If you were to store the spell in a glyph, as per Glyph of Warding spell, you could choose to activate the spell at a later time (presumably after donning armor) with the added benefit of not needing to concentrate on the spell. Set it up in a Demiplane with a conveniently placed set of armor and weaponry of choice and you're set.
Ok, this should work. You need to be a level 19 spellcaster to prepare it (to have 2 level 6 slots for glyph) and it takes a level 8 slot and 10 minutes to fully activate (so not very good mid combat). But if a wizard needed to fight in a gladiator battle...
Oooh, what if you have a planar portal to a plane where time flows 1/4 as fast as it does on the prime material plane? So you transport yourself there, don the armor, drink a potion of Heroism or whatever and step back through the portal to fight as Super Mage.
Other than that, maybe this is really a spell for Valor Bards who yearn to impersonate their Barbarian role model. :)
Other than that, maybe this is really a spell for Valor Bards who yearn to impersonate their Barbarian role model. :)
Not really. Valor Bards already get proficiency with medium armor and martial weapons.
The issue really is with the uselessness of the proficiency with "all" armor provided by the spell. Given how long it takes to don armor, and the fact that you can't cast while wearing armor you're not proficient with, it means that when you're done donning heavy armor, the spell ends. Half the spell's duration goes by if donning medium armor. If the spell's range were "Touch" instead of "Self", there'd be no problem.
Other than that, maybe this is really a spell for Valor Bards who yearn to impersonate their Barbarian role model. :)
Not really. Valor Bards already get proficiency with medium armor and martial weapons.
The issue really is with the uselessness of the proficiency with "all" armor provided by the spell. Given how long it takes to don armor, and the fact that you can't cast while wearing armor you're not proficient with, it means that when you're done donning heavy armor, the spell ends. Half the spell's duration goes by if donning medium armor. If the spell's range were "Touch" instead of "Self", there'd be no problem.
I know. That's the joke. Because the joke's on us.
I am remembering an item that stored a set of clothing/armor and when activated it would swap with what you were wearing. When you got the ring it had nothing in it, so you had to get dressed do the switch and you would then have to get dressed again.
I see folks focused on the wearing armor part of the spell but it does have a lot of other good benefits. I could see a valor or swords bard using magical secrets to pick this spell up. Especially if they are more of a gish build. A EK7/War Wizard13 might also find this spell useful to open a can of whoop arse for a fight.
Lots of ways for a wizard to wear armor. Not sure that is the sole purpose of the spell.
I see folks focused on the wearing armor part of the spell but it does have a lot of other good benefits. I could see a valor or swords bard using magical secrets to pick this spell up. Especially if they are more of a gish build. A EK7/War Wizard13 might also find this spell useful to open a can of whoop arse for a fight.
Lots of ways for a wizard to wear armor. Not sure that is the sole purpose of the spell.
If you look back to my original post (which started the thread), I wasn't claiming or suggesting the spell as a whole was useless. I was commenting on how one of the things the spell does appears to be entirely useless. Image Shield granted you, in addition to immunity from Magic Missile Advantage on Saving Throws versus Chromatic Orb, a spell that does not involve a Saving Throw. Tenser's Transformation granting proficiency with all armor is similar: there is no reasonable way to use that proficiency. If you don't have it, you can't cast the spell while wearing the armor, and you can't finish donning the armor (at least not heavy armor) before the spell's duration is up. If you have it, having it granted does nothing for you.
Whether or not the spell is good is an entirely separate issue, which will depend greatly on the build, as you point out. Also, it can be a nice effect to put on magic items which don't require actual casting of the spell (say, a potion, or a command-word activated item).
I see folks focused on the wearing armor part of the spell but it does have a lot of other good benefits. I could see a valor or swords bard using magical secrets to pick this spell up. Especially if they are more of a gish build. A EK7/War Wizard13 might also find this spell useful to open a can of whoop arse for a fight.
Lots of ways for a wizard to wear armor. Not sure that is the sole purpose of the spell.
You are correct. But the purpose of this thread IS to focus on the armor proficiency.
