My tooltip skills are lacking, but here's what it says in the PHB. It specifically notes no established rates exist. I think the idea is to make it as easy or hard as the DM wants.
"People who are able to cast spells don't fall into the category of ordinary hirelings. It might be possible to find someone willing to cast a spell in exchange for coin or favors, but it is rarely easy and no established pay rates exist. As a rule, the higher the level of the desired spell, the harder it is to find someone who can cast it and the more it costs.
Hiring someone to cast a relatively common spell of 1st or 2nd level, such as cure wounds or identify, is easy enough in a city or town, and might cost 10 to 50 gold pieces (plus the cost of any expensive material components). Finding someone able and willing to cast a higher-level spell might involve traveling to a large city, perhaps one with a university or prominent temple. Once found, the spellcaster might ask for a service instead of payment — the kind of service that only adventurers can provide, such as retrieving a rare item from a dangerous locale or traversing a monster-infested wilderness to deliver something important to a distant settlement."
Also, where can you get the cost of material components outside of a component pouch.
They're listed in the spell if the components have a cost. If no cost is given, no cost need be covered.
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I think the idea is at higher levels, there will be very few people willing and able to cast the spells at all. PCs are exceptional, there's usually not many NPCs running around that have five class levels and are able to cast level 3 spells for a bunch of strangers, let alone higher level spells. So we're talking about something rare and in high demand (to the PCs at least) with little to no competition, meaning the NPC can pretty much charge what they like. That cost can just be gold (or some other trade good, like that extra +1 sword the party has lying around) if you just want to move things along; or it can be a service, if you are looking to force them into a side quest; or they can owe the NPC a favor, if you can't think of anything right now, but want something in your pocket for later if you decide you want to mess with them.
Yeah, I feel they purposefully left it vague so that we could craft our own rules for our own campaign environment. That means that a lot of us will have things not quite right, but good enough.
The Sane Magical Pricing document has some good prices for spell scrolls: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8XAiXpOfz9cMWt1RTBicmpmUDg/view. You could start with that and keep it the same or increase it depending on the circumstances. The entire game rule mechanics for spell scrolls kind of messes up market mechanics for what we are used to.
Yeah, I feel they purposefully left it vague so that we could craft our own rules for our own campaign environment. That means that a lot of us will have things not quite right, but good enough.
The Sane Magical Pricing document has some good prices for spell scrolls: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8XAiXpOfz9cMWt1RTBicmpmUDg/view. You could start with that and keep it the same or increase it depending on the circumstances. The entire game rule mechanics for spell scrolls kind of messes up market mechanics for what we are used to.
Thanks for the link I'll check it out and see how it lines up for what I'm looking for.
Both pretty basic layout wise but they are pay what you want so have them for nothing. Material Componenets goes into a bit of detail about what is invovled with sourcing each component and I give them the costs I use in game. Verbal Components are just a bunch of spell verbals I give to players to make spell casting a little bit more interesting than "I cast Fireball".
If you want them and can't get them through drivethru let me know and I'll see if I can get a pdf copy to you.
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You can look at the cost to craft a spell scroll in XGtE and divide by 5 or so.
Nah, straight cost of the scroll. Mighty expensive keeps characters from looking to NPCs to do things the easy way. An apprentice or low level guild member might charge a bit less, but throw in a chance of spell malfunctions(no refunds, all spells are final.)
If I was a Wizard and had the spell slots though, I would just buy the scroll.
If the purchaser is a Wizard, the Wizards selling the scrolls would possibly increase the supply for that spell. All a wizard would need to do is spend the money to scribe the scroll and then he is now the caster as long as he is high enough level. That would - in a real fantasy world - increase competition and lower the cost of the service. Adventures would not long have to go to Black Bartholomew and pay 500 for the spell, they could go to new-guy Pete for 400.
Of course a Wizards guilds may put a stop to that and have spell casting services at fixed rates. Maybe have some magic thing where the scrolls they sell can be used, but not scribed into a spell book.
Rough cost for spell casting services I also use are:
Spell Level - Cost
Cantrip - 50gp
lvl 1 - 100gp
lvl 2 - 200gp
lvl 3 - 400gp
lvl 4 - 800gp
lvl 5 - 1600gp
lvl 6 - 3200gp
lvl 7 - 6400gp
lvl 8 - 12,800gp
lvl 9 - 25,600gp
So that might be for an NPC casting a spell for you or for aquiring a spell scroll to copy or cast yourself. I then let players use Charisma based skills to haggle. You don't need to set a DC for the haggling, just roleplay it and let the player roll and their roll is the level of discount you can potentially get.
