The updated subclasses are the druid’s Circle of the Shepherd, the fighter’s Cavalier, the paladin’s Oath of Conquest, and the warlock’s Celestial (formerly known as the Undying Light).
I like the Cavalier and Celestial Patron quite a bit. The Conquest option is ok, but not something I think would play. The Shepard is a little lacking I think though, it has some good qualities, but seems to be missing something.
I'm currently playing a Shepherd. I like and dislike this new iteration.
The hawk was super nerfed in this iteration. It makes the other spirits more attractive than before, I like this, but I do feel that they did hit the hawk too hard. Tbh I'm not sure how to properly balance it. It also seems they're wanting the spirits to provide different types of roles.
The bear giving temp hp and advantage on str checks and throws is not bad. Like the description you get its might and endurance, it's also a sign of protection.
Unicorns are know for powerful healing properties. So the spirit giving the aoe heals like it does makes sense. I feel as though it should do a different check and/or save though.. advantage to detect enemies fits more into the hawk's domain. Con comes to mind since they're about good health and such.
As for the hawk... I'm not sure if it should be a different animal entirely or not. As for its effect, it's clearly meant to be the offensive option. Again I feel it was hit too hard, I also feel like it's being done in a strange way.
What I'd do, is first off move the advantage on checks to detect enemies from Unicorn to the Hawk, it makes more sense here. As for its offensive effect I've had several ideas:
First and foremost I feel it should keep it's nature of being a spirit of hunting, so helping strike true or precise in some way.
The hawk marks all enemies in its aura - Once per turn the first hit with a weapon attack or ranged weapon attack does and extra 1d6 damage. (This feels maybe too powerful. But also can only happen basically from the martial side of attacks. It's like hunter's mark but only once per turn instead of all attacks.)
The hawk marks an enemy in its aura - This enemy takes an extra 1d6 damage whenever it's hit with a weapon attack or ranged weapon attack. (This one is especially powerful. I realized that as I typed it out.)
The hawk marks an enemy in its aura - Once per turn, this enemy takes an extra 1d6 damage whenever it's hit with a weapon attack or ranged weapon attack. This is basically 1 but it's only a single target.
The hawk imbues its keen sight into allies within its aura - Allies gain a +1 to attacks rolls. (Maybe +1~2 on damage rolls.)(This too is also possibly too strong.)
The hawk imbues its keen sight into allies within its aura - Once per round when you make an attack roll you can choose to add 1d4 to the roll.
As a bonus action, the hawk attacks an enemy with its talons every turn for (1d4), or (your wisdom modifier), or (Half druid level) damage. (Super undecided with damage there)
These are some of the ideas I came up with that feel like things that would give incentive to choose the hawk spirit but it not be over and under-shadowed by the rest of the options. But honestly I'm not sure how much of a fan I am of it granting advantage especially at the cost of your reaction.
Lemme know what you think? I'm thinking about actually presenting this to my DM and seeing if it's possible to have my spirits do this.
I'm not a fan of how they nerfed the warlock blade pack invocation smites. Warlocks are far squishier than paladins and have far fewer spell slots to use, so when they blow one on a smite, it should be doing far more than the pally smite does. I also don't like how they took away the patron specific invocations. Those made the choice seem more meaningful. I like how they added in some invocations to buff hex, though. Hex seems to fall off in usefulness fairly early, especially considering it's a concentration spell with a long duration. Maybe remove the concentration part of it if cast with a third lvl or above spell slot so it will be more enticing?
I dig almost all of it sans the Shepard. I'm just not a fan of how it read and some other people don't like some of its math. Conquest is quality with the changes, especially once Fear aura goes into hyperdrive. Cavalier is good even without a mount and brings some mount flavored utility Celestial patron is a much less confusing name and has decent, thematic changes from undying light Warlock invocations are much better this time around even if they had to lose flavor in the process
The Warlock has few spell slots but they are recharged after a short rest. The paladin after a long rest.
Yeah but paladins are also tanky as hell so it's not as large of a risk for them to be in melee with enemies. It's far more dangerous for a bladelock wearing light armor. The extra damage is what makes that risk worth taking. And how many short rests are your DMs letting you take in a day? Mine gives me at most 2, usually 1, but also usually only do 1 combat encounter in a day. Recharging on a short rest is great, but it's not tripling or quadrupling the # of spells a lock has. It's more often maybe doubling, so paladins will still have more smites to go around.
The Warlock has few spell slots but they are recharged after a short rest. The paladin after a long rest.
Yeah but paladins are also tanky as hell so it's not as large of a risk for them to be in melee with enemies. It's far more dangerous for a bladelock wearing light armor. The extra damage is what makes that risk worth taking. And how many short rests are your DMs letting you take in a day? Mine gives me at most 2, usually 1, but also usually only do 1 combat encounter in a day. Recharging on a short rest is great, but it's not tripling or quadrupling the # of spells a lock has. It's more often maybe doubling, so paladins will still have more smites to go around.