If you look back to my original post (which started the thread), I wasn't claiming or suggesting the spell as a whole was useless. I was commenting on how one of the things the spell does appears to be entirely useless. Image Shield granted you, in addition to immunity from Magic Missile Advantage on Saving Throws versus Chromatic Orb, a spell that does not involve a Saving Throw. Tenser's Transformation granting proficiency with all armor is similar: there is no reasonable way to use that proficiency. If you don't have it, you can't cast the spell while wearing the armor, and you can't finish donning the armor (at least not heavy armor) before the spell's duration is up. If you have it, having it granted does nothing for you.
Whether or not the spell is good is an entirely separate issue, which will depend greatly on the build, as you point out. Also, it can be a nice effect to put on magic items which don't require actual casting of the spell (say, a potion, or a command-word activated item).
I suppose my comment was more to point out the irrelevance of the post. A specific point commonly brought up regarding this particular spell. Of course you CAN wear armor. It's just that using Tenser's Transformation with medium or heavy sets of armor becomes problematic. Does a spell always have to be optimal? No. Are there ways for creative players to get around this? Yes. Could finding unique solutions around a spells perceived disadvantage be a fun challenge for a player? Sounds fun to me.
And your example regarding chromatic orb is a false equivalency. Tenser's Transformation DOES allow the character to wear armor. There is nothing stopping a wizard from casting this spell, scooping up a longsword and shield and diving directly into melee. Or taking just one minute to put on light armor. These tactics are fine. The problem isn't the spell. Its you wanting to wear plate with this spell. Obviously that would be a bad idea. UNLESS you and your DM put some work into making it happen.
If you look back to my original post (which started the thread), I wasn't claiming or suggesting the spell as a whole was useless. I was commenting on how one of the things the spell does appears to be entirely useless. Image Shield granted you, in addition to immunity from Magic Missile Advantage on Saving Throws versus Chromatic Orb, a spell that does not involve a Saving Throw. Tenser's Transformation granting proficiency with all armor is similar: there is no reasonable way to use that proficiency. If you don't have it, you can't cast the spell while wearing the armor, and you can't finish donning the armor (at least not heavy armor) before the spell's duration is up. If you have it, having it granted does nothing for you.
Whether or not the spell is good is an entirely separate issue, which will depend greatly on the build, as you point out. Also, it can be a nice effect to put on magic items which don't require actual casting of the spell (say, a potion, or a command-word activated item).
I suppose my comment was more to point out the irrelevance of the post. A specific point commonly brought up regarding this particular spell. Of course you CAN wear armor. It's just that using Tenser's Transformation with medium or heavy sets of armor becomes problematic. Does a spell always have to be optimal? No. Are there ways for creative players to get around this? Yes. Could finding unique solutions around a spells perceived disadvantage be a fun challenge for a player? Sounds fun to me.
And your example regarding chromatic orb is a false equivalency. Tenser's Transformation DOES allow the character to wear armor. There is nothing stopping a wizard from casting this spell, scooping up a longsword and shield and diving directly into melee. Or taking just one minute to put on light armor. These tactics are fine. The problem isn't the spell. Its you wanting to wear plate with this spell. Obviously that would be a bad idea. UNLESS you and your DM put some work into making it happen.
The spell, as written, does not, in fact, allow you to wear plate, nor any sort of heavy armor, since the spell's duration is too short for it. (I guess you can argue it does allow you to wear heavy armor, but it does not allow you to wear heavy armor in any way that results in the caster wearing heavy armor before the spell's duration is up.) It does allow you to wear medium or light armor, although it would take some heavy duty foresight and strategy to make it work, given the duration and the time it takes to don armor. But the spell explicitly gives you a "benefit" which you cannot reasonably take advantage of, namely heavy armor proficiency. If the spell does not actually give me the ability to wear heavy armor, it should not say it does.
Moreover, I'm pretty sure this situation arose from some sort of oversight. The combination of three factors, from three separate sections of the rules, is what brings about this issue:
Casters cannot cast while wearing armor they're not proficient in.
Getting into and out of armor takes a non-trivial amount of time, especially heavy armor.
The duration of the spell does not exceed the amount of time needed to get into heavy armor.
It's not hard to believe that specific combination was missed. Obviously the spell is meant to allow casters (Wizards, specifically) to wear heavy armor (among other things, of course). Not only does it say "all armor", which clearly includes heavy armor, but given the description of the spell, it's clear the intent is to transform the caster into a "fighter", including losing the ability to cast, Extra Attack, Saving Throws, etc. Maybe at some point, casters were able to cast while wearing armor they weren't proficient in, and this combination wasn't caught when that was added in. Maybe getting into and out of armor didn't take as long at some point. Maybe the spell lasted longer. Or maybe simply nobody thought of all three things at the same time. *shrug*
Tensers transformation in third would allow you to wear armour without the chance for spell failure, so you could wear armour, cast it, and if succesful, off you went. 5th has gone back to 1st / 2nd with the armour restrictions being absolutes.
