I don't think you would need the Dual Wielder feat as a Fighter 5 to throw 4 daggers;.
Attack action: Draw and throw dagger
Extra Attack: Draw and throw dagger
Nick Mastery: Draw and throw dagger
Light Property: Draw and throw dagger as bonus action
How are you getting 4 attacks here? All the Nick property lets you do is move the Light property's extra attack to the Attack action instead of its own Bonus Action. You can't use it more than once.
"This extra attack" is the aforementioned "extra attack of the Light property". Nick doesn't give you a new extra attack, it just changes the light property's timing, and also places a restriction on it.
Exactly, but the 1/turn is not a limit in the Light property but the Nick Mastery.
To me ''this'' extra attack = the extra attack of the Light property that you make as part of the Attack action instead of as a Bonus Action with the Nick Mastery.
The Nick mastery doesn't grant an extra attack.
There is only the extra attack of the Light property, as modified by Nick. (Maybe we should just find Nick and ask him.) That modification includes "you may only make this attack once a turn".
I don't think you would need the Dual Wielder feat as a Fighter 5 to throw 4 daggers;.
Attack action: Draw and throw dagger
Extra Attack: Draw and throw dagger
Nick Mastery: Draw and throw dagger
Light Property: Draw and throw dagger as bonus action
I dont think you get nick and light. Nick allows you to use light as part of the action. Not do it twice.
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The limit of 1/turn is in the Nick Mastery rather than the Light property hence the interrogations. But yeah i think the extra attack from the Light property should be limited to once per turn wether used as a bonus action or as part of the Attack action instead.
The limit of 1/turn is in the Nick Mastery rather than the Light property hence the interrogations. But yeah i think the extra attack from the Light property should be limited to once per turn wether used as a bonus action or as part of the Attack action instead.
It is EXPLICITELY stated in Nick that you do NOT get an extra attack. Nick does NOT give you any kind of attack in any way, shape, or form. All Nick does is allow you to take the extra attack you get from Light and move it from your bonus action to your part of your attack action.
The point i'm making is the place where this limit is found. A character without Nick Mastery that just relied on Light property weapons and had a way to take more than one bonus action per turn would not be limited to make this extra attack only once per turn. This limit should have been in the Light property.
The point i'm making is the place where this limitat is found. A character without Nick Mastery that just relied on Light property weapons and had a way to take more than one bonus action per turn would not be limited to make this extra attack only once per turn. This limit should have been in the Light property.
The limit essentially is in the Light action. Light gives you an extra attack as a bonus action. The underlying action economy of the game gives you one, and only one Bonus Action on your turn: "You can take only one Bonus Action on your turn, so you must choose which Bonus Action to use if you have more than one available."
With respect, it feels a bit like you're trying to force a square peg into a round hole. The game gives you a single Bonus Action on your turn. The Light property says if you take the Attack action with a Light weapon, you can later on in your turn use your one Bonus Action to make another attack with a different weapon that also has the Light property. The ONLY thing that Nick does is allow you to take that extra attack given to you by the Light property and make it as part of your Attack action instead of as a Bonus Action. The REASON that Nick specifies you can only make this extra attack once per turn is to keep people from doing what you're arguing in favor of.
Nick does not give you any attacks whatsoever. It merely allows you to take your ONE attack from Light at a different time. This frees up your Bonus Action to do other things that your character might be able to do with a Bonus Action (for example a level 2+ Rogue could then Disengage and possibly move away from danger).
Light Property: Extra attack of the Light property as a Bonus Action with different Light weapon can't add positive ability modifier to the damage. Nick Mastery: Extra attack of the Light property become part of Attack action instead of Bonus Action (1/turn). Dual Wielder Feat: Extra attack of the Dual Wielder feat as a Bonus Action with different non-Two-Handed melee weapon, can't add positive ability modifier to the damage. Two Weapon Fighting Style: Can now add ability modifier to the extra attack's damage of the Light property or Dual Wielder feat.
I feel like a level-5 fighter with a shield and an empty hand and three daggers on his belt can make three thrown dagger attacks all with the same attack action, and one of them (the one from Nick) won't get the fighter's Str/Dex modifier added into the damage. The fighter will still be left with their bonus action available after this sequence of three attacks.
