This is pretty much ripped straight out of Star Wars RPG systems, and adopted for use in D&D, albeit with a bit of a twist, if anyone was wondering as to the inspiration.
The idea is that you start with one positive "fate die" and negative "fate die" at the start of each campaign session. A natural 20 is not automatic success, nor is a natural 1 automatic failure. Instead, with a 20, you either get +10 to the result, or a "positive circumstance" (trust the DM), or generate a positive fate die. With a 1, you get a -10, "negative circumstance", or negative fate die (DM's choice).
Fate dice can also be generated by out of character actions- helping the DM with combat setup, or lighting or other atmospherics; assisting a player with rules understandings or prepping for their turn before it comes up; doing something really cool which fits with their character while turning down metagame benefits to a different course of action; properly playing out a scenario and ignoring the out of game knowledge they have as to things; there's no hard and fast rules. If you're being an awesome player and helping make the game better, you get a positive fate dice added to the pool. If, conversely, you're distracting another player and making it so both of you aren't ready for your turn, or muff up the mood by getting constant audible text message alerts on your phone that you refuse to turn off, or if you're metagaming too obviously, or if you're doing something which actively harms the enjoyment of other players, you generate a negative fate die. Again, no hard and fast rules, just general douschebaggery generates them.
How are they used? Well, a positive fate die can be used to negate disadvantage which would otherwise apply to a roll, or generate advantage on a roll which would otherwise be a straight roll. It can also be used to negate advantage on a roll of an enemy, or generate disadvantage on what would otherwise be a straight roll. Negative fate dice perform exactly the same, but in reverse, removing advantage to PCs or generating disadvantage to them, or aiding the enemies of the PCs. You can't use more than 1 fate die on the same roll, once one is assigned, it's assigned, and no further fate dice (positive or negative) can be applied.
This is in addition to the inspiration system, which is imho exclusively used for supporting great in character moments and cool stuff PCs do in line with their background or character more so than concerns outside the game, and is just another carrot and stick mechanic for rewarding the kind of behavior that makes for better games. It's nothing big, but I'm using it and enjoy it. Feel free to give it a whirl and see if you like it as well.
As a note, any unused fate dice disappear and the pool is reset at the end of each session.
Edit: Also, I'd love to hear of any other incentive systems you all use for out of game concerns! What are your thoughts on such systems as a whole? Do they corrupt the purity of the game? Do they garner player resentment? Or do they just make sense, and reinforce stuff you should be reinforcing whenever possible anyway? Feel free to chime in!
Giving a +10 bonus is almost guaranteed to turn a 20 into an automatic success, and likewise a -10 will turn a 1 into a failure. So that's redundant for attack rolls, and lets players succeed at ability checks that should be impossible for them.
The DM can already award inspiration for literally any reason whatsoever, so positive dice are mostly redundant. The ability to hurt an enemy's roll is redundant with the Lucky feat.
Hurting a player's rolls with negative fate dice for out of game reasons is not fun for anyone. Getting double penalized by generating a a negative fate die on a 1 is also not fun.
These rules require too much explanation and the terminology is obtuse. Why use the term dice if they're not something you roll?
1) Indeed! You see it correctly. It is indeed the goal and design for a natural 20 to allow success on checks that should otherwise be impossible, while not allowing them on absolutely ridiculous stuff (a strength 6 gnome without proficiency in athletics attempting to bust down the DC 35 full iron door, for example, or swimming up a waterfall in full plate, etc). It's not an automatic success no matter what, but it IS success where it would not otherwise exist.
2) Yes! However inspiration should be used, imho, as a tool to reward in character stuff- especially things that reflect your background, your ideals, your flaws, etc. Using it for out of character stuff is not appropriate in my opinion. Furthermore inspiration is modular- you either have it or don't. So if someone is really on a roll, or being consistently a detriment to the experience of the group, you can't a) "take away" inspiration, there is no negative inspiration, and b) you can't reward someone who has already been rewarded
3) Acting as a dbag and degrading the group's enjoyment is also not fun for anyone. That's the whole point- 'what you did is not fun, and does not add to the fun of the group'. It's not meant to be fun. It's meant to be a punishment to discourage negative behavior which is less severe than kicking someone out of a gaming group. As to the generation of them on natural ones, eh, that part (them being an option for generation on nat 1s and 20s) came from player feedback, YMMV.