That said here is an example of how to get inside platemail (for example) faster.
(glyph of warding) animate objects on a set of armour in the area which animates and flies to attach to you -(Centurions and more recently Iron Man style.) Casting it before wont work, both TT and AO are concentration. What a squire would take minutes to help you do, magical self moving / buckling armour will manage in rounds. (DM permitting)
(glyph of warding) TT when you collapse into it wearing armour
Alter self (skinny) wriggle inside armour you arent fitting into and cast (might need sleight of hand to cast in an enclosed space but grapple / restrain doesnt stop casting so why should this now? Alter self ends and the 'you cant kill someone' with poly / box' nature of the spell means your now in the armour.
Enlarge on the armour lying on the ground. Lie in chest plate, TT and it shrinks as you gain proficiency.
Some will require DM approval, but honestly if the spell is allowed this just trying to make it work and costing you more resources. (at least it doesnt require a potion of heroism as a material component anymore! So its not all bad?)
Tensers transformation in third would allow you to wear armour without the chance for spell failure, so you could wear armour, cast it, and if succesful, off you went. 5th has gone back to 1st / 2nd with the armour restrictions being absolutes.
That said here is an example of how to get inside platemail (for example) faster.
(glyph of warding) animate objects on a set of armour in the area which animates and flies to attach to you -(Centurions and more recently Iron Man style.) Casting it before wont work, both TT and AO are concentration. What a squire would take minutes to help you do, magical self moving / buckling armour will manage in rounds. (DM permitting)
(glyph of warding) TT when you collapse into it wearing armour
Alter self (skinny) wriggle inside armour you arent fitting into and cast (might need sleight of hand to cast in an enclosed space but grapple / restrain doesnt stop casting so why should this now? Alter self ends and the 'you cant kill someone' with poly / box' nature of the spell means your now in the armour.
Enlarge on the armour lying on the ground. Lie in chest plate, TT and it shrinks as you gain proficiency.
Some will require DM approval, but honestly if the spell is allowed this just trying to make it work and costing you more resources. (at least it doesnt require a potion of heroism as a material component anymore! So its not all bad?)
Haha! Those are pretty creative ways, I'll grant you that. None of them are strictly RAW, all require DM rulings to allow them to work, some even outright rules breakage (can't store Tenser's Transformation in a Glyph of Warding, since its level is too high), but you get brownie points for creativity, for sure!
All in all, if the spell is intended to let non-heavy armor wearers to wear heavy armor (I'd also extend that to medium armor, since half the spell's duration spent just donning the armor is, in my opinion, way too long to be reasonable), some rules should be changed to allow it, somehow (I'd lean towards allowing casting this spell, and this spell only, while wearing armor the caster is not proficient in). If not, the ability should be removed from the spell.
Glyphing it Does work - especially the glyph TT! This is because glyph can be upcast. #edit - super ironman mecha assembly would require a dm to work out how fast 6 to 10 people assembling a plate suit who cant get in each others way would take, (which is time divided by 6 to 10 easily enough)
Moreover, I'm pretty sure this situation arose from some sort of oversight. The combination of three factors, from three separate sections of the rules, is what brings about this issue:
Casters cannot cast while wearing armor they're not proficient in.
Getting into and out of armor takes a non-trivial amount of time, especially heavy armor.
The duration of the spell does not exceed the amount of time needed to get into heavy armor.
It's not hard to believe that specific combination was missed. Obviously the spell is meant to allow casters (Wizards, specifically) to wear heavy armor (among other things, of course). Not only does it say "all armor", which clearly includes heavy armor, but given the description of the spell, it's clear the intent is to transform the caster into a "fighter", including losing the ability to cast, Extra Attack, Saving Throws, etc. Maybe at some point, casters were able to cast while wearing armor they weren't proficient in, and this combination wasn't caught when that was added in. Maybe getting into and out of armor didn't take as long at some point. Maybe the spell lasted longer. Or maybe simply nobody thought of all three things at the same time. *shrug*
I checked out Tenser's Transformation from 2nd and 3rd editions. Couple links below...