This is what is intended. Daggers are small. It makes sense to be able to throw a handful or them, or throw a couple really quickly.
Someone has already done the math and setting yourself up for multiple attacks with Nick and Light weapons keeps up with just building around a single Heavy Two-Handed weapon in terms of damage, basically as closely as it can. In terms of level progression, which of the two builds does more damage per turn actually switches multiple times as you go from 1 to 20. Heavy Starts in the lead, gets passed at 4, passes again at 5, gets passed at 6, passes again at 11, then gets passed one last time at 17, and only by like 2.5 damage per turn.
1. Moves 5 feet towards goblin, take the Attack action, equip rapier & scimitar and attack with scimitar. [Action Action#1][5Movement][DualWielder:QuickDraw]
2. Attack with rapier and unequip rapier & scimitar. [Action Action#2][DualWielder:QuickDraw]
3. Equip shortsword & warhammer attack with shortsword with Advantage. [DualWielder:QuickDraw][LightWeapon][Nick][Vex]
4. Unequip shortsword and attack with warhammer with Advantage using both hands, knocking the goblin back ten feet. [DualWielder][BonusAction][Versatile][Vex][Push]
5. Unequip warhammer while moving 25 feet away from the goblin. [Free Object Interaction][25Movement]
1. Moves 5 feet towards goblin, take the Attack action, equip rapier & scimitar and attack with scimitar. [Action Action#1][5Movement][DualWielder:QuickDraw]
2. Attack with rapier and unequip rapier & scimitar. [Action Action#2][DualWielder:QuickDraw]
3. Equip shortsword & warhammer attack with shortsword with Advantage. [DualWielder:QuickDraw][LightWeapon][Nick][Vex]
4. Unequip shortsword and attack with warhammer with Advantage using both hands, knocking the goblin back ten feet. [DualWielder][BonusAction][Versatile][Vex][Push]
5. Unequip warhammer while moving 25 feet away from the goblin. [Free Object Interaction][25Movement]
Probably I'm missing something, but in step 4, is the interaction with the shortword done using the Bonus Action?
Equipping and Unequipping weapons can only be done as part of the Attack action, am I right?
1. Moves 5 feet towards goblin, take the Attack action, equip rapier & scimitar and attack with scimitar. [Action Action#1][5Movement][DualWielder:QuickDraw]
2. Attack with rapier and unequip rapier & scimitar. [Action Action#2][DualWielder:QuickDraw]
3. Equip shortsword & warhammer attack with shortsword with Advantage. [DualWielder:QuickDraw][LightWeapon][Nick][Vex]
4. Unequip shortsword and attack with warhammer with Advantage using both hands, knocking the goblin back ten feet. [DualWielder][BonusAction][Versatile][Vex][Push]
5. Unequip warhammer while moving 25 feet away from the goblin. [Free Object Interaction][25Movement]
It only says you can draw/stow weapons as part of an attack in the Attack action. Number 4 is a bonus action. So that also doesn't work.
I don't see any way that you could use Rapier, Scimitar, Shortsword and Warhammer all in one turn, but you could make another attack with the warhammer instead of the rapier.
* Attack 1: Warhammer, then stow it
* Attack 2: Draw Scimitar and Shortsword, attack with Scimitar
* Nick Attack: Attack with Shortsword. Stow both weapons.
If there is ever concern that the free item interaction shouldn't be used with Bonus Action, you could do the following as well:
1. Moves 5 feet towards goblin, take the Attack action, equip rapier & scimitar and attack with scimitar. [Action Action#1][5Movement][DualWielder:QuickDraw]
2. Attack with rapier and unequip rapier & scimitar. [Action Action#2][DualWielder:QuickDraw]
3. Equip shortsword & warhammer attack with shortsword with Advantage. [DualWielder:QuickDraw][LightWeapon][Nick][Vex]
4. Move 5 feet, unequip shortsword and attack with warhammer with Advantage using both hands, knocking the goblin back ten feet. [5Movement][Free Object Interaction][DualWielder][BonusAction][Versatile][Vex][Push]
5. Moving 20 feet away from the goblin. [20Movement]
If there is ever concern that the free item interaction shouldn't be used with Bonus Action, you could do the following as well:
1. Moves 5 feet towards goblin, take the Attack action, equip rapier & scimitar and attack with scimitar. [Action Action#1][5Movement][DualWielder:QuickDraw]
2. Attack with rapier and unequip rapier & scimitar. [Action Action#2][DualWielder:QuickDraw]
3. Equip shortsword & warhammer attack with shortsword with Advantage. [DualWielder:QuickDraw][LightWeapon][Nick][Vex]
4. Move 5 feet, unequip shortsword and attack with warhammer with Advantage using both hands, knocking the goblin back ten feet. [5Movement][Free Object Interaction][DualWielder][BonusAction][Versatile][Vex][Push]
5. Moving 20 feet away from the goblin. [20Movement]
This works, but I'd just add that it's not a repeatable pattern. You start with no weapons in hand and end with the Warhammer in hand. You could, of course, add a second routine where you start with the Warhammer and end with the Scimitar and Rapier and then alternate between those two.
