Hello! My group has been playing for almost 7 years together, and have taken their characters all the way from level 1 to 20 in the game. The campaign actually ened a few years ago when they had their original final fight, but we have been doing what we've been calling a level 20 "DLC" where they get to have an arc 10 years after they saved the world. For my most of my playefs these characters were their first ever DND characters and first time playing DND, and some of them have since became DMs for their games too, so this world and character hold a special place for them.
What I need help is with this: how do I make this final *final* battle be as "spectical" and fun as possible, since this is most likely the last time they'll ever play these characters or be in this world again?
Context for the final battle they'll be having: They have discoved the person who was manipulating not only several countries to be at war with each other, but threatened to bring war to the country the group protects as sworn heros and captured their children. The one behind everything is a Goddess of Fate and Chaos (she's both because she's her own twin and has 2 souls, and the conflicting magic has slowly turned her mad). The group is currently in the castle of one of the countries that are fighting, after they took care of the king (he was the one to organize their children to be captured to lure the groups country into the war), and they put together the last puzzle clues that this Goddess was the string puller this whole time. There is a huge battle happening outsode the castle as well, and several powerful allies that the party have made in their journey out there helping. The last session ened with them rolling for initivie against this Goddess. How do i make this fight as cool and spectical as possible?
A fun (read: horrible) idea would be to have the goddess manifest the various versions of the Deck of Many Things that swirl around her and allow her to "force" a character to draw a card each turn as she flings said card at them. Maybe it's good, maybe it's not. It's fate.
Also, try to make the sense of combat feel more cinematic than game-ist. Use a lot of description and try to keep things moving and not become a slog of math forever as player pile numbers on the boss until she falls. Add stages to the combat where things change as the goddess becomes worn down. There are some good examples of this in the Icewind Dale adventure with how the party is meant to defeat Auril.
The thing about level 20 combat is that, if you want to make it still challenging and rewarding, you really cannot worry about "did I make this *too* hard?"
The hardest thing to do is to ignore that impulse to protect your players. At level 20 you gotta basically try to kill them. Bust out Mordenkainen's Tome of Foes with all those high powered monsters nobody ever gets a chance to use, and throw them at the players.
If you *do* actually, accidently go too overboard, you can try to scale it back in the moment. Have a high level NPC ally intervene (I'm sure in 7 years they've become attached to some other characters) or tweak monster HP totals on the fly if you need to. But don't worry about that going into it
Combats will be memorable not for the mechanics, but for the emotions. The fight is really the sideshow to provide a vehicle for an emotional climax and final choices.
If they really are attached to some of those NPCs, I’d put some in danger. Make them choose to either keep fighting the goddess or go help their friend. If you really want to up the emotional stakes, make it so they have to choose between two or three NPCs, where they can’t save everyone. And let the person actually die. At level 20, they’ll have wish and/or true res, so maybe actual death isn’t on the table long term, but make the choices meaningful. Don’t be bashful about killing off one or more of those NPCs, the classic final victory always comes with a loss or two.
Maybe force it so the only way to truly, finally win is for one if the PCs sacrifices themself. Like they need to read the final words of the ritual, knowing they won’t be able to escape and will be sucked into whatever they’re going to trap the goddess in. Someplace outside of time, where they can’t be wished back.
Or, they’re going to split the halves into two separate beings, so the god can finally be reconciled. But to do it, one of the PCs needs to volunteer their body as a host. So the character dies, but also kind of becomes a god. Then in the next campaign, you can have clerics of the old PC.
Or combine them, where one reads the ritual and is consumed by the energy (and this is birth of a god type energy, not even a wish can bring them back), while a different one becomes a the new god.
at level 20, characters are essentially demigods, so REALLY lean into mythic descriptions and hyperboles (it fills up the sky)
(as you hit the goddess, the earth itself quakes)
(as she lays dying at your feet, you feel the entire universe shake at the killing of a god)
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Pronouns: Any/All
About Me: Godless monster in human form bent on extending their natural life to unnatural extremes /general of the goose horde /Moderator of Vinstreb School for the Gifted /holder of the evil storyteller badge of no honor /king of madness /The FBI/ The Archmage of I CAST...!
Alignment: Lawful Evil
Fun Fact: i gain more power the more you post on my forum threads. MUAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!
I am currently planning my own final battle with a god, my players are not as powerful as yours but some of the some things can apply to both. Since the enemy is a literal god, they should be so powerful the party can't beat them in a conventional way.
For background, my campaign is going to end when the villain casts a spell that allows them to take the godly power from a dirty of their choice. Since my BBEG just got his power he is a bit weakened and even slow to react to the players immediately after he succeeds. I have it set up so the party has to destroy some crystals that are kinda storing divine energy to make it easier for the BBEG to handle it. Once they destroy these it will weaken his even further, enough to take him head on and finish him off.
This isn't really advice on how to run level 20, but I think it would be really cool to show how even the most powerful adventurers would have to defeat you villain in an unconventional method. Or maybe she is too powerful to straight up kill and instead you need to hold her off while she uses up energy or a powerful ritual spell is cast to banish her.