In those editions the spell only provided a straight bump to AC rather than allowing the caster to wear armor. It appears that is something new to the 5th edition version of the spell.
I would suggest that the 10 minute duration was put into place very specifically with the donning armor times in mind. Purposefully making it difficult for a wizard to wear medium or heavy armors. You can say its bad design if you want but as been pointed out several times in the thread there are ways to get around it. Mostly requiring a decision from the DM which is a overall theme for 5th edition in general. Putting more power in the hands of the DM.
What you cant do to get TT to work is use True Polymorph on armour, transform it into a onesie and then set it on fire it, reverting it to plate. Annoyingly TP works on creature to creature or creature to object or object to creature but not object to object (as written) So whilst its impossible to turn a table into a chair, its possible to turn a troll into a table.. just think that one through.
Alternatively, and again with the armour laid down or otherwise held in place without internal bracing in the way, an allied caster using gaseous form on you so you breeze inside it (after you have cast TT) will work, cancelling concentration will fill out the armour and your combat ready. Of course the circumstances where you have plate laid out on the ground, under 10 minutes away from a fight, with an extra caster of 5th level on hand are ludicrously slim, but not as ludicrous as giving TT the ability to use armour, but not the time.
The last one can end badly, and raises so many questions about spell efficiency its more for fun. - IF the armour is suspended, in a manner where there is space enough for you to fit exactly (and all this in an age before micrometers have been developed) Teleport into it. (again you would need an ally to do it as you couldnt cast the spell if you were under TT)
What you cant do to get TT to work is use True Polymorph on armour, transform it into a onesie and then set it on fire it, reverting it to plate. Annoyingly TP works on creature to creature or creature to object or object to creature but not object to object (as written) So whilst its impossible to turn a table into a chair, its possible to turn a troll into a table.. just think that one through.
Alternatively, and again with the armour laid down or otherwise held in place without internal bracing in the way, an allied caster using gaseous form on you so you breeze inside it (after you have cast TT) will work, cancelling concentration will fill out the armour and your combat ready. Of course the circumstances where you have plate laid out on the ground, under 10 minutes away from a fight, with an extra caster of 5th level on hand are ludicrously slim, but not as ludicrous as giving TT the ability to use armour, but not the time.
The last one can end badly, and raises so many questions about spell efficiency its more for fun. - IF the armour is suspended, in a manner where there is space enough for you to fit exactly (and all this in an age before micrometers have been developed) Teleport into it. (again you would need an ally to do it as you couldnt cast the spell if you were under TT)
Perhaps Tenser's Transformation is meant to be one of those Dare spells. As in, you mostly just have it for RP purposes, kind of like that bag that you can pull the small animals out of. Until...it suddenly becomes useful. It's like a high school kid bringing a magnifying glass to a predetermined fight and you only bring it because you know the sun will be at a certain angle at sundown so that you can use it to blind this taller, stronger kid for 2 seconds so that you can trip the guy and get him in a lock because otherwise he would just wallop on you like you were a pillow.
It bugs me that people look at Tenser's Transformation, see the armor proficiency thing, figure "you can't put on armor within the spell's duration! DX" and decry the spell as useless.
Exsqueeze. The spell is absolutely monstrous; the armor proficiency is pretty obviously fluff, or there for people with some manner of homebrew magical swag that allows them to quick-don armor (or cast Transformation while armored with something like, just for giggs...a scroll). Beyond the armor proficiency?
You get fifty extra temp HP, a second attack, advantage on all swings, proficiency with anything you care to pick up, 2d12 extra force damage per swing (go TWF with easily-stowed daggers or shortswords for 6d12 force damage per round!), and proficiency with any brute-force save you don't already have. It is literally 'Muscle Wizard Casts Fist'. If you're a Sword or Valor bard that already gets armor proficiency, snag this with a level 14 Magical Secret and gain the ability to go Super Saiyan. Pack a Scimitar of Speed and you don't even need TWF, just unleash hellastation on whatever's in your path. Take War Caster at some point because everyone does, and while Tenser's Hulk Mode is up you have the effect of Resilient (Con) as well, so the spell protects its own concentration.
Is it a super optimal powergamer Win D&D Moar spell? Nah. But it is just about the most fun you can have with a 6th-level spell slot and an eye for Theater.