4) The actual use of them is very easy and intuitive I promise. They're represented physically with dice, black 6 sided dice for negative ones and white 6 sided dice for positive ones, the term is to clue them into the inspiration behind it. I could easily name it something different, you could call it a 'karma pool' if you wanted, use tokens instead of dice, whatever you like. This system was made for our group, just felt like sharing, I definitely would not keep the name "fate dice" if I were adding it into a RPG system to be sold :-)
1) Indeed! You see it correctly. It is indeed the goal and design for a natural 20 to allow success on checks that should otherwise be impossible, while not allowing them on absolutely ridiculous stuff (a strength 6 gnome without proficiency in athletics attempting to bust down the DC 35 full iron door, for example, or swimming up a waterfall in full plate, etc). It's not an automatic success no matter what, but it IS success where it would not otherwise exist.
The problem is that there's no such thing as DC 35 in 5e. In general, you use either DC 10, DC 15, or DC 20. Anything easier than that is generally too easy, and harder than that is generally too hard. If the player has extreme penalties or bonuses, you can use DC 5 for the things they normally wouldn't fail and DC 25 or 30 for the things that are normally too hard to attempt, but that's it. You don't go higher than that.
Like I said, a natural 20 is almost certainly going to be a success in a DC 20 check, but nearly-impossible tasks (DC 30s) will still be out of reach. Adding +10 messes with that by letting players consistently hit DC 30s when they roll a 20, even with a +0 modifier and no proficiency.
(By the way, you normally wouldn't apply Athletics for breaking down doors; it's your raw strength that matters.)
2) Yes! However inspiration should be used, imho, as a tool to reward in character stuff- especially things that reflect your background, your ideals, your flaws, etc. Using it for out of character stuff is not appropriate in my opinion. Furthermore inspiration is modular- you either have it or don't. So if someone is really on a roll, or being consistently a detriment to the experience of the group, you can't a) "take away" inspiration, there is no negative inspiration, and b) you can't reward someone who has already been rewarded
Inspiration is transferable, which largely solves the "you either have it or you don't" problem. If using inspiration for "out of character stuff" isn't appropriate, neither is handing out fate dice. They translate to the same thing - mechanical benefits for out-of-game behavior.
Slapping problematic players with an in-game penalty will not stop bad behavior. Psychology research shows that penalties translate into a purchase price: someone that likes to speed will see the occasional speeding ticket as the price to purchase the privilege of speeding, rather than a punishment. They'll continue to speed as long as they can afford the occasional ticket.
Problematic players need to be addressed out of game. You can't solve the problem with in-game mechanics, and the D&D rules assume everyone's acting in good faith.
Eh, I'm going to have to respectfully disagree, on pretty much every point you're making regarding this. First, flat +10 bonuses already (unwisely) exist in this game, in the form of things like "Pass without Trace". Also, contested skills get up to +17 bonuses on things for which Expertise applies, meaning in a contested roll an opponent can have a max result of 37, without even looking at anything beyond expertise and ability scores, for creatures bounded by a max of 20 in those scores. This is ignoring Inspiration and Guidance, with which someone can get up to a result of 53.
In addition, I'm not going to make certain things outright Impossible, but nor am I going to make them "merely" 30. That's just not how I run my game. Sounds like you and I would not enjoy the same kinds of campaigns, but I find artificial limitations on what DCs can be set, in a system which supports massively higher check results to be ill advised and ignoring the reality of the game. Some things should be a stretch, even for the very very skilled out there, and / or should require cooperation from multiple people to achieve. If you believe differently, that's fine, but I fundamentally disagree.
