It’s amazing what just a dip of fighter can do to other classes. Even just the one level grabs you two if not three weapon proficiencies. It honestly makes me wonder why they made the weapon mastery feat so bad by comparison. They could even have made it Weapon Mastery Expert and give you mastery in all weapons all the time and it wouldn’t seem that broken by comparison. Give it a +1 to something and it wouldn’t seem likely be one of the best feats, albeit multi-classing still grants you a lot of other stuff that can be useful. In this case, i’m not sure which would be better.
In general, the Weapon Master feat is pretty bad. A single level of Fighter grabs you 3 weapon masteries that are changeable after a Long Rest, Constitution saving throw proficiency, and armor/shield proficiencies (including heavy if done at level 1). This is basically the combination of 5 feats all at once (Lightly Armored, Moderately Armored, Heavily Armored, Weapon Master, Resilient - Constitution) for a single level of multiclassing. It pretty well makes those feats completely worthless unless you are at a table that bans multiclassing.
Agreed.
I hear Paladin is a close second, but you basically have to go strength instead of dexterity due to the requirements. I have found that if we just had two more points you could have a 13/14/15/8/8/15 or 15/14/15/8/8/13 and meet the requirements while still having the maximum bonus for your medium armor, but I’m sure that is by design… or at least would be claimed to be.
Anyway, they get two weapon expertise, spells and spell slots (generally Bless and Protection over Good and Evil are the best ones), as well as the lay on hands more for poison than health.
It’s amazing what just a dip of fighter can do to other classes. Even just the one level grabs you two if not three weapon proficiencies. It honestly makes me wonder why they made the weapon mastery feat so bad by comparison. They could even have made it Weapon Mastery Expert and give you mastery in all weapons all the time and it wouldn’t seem that broken by comparison. Give it a +1 to something and it wouldn’t seem likely be one of the best feats, albeit multi-classing still grants you a lot of other stuff that can be useful. In this case, i’m not sure which would be better.
In general, the Weapon Master feat is pretty bad. A single level of Fighter grabs you 3 weapon masteries that are changeable after a Long Rest, Constitution saving throw proficiency, and armor/shield proficiencies (including heavy if done at level 1). This is basically the combination of 5 feats all at once (Lightly Armored, Moderately Armored, Heavily Armored, Weapon Master, Resilient - Constitution) for a single level of multiclassing. It pretty well makes those feats completely worthless unless you are at a table that bans multiclassing.
Agreed.
I hear Paladin is a close second, but you basically have to go strength instead of dexterity due to the requirements. I have found that if we just had two more points you could have a 13/14/15/8/8/15 or 15/14/15/8/8/13 and meet the requirements while still having the maximum bonus for your medium armor, but I’m sure that is by design… or at least would be claimed to be.
Anyway, they get two weapon expertise, spells and spell slots (generally Bless and Protection over Good and Evil are the best ones), as well as the lay on hands more for poison than health.
Paladin has the bad requirement of needing 13 in both Strength and Charisma. In order to multiclass with Monk, you need a minimum 13 in Str, Dex, Wis, and Cha. That is a lot of ability scores that you have to spread around, meaning you will likely have lesser main stats across the board just so you can fulfill your multiclass requirements. Fighter only needs 13 in one of two stats, and most any character would want a decent Str or Dex, depending on build, so Fighter becomes very easy to multiclass. It's kind of the go-to dip under the 2024 rules, and easy to justify with any build.
It’s amazing what just a dip of fighter can do to other classes. Even just the one level grabs you two if not three weapon proficiencies. It honestly makes me wonder why they made the weapon mastery feat so bad by comparison. They could even have made it Weapon Mastery Expert and give you mastery in all weapons all the time and it wouldn’t seem that broken by comparison. Give it a +1 to something and it wouldn’t seem likely be one of the best feats, albeit multi-classing still grants you a lot of other stuff that can be useful. In this case, i’m not sure which would be better.
In general, the Weapon Master feat is pretty bad. A single level of Fighter grabs you 3 weapon masteries that are changeable after a Long Rest, Constitution saving throw proficiency, and armor/shield proficiencies (including heavy if done at level 1). This is basically the combination of 5 feats all at once (Lightly Armored, Moderately Armored, Heavily Armored, Weapon Master, Resilient - Constitution) for a single level of multiclassing. It pretty well makes those feats completely worthless unless you are at a table that bans multiclassing.