For instance, if they are haglging over a remove curse spell cast by a cleric in a temple the base cost would be 400gp, the player rolls persuasion (or deception or intimidation depending on their skill set) and rolls 15. This means you can start to haggle and the NPC can go upto a 15% discount and pontentially give them the remove curse for 340gp. And if they botch? Well a natural 1 means they insult the seller and the cost goes up or the offer is withdrawn.
PS to previous post: google drive links below for material and verbal coponent pdf's if you want them:
The Adventurer League formula works fairly well, but can start to break down at 6th level and higher. I have read a suggestion that "cube the level above 5th" is a better guideline for higher-level spells. And 9th level spells should always be "whatever the caster demands"! (if there are even 17th level NPC casters in the world in the first place)
For my campaign, I restrict available spellcasters to 1 spell level per "city class" generally available, with +1 spell level if you have "Special access". For example, in the Baron's capital city, spell level 1 is available to anyone with funds, and spell level 2 for nobles, friends of the Baron, or the Church's deputized adherents; in the provincial capital, on the other hand, it's spell level 2 base, while the kingdom's capital is spell level 3 (but the king has access to spell level 5).
I would generally assume that it works the same way as scroll prices -- level 1 is Common, etc -- but with a significant discount (say, 1/5 the item). For example
For more or less mundane spellcasting services, there are the magewright backgrounds where magewrights each have a specific spells list and either some limited casting capacity, or cast spells using the equivalent of pact slots and can be hired by their daily rate, most often with a contract for many weeks which could require that they be protected at all times by x number of hireling guards (2+ gp/day). For instance you could hire a 9th-level village healer to follow you around and help with their healing spells (outside of combat) for 25 gp/day (250 gp/tenday) + material components retainer. Or perhaps the whole of a city is in need of healing and you could have the village healer ask for a sponsorship in order to revivify your gently reposed party member. There are also potion crafters, smithmages, farmages, apothecaries, investigators, beastmages, travelmages, etc. All with their own unique skill and tool proficiencies which can be used to fill out a party with hirelings
Is there a good formula or rule of thumb on how much to charge players for spell services at temples per level?
My tooltip skills are lacking, but here's what it says in the PHB. It specifically notes no established rates exist. I think the idea is to make it as easy or hard as the DM wants.
"People who are able to cast spells don't fall into the category of ordinary hirelings. It might be possible to find someone willing to cast a spell in exchange for coin or favors, but it is rarely easy and no established pay rates exist. As a rule, the higher the level of the desired spell, the harder it is to find someone who can cast it and the more it costs.
Hiring someone to cast a relatively common spell of 1st or 2nd level, such as cure wounds or identify, is easy enough in a city or town, and might cost 10 to 50 gold pieces (plus the cost of any expensive material components). Finding someone able and willing to cast a higher-level spell might involve traveling to a large city, perhaps one with a university or prominent temple. Once found, the spellcaster might ask for a service instead of payment — the kind of service that only adventurers can provide, such as retrieving a rare item from a dangerous locale or traversing a monster-infested wilderness to deliver something important to a distant settlement."
Yeah, I read that and I got that GP level at 1st and 2nd but wondering what about at high levels I'd assume it would be a higher cost, or should be.
Also, where can you get the cost of material components outside of a component pouch.
They're listed in the spell if the components have a cost. If no cost is given, no cost need be covered.
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Thanks. Overlooked that part or I just never had any spell needed that had such a cost.
I think the idea is at higher levels, there will be very few people willing and able to cast the spells at all. PCs are exceptional, there's usually not many NPCs running around that have five class levels and are able to cast level 3 spells for a bunch of strangers, let alone higher level spells. So we're talking about something rare and in high demand (to the PCs at least) with little to no competition, meaning the NPC can pretty much charge what they like. That cost can just be gold (or some other trade good, like that extra +1 sword the party has lying around) if you just want to move things along; or it can be a service, if you are looking to force them into a side quest; or they can owe the NPC a favor, if you can't think of anything right now, but want something in your pocket for later if you decide you want to mess with them.
You can look at the cost to craft a spell scroll in XGtE and divide by 5 or so.
Roll three d10 put them together and that's how much it costs (today). If the spell is 4th or higher, roll four d10s.
I forget which adventure that is from.
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Yeah, I feel they purposefully left it vague so that we could craft our own rules for our own campaign environment. That means that a lot of us will have things not quite right, but good enough.
The Sane Magical Pricing document has some good prices for spell scrolls: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B8XAiXpOfz9cMWt1RTBicmpmUDg/view. You could start with that and keep it the same or increase it depending on the circumstances. The entire game rule mechanics for spell scrolls kind of messes up market mechanics for what we are used to.
Thanks for the link I'll check it out and see how it lines up for what I'm looking for.