Also, minor point: when you write "with advantage" it's of course only with advantage if the Vex attack hit.
I don't think you would need the Dual Wielder feat as a Fighter 5 to throw 4 daggers;.
Attack action: Draw and throw dagger
Extra Attack: Draw and throw dagger
Nick Mastery: Draw and throw dagger
Light Property: Draw and throw dagger as bonus action
I don't really know if they intend extra attacks during the Attack action to enable the Light property extra attack as bonus action or not though.
How are you getting 4 attacks here? All the Nick property lets you do is move the Light property's extra attack to the Attack action instead of its own Bonus Action. You can't use it more than once.
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The Nick mastery doesn't grant an extra attack.
There is only the extra attack of the Light property, as modified by Nick. (Maybe we should just find Nick and ask him.) That modification includes "you may only make this attack once a turn".
I dont think you get nick and light. Nick allows you to use light as part of the action. Not do it twice.
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The limit of 1/turn is in the Nick Mastery rather than the Light property hence the interrogations. But yeah i think the extra attack from the Light property should be limited to once per turn wether used as a bonus action or as part of the Attack action instead.
It is EXPLICITELY stated in Nick that you do NOT get an extra attack. Nick does NOT give you any kind of attack in any way, shape, or form. All Nick does is allow you to take the extra attack you get from Light and move it from your bonus action to your part of your attack action.
The point i'm making is the place where this limit is found. A character without Nick Mastery that just relied on Light property weapons and had a way to take more than one bonus action per turn would not be limited to make this extra attack only once per turn. This limit should have been in the Light property.
The limit essentially is in the Light action. Light gives you an extra attack as a bonus action. The underlying action economy of the game gives you one, and only one Bonus Action on your turn: "You can take only one Bonus Action on your turn, so you must choose which Bonus Action to use if you have more than one available."
With respect, it feels a bit like you're trying to force a square peg into a round hole. The game gives you a single Bonus Action on your turn. The Light property says if you take the Attack action with a Light weapon, you can later on in your turn use your one Bonus Action to make another attack with a different weapon that also has the Light property. The ONLY thing that Nick does is allow you to take that extra attack given to you by the Light property and make it as part of your Attack action instead of as a Bonus Action. The REASON that Nick specifies you can only make this extra attack once per turn is to keep people from doing what you're arguing in favor of.
Nick does not give you any attacks whatsoever. It merely allows you to take your ONE attack from Light at a different time. This frees up your Bonus Action to do other things that your character might be able to do with a Bonus Action (for example a level 2+ Rogue could then Disengage and possibly move away from danger).
So if i summarize the various features:
Light Property: Extra attack of the Light property as a Bonus Action with different Light weapon can't add positive ability modifier to the damage.
Nick Mastery: Extra attack of the Light property become part of Attack action instead of Bonus Action (1/turn).
Dual Wielder Feat: Extra attack of the Dual Wielder feat as a Bonus Action with different non-Two-Handed melee weapon, can't add positive ability modifier to the damage.
Two Weapon Fighting Style: Can now add ability modifier to the extra attack's damage of the Light property or Dual Wielder feat.
This is what is intended. Daggers are small. It makes sense to be able to throw a handful or them, or throw a couple really quickly.
