you can shove, drag, or carry, but you do not appear to be able to jump. Probable cause the being grappled is struggling to escape.
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Does jumping with someone grappled lessen your jump and by how much?
When you move, you can drag or carry the grappled creature with you, but your speed is halved, unless the creature is two or more sizes smaller than you. Each foot you clear on the jump costs a foot of movement so it's lessen by reducing your speed.
You can jump just as high and just as far while carrying a grappled creature, assuming there are no encumbrance considerations. As Plaguescarred says, your speed is halved, so you just have half as many feet to work with, and you may need to use the dash action to come up with enough movement. But the jumping calculation itself is no different from normal.
"Moving a Grappled Creature. When you move, you can drag or carry the grappled creature with you, but your speed is halved, unless the creature is two or more sizes smaller than you."
Although it is hard to imagine jumping while dragging a creature, you can always carry the grappled creature and in that case it is pretty easy to imagine the grappler also jumping. So, the only restriction on jumping while carrying a grappled creature would appear to be that the grappler's speed is halved (though check with your DM on how they want to run it).
Although it is hard to imagine jumping while dragging a creature, you can always carry the grappled creature and in that case it is pretty easy to imagine the grappler also jumping. So, the only restriction on jumping while carrying a grappled creature would appear to be that the grappler's speed is halved (though check with your DM on how they want to run it).
I would envision this Firstly, as a german suplex, or something similar to that. But outside of that....
Wanted to see if this is correct or if it is handled differently. It says your speed is halved. So if you have a movement speed of 30 feet it is now 15 feet. If you had used 15 feet to move up to the creature you grappled your speed is now zero because your “speed” was halved not your “remaining speed”.
I had a related question and figured I would ask it here rather than start a new thread.
Assuming you have sufficient movement and carrying capacity to jump while dragging a creature you have grappled, what happens to the grappled creature if you jump up 10 or more feet?
There are threads that discuss if a creature takes taking falling damage if they jump 10 or more feet voluntarily. In this case I am more interested in what happens to a creature involuntarily dragged along for such a jump?
I see three possible outcomes: both creatures suffer a fall, neither creature suffers a fall, or the dragged creature suffers a fall.
I had a related question and figured I would ask it here rather than start a new thread.
Assuming you have sufficient movement and carrying capacity to jump while dragging a creature you have grappled, what happens to the grappled creature if you jump up 10 or more feet?
There are threads that discuss if a creature takes taking falling damage if they jump 10 or more feet voluntarily. In this case I am more interested in what happens to a creature involuntarily dragged along for such a jump?
I see three possible outcomes: both creatures suffer a fall, neither creature suffers a fall, or the dragged creature suffers a fall.
1. I would assume, as there is nothing in the rules saying you cannot bring them with you, you just bring them with you as you jump as long as you could carry them with your strength.
2. Both parties would take fall damage. Fall damage doesn't care if you jumped yourself or if you were pushed off the ledge. It just cares if you fell x distance and then slammed on the ground. Now IMO if either person is STILL holding on to the other grappler/grappled and one side tries to say break there fall or slow it then that would be a DM call and both may take less damage etc...
I had a related question and figured I would ask it here rather than start a new thread.
Assuming you have sufficient movement and carrying capacity to jump while dragging a creature you have grappled, what happens to the grappled creature if you jump up 10 or more feet?
There are threads that discuss if a creature takes taking falling damage if they jump 10 or more feet voluntarily. In this case I am more interested in what happens to a creature involuntarily dragged along for such a jump?
I see three possible outcomes: both creatures suffer a fall, neither creature suffers a fall, or the dragged creature suffers a fall.
I see only one possible outcome, both creatures would fall normally and land prone after taking damage (1d6/10 ft)
Only a DM since 1980 (3000+ Sessions) / PhD, MS, MA / Mixed, Bi, Trans, Woman / No longer welcome in the US, apparently
Wyrlde: Adventures in the Seven Cities .-=] Lore Book | Patreon | Wyrlde YT [=-. An original Setting for 5e, a whole solar system of adventure. Ongoing updates, exclusies, more. Not Talking About It / Dubbed The Oracle in the Cult of Mythology Nerds
Thanks for the responses, that is what I figured. But given other threads debating whether the creature doing the jumping takes fall damage I thought I should ask and see what other people's thoughts on this were.