As to whether or not it works- try it in a game or two, see if it does. Carrots and sticks have survived millennia of evolution for a reason. You tell me if you see a difference in behavior, when there are mechanical rewards for doing things that add to the roleplaying experience and penalties for doing things that detract from it. Throw out a negative fate die when a player is showing another player a random youtube video on his phone instead of paying attention in combat and getting ready for his turn. See if it happens again. YMMV, but you can't tell me it doesn't work, personal experience tells me you're incorrect in that. Maybe you wouldn't want to play at a table with it, and that's fine. The base rules of D&D certainly don't support it. There's a reason this is in the "homebrew and house rules" section after all :-)
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Greetings!
This is pretty much ripped straight out of Star Wars RPG systems, and adopted for use in D&D, albeit with a bit of a twist, if anyone was wondering as to the inspiration.
The idea is that you start with one positive "fate die" and negative "fate die" at the start of each campaign session. A natural 20 is not automatic success, nor is a natural 1 automatic failure. Instead, with a 20, you either get +10 to the result, or a "positive circumstance" (trust the DM), or generate a positive fate die. With a 1, you get a -10, "negative circumstance", or negative fate die (DM's choice).
Fate dice can also be generated by out of character actions- helping the DM with combat setup, or lighting or other atmospherics; assisting a player with rules understandings or prepping for their turn before it comes up; doing something really cool which fits with their character while turning down metagame benefits to a different course of action; properly playing out a scenario and ignoring the out of game knowledge they have as to things; there's no hard and fast rules. If you're being an awesome player and helping make the game better, you get a positive fate dice added to the pool. If, conversely, you're distracting another player and making it so both of you aren't ready for your turn, or muff up the mood by getting constant audible text message alerts on your phone that you refuse to turn off, or if you're metagaming too obviously, or if you're doing something which actively harms the enjoyment of other players, you generate a negative fate die. Again, no hard and fast rules, just general douschebaggery generates them.
How are they used? Well, a positive fate die can be used to negate disadvantage which would otherwise apply to a roll, or generate advantage on a roll which would otherwise be a straight roll. It can also be used to negate advantage on a roll of an enemy, or generate disadvantage on what would otherwise be a straight roll. Negative fate dice perform exactly the same, but in reverse, removing advantage to PCs or generating disadvantage to them, or aiding the enemies of the PCs. You can't use more than 1 fate die on the same roll, once one is assigned, it's assigned, and no further fate dice (positive or negative) can be applied.
This is in addition to the inspiration system, which is imho exclusively used for supporting great in character moments and cool stuff PCs do in line with their background or character more so than concerns outside the game, and is just another carrot and stick mechanic for rewarding the kind of behavior that makes for better games. It's nothing big, but I'm using it and enjoy it. Feel free to give it a whirl and see if you like it as well.
As a note, any unused fate dice disappear and the pool is reset at the end of each session.
Edit: Also, I'd love to hear of any other incentive systems you all use for out of game concerns! What are your thoughts on such systems as a whole? Do they corrupt the purity of the game? Do they garner player resentment? Or do they just make sense, and reinforce stuff you should be reinforcing whenever possible anyway? Feel free to chime in!
A couple of thoughts:
The Forum Infestation (TM)
1) Indeed! You see it correctly. It is indeed the goal and design for a natural 20 to allow success on checks that should otherwise be impossible, while not allowing them on absolutely ridiculous stuff (a strength 6 gnome without proficiency in athletics attempting to bust down the DC 35 full iron door, for example, or swimming up a waterfall in full plate, etc). It's not an automatic success no matter what, but it IS success where it would not otherwise exist.