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Hello! My group has been playing for almost 7 years together, and have taken their characters all the way from level 1 to 20 in the game. The campaign actually ened a few years ago when they had their original final fight, but we have been doing what we've been calling a level 20 "DLC" where they get to have an arc 10 years after they saved the world. For my most of my playefs these characters were their first ever DND characters and first time playing DND, and some of them have since became DMs for their games too, so this world and character hold a special place for them.
What I need help is with this: how do I make this final *final* battle be as "spectical" and fun as possible, since this is most likely the last time they'll ever play these characters or be in this world again?
Context for the final battle they'll be having: They have discoved the person who was manipulating not only several countries to be at war with each other, but threatened to bring war to the country the group protects as sworn heros and captured their children. The one behind everything is a Goddess of Fate and Chaos (she's both because she's her own twin and has 2 souls, and the conflicting magic has slowly turned her mad). The group is currently in the castle of one of the countries that are fighting, after they took care of the king (he was the one to organize their children to be captured to lure the groups country into the war), and they put together the last puzzle clues that this Goddess was the string puller this whole time. There is a huge battle happening outsode the castle as well, and several powerful allies that the party have made in their journey out there helping. The last session ened with them rolling for initivie against this Goddess. How do i make this fight as cool and spectical as possible?
A fun (read: horrible) idea would be to have the goddess manifest the various versions of the Deck of Many Things that swirl around her and allow her to "force" a character to draw a card each turn as she flings said card at them. Maybe it's good, maybe it's not. It's fate.
Also, try to make the sense of combat feel more cinematic than game-ist. Use a lot of description and try to keep things moving and not become a slog of math forever as player pile numbers on the boss until she falls. Add stages to the combat where things change as the goddess becomes worn down. There are some good examples of this in the Icewind Dale adventure with how the party is meant to defeat Auril.
The thing about level 20 combat is that, if you want to make it still challenging and rewarding, you really cannot worry about "did I make this *too* hard?"
The hardest thing to do is to ignore that impulse to protect your players. At level 20 you gotta basically try to kill them. Bust out Mordenkainen's Tome of Foes with all those high powered monsters nobody ever gets a chance to use, and throw them at the players.
If you *do* actually, accidently go too overboard, you can try to scale it back in the moment. Have a high level NPC ally intervene (I'm sure in 7 years they've become attached to some other characters) or tweak monster HP totals on the fly if you need to. But don't worry about that going into it
Just go for it!
Combats will be memorable not for the mechanics, but for the emotions. The fight is really the sideshow to provide a vehicle for an emotional climax and final choices.
If they really are attached to some of those NPCs, I’d put some in danger. Make them choose to either keep fighting the goddess or go help their friend. If you really want to up the emotional stakes, make it so they have to choose between two or three NPCs, where they can’t save everyone. And let the person actually die. At level 20, they’ll have wish and/or true res, so maybe actual death isn’t on the table long term, but make the choices meaningful. Don’t be bashful about killing off one or more of those NPCs, the classic final victory always comes with a loss or two.
Maybe force it so the only way to truly, finally win is for one if the PCs sacrifices themself. Like they need to read the final words of the ritual, knowing they won’t be able to escape and will be sucked into whatever they’re going to trap the goddess in. Someplace outside of time, where they can’t be wished back.
Or, they’re going to split the halves into two separate beings, so the god can finally be reconciled. But to do it, one of the PCs needs to volunteer their body as a host. So the character dies, but also kind of becomes a god. Then in the next campaign, you can have clerics of the old PC.
Or combine them, where one reads the ritual and is consumed by the energy (and this is birth of a god type energy, not even a wish can bring them back), while a different one becomes a the new god.
at level 20, characters are essentially demigods, so REALLY lean into mythic descriptions and hyperboles (it fills up the sky)
(as you hit the goddess, the earth itself quakes)
(as she lays dying at your feet, you feel the entire universe shake at the killing of a god)
Pronouns: Any/All
About Me: Godless monster in human form bent on extending their natural life to unnatural extremes /general of the goose horde /Moderator of Vinstreb School for the Gifted /holder of the evil storyteller badge of no honor /king of madness /The FBI/ The Archmage of I CAST...!
Alignment: Lawful Evil
Fun Fact: i gain more power the more you post on my forum threads. MUAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!
I am currently planning my own final battle with a god, my players are not as powerful as yours but some of the some things can apply to both. Since the enemy is a literal god, they should be so powerful the party can't beat them in a conventional way.
For background, my campaign is going to end when the villain casts a spell that allows them to take the godly power from a dirty of their choice. Since my BBEG just got his power he is a bit weakened and even slow to react to the players immediately after he succeeds. I have it set up so the party has to destroy some crystals that are kinda storing divine energy to make it easier for the BBEG to handle it. Once they destroy these it will weaken his even further, enough to take him head on and finish him off.
This isn't really advice on how to run level 20, but I think it would be really cool to show how even the most powerful adventurers would have to defeat you villain in an unconventional method. Or maybe she is too powerful to straight up kill and instead you need to hold her off while she uses up energy or a powerful ritual spell is cast to banish her.