This being an old thread, this advice is for others who read through this:
1: CR is designs for multiple fights (6-8) per long rest, so a single deadly encounter won't be deadly unless it's amongst other encounters.
2: How you play them is key. If you drop the enemy 30ft. fro mthe party and then say "ok, go!" then the monsters will probably die. The boltchuckers, in this case, should have been at range, perhaps flanking the party or up towers/on cliffs if possible, to avoid melee. Nobody in history has won a battle with archers in the front rank, except perhaps the first people to invent bows!
3: As others said, you party composition, abilities, synergy, and magic items will all need to be accounted for. If the barbarian has rolled above average for their hitpoints, then you need to account for it. Similarly, if they have rolled below average, then you need to account for that and don't treat them like they are as tough as an average barbarian. If the wizard knows fire spells, then fire monsters who are immune to fire damage will be a massive problem, whilst ice monsters who are vulnerable to it will be a lesser threat.
So treat it like a baseline, then say "huh, X will easily kill Y, so this will be more/less difficult". If you can't see any key interactions, it's probably about right. If the monsters demand con saves and you know half the party has a con score of less than 10, then adjust the difficulty rating accordingly!
I've been trying this fix My encounters tend to have large number of low level (10-20) so I've used [DMG Chapter 8] Handling Mobs the trade off is Adjusted XP gets a multiplier that raises challenge rating with multiple monsters verse lower or no adjustment for 1 Mob The other one I've been using is to ignore the adjusted XP value and rank by the Total XP instead
I've also found Pack Advantage has decimated parties 4 level 3 with 6 wolf skeletons CR 1/4: Medium Encounter - XP 300 / Adjusted XP 600 Resulted with 3 toon in death saving throws, and 1 very bloodied toon at end of encounter 2 offsets: Monsters Surprised party, encounter range 30 feet
Party: 4 level 3, 4 level 11 + 1 level 15 - I also give out lots of magic items & treasure
CR is not a good way to balance encounters because its meant for and adventuring day of like 6 encounters per long rest or something crazy like that. It also doesn't take into consideration any items, and doesn't take into consideration the power creep of new subclasses.
Also, the only PCs to take damage are the PCs that are going to take the least amount of damage. What was to stop the bolt throwers from holding an action until they could shoot at the rouge/fighter or warlock?
So I have learnt that if i am setting up an encounter based on the CR then I usually have to buff my creatures HP by at least 50% in order to make sure they will last long enough to get hits in. I also have to think out how I plan the encounter and how the monsters will attack. I imagine the Paladin and Babarian are pretty tanky and so charged forward to take the majority of the hits so I would have set that up so that the 5 enemies never bunched, and made use of the ranged attacks against the Warlock and the Archer. If I am a giant and I can see my allies have 2 of the enemies in combat then I am throwing boulders at the soft squishy ones. Or have the attack happen in 2 waves so the tanks get tied up and then the rest of the enemies attack from behind, or the flank appearing on the map in round 2 catching the party out of position.
But yes I always buff my monsters anyway, never mid session, that isn't fair, but always before hand.
I did not read the large number of prior posts, but I can attest this is still an issue with 5e.
My observations as a player and gm in 5e, 6 encounters per long rest is more the exception than the average for encounters per long rest. They may have intended it to occur that way, but in reality it does not occur very much of the time.
I think the average is likely closer to 2 to 3 per long rest. Some situations it is higher but most of the time I think 2 or 3 per long rest is what ends up happening. Not that it was planned that way, but that is how the party ends up working it.
One thought, untested. If a party would normally encounter Y experience over 6 encounters. But they are only encountering say 2 or 3 encounters. Use X / 2 or 3 to determine how much XP worth of "threat" the party encounters per those 2 or 3 encounters.
Also recommend checking average to hit ability of encounters and average damage per hit, against groups AC and HP numbers. How much of the time can you expect the encounter to hit and damage a group and how impactful will that hit be. Also, do the same comparison from the group back to the monster. Based on how the group does combat tactics, what can you expect for the encounter living long enough to stress out the group.
Yes, it's broken and inaccurate, IMO. ;-) I also have very experienced players who, for the most part, use very good tactics as well. So... Yeah.
<off to beef up the next combat encounter some more>
Edit: After reading more above... Really? Designed for 6 encounters per long rest? Dang. Guess I need to reread some stuff and press my players better!