2) Yes! However inspiration should be used, imho, as a tool to reward in character stuff- especially things that reflect your background, your ideals, your flaws, etc. Using it for out of character stuff is not appropriate in my opinion. Furthermore inspiration is modular- you either have it or don't. So if someone is really on a roll, or being consistently a detriment to the experience of the group, you can't a) "take away" inspiration, there is no negative inspiration, and b) you can't reward someone who has already been rewarded
3) Acting as a dbag and degrading the group's enjoyment is also not fun for anyone. That's the whole point- 'what you did is not fun, and does not add to the fun of the group'. It's not meant to be fun. It's meant to be a punishment to discourage negative behavior which is less severe than kicking someone out of a gaming group. As to the generation of them on natural ones, eh, that part (them being an option for generation on nat 1s and 20s) came from player feedback, YMMV.
4) The actual use of them is very easy and intuitive I promise. They're represented physically with dice, black 6 sided dice for negative ones and white 6 sided dice for positive ones, the term is to clue them into the inspiration behind it. I could easily name it something different, you could call it a 'karma pool' if you wanted, use tokens instead of dice, whatever you like. This system was made for our group, just felt like sharing, I definitely would not keep the name "fate dice" if I were adding it into a RPG system to be sold :-)
The problem is that there's no such thing as DC 35 in 5e. In general, you use either DC 10, DC 15, or DC 20. Anything easier than that is generally too easy, and harder than that is generally too hard. If the player has extreme penalties or bonuses, you can use DC 5 for the things they normally wouldn't fail and DC 25 or 30 for the things that are normally too hard to attempt, but that's it. You don't go higher than that.
Like I said, a natural 20 is almost certainly going to be a success in a DC 20 check, but nearly-impossible tasks (DC 30s) will still be out of reach. Adding +10 messes with that by letting players consistently hit DC 30s when they roll a 20, even with a +0 modifier and no proficiency.
(By the way, you normally wouldn't apply Athletics for breaking down doors; it's your raw strength that matters.)
Inspiration is transferable, which largely solves the "you either have it or you don't" problem. If using inspiration for "out of character stuff" isn't appropriate, neither is handing out fate dice. They translate to the same thing - mechanical benefits for out-of-game behavior.
Slapping problematic players with an in-game penalty will not stop bad behavior. Psychology research shows that penalties translate into a purchase price: someone that likes to speed will see the occasional speeding ticket as the price to purchase the privilege of speeding, rather than a punishment. They'll continue to speed as long as they can afford the occasional ticket.
Problematic players need to be addressed out of game. You can't solve the problem with in-game mechanics, and the D&D rules assume everyone's acting in good faith.
The Forum Infestation (TM)
Eh, I'm going to have to respectfully disagree, on pretty much every point you're making regarding this. First, flat +10 bonuses already (unwisely) exist in this game, in the form of things like "Pass without Trace". Also, contested skills get up to +17 bonuses on things for which Expertise applies, meaning in a contested roll an opponent can have a max result of 37, without even looking at anything beyond expertise and ability scores, for creatures bounded by a max of 20 in those scores. This is ignoring Inspiration and Guidance, with which someone can get up to a result of 53.
In addition, I'm not going to make certain things outright Impossible, but nor am I going to make them "merely" 30. That's just not how I run my game. Sounds like you and I would not enjoy the same kinds of campaigns, but I find artificial limitations on what DCs can be set, in a system which supports massively higher check results to be ill advised and ignoring the reality of the game. Some things should be a stretch, even for the very very skilled out there, and / or should require cooperation from multiple people to achieve. If you believe differently, that's fine, but I fundamentally disagree.
As to whether or not it works- try it in a game or two, see if it does. Carrots and sticks have survived millennia of evolution for a reason. You tell me if you see a difference in behavior, when there are mechanical rewards for doing things that add to the roleplaying experience and penalties for doing things that detract from it. Throw out a negative fate die when a player is showing another player a random youtube video on his phone instead of paying attention in combat and getting ready for his turn. See if it happens again. YMMV, but you can't tell me it doesn't work, personal experience tells me you're incorrect in that. Maybe you wouldn't want to play at a table with it, and that's fine. The base rules of D&D certainly don't support it. There's a reason this is in the "homebrew and house rules" section after all :-)