I've been developing a Fighter/Wizard character for a new Forgotten Realms campaign. Basically I just wanted at least one fighter level, so I could wear armor and use weapons. I'm going for a battle mage type character, his backstory is he was training to join the Spellguard of Silverymoon.
Here's my question: Do you think taking a 2nd level in fighter to get Action Surge is worth missing out on the ability score increase or feat that I would get later on if I used that for a wizard level? Basically the way I'm building him its going to end up being between having action surge and a max INT of 18 (at level 20), or no action surge and a max INT of 20 (at level 20). An extra action per short rest, or more spells/spell slots and better INT rolls at higher levels.
I know this is all opinion, and depends on how I play etc.. but I just want some opinions and some pros and cons.
The vast majority of campaigns don’t get to level 20, so looking at the final state probably isn’t where you want to be looking. You probably want to target where you think your campaign will fall apart at, which is typically in the 10-14 range.
Also..what’s your DMs “encounter style”. Some DMs have multiple encounters a day making short rests more relevant. Others, tend to have one big encounter followed by a long rest. Action surge is more useful in the former and less useful in the later
The vast majority of campaigns don’t get to level 20, so looking at the final state probably isn’t where you want to be looking. You probably want to target where you think your campaign will fall apart at, which is typically in the 10-14 range.
Also..what’s your DMs “encounter style”. Some DMs have multiple encounters a day making short rests more relevant. Others, tend to have one big encounter followed by a long rest. Action surge is more useful in the former and less useful in the later
Yeah thats a good point, we probably won't get anywhere near to 20. Not on this campaign. We are starting at level 6, so it gives me some room to play around with the build. So I'm looking at Fighter 1/Wizard 5 or 2/4. Right now I'm using my first ability increase to get the War Caster feat. One thing to keep in mind is that if I skip that second level of Fighter I will be getting my next ability increase sooner. So it would probably will still effect my character during this campaign.
And our DM is pretty versatile on that, it depends on what the players are doing. But from what I know about this campaign he's putting together, it seems like there is going to be a lot of travel. So there will probably be a good amount of small encounter and random encounters etc. So as you said action surge would probably come in handy in that case.
So this why I'm kind of torn. Its either action surge or ability increases sooner.
Right now I'm leaning towards action surge, but a quicker intelligence increase would be nice too.
Action Surge is great, but +2 to Int is also great. Tough Call. I would go for +2 Int. Higher DC, Higher to hit, higher Int save, 1 extra spell prepared.
If you are starting at 6 you could also try 3/3. Then you would have both subclasses. You would then get an ASI each level for the next two levels for 4/4. If you take EK you would get a few more spell slots then other fighters.
Alternately if you don’t want to go farther into fighter you could pick up armor and weapon proficiencies by going cleric or artificer instead. Going cleric helps keep you at full number of spell slots.
One level of fighter gets you Con proficiency, a fighting style (is anything but +1 AC worth it for wizard) , and a 1 d10 + 1 heal per short rest.
One level of artificer also gets you Con proficiently, two more cantrips and two spell slots. The number of spells you can cast increases with your INT like your wizard levels.
Other then bladesingers does any wizard want to have a weapon in hand? If you don’t need the weapon cleric or artificers can get you the armour/shield or healing you are looking for.
I’m not sure that even a 1-level dip just for armor is a great idea. I’m going to guess you won’t have the str to wear heavy armor, and medium isn’t so great. I’d keep str the dump stat it’s supposed to be for wizards, boost your int and go straight wizard. Or if you’re really worried about getting hit, a point or two in dex will do you much more good in the long run (saves, initiative, ac and some skills) than str and armor. Also, multiclassing not only costs you that ASI, but also delays your spells by a level. You could even go straight wizard, and use that asi you would have lost to fighter to take an armor feat and give you a couple more ac points that way.
Another option is to splash 1 level of Artificer instead of Fighter. You'd still get Medium Armor and Shields, as well as access to a few spells on the Artificer list not found on the Wizard list (Cure Wounds, for example) as well as some more Cantrips. More importantly, the Artificer is unique from other half casters in that you round levels UP multiclassing spell slots, instead of down, so you won't be delaying your spell slot progression, and only pushing back the level you learn higher level spells by 1.
High elf gives an extra wizard cantrip, a bonus language, proficiency with multiple weapons, and a bonus to intelligence. This is on top of the multiple other abilities the base elf gives. Would be a nicer choice.
starting with one level of artificer gives proficiency in CON saves like a fighter, but does not delay slots gained. Proficiency in simple weapons and proficiency with light/medium armor/shields is good too. 2 cantrips, Intelligence based off you like, with options like thornwhip and guidance not usually available to the wizard.
prepared spell list that also keys off of intelligence, both by DC AND number of preparations. Sanctuary and cure wounds would be good choices to round out your battle mage needs.
the low level spell overlap is good, as it allows for more high level wizard spell preparations.