First: Jumping and Falling are two different things. If a creature can jump 15 feet into the air and then land on its feet in a controlled manner, it has jumped -- it has not fallen. Fall damage only applies to falls. Although it would be harder to quote rules to support this, I would also rule that such a creature could jump directly downward into a 15 foot deep pit without taking fall damage since it is capable of jumping and landing over such vertical distances. However, if for some reason the creature jumped upwards 15 feet and then landed at the bottom of a 15 foot pit then I would apply 15 feet worth of fall damage, which is 1d6.
Next: I would rule that you cannot vertically "drag" a creature while grappling it. The rules for dragging an object exist in order to be able to move a heavy object that you cannot carry since when you drag something along the ground you are not trying to apply the force against gravity by lifting the object -- you are typically only applying the force against opposite frictional forces of the object scraping along the ground -- typically these forces are less than gravity so you can move heavier objects in this manner than those which you would be able to lift or carry. When moving an object vertically you are now working against gravity and therefore you are not dragging the object, but instead you are now lifting or carrying it. Carrying capacity and encumbrance rules would apply here -- you cannot get around them by claiming to "drag" the creature vertically.
Finally, what happens to the creatures? The grappling creature is simply jumping. No fall damage. As for the grappled creature -- if we are simply maintaining the grapple throughout the jump, nothing happens to the grappled creature -- it has been carried throughout the jump -- no fall damage. If instead you decided to release the grapple and drop the creature from high in the air -- that creature would fall from that height and take fall damage. But then you wouldn't be grappling it any more so that's a decision that would have to be made.
Additional combat maneuvers that a player might want to try in this situation begin to exceed the simplified 5e ruleset and would require some DM adjudication. For example, there seems to be a lack of rules for damage from being crushed or slammed into a wall or floor. So, if the grappler wanted to throw the creature downwards from high up -- that seems like something that would cause more fall damage than gently dropping the creature. But there's not a great rule for that. Similarly, if on the way down you are attempting to body slam the creature into the floor and potentially landing on top of it and so on and so forth -- should this result in more than simple fall damage? The DM would have to decide that.
First: Jumping and Falling are two different things. If a creature can jump 15 feet into the air and then land on its feet in a controlled manner, it has jumped -- it has not fallen. Fall damage only applies to falls. Although it would be harder to quote rules to support this, I would also rule that such a creature could jump directly downward into a 15 foot deep pit without taking fall damage since it is capable of jumping and landing over such vertical distances. However, if for some reason the creature jumped upwards 15 feet and then landed at the bottom of a 15 foot pit then I would apply 15 feet worth of fall damage, which is 1d6.
This is exactly the point debates regarding high jumps that exceed 10 feet and whether fall damage applies or not pivot around. What constitutes a fall is not defined in the rules and so different people will decide that a fall starts at different points and then apply the rules that do exist. This style of not considering the height of a jump as part of a fall is somewhat supported by an August 2015 tweet from JC. The opposite position of considering the height of a jump as part of the fall also has an October 2015 tweet from JC to support it. (Sageadvice.eu has the text of the tweet JC was replying to: https://www.sageadvice.eu/jumping-damage/). Hence, threads like this one debating the matter: https://www.dndbeyond.com/forums/dungeons-dragons-discussion/rules-game-mechanics/64627-jumping-and-fall-damage.
Next: I would rule that you cannot vertically "drag" a creature while grappling it. The rules for dragging an object exist in order to be able to move a heavy object that you cannot carry since when you drag something along the ground you are not trying to apply the force against gravity by lifting the object -- you are typically only applying the force against opposite frictional forces of the object scraping along the ground -- typically these forces are less than gravity so you can move heavier objects in this manner than those which you would be able to lift or carry. When moving an object vertically you are now working against gravity and therefore you are not dragging the object, but instead you are now lifting or carrying it. Carrying capacity and encumbrance rules would apply here -- you cannot get around them by claiming to "drag" the creature vertically.
This is why when I asked the question I qualified it with "Assuming you have sufficient ... carrying capacity". If the weight of your gear, the creature you have grappled, and all of their gear exceeds your carrying capacity then at the very least you cannot jump high enough for this to matter since your movement is reduced to 5ft. I used the verb drag in my question because that is what is used in the Moving a Grappled Creature rule in the Grapple rules(https://www.dndbeyond.com/sources/phb/combat#Grappling). Looking back on my post this was not the best choice of words on my part.
Finally, what happens to the creatures? The grappling creature is simply jumping. No fall damage. As for the grappled creature -- if we are simply maintaining the grapple throughout the jump, nothing happens to the grappled creature -- it has been carried throughout the jump -- no fall damage. If instead you decided to release the grapple and drop the creature from high in the air -- that creature would fall from that height and take fall damage. But then you wouldn't be grappling it any more so that's a decision that would have to be made.
