Recently I had a discussion regarding Tidal Wave with one of my players and I wanted to check with others regarding my reasoning. We discussed the "direction" of Tidal Wave. Am I correct in assuming that the spell description
"You conjure up a wave of water that crashes down on an area within range. The area can be up to 30 feet long, up to 10 feet wide, and up to 10 feet tall. "
means that the spells direction, the movement of the water, is initially downwards? And that the tidal wave originates somewhere ABOVE the area in question, then crashes downwards?
I also ruled that the whole area affected by the wave must be seen by the caster, would you agree with this? That is, the spell cannot include e.g. an area hidden behind a closed door.
You can cast an Area of Effect spell in order to affect an area you can't see but, the spell has to placed in an area you CAN see. If something is in range of this placement, seen or not, I imagine it would be affected.
Let's say you come across a room that you need to move through but, vents in the floor are belching smoke and flame. Your DM allows you to surmise that a forge area either below or adjacent to this room. You cast Tidal Wave in the room you can see and it drains into the areas you cannot, extinguishing the forge.
Am I correct in assuming that the spell description
"You conjure up a wave of water that crashes down on an area within range. The area can be up to 30 feet long, up to 10 feet wide, and up to 10 feet tall. "
means that the spells direction, the movement of the water, is initially downwards? And that the tidal wave originates somewhere ABOVE the area in question, then crashes downwards?
The details of how the wave materializes are left up to the imagination. I reason the wave is probably 10 feet tall and capable of moving forward some distance before crashing down. Either way, anything within the area described should be affected and anything outside of the area should be left relatively untouched.
I also ruled that the whole area affected by the wave must be seen by the caster, would you agree with this?
The spellcasting rules don't require this, and neither does this particular spell.
That is, the spell cannot include e.g. an area hidden behind a closed door.
The rules for total cover and areas of effect already account for this. You can't place the point of origin for an area of effect behind cover, and an area effect can't protrude beyond total cover either (though some spells like Fireball might be able to bend around it.)
I think crashes down is more of a figure of speech. I don’t think the idea is that this conjures up a big brick of water that drops from above. I picture it more as a big curl of water, or somethings that swells up and flips over on itself, since that fits more with a wave. I agree with coder that a name like wave implies movement, but since the initial effect seems to be a fixed area, maybe there isn’t any and it is just a big block of water that appears. Of course the spell doesn’t specify, so you’re free to interpret direction how you like. I would probably even give the player some leeway in describing how the water moves, with the stipulation that it wouldn’t change the mechanics of the spell.
I agree with coder that a name like wave implies movement, but since the initial effect seems to be a fixed area, maybe there isn’t any and it is just a big block of water that appears. Of course the spell doesn’t specify, so you’re free to interpret direction how you like. I would probably even give the player some leeway in describing how the water moves, with the stipulation that it wouldn’t change the mechanics of the spell.
If we look at it from a practical perspective, a wave is a very complex thing to try to model in a pen and paper game. I think the spell is definitely intended to produce a wave of water, but trying to account for how that wave swells and how it might affect creatures differently based on where they are isn't worth the hassle. The game designers streamlined the process: if you're within the area the spell describes, you'll get caught up in the wave's flow and be subjected to blunt force one way or another.
I also ruled that the whole area affected by the wave must be seen by the caster, would you agree with this? That is, the spell cannot include e.g. an area hidden behind a closed door.
Well, you have to have a line of sight to pinpoint the place from which the spell originates but if it creates something bigger that expands outside your field of vision, it should be able to do so. Would you rule that if you cast fireball at the corner that the fire doesn't extend around it because you can't see it?
I think of it as standing on a beach watching a surfer on a huge wave. Except it’s constrained to the proportions of the spell. A wave doesn’t just crash in one spot, it moves crashing down in front of itself as it goes. Same for this. The area defined by the spell is where that rolling wave is crashing down as it moves. Not a bunch of water dropping from above. That would be a waterfall spell if there was one.
I would rule of cool that any thing that provides cover would have to stand up to the 4d8 damage. A stone building with a stone door? No problem. But a wooden building or even a stone building with a wooden door facing the tidal wave? Yeah, it better be described as a well built or tough door/wooden building. Otherwise I am ruling the tidal wave breaks it.
