I have a party of four Tier 3 PCs and we've just implemented the Bastion system retroactively; mostly as a test run to see how it works.
4 Special Facilities per PC, so 16 Special Facilities.
They opted to take a week off (10 days in Faerûn) and did a Bastion turn.
After a few rolls, and an expenditure of 3200gp, they just gained 16 Uncommon magic items!
I mean, they all have Gauntlets of Ogre Power, +1 everything, bags of Holding, etc.
1 week.
Now, I realize I'm the DM and have all the tools I need to limit things; it's my world yadda yadda. I get that. But, for this test run, we tried to just let the system work as written.
I can't help but feel like I'm just overlooking it misunderstanding some key element of the mechanics as written.
Can anyone shed any light on
this?
Thanks!
EDIT: Aaaahaaa! You folks already spotted where my erroneous impressions originate.
First, 2 of the PCs did in fact mistakenly take facilities for which they did not meet the prerequisites.
Second, they hadn't considered the fact that they're forcing themselves into a corner with regards to attunement choices. This sudden boom isn't sustainable unless they're planning on becoming magic item merchants...which isn't likely to pay off like they might think.
Thanks so much for your observations and analysis!
If you look at the new PHB's section on starting characters at higher levels it says that a tier 3 party can be expected to start with 2 common, 3 uncommon and 1 rare magic item so having your four person tier 3 party making 16 uncommon magic items using the Bastions seems more or less in line with that. I think it seems like a lot due to a combination of most DMs handing out fewer magic items than the developers obviously think we do (I'm including myself in that) and that if you'd established Bastions at level 5 you'd have built up this stockpile slower and it wouldn't seem such a shock
I have a party of four Tier 3 PCs and we've just implemented the Bastion system retroactively; mostly as a test run to see how it works.
4 Special Facilities per PC, so 16 Special Facilities.
They opted to take a week off (10 days in Faerûn) and did a Bastion turn.
After a few rolls, and an expenditure of 3200gp, they just gained 16 Uncommon magic items!
I mean, they all have Gauntlets of Ogre Power, +1 everything, bags of Holding, etc.
1 week.
Now, I realize I'm the DM and have all the tools I need to limit things; it's my world yadda yadda. I get that. But, for this test run, we tried to just let the system work as written.
I can't help but feel like I'm just overlooking it misunderstanding some key element of the mechanics as written.
Can anyone shed any light on
this?
Thanks!
Can you explain exactly how you got to that number? The special facilities that can craft uncommon magic items are the Arcane Study, Sacristy, Smithy, and Workshop. Are you saying all four of your players each have all four of these facilities? That would require all four players to have levels in an arcane caster class (for the Arcane Study) and levels in a divine caster class (for the Sacristy). Not unheard of, but a little odd.
You get 2 facilities at 5th and 2 a 9th (can choose anyone available). And I guess, basically every member of the party chose the same 4 crafting facilities for their Bastion (did a fast read, there may be another), and in that Turn selected to craft 1 item from each (most available post 9th). Now some have a prerequisite:
- Arcane Study (5th- use arcane focus or tool*(artificer)). magic tiem(arcana)
- Sacristy (9th Holy Symbol or druid focus): magic item (Relic)
- Scriptorium: craft spell scrolls
- Smithy (5th - none): magic item: Armament
- Workshop (5th -none) magic item: implement.
So in most cases, all your players chose the smithy, workshop, the caster facility of choice, and a 4th one. They should not be able to craft 4 uncommon items unless most are multiclassed in divine/druidic and arcane focus using (not entirely imposisble)... at most 3 uncommons, and a scroll or a potion per player?... its still a lot, but its doable.
But thats basically everything it does now (yes, it is powerfully good to craft magic items)... Magic items are still limited by Attunement slots and other aspects, but uncommon items are extremely good. They won't have any more variance in what their bastions do after that (craft the items again for selling?). Dont forget to roll the "special events" to see if something else happens (positive or negative).
Since you are the DM, you are the one that puts the conditions on what happens.
Deterministic crafting is always powerfull and Bastions gives you the people that do it without the player intervening*, since all it needs, its time and money, but time can be taken away by campaing plot (Bastions just keep the Mantain order), and money its given in treasures (completely DM purview), unless they go dragon hunting or something (but that also brings a lot of complications).
Aaaahaaa! You folks already spotted where my erroneous impressions originate.
First, 2 of the PCs did in fact mistakenly take facilities for which they did not meet the prerequisites.
Second, they hadn't considered the fact that they're forcing themselves into a corner with regards to attunement choices. This sudden boom isn't sustainable unless they're planning on becoming magic item merchants...which isn't likely to pay off like they might think.
Thanks so much for your observations and analysis!