Magical tinkering could go pretty far for utility purposes.
I've been developing a Fighter/Wizard character for a new Forgotten Realms campaign. Basically I just wanted at least one fighter level, so I could wear armor and use weapons. I'm going for a battle mage type character, his backstory is he was training to join the Spellguard of Silverymoon.
Here's my question: Do you think taking a 2nd level in fighter to get Action Surge is worth missing out on the ability score increase or feat that I would get later on if I used that for a wizard level? Basically the way I'm building him its going to end up being between having action surge and a max INT of 18 (at level 20), or no action surge and a max INT of 20 (at level 20). An extra action per short rest, or more spells/spell slots and better INT rolls at higher levels.
I know this is all opinion, and depends on how I play etc.. but I just want some opinions and some pros and cons.
The vast majority of campaigns don’t get to level 20, so looking at the final state probably isn’t where you want to be looking. You probably want to target where you think your campaign will fall apart at, which is typically in the 10-14 range.
Also..what’s your DMs “encounter style”. Some DMs have multiple encounters a day making short rests more relevant. Others, tend to have one big encounter followed by a long rest. Action surge is more useful in the former and less useful in the later
Yeah thats a good point, we probably won't get anywhere near to 20. Not on this campaign. We are starting at level 6, so it gives me some room to play around with the build. So I'm looking at Fighter 1/Wizard 5 or 2/4. Right now I'm using my first ability increase to get the War Caster feat. One thing to keep in mind is that if I skip that second level of Fighter I will be getting my next ability increase sooner. So it would probably will still effect my character during this campaign.
And our DM is pretty versatile on that, it depends on what the players are doing. But from what I know about this campaign he's putting together, it seems like there is going to be a lot of travel. So there will probably be a good amount of small encounter and random encounters etc. So as you said action surge would probably come in handy in that case.
So this why I'm kind of torn. Its either action surge or ability increases sooner.
Right now I'm leaning towards action surge, but a quicker intelligence increase would be nice too.
Action Surge is great, but +2 to Int is also great. Tough Call. I would go for +2 Int. Higher DC, Higher to hit, higher Int save, 1 extra spell prepared.
If you are starting at 6 you could also try 3/3. Then you would have both subclasses. You would then get an ASI each level for the next two levels for 4/4. If you take EK you would get a few more spell slots then other fighters.
Alternately if you don’t want to go farther into fighter you could pick up armor and weapon proficiencies by going cleric or artificer instead. Going cleric helps keep you at full number of spell slots.
One level of fighter gets you Con proficiency, a fighting style (is anything but +1 AC worth it for wizard) , and a 1 d10 + 1 heal per short rest.
One level of artificer also gets you Con proficiently, two more cantrips and two spell slots. The number of spells you can cast increases with your INT like your wizard levels.
Other then bladesingers does any wizard want to have a weapon in hand? If you don’t need the weapon cleric or artificers can get you the armour/shield or healing you are looking for.
I’m not sure that even a 1-level dip just for armor is a great idea. I’m going to guess you won’t have the str to wear heavy armor, and medium isn’t so great. I’d keep str the dump stat it’s supposed to be for wizards, boost your int and go straight wizard. Or if you’re really worried about getting hit, a point or two in dex will do you much more good in the long run (saves, initiative, ac and some skills) than str and armor.
Also, multiclassing not only costs you that ASI, but also delays your spells by a level.
You could even go straight wizard, and use that asi you would have lost to fighter to take an armor feat and give you a couple more ac points that way.
Another option is to splash 1 level of Artificer instead of Fighter. You'd still get Medium Armor and Shields, as well as access to a few spells on the Artificer list not found on the Wizard list (Cure Wounds, for example) as well as some more Cantrips. More importantly, the Artificer is unique from other half casters in that you round levels UP multiclassing spell slots, instead of down, so you won't be delaying your spell slot progression, and only pushing back the level you learn higher level spells by 1.
High elf gives an extra wizard cantrip, a bonus language, proficiency with multiple weapons, and a bonus to intelligence. This is on top of the multiple other abilities the base elf gives. Would be a nicer choice.
starting with one level of artificer gives proficiency in CON saves like a fighter, but does not delay slots gained. Proficiency in simple weapons and proficiency with light/medium armor/shields is good too.
2 cantrips, Intelligence based off you like, with options like thornwhip and guidance not usually available to the wizard.
prepared spell list that also keys off of intelligence, both by DC AND number of preparations. Sanctuary and cure wounds would be good choices to round out your battle mage needs.
the low level spell overlap is good, as it allows for more high level wizard spell preparations.
Magical tinkering could go pretty far for utility purposes.