If you don't know, binders were a class introduced in the Tome of Magic supplement for 3.5. They were basically hobo mages that drudged up dead demi-powers and temporarily bound them as a way of gaining quick and (comparatively) easy power. They, like much of that material, haven't been converted over to 5e, nor do I expect them too, as the feats and vestiges and alternate class features were sometimes overly complicated. My question relates to how 5e handles warlocks, because patrons strike me as thematically similar to vestiges, so much so that I feel like WotC was heavily influenced by binders and modified them into a more party-friendly class (the warlock).
But of course, there are still some major differences, and I wonder if a homebrew version of binders could fit into a world that already has warlocks in it. Or would the two just be too similar or even contradictory?
Are binders synonymous with warlock? Kind of? I mean, in 4th edition, warlocks got the Vestige pact, that functioned sort of similarly to how binders worked. At least, as much as the vastly different rule sets could function similarly. And they thematically fit into warlock; Vestiges and Patrons do seem to work together.
So, can you fit binders into the warlock? Absolutely. As a class, the key feature of the Binder is how you can switch out whatever you're binding on a day-to-day basis. Need to be melee, bind the right souls and you're a front line tank. Want to make a gaze-based caster, totally doable. Summoner? Also possible.
To translate this into a subclass, we need to bring flexible options to the warlock chasis. So, that's what we do. The level 1 feature of the Vestige pact is that, after a long rest, you get the option to reassign all your Invocations, spells known, and Pact Form (book, blade, chain). Maybe increase the number of Invocation slots or the like. Then, just make a few new Invocations to fit the themes of your favorite Vestiges from Tome of Magic.
Its not perfect, but I think its a good close approximation. After that, its merely a question of bringing personality to your Vestiges. This is normally pretty easy to do with something like a cambion or a Hag for a Patron, but Vestiges aren't as solidly baked into the lore of the game, so you're going to have to figure out how you want to handle them.
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Another option that I toyed with is making your Pact Form (level 3) into the Pact of the Sigil, and that lets you switch up your subclass as well as your spells and Invocations.
far as i am aware, warlock would be the main 5e class and it would be flavoring taking power from a dead god or dead power, as some, mainly the great old one are examples where while commonly warlocks strike a deal of sorts for powers, they can also try to take it by force and all the possible dangers that come with such actions
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If you don't know, binders were a class introduced in the Tome of Magic supplement for 3.5. They were basically hobo mages that drudged up dead demi-powers and temporarily bound them as a way of gaining quick and (comparatively) easy power. They, like much of that material, haven't been converted over to 5e, nor do I expect them too, as the feats and vestiges and alternate class features were sometimes overly complicated. My question relates to how 5e handles warlocks, because patrons strike me as thematically similar to vestiges, so much so that I feel like WotC was heavily influenced by binders and modified them into a more party-friendly class (the warlock).
But of course, there are still some major differences, and I wonder if a homebrew version of binders could fit into a world that already has warlocks in it. Or would the two just be too similar or even contradictory?
"The Epic Level Handbook wasn't that bad, guys.
Guys, pls."
Are binders synonymous with warlock? Kind of? I mean, in 4th edition, warlocks got the Vestige pact, that functioned sort of similarly to how binders worked. At least, as much as the vastly different rule sets could function similarly. And they thematically fit into warlock; Vestiges and Patrons do seem to work together.
So, can you fit binders into the warlock? Absolutely. As a class, the key feature of the Binder is how you can switch out whatever you're binding on a day-to-day basis. Need to be melee, bind the right souls and you're a front line tank. Want to make a gaze-based caster, totally doable. Summoner? Also possible.
To translate this into a subclass, we need to bring flexible options to the warlock chasis. So, that's what we do. The level 1 feature of the Vestige pact is that, after a long rest, you get the option to reassign all your Invocations, spells known, and Pact Form (book, blade, chain). Maybe increase the number of Invocation slots or the like. Then, just make a few new Invocations to fit the themes of your favorite Vestiges from Tome of Magic.
Its not perfect, but I think its a good close approximation. After that, its merely a question of bringing personality to your Vestiges. This is normally pretty easy to do with something like a cambion or a Hag for a Patron, but Vestiges aren't as solidly baked into the lore of the game, so you're going to have to figure out how you want to handle them.
-------------------------
Another option that I toyed with is making your Pact Form (level 3) into the Pact of the Sigil, and that lets you switch up your subclass as well as your spells and Invocations.
Thanks for the reply. I think I might have worded my post unnecessarily verbose but I'm glad you got the gist of it regardless.
"The Epic Level Handbook wasn't that bad, guys.
Guys, pls."
far as i am aware, warlock would be the main 5e class and it would be flavoring taking power from a dead god or dead power, as some, mainly the great old one are examples where while commonly warlocks strike a deal of sorts for powers, they can also try to take it by force and all the possible dangers that come with such actions