A couple of things I amde you may find some use for:
https://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/254143/Spell-Casting-101-Material-components
https://www.drivethrurpg.com/product/252691/Spell-Casting-101-Verbal-components
Both pretty basic layout wise but they are pay what you want so have them for nothing. Material Componenets goes into a bit of detail about what is invovled with sourcing each component and I give them the costs I use in game. Verbal Components are just a bunch of spell verbals I give to players to make spell casting a little bit more interesting than "I cast Fireball".
If you want them and can't get them through drivethru let me know and I'll see if I can get a pdf copy to you.
Nah, straight cost of the scroll. Mighty expensive keeps characters from looking to NPCs to do things the easy way. An apprentice or low level guild member might charge a bit less, but throw in a chance of spell malfunctions(no refunds, all spells are final.)
If I was a Wizard and had the spell slots though, I would just buy the scroll.
If the purchaser is a Wizard, the Wizards selling the scrolls would possibly increase the supply for that spell. All a wizard would need to do is spend the money to scribe the scroll and then he is now the caster as long as he is high enough level. That would - in a real fantasy world - increase competition and lower the cost of the service. Adventures would not long have to go to Black Bartholomew and pay 500 for the spell, they could go to new-guy Pete for 400.
Of course a Wizards guilds may put a stop to that and have spell casting services at fixed rates. Maybe have some magic thing where the scrolls they sell can be used, but not scribed into a spell book.
Rough cost for spell casting services I also use are:
Spell Level - Cost
Cantrip - 50gp
lvl 1 - 100gp
lvl 2 - 200gp
lvl 3 - 400gp
lvl 4 - 800gp
lvl 5 - 1600gp
lvl 6 - 3200gp
lvl 7 - 6400gp
lvl 8 - 12,800gp
lvl 9 - 25,600gp
So that might be for an NPC casting a spell for you or for aquiring a spell scroll to copy or cast yourself. I then let players use Charisma based skills to haggle. You don't need to set a DC for the haggling, just roleplay it and let the player roll and their roll is the level of discount you can potentially get.
For instance, if they are haglging over a remove curse spell cast by a cleric in a temple the base cost would be 400gp, the player rolls persuasion (or deception or intimidation depending on their skill set) and rolls 15. This means you can start to haggle and the NPC can go upto a 15% discount and pontentially give them the remove curse for 340gp. And if they botch? Well a natural 1 means they insult the seller and the cost goes up or the offer is withdrawn.
PS to previous post: google drive links below for material and verbal coponent pdf's if you want them:
Verbal Components: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1vZKxh_3NscFuXvTbv07lRtNvQUpg2Mcj/view?usp=sharing
Material Components: https://drive.google.com/file/d/1brNcgADfNI0HDcMhCkeRRoB5enxp6CvI/view?usp=sharing
This is formula the Adventures League use for spell casting price. I use it when PC's need to use NPC spell services.
Then Add Component Cost -
So some examples:
hope this makes sense...
Actually, that is really helpful. Thank you!
The Adventurer League formula works fairly well, but can start to break down at 6th level and higher. I have read a suggestion that "cube the level above 5th" is a better guideline for higher-level spells. And 9th level spells should always be "whatever the caster demands"! (if there are even 17th level NPC casters in the world in the first place)
For my campaign, I restrict available spellcasters to 1 spell level per "city class" generally available, with +1 spell level if you have "Special access". For example, in the Baron's capital city, spell level 1 is available to anyone with funds, and spell level 2 for nobles, friends of the Baron, or the Church's deputized adherents; in the provincial capital, on the other hand, it's spell level 2 base, while the kingdom's capital is spell level 3 (but the king has access to spell level 5).
I would generally assume that it works the same way as scroll prices -- level 1 is Common, etc -- but with a significant discount (say, 1/5 the item). For example
Spell scrolls are more work than the spell casting. Like a free spell you can carry around.
There are rules for this on page 133 of XGTE.
Cantrip scroll start at 15 gp, and prices rise steeply from there. I normally reduce some of these prices as I gold if restricted in our campaign
For more or less mundane spellcasting services, there are the magewright backgrounds where magewrights each have a specific spells list and either some limited casting capacity, or cast spells using the equivalent of pact slots and can be hired by their daily rate, most often with a contract for many weeks which could require that they be protected at all times by x number of hireling guards (2+ gp/day). For instance you could hire a 9th-level village healer to follow you around and help with their healing spells (outside of combat) for 25 gp/day (250 gp/tenday) + material components retainer. Or perhaps the whole of a city is in need of healing and you could have the village healer ask for a sponsorship in order to revivify your gently reposed party member. There are also potion crafters, smithmages, farmages, apothecaries, investigators, beastmages, travelmages, etc. All with their own unique skill and tool proficiencies which can be used to fill out a party with hirelings
https://www.dmsguild.com/product/440994/Magewright-Backgrounds-Vol-I-VI--BUNDLE.