Has anyone found clarity as to whether a 14h-level Artificer with the Magic Item Savant Feature needs to do an ability check to cast a spell from a non-Artificer spell scroll, aka, ignoring "class ... spell and level requirements" when "using a magic item"? I've been reading discussion threads on different fora and finding little agreement.

"You ignore all class, race, spell and level requirements on attuning to or using a magic item."

RAW suggests that the Magic Item Savant can cast any spell on a scroll. Anyone read an official or semi-official ruling that's different?

It seems to be a case of specific (Artificer class feature) beats general (Spell scroll rules).

A spell scroll is categorized as a magic item in the DMG.  However, there might be a couple of potential issues here:

First, the item description says:  "If the spell is on your class’s spell list, you can read the scroll and cast its spell without providing any material components. Otherwise, the scroll is unintelligible."

As written, is that a class requirement per se, or is that . . . some other type of requirement?

Next, the item description only calls for an ability check "If the spell is on your class’s spell list but of a higher level than you can normally cast".

So, as written, is that a level requirement per se, or is that . . . some other type of requirement?

My hunch is that this isn't quite going to work, but that might be too nitpicky.

I think the rule only applies to items the artificer could create or spells they could cast. If they could not copy or create a scroll then they still do not get to cast it.

I do not think scrolls count as items RAW. they are listed separately from everything else that needs attunement.

The 14th level skill specifically mentions attuneable items. Nothing else. "You ignore all class, race, spell, and level requirements on attuning to or using a magic item." Items like weapons and wands and such.

The whole point of an artificer is to copy or make magic items, I do not even think they mention scrolls anyplace else in the description of artificer.

So why would they all of a sudden gain scroll knowledge? From all other classes?

Quote from TheGnome5786 >>

I think the rule only applies to items the artificer could create or spells they could cast. If they could not copy or create a scroll then they still do not get to cast it.

I do not think scrolls count as items RAW. they are listed separately from everything else that needs attunement.

The 14th level skill specifically mentions attuneable items. Nothing else. "You ignore all class, race, spell, and level requirements on attuning to or using a magic item." Items like weapons and wands and such.

The whole point of an artificer is to copy or make magic items, I do not even think they mention scrolls anyplace else in the description of artificer.

So why would they all of a sudden gain scroll knowledge? From all other classes?

Most of this argument doesn't seem correct to me.  It's a class feature -- it does what it says it does.  Only applies to items the artificer could create or spells they could cast?  That is not specified or even implied anywhere in the class feature.  Scrolls don't count as items?  Listed separately?  What do you mean?  The Spell Scroll is listed alphabetically along with all other magic items in the DMG.  Only mentions attuneable items?  That's not correct either -- it says "You ignore . . . requirements on attuning to OR using a magic item".

However, that does bring up another potential issue.  The item description says:  "you can use an action to read the scroll and cast its spell".  So, does this mean that we are taking the Cast a Spell action when casting from a scroll?  Or are we taking the Use an Object action?  I should know this but I cannot remember.  But it would seem like the latter is required in order for the class feature to apply.

In terms of the two issues that I brought up previously, I think that the 2nd one is probably ok (it's a level requirement) but I have a feeling that the first one is probably not actually a class requirement, but instead it is a requirement that the spell is on a specific spell list.  Maybe.  I could see arguments both ways on that one.

Artificers are very good at creating scrolls (if proficient in Arcana) -- the Magic Item Adept lets them create common or uncommon magic items (mostly scrolls) at 1/4 the time and 1/2 the cost -- I have an artificer who writes lots of scrolls during down time. Since by my reckoning scrolls are magic items (if consumable ones like potions) they should qualify for use with the Magic Item Savant feature. But the wording of how that works is ambiguous re: rules for spell scroll use thus my question.

I think using a scroll is taking the Use Magic Item action, if memory serves rather than "Use an Object" and the effects produced are the spell -- and I've seen rules to suggest that scrolls do not qualify for "Use an Object" (so a Thief can't use Fast Hands to use one). The closest class feature to this Artificer feature is the Thief's "Use Magic Item" feature, for which scrolls do qualify though the Thief does need to make an ability check ... both of these are mentioned in the Sage Advice compendium: https://www.dndbeyond.com/sources/sac/sage-advice-compendium#ClassFeatures

Ah, that's interesting that the Use an Object action does not work to activate a magic item according to the DMG.

