is applied to the check without them. For others like Brewer's, downtime only activity, can offset living expenses. Overall, most tool proficiencies are associated with backgrounds, more something they use to do, but don't do anymore. Can get some benefits or problems from it from time to time, but not the main focus. For us, downtime is always handled away from the table. Whether it is hours, days, or years, doesn't really matter, table time is for role play, intrigue, and combat, not working 9-5 to obtain something that can be had in a day of encounters.
I got a cleric at the table that bought a "Alchemy for dummies" book and started practicing with that. As well a rogue wanting to tinker and create stuff, including poisons and such.
1. When traveling they can declare the desire to look for stuff in the wild. I have them roll a Survival/Nature check to see if they find something. Through a random table it is generated what they find, what it can be turned into and for how many doses.
2. Working on Alchemy and preparations they can spend 2-3 hours before sleep and then let the distillation process etc run while they sleep. I'm nice that way. With a simple Int check with a DC19 they get the full doses prepared. At 17 only 1 or 2 doses are successfully made. After 9 months in game through application of Alchemy, or learning from a trainer somewhere, they can become proficient and gain the proficiency bonus to make the rolls easier.
3. For healing potions I require the cleric to use Nature/Wilderness Check to find the ingredients. An Alchemy Check to make the liquid substance. Then 8 hours of Divine Prayer to infuse the liquid with its full healing properties. This prevents the players from flooding the market with their own potions...to a degree hehehe.
4. The cleric now wants to start a business for alchemy creations. In town there is a magic store that dabbles some into alchemy. Will be interesting to see how the cleric will get the deed to a store and deal with possible competition. For this its best to keep it as simple as possible. Nobody likes extensive book keeping.
---Once a month roll on a table. Outcome will range from "Massive loss", "minor loss", "break even", "minor profit", "Massive profit". The "break even" price is what the DM has to come up with in relation to the economy in the game.
As a DM just turn that roll into a narrative explanation. Employee X went out to find the ingredients but ran into a group of Bullywugs in the swamp. They prevented him to get what was required. Employee Y saw a need in the community and started to focus on brewing this one particular elixir... etc etc. And some made up descriptions might cause the Cleric to go on a quest to deal with whatever was going on.