This is a class I developed because I was watching some videos talking about how Rangers lack a solid class concept. So I decided to make a class inspired by characters like The Witch Hunter, Hellboy, The Winchesters, Constantine, that sort of feel. A character who does not do magic themselves, but understands magic and the supernatural enough to thwart those who use it. I took aspects of the existing ranger and the Monk to try and create a class which fills a truly unique niche in the party composition. Their big feature is either increasing your likelihood of saving against a spell, or preventing magic caster enemies from being able to cast for a turn.
Big features of the class: Ability to switch out "Warden's Mark" damage type, which is specific to certain enemy types and gives you advantage on certain checks to identify a target or effect.
Disruptive Blow: Force a saving throw on a single target and on a failure, the target cannot use a new magical ability until the end of its next turn. After failing, the target is immune to the effect for 1 minute.
Capstone ability: Level 18 can cause a creature to lose a legendary action Level 20: can make a target vulnerable to your Warden's Mark damage types. On a crit, they also cannot cast a spell which targets itself or another creature until next turn.
3 subclasses: Bullwork, Duskwalker, Saboteur. Bullwork: Give area effects to help saves or block spells
Duskwalker: Create a spectral self which can assist in maneuvering, attacking, and sacrificing itself in order to tank spell attack damage.
Saboteur: Mundane hunter who can craft runes into weapons and traps which can remotely disable spell casters or have spells cast into them.
This seems like an awesome class, and it seems super fun to roleplay! i had an idea for an ability that could be unlocked at mid to high levels that flat-out burns opponent spell slots without them actually casting, and maybe the ability to absorb, store, and recast magical attacks. It also seems really well balanced conceptually. as a martial it can keep up with casters who struggle against other casters, and if it gets paired against a martial enemy, any pc martial with a half competent team can really help with the defeat. i honestly love this idea, right down to the name, and i'd like to suggest one more subclass concept: Enhanced, which accepts technological grafts and upgrades with the express intent of overwhelming casters blow by blow.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Sadistic DM throw an unbeatable BBEG at you? Maybe you're out of spell lots too? Just cast Command: begone, and pray real hard that the other guy rolls a nat one...
Thanks for the feedback. One of the subclasses does have the ability at a higher level to absorb some of a spell's effect and reflect it back at the castor. But by all means, please try it test it, and see what needs working on. I avoided having an ability to burn spell slots on an enemy because A: It would really annoy DMs, making them less likely to allow it, and B: because enemy stat blocks don't have the same kind of spell slots as PCs, as I understand it.
I'm seeing a lot of problems, which I will list in order:
You can't have proficiency in ability scores.
At first, you say that Warden's Mark is PB uses, but then it just says "as a bonus action."
How long does Warden's Instinct last for?
"Existing Spells are not affected unless the creature fails a concentration check." What does that mean?
How long does Reactive Ward last for? Why would you use it if you don't know if you'll be targeted by a spell before it expires?
Is Quarry Insight ALL resistances and vulnerabilities, and why does it not detect Immunities? Those would probably be the easiest to discern.
The first point of Hunter's Instinct is pretty useless, because most of the time, magically hidden creatures won't be found by a perception check.
How does Relentless Warden work on sustained, non-concentration effect?
The third part of Apex Warden, the crit part, is too random.
The capstone is going to be overpowered if your Mark is Piercing, or useless if it's Psychic. Big issue.
Bulwark:
Protective Strike seems overpowered.
Arcane reflection is VERY overpowered.
Stalwart Pursuit makes an overpowered feature more overpowered.
Bastion of Will is VERY overpowered. QUARTERING spell damage is busted.
I have absolutely no idea how the 17th level feature works.
Duskwalker
Blatantly magical. Seems wrong for the antimagic class.
Elusive Strike is VERY overpowered.
for the 7th level feature, you need to clarify if the image moves with you or not.
Hunter's Echo is going to die instantly.
Phantom Veil seems strong.
Phantom Sacrifice does WAY too much damage.
Saboteur
Another MAGICAL subclass for the ANTIMAGIC class. FIX THIS.
Runic Disruption is strong, and it shouldn't be random.
Warding trap needs to state the action cost to arm it, and it shouldn't SYNERGISE WITH MAGIC. The wording for how the spell option works needs A LOT of work.
Saboteur's Instinct is going to ruin so many fun surprises the DM sets up. Anti-fun.
Saboteur's Gambit is kind of underwhelming.
All According to Plan is needlessly complicated, and storing the spell in the trap isn't going to have any effect; everyone's just going to run away from it. Just make the spell fail. The warden is unlikely to know the spell's level, which is a HUGE problem. It's nowhere near strong enough for a 1/day feature.
Finally, around 150 (according to AI) 2024 monsters are spellcasters, meaning this class will be useful in about 1/3 of all encounters.
Thanks for reviewing, I appreciate the oversight. This is my first attempt at homebrew, so I definitely need the feedback.
