Hey, so i'm new to D&D and on my first adventure (joining a seasoned group) I came across a scenario where I (a Barbarian) was in a hallway only one person wide with 2 of my teammates in front of me and in front of them an orc. Because of the narrow hallway I couldn't get around them or throw any weapons as they were in my line of sight. So I did something dumb and tried to jump them lol didn't work
Anyways, my thought now was, could I have used "Help" in a way such as picking up a rock and throwing it (likely using a Strength Check) so it hit the wall behind the orc and distracted him to give advantage to the player within 5 feet of enemy?
Not sure if this situation will happen again but we are still in the dungeon lol so it could, and wanted to know if that seemed feasible. I did read that to use distraction you're supposed to be within 5 feet of the enemy yourself, so not sure if throwing a rock from a distance is ok to do or not.
Any thoughts? Or even any other suggestions I could have done instead? Basic Barbarian stats so low charisma, wisdom and Int if that helps (so inspiring probably out of the question)
Yes, you have to be within 5 feet of the target that's being attacked to grant advantage to your ally. There is actually a Rogue subclass that lets you help from a distance, so letting everyone do it would be unfair to anyone who took that subclass.
It tends to vary by DMs... some DMs say you can't attack if you have allies between you and a target, others say that your allies can just duck as a free action to avoid the attack, and some DMs just give the enemy 1/2 cover. That said... sometimes you just don't have a clear shot on any targets on your turn. One thing you could do is grapple your own ally to pull them out of the way, or just ready an attack to release as soon as you get a clear opening.
The DM placed more restrictions than the rules have, since you can normally make a ranged attack through creatures, providing half cover along the way.
Forgive me, but since you say you're new to D&D, I want to address a separate problem I notice here -
If you're going through a corridor one-person wide, you - the barbarian - should be in front. You've got all those hit points and all that berserker rage. You're the first guy through the door. If you ever hear a DM ask "what order are you going in?" that's DM code for, "I'm warning you to think about this because it matters." Maybe the rogue wants to go first and deactivate traps, but outside of that...
From a purely tactical, dice-rolling point of view, you are the party's suit of armor.
All this to say: the way to solve this particular problem is to not have it in the first place.
If it's unavoidable, I second TransmorpherDDS' advice. Just use your lunatic rage-strength to manhandle your fellow party members. Fling their tiny bodies around like dolls in your thirst to get to the fight!
Thats a good point about the Rogue class and not allowing everyone to do it. Guess sometimes there just aren't good options. My DM is a little tricky, if you miss a throwing attack bad enough and there are allies in front you could end up hitting them by mistake. I think thats why I didn't go that direction.
Ya I probably could have thrown a javelin or something, though as I mentioned in a different reply my DM can make it so you hit the teammate instead due to poor aim on a bad roll. The hallway was 5x5 and teammates and orc were in each so it would half my movement trying to get by them if I could squeeze through and as a dwarf with 25 movement I wouldn't make it to behind the orc.
Tim - Ya I should have been in front and was essentially but one of our teammates decided we should all go grab barrels in a different room and I followed being a new guy and then orcs came after I turned and left to get barrels lol. bad choice to say the least.
Would throwing your allies around cause them damage? Grapple is an action isn't it? so I could only do it to one teammate, move them then still be behind the other?
Ya I probably could have thrown a javelin or something, though as I mentioned in a different reply my DM can make it so you hit the teammate instead due to poor aim on a bad roll. The hallway was 5x5 and teammates and orc were in each so it would half my movement trying to get by them if I could squeeze through and as a dwarf with 25 movement I wouldn't make it to behind the orc.
Your DM was using an optional rule called Hitting Cover. It only comes up if you rolled low enought to miss the target but high enought to hit the cover.
Hitting Cover: When a ranged attack misses a target that has cover, you can use this optional rule to determine whether the cover was struck by the attack. First, determine whether the attack roll would have hit the protected target without the cover. If the attack roll falls within a range low enough to miss the target but high enough to strike the target if there had been no cover, the object used for cover is struck. If a creature is providing cover for the missed creature and the attack roll exceeds the AC of the covering creature, the covering creature is hit.