I’d also say, if word gets out that there’s an unguarded magic item factory in the area, the place will be a juicy target for bandits the next time the PCs are out. You can always just choose that bastion event where they get attacked, and since there’s no guards, they’ll lose the use of one of their facilities for a bit. I’m a little conflicted on suggesting this, as it feels kind of like punishing them for their choices. But there’s a fine line between punishment and logical, in-game consequences.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
To post a comment, please login or register a new account.
Context:
I have a party of four Tier 3 PCs and we've just implemented the Bastion system retroactively; mostly as a test run to see how it works.
4 Special Facilities per PC, so 16 Special Facilities.
They opted to take a week off (10 days in Faerûn) and did a Bastion turn.
After a few rolls, and an expenditure of 3200gp, they just gained 16 Uncommon magic items!
I mean, they all have Gauntlets of Ogre Power, +1 everything, bags of Holding, etc.
1 week.
Now, I realize I'm the DM and have all the tools I need to limit things; it's my world yadda yadda. I get that. But, for this test run, we tried to just let the system work as written.
I can't help but feel like I'm just overlooking it misunderstanding some key element of the mechanics as written.
Can anyone shed any light on
this?
Thanks!
EDIT: Aaaahaaa! You folks already spotted where my erroneous impressions originate.
First, 2 of the PCs did in fact mistakenly take facilities for which they did not meet the prerequisites.
Second, they hadn't considered the fact that they're forcing themselves into a corner with regards to attunement choices. This sudden boom isn't sustainable unless they're planning on becoming magic item merchants...which isn't likely to pay off like they might think.
Thanks so much for your observations and analysis!
If you look at the new PHB's section on starting characters at higher levels it says that a tier 3 party can be expected to start with 2 common, 3 uncommon and 1 rare magic item so having your four person tier 3 party making 16 uncommon magic items using the Bastions seems more or less in line with that. I think it seems like a lot due to a combination of most DMs handing out fewer magic items than the developers obviously think we do (I'm including myself in that) and that if you'd established Bastions at level 5 you'd have built up this stockpile slower and it wouldn't seem such a shock
Can you explain exactly how you got to that number? The special facilities that can craft uncommon magic items are the Arcane Study, Sacristy, Smithy, and Workshop. Are you saying all four of your players each have all four of these facilities? That would require all four players to have levels in an arcane caster class (for the Arcane Study) and levels in a divine caster class (for the Sacristy). Not unheard of, but a little odd.
pronouns: he/she/they
Let me see.
You get 2 facilities at 5th and 2 a 9th (can choose anyone available).
And I guess, basically every member of the party chose the same 4 crafting facilities for their Bastion (did a fast read, there may be another), and in that Turn selected to craft 1 item from each (most available post 9th). Now some have a prerequisite:
- Arcane Study (5th- use arcane focus or tool*(artificer)). magic tiem(arcana)
- Sacristy (9th Holy Symbol or druid focus): magic item (Relic)
- Scriptorium: craft spell scrolls
- Smithy (5th - none): magic item: Armament
- Workshop (5th -none) magic item: implement.
So in most cases, all your players chose the smithy, workshop, the caster facility of choice, and a 4th one. They should not be able to craft 4 uncommon items unless most are multiclassed in divine/druidic and arcane focus using (not entirely imposisble)... at most 3 uncommons, and a scroll or a potion per player?... its still a lot, but its doable.
But thats basically everything it does now (yes, it is powerfully good to craft magic items)... Magic items are still limited by Attunement slots and other aspects, but uncommon items are extremely good. They won't have any more variance in what their bastions do after that (craft the items again for selling?). Dont forget to roll the "special events" to see if something else happens (positive or negative).
Since you are the DM, you are the one that puts the conditions on what happens.
Deterministic crafting is always powerfull and Bastions gives you the people that do it without the player intervening*, since all it needs, its time and money, but time can be taken away by campaing plot (Bastions just keep the Mantain order), and money its given in treasures (completely DM purview), unless they go dragon hunting or something (but that also brings a lot of complications).
Aaaahaaa! You folks already spotted where my erroneous impressions originate.
First, 2 of the PCs did in fact mistakenly take facilities for which they did not meet the prerequisites.
Second, they hadn't considered the fact that they're forcing themselves into a corner with regards to attunement choices. This sudden boom isn't sustainable unless they're planning on becoming magic item merchants...which isn't likely to pay off like they might think.
Thanks so much for your observations and analysis!
I’d also say, if word gets out that there’s an unguarded magic item factory in the area, the place will be a juicy target for bandits the next time the PCs are out. You can always just choose that bastion event where they get attacked, and since there’s no guards, they’ll lose the use of one of their facilities for a bit.
I’m a little conflicted on suggesting this, as it feels kind of like punishing them for their choices. But there’s a fine line between punishment and logical, in-game consequences.