I think I corrected the Warden's Mark language, let me know.
Warden's Instinct lasts until you change it on a short or long rest.
"Existing spells" means if they already cast a spell before you attempted to use your ability. So if they for example had Force Cage going or they previously cast Slow on you, it doesn't end that spell unless they needed to maintain Concentration and they need to pass a con save to maintain it as with anyone else.
Reactive ward: Added language that it adds +2 to AC or Spell Save until the beginning of your next turn. So it operates like Shield but for Spell saves.
Quarry Insight: Added language that it detects Resistances, Immunities, or Vulnerabilities if any.
Hunter's Instinct: Gives you advantage if a creature is invisible or otherwise magically obscured. Admittedly it is very circumstantial, but can be very useful in those cases.
Relentless Warden is used on a non-concentration effect and succeeds, the damage taken by the spell should be halved. If it's a non-damage effect, the effect should end, but I am open to suggestions to make this more workable if it comes off too strong.
Apex Warden: Why is this "too random"? It's already a very situational effect. Scoring a crit just makes it that much more rewarding in the moment. Vorpal Blades by that standard are just as "random".
Capstone: By this level your character can prepare two Wardens Instinct Damage Types simultaneously. So you and your party can spend one round doing significant damage. And it's a level 20 feature. It probably should be powerful. So if your two damage types are Radiant and Fire, it might be quite useful for the team. But that is also the risk of playing that way. Your chosen damage type might or might not be to your party's advantage if you didn't take that into account.
Bullwark:
Protective Strike: Which part is overpowered? How would you suggest fixing it? It is also limited by the Guile pool you have. At Level 3 you can use this ability twice per long rest. Eventually you can roll 1d10 on a short rest and gain that amount of Guile back.
Arcane Reflection: How would you suggest fixing this? Presently it is limited by your reaction and Guile pool. It's not too different from Absorb Elements, which is a first level spell. You still have to take damage from the spell attack. And you have to hit on your next turn for the damage to be added.
Stalwart Pursuit: Changed to Wisdom + Warden Level rather than Wisdom + 2x Warden Level in healing. Also limited to within 15 feet. Added a 2 Guile cost
Bastion of Will: Usable 1 time per long rest, so only good for one encounter. Changed language so the aura only grants +5 to saving throws and casters still have to make a saving throw or their spells have half the effect.
Added clarifying language to the level 17 ability, so if an attack dealt 32 fire damage, because you saved you took 16, the ability would reflect 8 fire damage back to the caster.
Duskwalker:
Elusive Strike: Same limiting factor. at early levels you can do this twice per long rest.
Elusive Prey: Added language that the shadow moves with you.
Hunter's Echo: Designed to give you more maneuverability (you can switch places or it can take an attack for you) or you can have it tank a hit for you. The low hit points is the balancing, but I welcome advice on how to make it more effective / useful.
Phantom Veil: only gives resistance to magical damage. Otherwise it's similar to Blur.
Phantom Sacrifice: As you mentioned, the Phantom dies easily, so opportunity to use it might be limited. Total cost for this manuver is 7 Guile, and average damage would be around 33 damage radius for a level 17 feature. What would you suggest?
Saboteur:
Runic Disruption: Why should it not be random? At level 3 you're only able to use it twice per long rest and costs 1 guile to activate. That target also likely won't be able to be effected for the rest of that combat due to the 1 min immunity.
Saboteur's Instinct: This ability would just let you know something is within 30 feet. DM can use this to heighten tension. A perception or investigation is still needed to find the creature.
Saboteur's Gambit: Any advice is welcome, but the primary appeal to this is to allow the Warden to pass off their abilities to other people in a critical moment. It is to encourage more team player mentality rather than one man army.
All According to Plan: I would welcome advice on the language of the ability, I wanted to make sure that it wasn't too vague. Basically the intent is to spend guile to potentially capture a spell in a trap. The spell activates from the trap next turn. It has a lot of factors to consider.
I understand your argument with this class using magic, but as far as the fantasy of the class goes, in all of the examples given for inspiration, all of the characters can use magic and magical items to a limited degree, but the point of the class is that they are targeting magical creatures or casters. Feel free to flavor however you choose. As far as 1/3 of creatures being magic or casters, I mean, if you are playing a melee fighter, you're not going to get as much use if the enemy is a flying type or teleports. You are still able to do damage to creatures and you are still a skill monkey to some extent. Hopefully your DM will take classes into account and give you more opportunities to use your unique abilities.
I don't necessarily agree with the only 1/3 assessment, because yes, only 150 are spellcasters, but just because you're not a spellcaster doesn't mean you don't use magic.
Rollback Post to RevisionRollBack
Sadistic DM throw an unbeatable BBEG at you? Maybe you're out of spell lots too? Just cast Command: begone, and pray real hard that the other guy rolls a nat one...