This being an old thread, this advice is for others who read through this:
1: CR is designs for multiple fights (6-8) per long rest, so a single deadly encounter won't be deadly unless it's amongst other encounters.
2: How you play them is key. If you drop the enemy 30ft. fro mthe party and then say "ok, go!" then the monsters will probably die. The boltchuckers, in this case, should have been at range, perhaps flanking the party or up towers/on cliffs if possible, to avoid melee. Nobody in history has won a battle with archers in the front rank, except perhaps the first people to invent bows!
3: As others said, you party composition, abilities, synergy, and magic items will all need to be accounted for. If the barbarian has rolled above average for their hitpoints, then you need to account for it. Similarly, if they have rolled below average, then you need to account for that and don't treat them like they are as tough as an average barbarian. If the wizard knows fire spells, then fire monsters who are immune to fire damage will be a massive problem, whilst ice monsters who are vulnerable to it will be a lesser threat.
So treat it like a baseline, then say "huh, X will easily kill Y, so this will be more/less difficult". If you can't see any key interactions, it's probably about right. If the monsters demand con saves and you know half the party has a con score of less than 10, then adjust the difficulty rating accordingly!
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I've been trying this fix
My encounters tend to have large number of low level (10-20) so I've used [DMG Chapter 8] Handling Mobs
the trade off is Adjusted XP gets a multiplier that raises challenge rating with multiple monsters verse lower or no adjustment for 1 Mob
The other one I've been using is to ignore the adjusted XP value and rank by the Total XP instead
I've also found Pack Advantage has decimated parties 4 level 3 with 6 wolf skeletons CR 1/4:
Medium Encounter - XP 300 / Adjusted XP 600
Resulted with 3 toon in death saving throws, and 1 very bloodied toon at end of encounter
2 offsets: Monsters Surprised party, encounter range 30 feet
Party: 4 level 3, 4 level 11 + 1 level 15 - I also give out lots of magic items & treasure
CR is not a good way to balance encounters because its meant for and adventuring day of like 6 encounters per long rest or something crazy like that. It also doesn't take into consideration any items, and doesn't take into consideration the power creep of new subclasses.
Also, the only PCs to take damage are the PCs that are going to take the least amount of damage. What was to stop the bolt throwers from holding an action until they could shoot at the rouge/fighter or warlock?
2018? Seriously?
So I have learnt that if i am setting up an encounter based on the CR then I usually have to buff my creatures HP by at least 50% in order to make sure they will last long enough to get hits in. I also have to think out how I plan the encounter and how the monsters will attack. I imagine the Paladin and Babarian are pretty tanky and so charged forward to take the majority of the hits so I would have set that up so that the 5 enemies never bunched, and made use of the ranged attacks against the Warlock and the Archer. If I am a giant and I can see my allies have 2 of the enemies in combat then I am throwing boulders at the soft squishy ones. Or have the attack happen in 2 waves so the tanks get tied up and then the rest of the enemies attack from behind, or the flank appearing on the map in round 2 catching the party out of position.
But yes I always buff my monsters anyway, never mid session, that isn't fair, but always before hand.
I did not read the large number of prior posts, but I can attest this is still an issue with 5e.
My observations as a player and gm in 5e, 6 encounters per long rest is more the exception than the average for encounters per long rest. They may have intended it to occur that way, but in reality it does not occur very much of the time.
I think the average is likely closer to 2 to 3 per long rest. Some situations it is higher but most of the time I think 2 or 3 per long rest is what ends up happening. Not that it was planned that way, but that is how the party ends up working it.
One thought, untested. If a party would normally encounter Y experience over 6 encounters. But they are only encountering say 2 or 3 encounters. Use X / 2 or 3 to determine how much XP worth of "threat" the party encounters per those 2 or 3 encounters.
Also recommend checking average to hit ability of encounters and average damage per hit, against groups AC and HP numbers. How much of the time can you expect the encounter to hit and damage a group and how impactful will that hit be. Also, do the same comparison from the group back to the monster. Based on how the group does combat tactics, what can you expect for the encounter living long enough to stress out the group.
Yes, it's broken and inaccurate, IMO. ;-) I also have very experienced players who, for the most part, use very good tactics as well. So... Yeah.
<off to beef up the next combat encounter some more>
Edit: After reading more above... Really? Designed for 6 encounters per long rest? Dang. Guess I need to reread some stuff and press my players better!