According to the DMG -> Activating an Item:  "Activating some magic items requires a user to do something special" . . . "The description of each item category or individual item details how an item is activated" . . . "If an item requires an action to activate, that action isn't a function of the Use an Item action" . . . "Some items are used up when they are activated.  The writing vanishes from a scroll when it is read.  Once used, a consumable item loses its magic." . . . "Some magic items allow the user to cast a spell from the item" . . . "Many items, such as potions, bypass the casting of a spell and confer the spell's effects, with their usual duration.  Certain items make exceptions to these rules" . . . "If you don't have a spellcasting ability-perhaps you're a rogue with the Use Magic Device feature- your spellcasting ability modifier is +0 for the item, and your proficiency bonus does apply" . . . "Some magic items have charges that must be expended to activate their properties. The number of charges an item has remaining is revealed when an identify spell is cast on it, as well as when a creature attunes to it.  Additionally, when an item regains charges, the creature attuned to it learns how many charges it regained."

So, my takeaway from all of that is that there is not one type of action that "uses" or activates a magic item -- it will depend on the item itself and what is written in that item's description.

Interestingly, according to the DMG, all magic items fall into one of 9 possible categories:   armor, potions, rings, rods, scrolls, staffs, wands, weapons, or wonderous items.  Of course, a spell scroll belongs to the scrolls category.  The description for the Scrolls category says:  "A scroll is a consumable magic item. Whatever the nature of the magic contained in a scroll, unleashing that magic requires using an action to read the scroll" and "Any creature that can understand a written language can read the arcane script on a scroll and attempt to activate it".

Next, within the Scrolls category we have the item itself which is a Spell Scroll.  "If the spell is on your class's spell list you can use an action to read the scroll and cast its spell without having to provide any of the spell's components.  Otherwise, the scroll is unintelligible."

So now at least we know which type of action is required to cast a spell from a spell scroll, which "uses" and/or activates this magic item.  We must use an "improvised action" to read the spell scroll.  The class features such as the Artificer's Magic Item Savant and the Rogue/Thief's Use Magic Device both say that certain requirements are ignored "on using a magic item" or "on the use of magic items".  I was taking that to mean that the Use an Object action is required for these features which might apply only to some magic items -- but the 5e system doesn't seem to work that way at all and these phrases should just be interpreted as common language.

I'm not sure if any of that even helps answer the original question but at least I have a better grasp of the mechanics now!

If we really parse the wording of the description for the Spell Scroll, my current thinking is that these class features WILL allow you to bypass the ability check for scrolls with high-level spells, BUT the spell must still be on your class's spell list to cast it.  This reads to me like it's not technically a class restriction, however, Sage Advice seems to imply that it is since they are saying that a Thief can use its class feature to cast spells from spell scrolls (a Rogue / Thief doesn't otherwise have a class spell list).  So if you are good with that ruling then you are good to go!

Will it unbalance the game it is being played in (not the larger rules)?

Does it add to the fun for *everyone* (including the DM)?

Aside from the rules, is there a reason not to allow it that is based in the world being played in or the needs of the party?

If the answers there are No, yes, no -- then I would be fine allowing it in my games, but that call will always remain with the DM.

Yes, When I realized Artificer's Magic Savant was similar to Thief's Use Magic Item, and based on the Sage Advice column comments, I have decided to allow it without class restrictions as worded in the feature. (Though it turns out there is no rule that a Thief needs to make an ability check to use a spell scroll -- I was confusing the language from what a Thief uses as a spell casting DC when activating an item that requires the user to do so.)

The way I always read it is that it gives you the ability to try. You'd still have to roll to see if it's successful, if it's a spell level you wouldn't be able to cast normally because you're not high enough level.

So you'd be able to use a scroll of Wish, but you'd still have to make a DC19 intelligence check for it to succeed.

The scroll use rules considerably predate the artificer class so I’m not surprised they don’t cover its ability. That said I would treat the ratifier ability as a specific rule superceding the older general scroll rules. Further as an arcane magic user I wouldn’t have a problem with them reading, using and casting spells from any of the arcane lists (artificer, bard, Wizard, sorceror) I might have to think about the warlock as the language of the scroll might be different from standard arcane notation. I would also generally take them trying to use divine or primal scrolls as problematic.