There is another optional rules the DM could have used to let you mve through it called Overrun;
Overrun: When a creature tries to move through a hostile creature's space, the mover can try to force its way through by overrunning the hostile creature. As an action or a bonus action, the mover makes a Strength (Athletics) check contested by the hostile creature's Strength (Athletics) check. The creature attempting the overrun has advantage on this check if it is larger than the hostile creature, or disadvantage if it is smaller. If the mover wins the contest, it can move through the hostile creature's space once this turn.
So it sounds like your wily dm gave you guys the opportunity to juke yourselves out of position and you took it. Good learning experience.
Mechanically, I think you have to work out with your DM how it would happen. If the tunnel is so tight you’re all squeezing through on your bellies, grappling might not work, for instance. But RAW, the grapple attack itself doesn’t do damage. RAW if you elect Attack as your Action, a fifth-level barb can grapple as many times as they have empty hands. RAW, a grappler can move a creature they have grappled, using the Movement phase of their turn. Their movement will be halved, however.
So what I’m seeing in my head is our dwarf using the Bonus Action component of his turn to activate Rage, using the Attack option for his main Action to grapple and using 10 feet of his available Movement phase to trade places with the player in front of him. Repeat the process next turn.
A — B — C — Orc
becomes
B — A — C — Orc
and then
B — C — A — Orc, at which time I also think the Orc gets an attack of opportunity on you, provided he still has an available Reaction himself. If anyone has a different rule or sees a flaw, that’s fine.
But the most important thing I want to convey is that every time a dwarven barbarian walks down any hallway anywhere, this is the example we are striving to follow. This is what it should look like- the hallway fight from Oldboy.
Within the rules: Action attack and grapple they ally ahead of you, move 5ft back and drag them with you then release the grapple (free action). This uses 10ft of movement. Then use 15ft of movement to pass through them (10ft) and step in front of them (5ft). Mission accomplished. That’s a total of 25ft of movement used and one Attack used up. If you’ve got Extra Attack you can still use it.
With Dm Options - Action Overrun - Use a Bonus Action Rage, then compare Athletics to Athletics on Orc. If you win (you have advantage from rage), you can move through your ally (10ft) and the enemy (10ft) and past the enemy (5ft). You won’t have actions left but now there are two of you in melee which should help.
You can move through a nonhostile creature's space. In contrast, you can move through a hostile creature's space only if the creature is at least two sizes larger or smaller than you. Remember that another creature's space is difficult terrain for you.
Whether a creature is a friend or an enemy, you can't willingly end your move in its space.
If you leave a hostile creature's reach during your move, you provoke an opportunity attack, as explained later in the chapter.
RAW, you can move forward 5ft into your allies space, make your melee attack/s and then step back 5ft with just 20 ft of movement but at the risk of the opponent's opportunity attack.
RAW, you can move forward 5ft into your allies space, make your melee attack/s and then step back 5ft with just 20 ft of movement but at the risk of the opponent's opportunity attack.
A Dev has clarified more than once that the rules are not intended to allow this
RAW, you can move forward 5ft into your allies space, make your melee attack/s and then step back 5ft with just 20 ft of movement but at the risk of the opponent's opportunity attack.
A Dev has clarified more than once that the rules are not intended to allow this
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One time me and my party members were in a similar kind of situation but with a staircase going down that was blocked by some ghouls, so one of my party members used our bag of holding which was full of water and just flooded them to get past them, which in turn also blew out a secret door from the water pressure, then again our DM was a little homebrewish.
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"Know your enemy, know your self" Click here to read my Homebrew thread! "Veni, vidi, vici...
Status update: I am going to be afk very frequently for a currently un predictable amount of time, for more information/details on this, check my homebrew thread which can be found easier by clicking the 'here' above ^^^
Also if you have something else big and heavy it could have a similar effect.