Additional combat maneuvers that a player might want to try in this situation begin to exceed the simplified 5e ruleset and would require some DM adjudication. For example, there seems to be a lack of rules for damage from being crushed or slammed into a wall or floor. So, if the grappler wanted to throw the creature downwards from high up -- that seems like something that would cause more fall damage than gently dropping the creature. But there's not a great rule for that. Similarly, if on the way down you are attempting to body slam the creature into the floor and potentially landing on top of it and so on and so forth -- should this result in more than simple fall damage? The DM would have to decide that.
This definitely seems the most fair to me given the assumption that a high jump isn't part of a fall. I wasn't sure if people would handle the grappled creature differently or not and handling them differently seems like it would be ripe for abuse.
And I like your thoughts on simply adjudicating it as an improvised action if the player's goal is anything other than carrying the creature along with them. My concern when I asked the question is that jumping while grappling a creature could be a way to trade movement and potentially damage to guaranteed cause damage and the Prone condition to the grappled creature. To me adjudicating it as an improvised attack (probably as a Shove attack) seems a more fair way of handling this.
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Does jumping with someone grappled lessen your jump and by how much?
Yes and by all of it.
you can shove, drag, or carry, but you do not appear to be able to jump. Probable cause the being grappled is struggling to escape.
Only a DM since 1980 (3000+ Sessions) / PhD, MS, MA / Mixed, Bi, Trans, Woman / No longer welcome in the US, apparently
Wyrlde: Adventures in the Seven Cities
.-=] Lore Book | Patreon | Wyrlde YT [=-.
An original Setting for 5e, a whole solar system of adventure. Ongoing updates, exclusies, more.
Not Talking About It / Dubbed The Oracle in the Cult of Mythology Nerds
When you move, you can drag or carry the grappled creature with you, but your speed is halved, unless the creature is two or more sizes smaller than you. Each foot you clear on the jump costs a foot of movement so it's lessen by reducing your speed.
You can jump just as high and just as far while carrying a grappled creature, assuming there are no encumbrance considerations. As Plaguescarred says, your speed is halved, so you just have half as many feet to work with, and you may need to use the dash action to come up with enough movement. But the jumping calculation itself is no different from normal.
"Not all those who wander are lost"
It'd have been further lessen if it'd instead said every foot of movement costs 1 extra foot.
so your base movement is lessened but as long as you have movement to run and the jump itself remains the same?
This is the text of the rule.
"Moving a Grappled Creature. When you move, you can drag or carry the grappled creature with you, but your speed is halved, unless the creature is two or more sizes smaller than you."
Although it is hard to imagine jumping while dragging a creature, you can always carry the grappled creature and in that case it is pretty easy to imagine the grappler also jumping. So, the only restriction on jumping while carrying a grappled creature would appear to be that the grappler's speed is halved (though check with your DM on how they want to run it).
I would also note that you are still subject to the Lifting and Carrying rules, this is especially relevant if your table uses the encumbrance rules.
I would envision this Firstly, as a german suplex, or something similar to that. But outside of that....
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When you get to suplices then you have gone quite far beyond what a Grapple is though.
Hard Disagree.
Wrestling itself, used to be referred to as grappling.
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Wanted to see if this is correct or if it is handled differently. It says your speed is halved. So if you have a movement speed of 30 feet it is now 15 feet. If you had used 15 feet to move up to the creature you grappled your speed is now zero because your “speed” was halved not your “remaining speed”.
EZD6 by DM Scotty
https://www.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/397599/EZD6-Core-Rulebook?
I had a related question and figured I would ask it here rather than start a new thread.
Assuming you have sufficient movement and carrying capacity to jump while dragging a creature you have grappled, what happens to the grappled creature if you jump up 10 or more feet?
There are threads that discuss if a creature takes taking falling damage if they jump 10 or more feet voluntarily. In this case I am more interested in what happens to a creature involuntarily dragged along for such a jump?
I see three possible outcomes: both creatures suffer a fall, neither creature suffers a fall, or the dragged creature suffers a fall.
1. I would assume, as there is nothing in the rules saying you cannot bring them with you, you just bring them with you as you jump as long as you could carry them with your strength.
2. Both parties would take fall damage. Fall damage doesn't care if you jumped yourself or if you were pushed off the ledge. It just cares if you fell x distance and then slammed on the ground.
Now IMO if either person is STILL holding on to the other grappler/grappled and one side tries to say break there fall or slow it then that would be a DM call and both may take less damage etc...
I see only one possible outcome, both creatures would fall normally and land prone after taking damage (1d6/10 ft)
Yeah, i see both hurting.