Someone has already done the math and setting yourself up for multiple attacks with Nick and Light weapons keeps up with just building around a single Heavy Two-Handed weapon in terms of damage, basically as closely as it can. In terms of level progression, which of the two builds does more damage per turn actually switches multiple times as you go from 1 to 20. Heavy Starts in the lead, gets passed at 4, passes again at 5, gets passed at 6, passes again at 11, then gets passed one last time at 17, and only by like 2.5 damage per turn.
Ok, I think this is possible:
A fifth-level fighter with dual-wielder and two-weapon fighting initiates combat with a goblin 10 feet away:
<StartOfTurn>
1. Moves to the goblin while unsheathing a rapier and a scimitar. [5Movement][DualWielder:QuickDraw]
2. Attacks with the scimitar.[AttackAction#1]
3. Sheaths the scimitar and pulls out a shortsword.[DualWielder:QuickDraw]
4. Attacks and hits with the rapier.[DualWielder][BonusAction]
5. Attacks with Advantage and hits with the shortsword.[Vex][LightWeapon][Nick]
6. Sheathes the shortsword and rapier.[DualWielder:QuickDraw]
7. Draws a warhammer and using both hands attacks with Advantage, knocking the goblin back ten feet.[AttackAction#2][Versatile][Vex][Push]
8. Sheathes the warhammer while moving twenty-five more feet away from the goblin.[DualWielder:QuickDraw][25Movement]
<EndOfTurn>
Quick Draw allows you to draw two weapons or stow two weapons, not stow one and draw another.
@Nydalap without going into too much detail, just a quick comment. Dual Wielder says:
You can interpret this as getting either two draws or two stows, but not one of each.
EDIT: I got ninja'd by @DerManiac :D
It could work in the following way:
1. Moves 5 feet towards goblin, take the Attack action, equip rapier & scimitar and attack with scimitar. [Action Action#1][5Movement][DualWielder:QuickDraw]
2. Attack with rapier and unequip rapier & scimitar. [Action Action#2][DualWielder:QuickDraw]
3. Equip shortsword & warhammer attack with shortsword with Advantage. [DualWielder:QuickDraw][LightWeapon][Nick][Vex]
4. Unequip shortsword and attack with warhammer with Advantage using both hands, knocking the goblin back ten feet. [DualWielder][BonusAction][Versatile][Vex][Push]
5. Unequip warhammer while moving 25 feet away from the goblin. [Free Object Interaction][25Movement]
Probably I'm missing something, but in step 4, is the interaction with the shortword done using the Bonus Action?
Equipping and Unequipping weapons can only be done as part of the Attack action, am I right?
It only says you can draw/stow weapons as part of an attack in the Attack action. Number 4 is a bonus action. So that also doesn't work.
I don't see any way that you could use Rapier, Scimitar, Shortsword and Warhammer all in one turn, but you could make another attack with the warhammer instead of the rapier.
* Attack 1: Warhammer, then stow it
* Attack 2: Draw Scimitar and Shortsword, attack with Scimitar
* Nick Attack: Attack with Shortsword. Stow both weapons.
* Free Object Interaction: Draw Warhammer
* Bonus Action Attack: Warhammer
You're right Free Object Interaction to unequip would need tp be done at step 4 and step 5would move still wielding warhammer then i guess.
If there is ever concern that the free item interaction shouldn't be used with Bonus Action, you could do the following as well:
1. Moves 5 feet towards goblin, take the Attack action, equip rapier & scimitar and attack with scimitar. [Action Action#1][5Movement][DualWielder:QuickDraw]
2. Attack with rapier and unequip rapier & scimitar. [Action Action#2][DualWielder:QuickDraw]
3. Equip shortsword & warhammer attack with shortsword with Advantage. [DualWielder:QuickDraw][LightWeapon][Nick][Vex]
4. Move 5 feet, unequip shortsword and attack with warhammer with Advantage using both hands, knocking the goblin back ten feet. [5Movement][Free Object Interaction][DualWielder][BonusAction][Versatile][Vex][Push]
5. Moving 20 feet away from the goblin. [20Movement]
This works, but I'd just add that it's not a repeatable pattern. You start with no weapons in hand and end with the Warhammer in hand. You could, of course, add a second routine where you start with the Warhammer and end with the Scimitar and Rapier and then alternate between those two.
Also, minor point: when you write "with advantage" it's of course only with advantage if the Vex attack hit.