It bugs me that people look at Tenser's Transformation, see the armor proficiency thing, figure "you can't put on armor within the spell's duration! DX" and decry the spell as useless.
Exsqueeze. The spell is absolutely monstrous; the armor proficiency is pretty obviously fluff, or there for people with some manner of homebrew magical swag that allows them to quick-don armor (or cast Transformation while armored with something like, just for giggs...a scroll). Beyond the armor proficiency?
You get fifty extra temp HP, a second attack, advantage on all swings, proficiency with anything you care to pick up, 2d12 extra force damage per swing (go TWF with easily-stowed daggers or shortswords for 6d12 force damage per round!), and proficiency with any brute-force save you don't already have. It is literally 'Muscle Wizard Casts Fist'. If you're a Sword or Valor bard that already gets armor proficiency, snag this with a level 14 Magical Secret and gain the ability to go Super Saiyan. Pack a Scimitar of Speed and you don't even need TWF, just unleash hellastation on whatever's in your path. Take War Caster at some point because everyone does, and while Tenser's Hulk Mode is up you have the effect of Resilient (Con) as well, so the spell protects its own concentration.
Is it a super optimal powergamer Win D&D Moar spell? Nah. But it is just about the most fun you can have with a 6th-level spell slot and an eye for Theater.
I'm not sure whether you're referring to my original post, but I am not saying the spell is useless. I was merely pointing out a design flaw with the spell, which grants you an ability can not reasonably use, namely proficiency with heavy armor, and another that is very difficult to use, proficiency with medium armor. I still stand behind that as a flaw, but whether the spell is good or not, or useless or useful, is another discussion. =)
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Ok, this should work. You need to be a level 19 spellcaster to prepare it (to have 2 level 6 slots for glyph) and it takes a level 8 slot and 10 minutes to fully activate (so not very good mid combat). But if a wizard needed to fight in a gladiator battle...
I am not sure how skill empowerment applies to the situation. And elven chain defeats the need to cast the titular spell in the first place.
Oooh, what if you have a planar portal to a plane where time flows 1/4 as fast as it does on the prime material plane? So you transport yourself there, don the armor, drink a potion of Heroism or whatever and step back through the portal to fight as Super Mage.
Other than that, maybe this is really a spell for Valor Bards who yearn to impersonate their Barbarian role model. :)
Not really. Valor Bards already get proficiency with medium armor and martial weapons.
The issue really is with the uselessness of the proficiency with "all" armor provided by the spell. Given how long it takes to don armor, and the fact that you can't cast while wearing armor you're not proficient with, it means that when you're done donning heavy armor, the spell ends. Half the spell's duration goes by if donning medium armor. If the spell's range were "Touch" instead of "Self", there'd be no problem.
I know. That's the joke. Because the joke's on us.
I am remembering an item that stored a set of clothing/armor and when activated it would swap with what you were wearing. When you got the ring it had nothing in it, so you had to get dressed do the switch and you would then have to get dressed again.
I just can't remember the name.
I see folks focused on the wearing armor part of the spell but it does have a lot of other good benefits. I could see a valor or swords bard using magical secrets to pick this spell up. Especially if they are more of a gish build. A EK7/War Wizard13 might also find this spell useful to open a can of whoop arse for a fight.
Lots of ways for a wizard to wear armor. Not sure that is the sole purpose of the spell.
Current Characters I am playing: Dr Konstantin van Wulf | Taegen Willowrun | Mad Magnar
Check out my homebrew: Items | Monsters | Spells | Subclasses | Feats
If you look back to my original post (which started the thread), I wasn't claiming or suggesting the spell as a whole was useless. I was commenting on how one of the things the spell does appears to be entirely useless. Image Shield granted you, in addition to immunity from Magic Missile Advantage on Saving Throws versus Chromatic Orb, a spell that does not involve a Saving Throw. Tenser's Transformation granting proficiency with all armor is similar: there is no reasonable way to use that proficiency. If you don't have it, you can't cast the spell while wearing the armor, and you can't finish donning the armor (at least not heavy armor) before the spell's duration is up. If you have it, having it granted does nothing for you.
Whether or not the spell is good is an entirely separate issue, which will depend greatly on the build, as you point out. Also, it can be a nice effect to put on magic items which don't require actual casting of the spell (say, a potion, or a command-word activated item).