You could callback the Ranger's "Favored Enemy" mechanic to determine your focus against certain kinds of creatures. Maybe a mechanic that allows you to use a reaction to grant an ally a bonus to a saving throw when that enemy targets them. And use the "Compelled Duel" spell as a blueprint to develop some class mechanic that enables the Warden to pull aggro on their enemies so their allies don't get attacked as much.
Click here for google doc with full class and subclasses
This is a class I developed because I was watching some videos talking about how Rangers lack a solid class concept. So I decided to make a class inspired by characters like The Witch Hunter, Hellboy, The Winchesters, Constantine, that sort of feel. A character who does not do magic themselves, but understands magic and the supernatural enough to thwart those who use it. I took aspects of the existing ranger and the Monk to try and create a class which fills a truly unique niche in the party composition. Their big feature is either increasing your likelihood of saving against a spell, or preventing magic caster enemies from being able to cast for a turn.
Big features of the class: Ability to switch out "Warden's Mark" damage type, which is specific to certain enemy types and gives you advantage on certain checks to identify a target or effect.
Disruptive Blow: Force a saving throw on a single target and on a failure, the target cannot use a new magical ability until the end of its next turn. After failing, the target is immune to the effect for 1 minute.
Capstone ability: Level 18 can cause a creature to lose a legendary action
Level 20: can make a target vulnerable to your Warden's Mark damage types. On a crit, they also cannot cast a spell which targets itself or another creature until next turn.
3 subclasses: Bullwork, Duskwalker, Saboteur.
Bullwork: Give area effects to help saves or block spells
Duskwalker: Create a spectral self which can assist in maneuvering, attacking, and sacrificing itself in order to tank spell attack damage.
Saboteur: Mundane hunter who can craft runes into weapons and traps which can remotely disable spell casters or have spells cast into them.
I'd appreciate feedback.
This seems like an awesome class, and it seems super fun to roleplay! i had an idea for an ability that could be unlocked at mid to high levels that flat-out burns opponent spell slots without them actually casting, and maybe the ability to absorb, store, and recast magical attacks. It also seems really well balanced conceptually. as a martial it can keep up with casters who struggle against other casters, and if it gets paired against a martial enemy, any pc martial with a half competent team can really help with the defeat. i honestly love this idea, right down to the name, and i'd like to suggest one more subclass concept: Enhanced, which accepts technological grafts and upgrades with the express intent of overwhelming casters blow by blow.
Sadistic DM throw an unbeatable BBEG at you? Maybe you're out of spell lots too? Just cast Command: begone, and pray real hard that the other guy rolls a nat one...
Thanks for the feedback. One of the subclasses does have the ability at a higher level to absorb some of a spell's effect and reflect it back at the castor. But by all means, please try it test it, and see what needs working on. I avoided having an ability to burn spell slots on an enemy because A: It would really annoy DMs, making them less likely to allow it, and B: because enemy stat blocks don't have the same kind of spell slots as PCs, as I understand it.
I'm seeing a lot of problems, which I will list in order:
Bulwark:
Duskwalker
Saboteur
Finally, around 150 (according to AI) 2024 monsters are spellcasters, meaning this class will be useful in about 1/3 of all encounters.
Thanks for reviewing, I appreciate the oversight. This is my first attempt at homebrew, so I definitely need the feedback.
Bullwark:
Duskwalker:
Saboteur:
I understand your argument with this class using magic, but as far as the fantasy of the class goes, in all of the examples given for inspiration, all of the characters can use magic and magical items to a limited degree, but the point of the class is that they are targeting magical creatures or casters. Feel free to flavor however you choose. As far as 1/3 of creatures being magic or casters, I mean, if you are playing a melee fighter, you're not going to get as much use if the enemy is a flying type or teleports. You are still able to do damage to creatures and you are still a skill monkey to some extent. Hopefully your DM will take classes into account and give you more opportunities to use your unique abilities.
I don't necessarily agree with the only 1/3 assessment, because yes, only 150 are spellcasters, but just because you're not a spellcaster doesn't mean you don't use magic.
Sadistic DM throw an unbeatable BBEG at you? Maybe you're out of spell lots too? Just cast Command: begone, and pray real hard that the other guy rolls a nat one...
I love this idea!
You could callback the Ranger's "Favored Enemy" mechanic to determine your focus against certain kinds of creatures. Maybe a mechanic that allows you to use a reaction to grant an ally a bonus to a saving throw when that enemy targets them. And use the "Compelled Duel" spell as a blueprint to develop some class mechanic that enables the Warden to pull aggro on their enemies so their allies don't get attacked as much.
This is an idea that is really worth developing.
Anzio Faro. Protector Aasimar light cleric. Lvl 18.
Viktor Gavriil. White dragonborn grave cleric. Lvl 20.
Ikram Sahir ibn-Malik al-Sayyid Ra'ad. Brass dragonborn draconic sorcerer Lvl 9. Fire elemental devil.
Wrangler of cats.