The functional cost for a feat is much lower than the cost of taking a level of a second class. You're giving up the opportunity cost of taking a different feat, vs giving up an entire level's worth of class features which you will never get back.
Which isn't to say Weapon master is worth taking, either specifically for a monk or in general.
No reason to mess around with short sword and scimitar. Your monk weapons do your monk damage die, not their normal damage. Two daggers does just as well, you get the nick property, and you can throw them when needed. Level 5 you get extra attack. So assuming you have Nick mastery (either multiclassing or the feat at level 4), that's Attack (normal), Attack (extra attack), Attack (from nick), Unarmed Attack as bonus action, Unarmed attack (from Flurry). Five attacks per round at level 5 (or level 6 if you multiclassed). Do this in Darkness as a Shadow Monk and all 5 attacks have advantage. Do this instead with Mercy Monk and you can add Martial Arts die plus your Wisdom modifier to it, which is effectively like another attack in some ways.
If you took the weapon mastery feat (not multiclass) to get weapon mastery in daggers, then this is fine but if you multiclassed, using two daggers is wasted, the reason for mixing scimitar (or dagger) with a shortsword is that if the shortsword hits, the next attack has advantage, you can try to seek situtations where you have advantage but for the majority of builds it is hard to ensure you have advantage 100% of the time, meanwhile having two daggers gives zero net benefit over scimitar+shortsword or dagger+shortsword.
The best combination that accomplishes the same weapon masteries but where each weapon has the thrown property as well is handaxe and either dagger or light hammer. People forget that the handaxe is a monk weapon.
The best combination that accomplishes the same weapon masteries but where each weapon has the thrown property as well is handaxe and either dagger or light hammer. People forget that the handaxe is a monk weapon.
Just to be clear, with the Weapon Mastery feat, you only have access to Nick (Dagger) or Vex (Handaxe) at a given time. If you multiclass, that's totally fine, rock that 1d12 Handaxe to set up advantage for the 1d12 Dagger Nick attack in the same attack action before you flurry for your Bonus Action. Also, if you know your enemy has a weakness or resistance, you can prepare with appropriate weapons (Silver weapons versus shapechangers for example).
Agreed.
I hear Paladin is a close second, but you basically have to go strength instead of dexterity due to the requirements. I have found that if we just had two more points you could have a 13/14/15/8/8/15 or 15/14/15/8/8/13 and meet the requirements while still having the maximum bonus for your medium armor, but I’m sure that is by design… or at least would be claimed to be.
Anyway, they get two weapon expertise, spells and spell slots (generally Bless and Protection over Good and Evil are the best ones), as well as the lay on hands more for poison than health.
Paladin has the bad requirement of needing 13 in both Strength and Charisma. In order to multiclass with Monk, you need a minimum 13 in Str, Dex, Wis, and Cha. That is a lot of ability scores that you have to spread around, meaning you will likely have lesser main stats across the board just so you can fulfill your multiclass requirements. Fighter only needs 13 in one of two stats, and most any character would want a decent Str or Dex, depending on build, so Fighter becomes very easy to multiclass. It's kind of the go-to dip under the 2024 rules, and easy to justify with any build.
The functional cost for a feat is much lower than the cost of taking a level of a second class. You're giving up the opportunity cost of taking a different feat, vs giving up an entire level's worth of class features which you will never get back.
Which isn't to say Weapon master is worth taking, either specifically for a monk or in general.
The best combination that accomplishes the same weapon masteries but where each weapon has the thrown property as well is handaxe and either dagger or light hammer. People forget that the handaxe is a monk weapon.
Just to be clear, with the Weapon Mastery feat, you only have access to Nick (Dagger) or Vex (Handaxe) at a given time. If you multiclass, that's totally fine, rock that 1d12 Handaxe to set up advantage for the 1d12 Dagger Nick attack in the same attack action before you flurry for your Bonus Action. Also, if you know your enemy has a weakness or resistance, you can prepare with appropriate weapons (Silver weapons versus shapechangers for example).
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My houserulings.