I think I've kinda gone a bit overboard with the build up to this, the players are about to enter their BBEG fight for a long running 2 year campaign. They are only level 12 (i know, we play slow), and the end game boss is a kraken priest.
Summary of the story: Three followers of Talos are gaining believers of the cause to give power to Talos and create chaos and destruction to the world. The players are on their quest to destroy each of the three followers and stop Talos. They are up against the final one, the Ravager who is a kraken priest. This priest will summon a kraken, full size, full power, and yes the players are too low to take it on 1v1. So they players have been gaining allies, they have 6 ships from the lords alliance at their disposal, as well as 2 of their own and they have also allied with an adult blue dragon who has prior beef with the kraken. The Ravager has a fleet of 9 ships and a kraken, and has previously used sahuagin in his attacks.
The players are sailing head first towards the Ravagers fleet on a stolen Talos supply ship, the intel they have is that there are 9 ships in the opposing fleet, a kraken will join the fight, but they do not know the make up of the fleet, as in any of the enemies that will be aboard the ships. Their plan is to sneaky sneaky water walk to the command ship and assassinate the Ravager, whilst the bought out crew who should be supplying the Talos fleet keeps the other boats busy by unloading the cargo. One of the ships in the players fleet is also rigged with explosives, it was a deterrent for being pirated, and they fully intend on detonating this ship at some point.
My question, this will turn into a fight consisting of 5 players, with 8 ships at their disposal and blue dragon, against 9 ships kraken.
How the hell do I run this fight? I've seen rules for ship vs ship combat, but the dragon and kraken may slap those rules in the face, and the players fully intend to board ships and use standard combat rules. I can change the class of dragon to ancient if it helps the combat, I can add sahuagin and wizards on the enemy ships for flavour, due to lack of information the players have gathered I can be flexible with what is going on, I'm also not opposed to using custom rules to oversee this fight but the players definitely want to use their abilities and attacks as per standard combat rules.
The original intent for this fight was to be ship vs ship combat, running it more like a vehicle based wargame, each player commanded a ship. But they are boarding the bloody enemy ship and consider having a player per ship as "splitting the party" so won't do it.
Have a sea map, give the ships an AC, HP, and some sort of roll for cannons. Oh, and a movement speeed. Now you can treat the ships as "characters" and let them wear down the Kraken and the other ships.
Once you get the ships on the both sides kinda reduced or wiped out, (and hopefully the kraken and the dragon are fairly depleted), and they're ready to take the kraken head on, let the kraken be a GINORMOUS thing on a new map for the characters to fight either 1v1 at that point, or from the perspective of a ship.
You don't have to use the "character" level scale for everything. You don't have to follow the characters moving 30 ft per 6 seconds when journeying across the continent, so why do that now?
Just up the scale of your maps and units to fit what you need till you can drop down to a smaller one when it works.
EDIT:
Sorry. Saw the last bit. Still would say the same thing. The dragon and kraken would just be units as you would vehicles. They also f*** off when the characters want to board ships. When the characters board, they drop scale down to the personal one again. then once they conquer the ship, they have to go back up to world travel scale, Rinse and repeat. Have multiple ships drawn out.
You will need to have flags to signal the other other ships, which will take a turn to signal and a turn to enact (so always a delay -- but that applies to both sides). Only because it adds tension and the possibility of conflicting commands.
good luck
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Only a DM since 1980 (3000+ Sessions) / PhD, MS, MA / Mixed, Bi, Trans, Woman / No longer welcome in the US, apparently
Wyrlde: Adventures in the Seven Cities .-=] Lore Book | Patreon | Wyrlde YT [=-. An original Setting for 5e, a whole solar system of adventure. Ongoing updates, exclusies, more. Not Talking About It / Dubbed The Oracle in the Cult of Mythology Nerds
You could also do the classic DND ruling of: whatever happens outside the players' combat doesn't affect them. If they're sneaking into the main BBEG ship to assassinate him, then only have them and whoever is in the immediate vicinity in the combat itself. Anything else will turn into a slog.