You are correct. But the purpose of this thread IS to focus on the armor proficiency.
I suppose my comment was more to point out the irrelevance of the post. A specific point commonly brought up regarding this particular spell. Of course you CAN wear armor. It's just that using Tenser's Transformation with medium or heavy sets of armor becomes problematic. Does a spell always have to be optimal? No. Are there ways for creative players to get around this? Yes. Could finding unique solutions around a spells perceived disadvantage be a fun challenge for a player? Sounds fun to me.
And your example regarding chromatic orb is a false equivalency. Tenser's Transformation DOES allow the character to wear armor. There is nothing stopping a wizard from casting this spell, scooping up a longsword and shield and diving directly into melee. Or taking just one minute to put on light armor. These tactics are fine. The problem isn't the spell. Its you wanting to wear plate with this spell. Obviously that would be a bad idea. UNLESS you and your DM put some work into making it happen.
Current Characters I am playing: Dr Konstantin van Wulf | Taegen Willowrun | Mad Magnar
Check out my homebrew: Items | Monsters | Spells | Subclasses | Feats
The spell, as written, does not, in fact, allow you to wear plate, nor any sort of heavy armor, since the spell's duration is too short for it. (I guess you can argue it does allow you to wear heavy armor, but it does not allow you to wear heavy armor in any way that results in the caster wearing heavy armor before the spell's duration is up.) It does allow you to wear medium or light armor, although it would take some heavy duty foresight and strategy to make it work, given the duration and the time it takes to don armor. But the spell explicitly gives you a "benefit" which you cannot reasonably take advantage of, namely heavy armor proficiency. If the spell does not actually give me the ability to wear heavy armor, it should not say it does.
Moreover, I'm pretty sure this situation arose from some sort of oversight. The combination of three factors, from three separate sections of the rules, is what brings about this issue:
It's not hard to believe that specific combination was missed. Obviously the spell is meant to allow casters (Wizards, specifically) to wear heavy armor (among other things, of course). Not only does it say "all armor", which clearly includes heavy armor, but given the description of the spell, it's clear the intent is to transform the caster into a "fighter", including losing the ability to cast, Extra Attack, Saving Throws, etc. Maybe at some point, casters were able to cast while wearing armor they weren't proficient in, and this combination wasn't caught when that was added in. Maybe getting into and out of armor didn't take as long at some point. Maybe the spell lasted longer. Or maybe simply nobody thought of all three things at the same time. *shrug*
Tensers transformation in third would allow you to wear armour without the chance for spell failure, so you could wear armour, cast it, and if succesful, off you went. 5th has gone back to 1st / 2nd with the armour restrictions being absolutes.
That said here is an example of how to get inside platemail (for example) faster.
(glyph of warding) animate objects on a set of armour in the area which animates and flies to attach to you -(Centurions and more recently Iron Man style.) Casting it before wont work, both TT and AO are concentration. What a squire would take minutes to help you do, magical self moving / buckling armour will manage in rounds. (DM permitting)
(glyph of warding) TT when you collapse into it wearing armour
Alter self (skinny) wriggle inside armour you arent fitting into and cast (might need sleight of hand to cast in an enclosed space but grapple / restrain doesnt stop casting so why should this now? Alter self ends and the 'you cant kill someone' with poly / box' nature of the spell means your now in the armour.
Enlarge on the armour lying on the ground. Lie in chest plate, TT and it shrinks as you gain proficiency.
Some will require DM approval, but honestly if the spell is allowed this just trying to make it work and costing you more resources. (at least it doesnt require a potion of heroism as a material component anymore! So its not all bad?)
Ah, that must be it! Thanks. ;D
Haha! Those are pretty creative ways, I'll grant you that. None of them are strictly RAW, all require DM rulings to allow them to work, some even outright rules breakage (can't store Tenser's Transformation in a Glyph of Warding, since its level is too high), but you get brownie points for creativity, for sure!
All in all, if the spell is intended to let non-heavy armor wearers to wear heavy armor (I'd also extend that to medium armor, since half the spell's duration spent just donning the armor is, in my opinion, way too long to be reasonable), some rules should be changed to allow it, somehow (I'd lean towards allowing casting this spell, and this spell only, while wearing armor the caster is not proficient in). If not, the ability should be removed from the spell.