Only a DM since 1980 (3000+ Sessions) / PhD, MS, MA / Mixed, Bi, Trans, Woman / No longer welcome in the US, apparently
Wyrlde: Adventures in the Seven Cities
.-=] Lore Book | Patreon | Wyrlde YT [=-.
An original Setting for 5e, a whole solar system of adventure. Ongoing updates, exclusies, more.
Not Talking About It / Dubbed The Oracle in the Cult of Mythology Nerds
Thanks for the responses, that is what I figured. But given other threads debating whether the creature doing the jumping takes fall damage I thought I should ask and see what other people's thoughts on this were.
I assume debates wither jumping creature falls and take damage or not depends if it has yet run out of movement.
First: Jumping and Falling are two different things. If a creature can jump 15 feet into the air and then land on its feet in a controlled manner, it has jumped -- it has not fallen. Fall damage only applies to falls. Although it would be harder to quote rules to support this, I would also rule that such a creature could jump directly downward into a 15 foot deep pit without taking fall damage since it is capable of jumping and landing over such vertical distances. However, if for some reason the creature jumped upwards 15 feet and then landed at the bottom of a 15 foot pit then I would apply 15 feet worth of fall damage, which is 1d6.
Next: I would rule that you cannot vertically "drag" a creature while grappling it. The rules for dragging an object exist in order to be able to move a heavy object that you cannot carry since when you drag something along the ground you are not trying to apply the force against gravity by lifting the object -- you are typically only applying the force against opposite frictional forces of the object scraping along the ground -- typically these forces are less than gravity so you can move heavier objects in this manner than those which you would be able to lift or carry. When moving an object vertically you are now working against gravity and therefore you are not dragging the object, but instead you are now lifting or carrying it. Carrying capacity and encumbrance rules would apply here -- you cannot get around them by claiming to "drag" the creature vertically.
Finally, what happens to the creatures? The grappling creature is simply jumping. No fall damage. As for the grappled creature -- if we are simply maintaining the grapple throughout the jump, nothing happens to the grappled creature -- it has been carried throughout the jump -- no fall damage. If instead you decided to release the grapple and drop the creature from high in the air -- that creature would fall from that height and take fall damage. But then you wouldn't be grappling it any more so that's a decision that would have to be made.
Additional combat maneuvers that a player might want to try in this situation begin to exceed the simplified 5e ruleset and would require some DM adjudication. For example, there seems to be a lack of rules for damage from being crushed or slammed into a wall or floor. So, if the grappler wanted to throw the creature downwards from high up -- that seems like something that would cause more fall damage than gently dropping the creature. But there's not a great rule for that. Similarly, if on the way down you are attempting to body slam the creature into the floor and potentially landing on top of it and so on and so forth -- should this result in more than simple fall damage? The DM would have to decide that.
This is exactly the point debates regarding high jumps that exceed 10 feet and whether fall damage applies or not pivot around. What constitutes a fall is not defined in the rules and so different people will decide that a fall starts at different points and then apply the rules that do exist. This style of not considering the height of a jump as part of a fall is somewhat supported by an August 2015 tweet from JC. The opposite position of considering the height of a jump as part of the fall also has an October 2015 tweet from JC to support it. (Sageadvice.eu has the text of the tweet JC was replying to: https://www.sageadvice.eu/jumping-damage/). Hence, threads like this one debating the matter: https://www.dndbeyond.com/forums/dungeons-dragons-discussion/rules-game-mechanics/64627-jumping-and-fall-damage.
This is why when I asked the question I qualified it with "Assuming you have sufficient ... carrying capacity". If the weight of your gear, the creature you have grappled, and all of their gear exceeds your carrying capacity then at the very least you cannot jump high enough for this to matter since your movement is reduced to 5ft. I used the verb drag in my question because that is what is used in the Moving a Grappled Creature rule in the Grapple rules(https://www.dndbeyond.com/sources/phb/combat#Grappling). Looking back on my post this was not the best choice of words on my part.
This definitely seems the most fair to me given the assumption that a high jump isn't part of a fall. I wasn't sure if people would handle the grappled creature differently or not and handling them differently seems like it would be ripe for abuse.
And I like your thoughts on simply adjudicating it as an improvised action if the player's goal is anything other than carrying the creature along with them. My concern when I asked the question is that jumping while grappling a creature could be a way to trade movement and potentially damage to guaranteed cause damage and the Prone condition to the grappled creature. To me adjudicating it as an improvised attack (probably as a Shove attack) seems a more fair way of handling this.