The rest, such as the kraken/dragon/explosive boats/fleets, can be willing be set dressing to affect certain rounds of the combat. Maybe the kraken appears and attacks the party for one round, then the dragon swoops down and fights it back. The party can still choose how to affect things, such as calling for the dragon's help or signaling to explode the trap ship.
I don't think the players should be the ones in charge of everything - they should be focused on the BBEG. That's just my 2cp though.
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I know what you're thinking: "In that flurry of blows, did he use all his ki points, or save one?" Well, are ya feeling lucky, punk?
Thanks guys, I went with the overall map and then a battlemap for when they board a boat. They ignored all the naval stuff and when straight in for a full frontal attack against the lead boat in the fleet.
They have killed the BBEG in 3 turns, now the kraken has turned up, they decided "we got this", and well, after 1 turn it's not gone well for them. The dragon is about to approach, the rest of their fleet is about to rain down hell, their priority now is get off this ship and find a way to survive. Good learning curve, prep all you want as a DM, but the players will find a way to go off piste and make you think on your toes.
Now the BBEG needs a final form, theres still a priestess left on the boat so some form of revivify and anime style level up is required, thats one thing I find interesting that each group will appreciate something different. They said to me "damn, if theres no final form of this kraken priest I'll be disappointed"
The advice of showing them what the characters see and limit it to that has been really useful for this planning, thanks guys, looking forward to the next 2 sessions of continuing this long arse fight!
Thanks guys, I went with the overall map and then a battlemap for when they board a boat. They ignored all the naval stuff and when straight in for a full frontal attack against the lead boat in the fleet.
They have killed the BBEG in 3 turns, now the kraken has turned up, they decided "we got this", and well, after 1 turn it's not gone well for them. The dragon is about to approach, the rest of their fleet is about to rain down hell, their priority now is get off this ship and find a way to survive. Good learning curve, prep all you want as a DM, but the players will find a way to go off piste and make you think on your toes.
Now the BBEG needs a final form, theres still a priestess left on the boat so some form of revivify and anime style level up is required, thats one thing I find interesting that each group will appreciate something different. They said to me "damn, if theres no final form of this kraken priest I'll be disappointed"
The advice of showing them what the characters see and limit it to that has been really useful for this planning, thanks guys, looking forward to the next 2 sessions of continuing this long arse fight!
I think I've kinda gone a bit overboard with the build up to this, the players are about to enter their BBEG fight for a long running 2 year campaign. They are only level 12 (i know, we play slow), and the end game boss is a kraken priest.
Summary of the story: Three followers of Talos are gaining believers of the cause to give power to Talos and create chaos and destruction to the world. The players are on their quest to destroy each of the three followers and stop Talos. They are up against the final one, the Ravager who is a kraken priest. This priest will summon a kraken, full size, full power, and yes the players are too low to take it on 1v1. So they players have been gaining allies, they have 6 ships from the lords alliance at their disposal, as well as 2 of their own and they have also allied with an adult blue dragon who has prior beef with the kraken. The Ravager has a fleet of 9 ships and a kraken, and has previously used sahuagin in his attacks.
The players are sailing head first towards the Ravagers fleet on a stolen Talos supply ship, the intel they have is that there are 9 ships in the opposing fleet, a kraken will join the fight, but they do not know the make up of the fleet, as in any of the enemies that will be aboard the ships. Their plan is to sneaky sneaky water walk to the command ship and assassinate the Ravager, whilst the bought out crew who should be supplying the Talos fleet keeps the other boats busy by unloading the cargo. One of the ships in the players fleet is also rigged with explosives, it was a deterrent for being pirated, and they fully intend on detonating this ship at some point.
My question, this will turn into a fight consisting of 5 players, with 8 ships at their disposal and blue dragon, against 9 ships kraken.
How the hell do I run this fight? I've seen rules for ship vs ship combat, but the dragon and kraken may slap those rules in the face, and the players fully intend to board ships and use standard combat rules. I can change the class of dragon to ancient if it helps the combat, I can add sahuagin and wizards on the enemy ships for flavour, due to lack of information the players have gathered I can be flexible with what is going on, I'm also not opposed to using custom rules to oversee this fight but the players definitely want to use their abilities and attacks as per standard combat rules.