Glyphing it Does work - especially the glyph TT! This is because glyph can be upcast. #edit - super ironman mecha assembly would require a dm to work out how fast 6 to 10 people assembling a plate suit who cant get in each others way would take, (which is time divided by 6 to 10 easily enough)
I checked out Tenser's Transformation from 2nd and 3rd editions. Couple links below...
http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/transformation.htm
http://pandaria.rpgworlds.info/cant/rules/adnd_spells.htm#Tenser's%20Transformation
In those editions the spell only provided a straight bump to AC rather than allowing the caster to wear armor. It appears that is something new to the 5th edition version of the spell.
I would suggest that the 10 minute duration was put into place very specifically with the donning armor times in mind. Purposefully making it difficult for a wizard to wear medium or heavy armors. You can say its bad design if you want but as been pointed out several times in the thread there are ways to get around it. Mostly requiring a decision from the DM which is a overall theme for 5th edition in general. Putting more power in the hands of the DM.
Current Characters I am playing: Dr Konstantin van Wulf | Taegen Willowrun | Mad Magnar
Check out my homebrew: Items | Monsters | Spells | Subclasses | Feats
You're right, of course. I completely missed that!
No worries, communal intelligence for the win!
What you cant do to get TT to work is use True Polymorph on armour, transform it into a onesie and then set it on fire it, reverting it to plate. Annoyingly TP works on creature to creature or creature to object or object to creature but not object to object (as written) So whilst its impossible to turn a table into a chair, its possible to turn a troll into a table.. just think that one through.
Alternatively, and again with the armour laid down or otherwise held in place without internal bracing in the way, an allied caster using gaseous form on you so you breeze inside it (after you have cast TT) will work, cancelling concentration will fill out the armour and your combat ready. Of course the circumstances where you have plate laid out on the ground, under 10 minutes away from a fight, with an extra caster of 5th level on hand are ludicrously slim, but not as ludicrous as giving TT the ability to use armour, but not the time.
The last one can end badly, and raises so many questions about spell efficiency its more for fun. - IF the armour is suspended, in a manner where there is space enough for you to fit exactly (and all this in an age before micrometers have been developed) Teleport into it. (again you would need an ally to do it as you couldnt cast the spell if you were under TT)
Perhaps Tenser's Transformation is meant to be one of those Dare spells. As in, you mostly just have it for RP purposes, kind of like that bag that you can pull the small animals out of. Until...it suddenly becomes useful. It's like a high school kid bringing a magnifying glass to a predetermined fight and you only bring it because you know the sun will be at a certain angle at sundown so that you can use it to blind this taller, stronger kid for 2 seconds so that you can trip the guy and get him in a lock because otherwise he would just wallop on you like you were a pillow.
It bugs me that people look at Tenser's Transformation, see the armor proficiency thing, figure "you can't put on armor within the spell's duration! DX" and decry the spell as useless.
Exsqueeze. The spell is absolutely monstrous; the armor proficiency is pretty obviously fluff, or there for people with some manner of homebrew magical swag that allows them to quick-don armor (or cast Transformation while armored with something like, just for giggs...a scroll). Beyond the armor proficiency?
You get fifty extra temp HP, a second attack, advantage on all swings, proficiency with anything you care to pick up, 2d12 extra force damage per swing (go TWF with easily-stowed daggers or shortswords for 6d12 force damage per round!), and proficiency with any brute-force save you don't already have. It is literally 'Muscle Wizard Casts Fist'. If you're a Sword or Valor bard that already gets armor proficiency, snag this with a level 14 Magical Secret and gain the ability to go Super Saiyan. Pack a Scimitar of Speed and you don't even need TWF, just unleash hellastation on whatever's in your path. Take War Caster at some point because everyone does, and while Tenser's Hulk Mode is up you have the effect of Resilient (Con) as well, so the spell protects its own concentration.
Is it a super optimal powergamer Win D&D Moar spell? Nah. But it is just about the most fun you can have with a 6th-level spell slot and an eye for Theater.
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Hah! I am sold Yurei. Mostly by the wrestling announcer lingo.
I'm not sure whether you're referring to my original post, but I am not saying the spell is useless. I was merely pointing out a design flaw with the spell, which grants you an ability can not reasonably use, namely proficiency with heavy armor, and another that is very difficult to use, proficiency with medium armor. I still stand behind that as a flaw, but whether the spell is good or not, or useless or useful, is another discussion. =)