Indeed. Warlock are more spellcaster than fighter. Eldritch smite is a nice addition for the Pact of the blade. Also, Eldritch smite can knock the target prone.
I am very disappointed with the Cavalier. It feels like a watered down Battle Master (much like the other superiority dice focused archetypes in UA) rather than it's own distinct and unique Archetype.
The Warlock has few spell slots but they are recharged after a short rest. The paladin after a long rest.
Yeah but paladins are also tanky as hell so it's not as large of a risk for them to be in melee with enemies. It's far more dangerous for a bladelock wearing light armor. The extra damage is what makes that risk worth taking. And how many short rests are your DMs letting you take in a day? Mine gives me at most 2, usually 1, but also usually only do 1 combat encounter in a day. Recharging on a short rest is great, but it's not tripling or quadrupling the # of spells a lock has. It's more often maybe doubling, so paladins will still have more smites to go around.
Indeed. Warlock are more spellcaster than fighter. Eldritch smite is a nice addition for the Pact of the blade. Also, Eldritch smite can knock the target prone.
Which is why the nerf to the eldritch smite damage is a bad thing. Don't forget that one of the weapon smites from the other UA also knocked enemies prone.
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Some of the proposed archetypes have been revised:
http://media.wizards.com/2017/dnd/downloads/June5UA_RevisedClassOptv1.pdf
The updated subclasses are the druid’s Circle of the Shepherd, the fighter’s Cavalier, the paladin’s Oath of Conquest, and the warlock’s Celestial (formerly known as the Undying Light).
I like the Cavalier and Celestial Patron quite a bit. The Conquest option is ok, but not something I think would play. The Shepard is a little lacking I think though, it has some good qualities, but seems to be missing something.
She/Her College Student Player and Dungeon Master
The Celestial Pact in his last trait is like this:
I like the Sheperd, i find it fitting.
Hombrewing and roleplaying a lot.
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I'm currently playing a Shepherd. I like and dislike this new iteration.
The hawk was super nerfed in this iteration. It makes the other spirits more attractive than before, I like this, but I do feel that they did hit the hawk too hard. Tbh I'm not sure how to properly balance it. It also seems they're wanting the spirits to provide different types of roles.
The bear giving temp hp and advantage on str checks and throws is not bad. Like the description you get its might and endurance, it's also a sign of protection.
Unicorns are know for powerful healing properties. So the spirit giving the aoe heals like it does makes sense. I feel as though it should do a different check and/or save though.. advantage to detect enemies fits more into the hawk's domain. Con comes to mind since they're about good health and such.
As for the hawk... I'm not sure if it should be a different animal entirely or not. As for its effect, it's clearly meant to be the offensive option. Again I feel it was hit too hard, I also feel like it's being done in a strange way.
What I'd do, is first off move the advantage on checks to detect enemies from Unicorn to the Hawk, it makes more sense here. As for its offensive effect I've had several ideas:
First and foremost I feel it should keep it's nature of being a spirit of hunting, so helping strike true or precise in some way.
These are some of the ideas I came up with that feel like things that would give incentive to choose the hawk spirit but it not be over and under-shadowed by the rest of the options. But honestly I'm not sure how much of a fan I am of it granting advantage especially at the cost of your reaction.
Lemme know what you think? I'm thinking about actually presenting this to my DM and seeing if it's possible to have my spirits do this.
I'm not a fan of how they nerfed the warlock blade pack invocation smites. Warlocks are far squishier than paladins and have far fewer spell slots to use, so when they blow one on a smite, it should be doing far more than the pally smite does. I also don't like how they took away the patron specific invocations. Those made the choice seem more meaningful. I like how they added in some invocations to buff hex, though. Hex seems to fall off in usefulness fairly early, especially considering it's a concentration spell with a long duration. Maybe remove the concentration part of it if cast with a third lvl or above spell slot so it will be more enticing?
The Warlock has few spell slots but they are recharged after a short rest. The paladin after a long rest.
I dig almost all of it sans the Shepard. I'm just not a fan of how it read and some other people don't like some of its math.
Conquest is quality with the changes, especially once Fear aura goes into hyperdrive.
Cavalier is good even without a mount and brings some mount flavored utility
Celestial patron is a much less confusing name and has decent, thematic changes from undying light
Warlock invocations are much better this time around even if they had to lose flavor in the process
I am very disappointed with the Cavalier. It feels like a watered down Battle Master (much like the other superiority dice focused archetypes in UA) rather than it's own distinct and unique Archetype.