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"Know your enemy, know your self" Click here to read my Homebrew thread! "Veni, vidi, vici...
Status update: I am going to be afk very frequently for a currently un predictable amount of time, for more information/details on this, check my homebrew thread which can be found easier by clicking the 'here' above ^^^
Actually, why not use some kind of spell to blind the enemy or something else like maybe using gaseous form on the enemy so you can walk through them? Why force your way past when you can just go through???
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"Know your enemy, know your self" Click here to read my Homebrew thread! "Veni, vidi, vici...
Status update: I am going to be afk very frequently for a currently un predictable amount of time, for more information/details on this, check my homebrew thread which can be found easier by clicking the 'here' above ^^^
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Hey, so i'm new to D&D and on my first adventure (joining a seasoned group) I came across a scenario where I (a Barbarian) was in a hallway only one person wide with 2 of my teammates in front of me and in front of them an orc. Because of the narrow hallway I couldn't get around them or throw any weapons as they were in my line of sight. So I did something dumb and tried to jump them lol didn't work
Anyways, my thought now was, could I have used "Help" in a way such as picking up a rock and throwing it (likely using a Strength Check) so it hit the wall behind the orc and distracted him to give advantage to the player within 5 feet of enemy?
Not sure if this situation will happen again but we are still in the dungeon lol so it could, and wanted to know if that seemed feasible. I did read that to use distraction you're supposed to be within 5 feet of the enemy yourself, so not sure if throwing a rock from a distance is ok to do or not.
Any thoughts? Or even any other suggestions I could have done instead? Basic Barbarian stats so low charisma, wisdom and Int if that helps (so inspiring probably out of the question)
Thanks
Yes, you have to be within 5 feet of the target that's being attacked to grant advantage to your ally. There is actually a Rogue subclass that lets you help from a distance, so letting everyone do it would be unfair to anyone who took that subclass.
It tends to vary by DMs... some DMs say you can't attack if you have allies between you and a target, others say that your allies can just duck as a free action to avoid the attack, and some DMs just give the enemy 1/2 cover. That said... sometimes you just don't have a clear shot on any targets on your turn. One thing you could do is grapple your own ally to pull them out of the way, or just ready an attack to release as soon as you get a clear opening.
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The DM placed more restrictions than the rules have, since you can normally make a ranged attack through creatures, providing half cover along the way.
Forgive me, but since you say you're new to D&D, I want to address a separate problem I notice here -
If you're going through a corridor one-person wide, you - the barbarian - should be in front. You've got all those hit points and all that berserker rage. You're the first guy through the door. If you ever hear a DM ask "what order are you going in?" that's DM code for, "I'm warning you to think about this because it matters." Maybe the rogue wants to go first and deactivate traps, but outside of that...
From a purely tactical, dice-rolling point of view, you are the party's suit of armor.
All this to say: the way to solve this particular problem is to not have it in the first place.
If it's unavoidable, I second TransmorpherDDS' advice. Just use your lunatic rage-strength to manhandle your fellow party members. Fling their tiny bodies around like dolls in your thirst to get to the fight!
Thats a good point about the Rogue class and not allowing everyone to do it. Guess sometimes there just aren't good options. My DM is a little tricky, if you miss a throwing attack bad enough and there are allies in front you could end up hitting them by mistake. I think thats why I didn't go that direction.
Ya I probably could have thrown a javelin or something, though as I mentioned in a different reply my DM can make it so you hit the teammate instead due to poor aim on a bad roll. The hallway was 5x5 and teammates and orc were in each so it would half my movement trying to get by them if I could squeeze through and as a dwarf with 25 movement I wouldn't make it to behind the orc.
Tim - Ya I should have been in front and was essentially but one of our teammates decided we should all go grab barrels in a different room and I followed being a new guy and then orcs came after I turned and left to get barrels lol. bad choice to say the least.
Would throwing your allies around cause them damage? Grapple is an action isn't it? so I could only do it to one teammate, move them then still be behind the other?