The original intent for this fight was to be ship vs ship combat, running it more like a vehicle based wargame, each player commanded a ship. But they are boarding the bloody enemy ship and consider having a player per ship as "splitting the party" so won't do it.
Have a sea map, give the ships an AC, HP, and some sort of roll for cannons. Oh, and a movement speeed. Now you can treat the ships as "characters" and let them wear down the Kraken and the other ships.
Once you get the ships on the both sides kinda reduced or wiped out, (and hopefully the kraken and the dragon are fairly depleted), and they're ready to take the kraken head on, let the kraken be a GINORMOUS thing on a new map for the characters to fight either 1v1 at that point, or from the perspective of a ship.
You don't have to use the "character" level scale for everything. You don't have to follow the characters moving 30 ft per 6 seconds when journeying across the continent, so why do that now?
Just up the scale of your maps and units to fit what you need till you can drop down to a smaller one when it works.
EDIT:
Sorry. Saw the last bit. Still would say the same thing. The dragon and kraken would just be units as you would vehicles. They also f*** off when the characters want to board ships. When the characters board, they drop scale down to the personal one again. then once they conquer the ship, they have to go back up to world travel scale, Rinse and repeat. Have multiple ships drawn out.
Welcome to naval wargaming?
Bob-the+Fish is pretty much dead on. Ghosts of Saltmarsh has stat blocks for ships, a quick google search and choice of first pick gives me this: https://www.gmbinder.com/share/-LfeUt9PwgZNsa00Kv3N
You will need to have flags to signal the other other ships, which will take a turn to signal and a turn to enact (so always a delay -- but that applies to both sides). Only because it adds tension and the possibility of conflicting commands.
good luck
Only a DM since 1980 (3000+ Sessions) / PhD, MS, MA / Mixed, Bi, Trans, Woman / No longer welcome in the US, apparently
Wyrlde: Adventures in the Seven Cities
.-=] Lore Book | Patreon | Wyrlde YT [=-.
An original Setting for 5e, a whole solar system of adventure. Ongoing updates, exclusies, more.
Not Talking About It / Dubbed The Oracle in the Cult of Mythology Nerds
You could also do the classic DND ruling of: whatever happens outside the players' combat doesn't affect them. If they're sneaking into the main BBEG ship to assassinate him, then only have them and whoever is in the immediate vicinity in the combat itself. Anything else will turn into a slog.
The rest, such as the kraken/dragon/explosive boats/fleets, can be willing be set dressing to affect certain rounds of the combat. Maybe the kraken appears and attacks the party for one round, then the dragon swoops down and fights it back. The party can still choose how to affect things, such as calling for the dragon's help or signaling to explode the trap ship.
I don't think the players should be the ones in charge of everything - they should be focused on the BBEG. That's just my 2cp though.
I know what you're thinking: "In that flurry of blows, did he use all his ki points, or save one?" Well, are ya feeling lucky, punk?
Thanks guys, I went with the overall map and then a battlemap for when they board a boat. They ignored all the naval stuff and when straight in for a full frontal attack against the lead boat in the fleet.
They have killed the BBEG in 3 turns, now the kraken has turned up, they decided "we got this", and well, after 1 turn it's not gone well for them. The dragon is about to approach, the rest of their fleet is about to rain down hell, their priority now is get off this ship and find a way to survive. Good learning curve, prep all you want as a DM, but the players will find a way to go off piste and make you think on your toes.
Now the BBEG needs a final form, theres still a priestess left on the boat so some form of revivify and anime style level up is required, thats one thing I find interesting that each group will appreciate something different. They said to me "damn, if theres no final form of this kraken priest I'll be disappointed"
The advice of showing them what the characters see and limit it to that has been really useful for this planning, thanks guys, looking forward to the next 2 sessions of continuing this long arse fight!
Kraken priests: final form MUST be Cthulhu...
Damn, I think I might have to do that. I’m sure the guys will crap themselves over Cthulhu
Lol. There's some actually pretty good stat blocks if you browse homebrew.
https://www.dndbeyond.com/monsters/2809623-cthulhu