Well, you have to have a line of sight to pinpoint the place from which the spell originates but if it creates something bigger that expands outside your field of vision, it should be able to do so.
The rules explicitly allow you to choose a point you can't see. Again, there is absolutely no requirement to see what you're targeting unless the spell says so.
A Clear Path to the Target
To target something, you must have a clear path to it, so it can't be behind total cover. If you place an area of effect at a point that you can't see and an obstruction, such as a wall, is between you and that point, the point of origin comes into being on the near side of that obstruction.
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Hello!
Recently I had a discussion regarding Tidal Wave with one of my players and I wanted to check with others regarding my reasoning. We discussed the "direction" of Tidal Wave. Am I correct in assuming that the spell description
"You conjure up a wave of water that crashes down on an area within range. The area can be up to 30 feet long, up to 10 feet wide, and up to 10 feet tall. "
means that the spells direction, the movement of the water, is initially downwards? And that the tidal wave originates somewhere ABOVE the area in question, then crashes downwards?
I also ruled that the whole area affected by the wave must be seen by the caster, would you agree with this? That is, the spell cannot include e.g. an area hidden behind a closed door.
Regards,
You can cast an Area of Effect spell in order to affect an area you can't see but, the spell has to placed in an area you CAN see. If something is in range of this placement, seen or not, I imagine it would be affected.
Let's say you come across a room that you need to move through but, vents in the floor are belching smoke and flame. Your DM allows you to surmise that a forge area either below or adjacent to this room. You cast Tidal Wave in the room you can see and it drains into the areas you cannot, extinguishing the forge.
The details of how the wave materializes are left up to the imagination. I reason the wave is probably 10 feet tall and capable of moving forward some distance before crashing down. Either way, anything within the area described should be affected and anything outside of the area should be left relatively untouched.
The spellcasting rules don't require this, and neither does this particular spell.
The rules for total cover and areas of effect already account for this. You can't place the point of origin for an area of effect behind cover, and an area effect can't protrude beyond total cover either (though some spells like Fireball might be able to bend around it.)
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I think crashes down is more of a figure of speech. I don’t think the idea is that this conjures up a big brick of water that drops from above. I picture it more as a big curl of water, or somethings that swells up and flips over on itself, since that fits more with a wave.
I agree with coder that a name like wave implies movement, but since the initial effect seems to be a fixed area, maybe there isn’t any and it is just a big block of water that appears. Of course the spell doesn’t specify, so you’re free to interpret direction how you like. I would probably even give the player some leeway in describing how the water moves, with the stipulation that it wouldn’t change the mechanics of the spell.
If we look at it from a practical perspective, a wave is a very complex thing to try to model in a pen and paper game. I think the spell is definitely intended to produce a wave of water, but trying to account for how that wave swells and how it might affect creatures differently based on where they are isn't worth the hassle. The game designers streamlined the process: if you're within the area the spell describes, you'll get caught up in the wave's flow and be subjected to blunt force one way or another.
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Well, you have to have a line of sight to pinpoint the place from which the spell originates but if it creates something bigger that expands outside your field of vision, it should be able to do so. Would you rule that if you cast fireball at the corner that the fire doesn't extend around it because you can't see it?
I think of it as standing on a beach watching a surfer on a huge wave. Except it’s constrained to the proportions of the spell. A wave doesn’t just crash in one spot, it moves crashing down in front of itself as it goes. Same for this. The area defined by the spell is where that rolling wave is crashing down as it moves. Not a bunch of water dropping from above. That would be a waterfall spell if there was one.
EZD6 by DM Scotty
https://www.drivethrurpg.com/en/product/397599/EZD6-Core-Rulebook?
I would rule of cool that any thing that provides cover would have to stand up to the 4d8 damage. A stone building with a stone door? No problem. But a wooden building or even a stone building with a wooden door facing the tidal wave? Yeah, it better be described as a well built or tough door/wooden building. Otherwise I am ruling the tidal wave breaks it.
The rules explicitly allow you to choose a point you can't see. Again, there is absolutely no requirement to see what you're targeting unless the spell says so.
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