Thanks
Your DM was using an optional rule called Hitting Cover. It only comes up if you rolled low enought to miss the target but high enought to hit the cover.
There is another optional rules the DM could have used to let you mve through it called Overrun;
So it sounds like your wily dm gave you guys the opportunity to juke yourselves out of position and you took it. Good learning experience.
Mechanically, I think you have to work out with your DM how it would happen. If the tunnel is so tight you’re all squeezing through on your bellies, grappling might not work, for instance. But RAW, the grapple attack itself doesn’t do damage. RAW if you elect Attack as your Action, a fifth-level barb can grapple as many times as they have empty hands. RAW, a grappler can move a creature they have grappled, using the Movement phase of their turn. Their movement will be halved, however.
So what I’m seeing in my head is our dwarf using the Bonus Action component of his turn to activate Rage, using the Attack option for his main Action to grapple and using 10 feet of his available Movement phase to trade places with the player in front of him. Repeat the process next turn.
A — B — C — Orc
becomes
B — A — C — Orc
and then
B — C — A — Orc, at which time I also think the Orc gets an attack of opportunity on you, provided he still has an available Reaction himself. If anyone has a different rule or sees a flaw, that’s fine.
But the most important thing I want to convey is that every time a dwarven barbarian walks down any hallway anywhere, this is the example we are striving to follow. This is what it should look like- the hallway fight from Oldboy.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VwIIDzrVVdc
Within the rules: Action attack and grapple they ally ahead of you, move 5ft back and drag them with you then release the grapple (free action). This uses 10ft of movement. Then use 15ft of movement to pass through them (10ft) and step in front of them (5ft). Mission accomplished. That’s a total of 25ft of movement used and one Attack used up. If you’ve got Extra Attack you can still use it.
With Dm Options - Action Overrun - Use a Bonus Action Rage, then compare Athletics to Athletics on Orc. If you win (you have advantage from rage), you can move through your ally (10ft) and the enemy (10ft) and past the enemy (5ft). You won’t have actions left but now there are two of you in melee which should help.
RAW, you can move forward 5ft into your allies space, make your melee attack/s and then step back 5ft with just 20 ft of movement but at the risk of the opponent's opportunity attack.
A Dev has clarified more than once that the rules are not intended to allow this
Even if you allowed it, that means you’re squeezing (attack at Disadvantage and get attacked at Advantage). Not the greatest way to do it.
What kind of gear do you have?
"Know your enemy, know your self"
Click here to read my Homebrew thread!
"Veni, vidi, vici...
Status update:
I am going to be afk very frequently for a currently un predictable amount of time, for more information/details on this, check my homebrew thread which can be found easier by clicking the 'here' above ^^^
One time me and my party members were in a similar kind of situation but with a staircase going down that was blocked by some ghouls, so one of my party members used our bag of holding which was full of water and just flooded them to get past them, which in turn also blew out a secret door from the water pressure, then again our DM was a little homebrewish.
"Know your enemy, know your self"
Click here to read my Homebrew thread!
"Veni, vidi, vici...
Status update:
I am going to be afk very frequently for a currently un predictable amount of time, for more information/details on this, check my homebrew thread which can be found easier by clicking the 'here' above ^^^
Also if you have something else big and heavy it could have a similar effect.
"Know your enemy, know your self"
Click here to read my Homebrew thread!
"Veni, vidi, vici...
Status update:
I am going to be afk very frequently for a currently un predictable amount of time, for more information/details on this, check my homebrew thread which can be found easier by clicking the 'here' above ^^^
Actually, why not use some kind of spell to blind the enemy or something else like maybe using gaseous form on the enemy so you can walk through them? Why force your way past when you can just go through???
"Know your enemy, know your self"
Click here to read my Homebrew thread!
"Veni, vidi, vici...
Status update:
I am going to be afk very frequently for a currently un predictable amount of time, for more information/details on this, check my homebrew thread which can be found easier by clicking the 'here' above ^^^